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Buh

Elmander is better than Becchio

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Do you think Elmander deserved to go through that b@llocks cheering for Becchio yesterday?

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It would be a guess that he''s better as Becchio has never been tested at this level.

I like Elmander though, once he''s up to speed fully, after playing in a poor quality league, he''ll be a very strong player for us. Looking good now, with room to improve.

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Spot on OP, the ironic cheers for Becchio were embarrassing as well. Elmander looked like he had a good game yesterday.

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Were the cheers really ironic though?, or do some of the crowd just want to see becchio given a chance, after all our ''strike force'' hasnt exactly set the premier league alight.I think most supporters would like the management to mix it up a bit, particularly if we''re losing. Fresh legs are v important...even when we''re ahead , otherwise what happens if say elmander injured after 15 mins and beccio not had sniff all season till that point?

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I have no issue with Becchio as a player and I definitely would have used him more before now. My issue was the reaction from sections of the crowd in full-on tinpot mode and the lack of class and intelligence showed by Becchio in going to the papers.

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Buh wrote the following post at 2013-12-01 3:37 PM:

I have no issue with Becchio as a player and I definitely would have used him more before now. My issue was the reaction from sections of the crowd in full-on tinpot mode and the lack of class and intelligence showed by Becchio in going to the papers.

The supporters pay their money and can react however they want - just as you can spout your opinions on here - as we all live in a democracy - so why don''t you just do one you ignorant imbecile.

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Tell me people are allowed an opinion - tell me to do one. hypocrisy overload!

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No evidence Hughton has fined Becchio. said it would be handled in house.

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Hooper is better than both of them.

So whats your point ? The pathetic embarassing part is the fact that somoene feels the need to create this thread. And worse people find it embarassing when fans support a player. Cheering Beccio had nothing to do with his ability.So master armchair plaudits..We boo a player, we are wrongWe cheer a player, we are wrong

What do you want us to do ??Pr1cks !!

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Buh wrote the following post at 2013-12-01 3:51 PM:

Tell me people are allowed an opinion - tell me to do one. hypocrisy overload!

to quote ''solid gold FACT ''- does not relate to an opinion.

If you have an opinion on Becchio v Elmander, then state it''s an opinion, not fact.

So you take your fact and do one in my opinion!

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Think in all likelihood Elmander is better than Becchio. but most fans feel he hasnt had a chance to prove himself, and the cheers were simply a show of support for a player most feel has been harshly treated. If he was being kept out of the team by a free-scoring forward line it would be very understandable, but in a team thats struggled to score goals, you would have thought he would have at least been given an opportunity. Think fans were just glad he got a chance to show what he can do

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One has played 76 times for Sweden, the other scored a few goals for Leeds at Championship level.As Nuff said would sayNuff said.

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You''re right on yer facts Ricardo, but did you consider that if Becchio had 79 caps for T''Argies he''d be at CR at all?....M Arteta wasnt ever capped at senior level for spain, still a decent player.

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[quote user="wcorkcanary"]You''re right on yer facts Ricardo, but did you consider that if Becchio had 79 caps for T''Argies he''d be at CR at all?....M Arteta wasnt ever capped at senior level for spain, still a decent player.[/quote]So if Becchio had been Swedish do you think he would ever have been an international?He''s Championship material at best. As we have seen, he couldn''t displace an aging Grant Holt last season. This season we have bought better players. To see him as anything other than 4th choice is indeed perverse.

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Elmander currently deserves his place in the team Ricardo, i agree with you about that.
But to class Becchio as championship material at best? How do you arrive to that conclusion? Elmanders goal scoring record in the Prem is hardly inspiring (92 apps, 18 goals). And at times, Elmander has looked poor this season. At those times, Becchio should have been the obvious replacement but it never came. Then he goes to the media and that get''s him some game time. Odd ethos but fair play.
Holt was finding his form at the end of the season in my opinion. To say he couldn''t displace is a bit odd in itself because it''s clear that Hughton / coaching team aren''t a big fan of him. Hence his limited appearances. He trains fantastically apparently. And 75 goals in 190 appearances for Leeds, isn''t a bad return, for someone who can also hold up the ball and provide link up play.
I''ve perhaps seen a bit more of Becchio for Leeds than most as unfortunately i have some leeds fans as relatives. He''s a tidy player. Elmander is playing quite well and deserves his place ahead of Becchio but he certainly hasn''t done anything Becchio can''t. In my opinion of course. He probably doesn''t have the strength of Elmander, so maybe won''t hold up the ball quite as well. But i think you''d get more goals playing Becchio all season than you would Elmander.

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[quote user="hogesar"]Elmander currently deserves his place in the team Ricardo, i agree with you about that.
But to class Becchio as championship material at best? How do you arrive to that conclusion? Elmanders goal scoring record in the Prem is hardly inspiring (92 apps, 18 goals). And at times, Elmander has looked poor this season. At those times, Becchio should have been the obvious replacement but it never came. Then he goes to the media and that get''s him some game time. Odd ethos but fair play.
Holt was finding his form at the end of the season in my opinion. To say he couldn''t displace is a bit odd in itself because it''s clear that Hughton / coaching team aren''t a big fan of him. Hence his limited appearances. He trains fantastically apparently. And 75 goals in 190 appearances for Leeds, isn''t a bad return, for someone who can also hold up the ball and provide link up play.
I''ve perhaps seen a bit more of Becchio for Leeds than most as unfortunately i have some leeds fans as relatives. He''s a tidy player. Elmander is playing quite well and deserves his place ahead of Becchio but he certainly hasn''t done anything Becchio can''t. In my opinion of course. He probably doesn''t have the strength of Elmander, so maybe won''t hold up the ball quite as well. But i think you''d get more goals playing Becchio all season than you would Elmander.
[/quote]Straight swap for Steve Morison plus a packet of wine gums should tell you something about how high he is rated.As for scoring more with him in the team, we''ll never know because hopefully we won''t have an injury crisis that''s forces us to choose our 4th string.I reckon he''ll be back at Leeds come January.

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I think he''ll be going abroad if he goes anywhere. He was linked with moves to Turkey before he came to us.

I don''t entirely disagree with you Ricardo but I wouldn''t say that the Swedish national side is blessed with a lot of depth in quality in the striking department.

I would also say they are very different styles of player. Elmander has often been deployed as a deeper lying player, more of a creator. In fact he has even been deployed as a right winger before now. Becchio is more of the out and out target man.

In my opinion his record in the Championship is pretty decent, Going by wiki he scored 51 times in 108 appearances over three seasons. Last season - before we signed him, he had scored 20 goals in 31 appearances. Holt scored 23 in 48 appearances.

So I think his performances deserve a chance at this level and comparing him directly with Elmander may be slightly off anyway.

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[quote user="ricardo"][quote user="hogesar"]Elmander currently deserves his place in the team Ricardo, i agree with you about that.
But to class Becchio as championship material at best? How do you arrive to that conclusion? Elmanders goal scoring record in the Prem is hardly inspiring (92 apps, 18 goals). And at times, Elmander has looked poor this season. At those times, Becchio should have been the obvious replacement but it never came. Then he goes to the media and that get''s him some game time. Odd ethos but fair play.
Holt was finding his form at the end of the season in my opinion. To say he couldn''t displace is a bit odd in itself because it''s clear that Hughton / coaching team aren''t a big fan of him. Hence his limited appearances. He trains fantastically apparently. And 75 goals in 190 appearances for Leeds, isn''t a bad return, for someone who can also hold up the ball and provide link up play.
I''ve perhaps seen a bit more of Becchio for Leeds than most as unfortunately i have some leeds fans as relatives. He''s a tidy player. Elmander is playing quite well and deserves his place ahead of Becchio but he certainly hasn''t done anything Becchio can''t. In my opinion of course. He probably doesn''t have the strength of Elmander, so maybe won''t hold up the ball quite as well. But i think you''d get more goals playing Becchio all season than you would Elmander.
[/quote]Straight swap for Steve Morison plus a packet of wine gums should tell you something about how high he is rated.As for scoring more with him in the team, we''ll never know because hopefully we won''t have an injury crisis that''s forces us to choose our 4th string.I reckon he''ll be back at Leeds come January.[/quote]
Irrelevant. Do good players HAVE to go for high fees? Bloody grant Holt, he must have been terrible.
Hoolahan? 250k? League 2 at best.
I could go on. Take context with your argument as well.
Becchio wanted to leave Leeds. That much was well-known and confirmed by Warnock. Warnock has said, he knew there was no point in keeping a striker who didn''t want to be there. We offered him a striker who scored 10+ goals in the Prem last year, plus some money. That was at the time perceived as a good signing. For both teams, generally.
He is fourth choice. But we''re currently playing our 3rd choice as second choice. So now he''s third choice. Right? So if Elmander takes a knock, he''s second. Ricky might not be back by Swansea. If Becchio gets 30 minutes, and scores. He could well keep his place.
I also don''t think he''ll be back at Leeds come Jan, and hope not unless we have someone else lined up. For his career a move may be best.

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I really rate elmander, he doesn''t get the credit he deserves. Works very hard indeed, often charges back to help out the midfield too! Got a pretty decent touch and is fitting in nicely. Really hope he gets a goal soon, deserves one!

As for becchio....bringing him on was pretty clever in my opinion. Game was flat 2nd half, bringing him in actually raised the noise level, even if for the wrong reasons. Also re the Warwick autobiography....norwich wanted Morrison out for being a disturbance to the squad, but were not prepared to lose a striker and be left short. We got offered becchio and took it...

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[quote user="chicken"]I think he''ll be going abroad if he goes anywhere. He was linked with moves to Turkey before he came to us.

I don''t entirely disagree with you Ricardo but I wouldn''t say that the Swedish national side is blessed with a lot of depth in quality in the striking department.

I would also say they are very different styles of player. Elmander has often been deployed as a deeper lying player, more of a creator. In fact he has even been deployed as a right winger before now. Becchio is more of the out and out target man.

In my opinion his record in the Championship is pretty decent, Going by wiki he scored 51 times in 108 appearances over three seasons. Last season - before we signed him, he had scored 20 goals in 31 appearances. Holt scored 23 in 48 appearances.

So I think his performances deserve a chance at this level and comparing him directly with Elmander may be slightly off anyway.[/quote]So if Ricky''s injury is longer term you don''t see a striker being the priority in the transfer window? We certainly won''t be going with Becchio as second choice.Yes, his strike rate was a bit better than Holts in the Chumps, but there was a bit more to Holty than goal scoring. I don''t see that in Becchio and by the look of things neither does CH.No denying he is a decent Championship striker but any more than that is stretching it a bit.

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Dont get me wrong Ricardo, I''m not saying he''s all that, My point was that he''s Argentinan, , and therefore would have to be pretty good indeed to get capped. Personally i think elmander is ok, but also think that of Becchio. As for whether i think he''d get capped if he was Swedish.... i dont know., but we were prepared to pay pretty big money for Toivonen, who hardly plays....for club or country.

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[quote user="wcorkcanary"]Dont get me wrong Ricardo, I''m not saying he''s all that, My point was that he''s Argentinan, , and therefore would have to be pretty good indeed to get capped. Personally i think elmander is ok, but also think that of Becchio. As for whether i think he''d get capped if he was Swedish.... i dont know., but we were prepared to pay pretty big money for Toivonen, who hardly plays....for club or country.[/quote]

Toivonen got back into the PSV side and is now a regular. I don''t have any strong feelings on Becchio vs Elmander. The latter in his prime was undoubtedly a considerably better player than Becchio in his prime. But Elmander is a couple of years or so beyond his prime.

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Another striker would be good, and note I did not say that we shouldn''t look for another one. Elmander is only here on loan after all, and if Becchio really isn''t up to it then he''ll be off soon as well.

As posted elsewhere, I feel we are actually a season behind, in spending terms, to the likes of Southampton and Swansea. The issue with that is that the next signings we make may need to be that bit more expensive to bring in a player clearly better than what we have.

I guess all I was saying with Becchio is that he probably would have been given a chance in the premier league at some point with that sort of goal scoring record. He may well not give as much to the team as Holt did in terms of build up play but his goal scoring record is pretty decent.

I don''t think anyone can really say they have seen enough of him in a Norwich shirt in the premier league to say that he is or isn''t up to it. I think primarily at the moment he doesn''t fit into the system Hughton wants to play. And the reality is that at his age he doesn''t want to be sitting on the bench - fair play to the lad for that.

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