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yellowandgreenmachine

Puzzling

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Why so many posters on this forum are happy to watch such poor football on a consistent basis.

Happy to defend a Manager with such an abysmal record this calendar year.

And some genuinely don''t believe we will be in a relegation fight should this all continue.

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Equally puzzling that so many posters have such unrealistic expectations of our place in the world as a team playing way above its resources, do not understand the realities of modern football with its increasing concentration on a few clubs able to use vast wealth to globalise the game and who lack the patience to allow a team to develop through setbacks and accept that players are learning at this level and will make mistakes.

Puzzlement depends on your standpoint and your view from that place.

We may well be in a relegation if this continues. You would not predict that we will be untouched by scares this season. But that is inevitable on most indicators. We have a team that cost less than single players on the bench at the top clubs. You get what you pay for by and large and even our bargains can compete with world class players every week..

We have to keep our nerve and continue to pick up points where we can. We will survive this season and will build year on year as teams like Stoke have done. There will be painful and embarrassing days. As Norwich we can''t avoid them. We are not rich enough. We are not good enough.

As Norwich, we must never accept the painful and embarrassing days and we must bounce back better and stronger. This is a real test of the manager''s and the players'' characters. I have faith in both.

But, it depends on your viewpoint.

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A well argued response for sure.

I am under no illusions about our place in the pecking order. We certainly shouldn''t be thinking we will qualifying for Europe any time soon. But what disappoints me is that with the squad we have at our disposal, a better tactician, with a more positive, yet shrewd, approach to playing football, could easily have us sitting above the likes of the West Broms and Stokes of this world come the end of this season.

Last season''s league position was great for us.. But that ten game run has long gone and it simply isn''t coming back.

We are now looking at a relegation dogfight, one which I don''t think we''d win. Perhaps a relegation scrap is indeed about our level - what we should expect.

But with the openess of the league this season we could do much more, should Hughton not remain in charge. It is a wasted opportunity to allow him to continue.

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[quote user="CambridgeCanary"]Equally puzzling that so many posters have such unrealistic expectations of our place in the world as a team playing way above its resources, do not understand the realities of modern football with its increasing concentration on a few clubs able to use vast wealth to globalise the game and who lack the patience to allow a team to develop through setbacks and accept that players are learning at this level and will make mistakes.

Puzzlement depends on your standpoint and your view from that place.

We may well be in a relegation if this continues. You would not predict that we will be untouched by scares this season. But that is inevitable on most indicators. We have a team that cost less than single players on the bench at the top clubs. You get what you pay for by and large and even our bargains can compete with world class players every week..

We have to keep our nerve and continue to pick up points where we can. We will survive this season and will build year on year as teams like Stoke have done. There will be painful and embarrassing days. As Norwich we can''t avoid them. We are not rich enough. We are not good enough.

As Norwich, we must never accept the painful and embarrassing days and we must bounce back better and stronger. This is a real test of the manager''s and the players'' characters. I have faith in both.

But, it depends on your viewpoint.[/quote]

Actually Cambridge I don''t think many fans do have unrealistic expectations, but if a few do then they were so encouraged by Alan Bowkett, who demanded a top-ten finish this season...(imagine smiley face here).

The problem sensible fans have with Hughton is not that we are where we are, but that we are doing worse than we did under him last season, when all the difficulties you mention also applied.

In short we are regressing, despite summer spending that should have kept us level with last season''s performance, and dangerously so.

I think the figures do bear repeating:

Last season we gained 44 points, at 1.15 points per game, we scored 41 goals at 1.078 per game and conceded 58 goals at 1.52 goals per game. Our goal difference was -17.

This season we are gaining points at 1.0 per game, which would if continued see us finish on 38 points. We are scoring at 0.857 goals per game and conceding at 2.0 goals per game. If that carried on we would score 33 and let in 76, which equates to a GD of -43.

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[quote user="yellowandgreenmachine"]Why so many posters on this forum are happy to watch such poor football on a consistent basis.

Happy to defend a Manager with such an abysmal record this calendar year.

And some genuinely don''t believe we will be in a relegation fight should this all continue.[/quote]

Its called being a supporter mate. Sometimes its good and you''re up. Sometimes its poor and you''re down. Whats new? its been like that for my entire life. When we are in the top league we usually lose more than we win. The big beasts will eat you many more times than you eat them.If you are expecting it to be good all the time then I''ve got news for you.It aint.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="CambridgeCanary"]Equally puzzling that so many posters have such unrealistic expectations of our place in the world as a team playing way above its resources, do not understand the realities of modern football with its increasing concentration on a few clubs able to use vast wealth to globalise the game and who lack the patience to allow a team to develop through setbacks and accept that players are learning at this level and will make mistakes.

Puzzlement depends on your standpoint and your view from that place.

We may well be in a relegation if this continues. You would not predict that we will be untouched by scares this season. But that is inevitable on most indicators. We have a team that cost less than single players on the bench at the top clubs. You get what you pay for by and large and even our bargains can compete with world class players every week..

We have to keep our nerve and continue to pick up points where we can. We will survive this season and will build year on year as teams like Stoke have done. There will be painful and embarrassing days. As Norwich we can''t avoid them. We are not rich enough. We are not good enough.

As Norwich, we must never accept the painful and embarrassing days and we must bounce back better and stronger. This is a real test of the manager''s and the players'' characters. I have faith in both.

But, it depends on your viewpoint.[/quote]

Actually Cambridge I don''t think many fans do have unrealistic expectations, but if a few do then they were so encouraged by Alan Bowkett, who demanded a top-ten finish this season...(imagine smiley face here).

The problem sensible fans have with Hughton is not that we are where we are, but that we are doing worse than we did under him last season, when all the difficulties you mention also applied.

In short we are regressing, despite summer spending that should have kept us level with last season''s performance, and dangerously so.

I think the figures do bear repeating:

Last season we gained 44 points, at 1.15 points per game, we scored 41 goals at 1.078 per game and conceded 58 goals at 1.52 goals per game. Our goal difference was -17.

This season we are gaining points at 1.0 per game, which would if continued see us finish on 38 points. We are scoring at 0.857 goals per game and conceding at 2.0 goals per game. If that carried on we would score 33 and let in 76, which equates to a GD of -43.[/quote]All of which make it look very relegation-ish, Purple.It''s always a struggle in this league but I still think at least 5 or 6 teams will fail to get 40 points so by no means is it all black at this stage.That will be the case regardless of whether CH stays or goes. IMO.

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Ricardo I know it goes with the territory of supporting a club of our size and stature to lose more than we win at this level, but all too often it is just so toothless under Hughton.

This season is worse than most of last season.

I can''t stand the guy''s defeatist demeanour. It must rub onto the players. It has to be demotivating to have to play under that kind of damage limitation approach.

I''d rather we cut our losses now. Even if we still end up in a relegation fight I''d much rather have someone stronger in charge who can motivate.

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I would not argue too ardently that we are not regressing at present. After the obvious point that we are still on the bend of the race and until the stagger evens out, our place is hard to ascertain. We now have only Chelsea and Manchester united to play away of the big teams.

More relevantly, I suspect that we have regressed. Certainly we have against many of the top six. Our spending has improved the team and is a record for us but nothing compared to what other teams have spent. The gap between us and the top six has widened.

I also feel that insufficient attention has been given to the new players having to adapt to the pace and pressure of the Prem. We wondered if several would make it when they were signed and now there is an expectation that they would play to capacity on day one. Only Fer did. the others are learning and/or catching up after delayed starts because of injury or other factors.

If we are still regressing at the end of February then we will have a scrap on our hands. It could go either way. I think that we are regressing at the moment is neither surprising nor overly concerning.

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I suspect the OP hasn''t followed City very long.  You don''t support Norwich City to make yourself feel "happy".  Those sort of fans generally gravitate to teams like Man U or Chelsea.

 

City have ups and downs, more downs that ups.  You might as well get used to it - if you continue to support City, I guarantee you''ll see worse - much worse - than this.

 

Unlike the OP, the Board can''t just throw their toys out the pram and sack the manager because they don''t like his "demeanour".  They need to take a measured judgement on whether replacing Hughton makes it more likely we will do better for the rest of this season.  They will look at the fact that despite what you think is a dreadful season so far, after 14 of 38 games we are 4 points above the relegation zone and in the pack of mid-table teams.

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CambridgeCanary wrote the following post at 2013-12-05 1:13 PM:

Equally puzzling that so many posters have such unrealistic expectations of our place in the world as a team playing way above its resources, do not understand the realities of modern football with its increasing concentration on a few clubs able to use vast wealth to globalise the game and who lack the patience to allow a team to develop through setbacks and accept that players are learning at this level and will make mistakes.

Puzzlement depends on your standpoint and your view from that place.

We may well be in a relegation if this continues. You would not predict that we will be untouched by scares this season. But that is inevitable on most indicators. We have a team that cost less than single players on the bench at the top clubs. You get what you pay for by and large and even our bargains can compete with world class players every week..

We have to keep our nerve and continue to pick up points where we can. We will survive this season and will build year on year as teams like Stoke have done. There will be painful and embarrassing days. As Norwich we can''t avoid them. We are not rich enough. We are not good enough.

As Norwich, we must never accept the painful and embarrassing days and we must bounce back better and stronger. This is a real test of the manager''s and the players'' characters. I have faith in both.

But, it depends on your viewpoint.

CC, the board, et al McNally and Bowkett both suggested they expected improvement on last season in respect of the money that Hughton spent pre season. Supporters have a right to some expectation of seeing a decent game of football for the money they are expected to pay for the privilege, although that is not a privilege at this time. It Isn''t just a scare now, we are a terrible footballing team coached by a very inept manager at this time, and that is not personal, his own stats tell you that.

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Unrealistic expectations eh Cambridge? I think its more to do with the manor of defeat. I certainly don''t expect Norwich to gain points against the likes of Man City and Liverpool. But I also shouldn''t expect such a heavy beating everytime. I always hoped we could pull of an upset or at least give them a run, but now that hope under Hughton has gone. I don''t care what people think of me for saying this, but currently I''m out of love with Norwich City. I go into games with zero hope and expectation, and that''s due to the current regime.

 

No we shouldn''t expect a single point in this league. However in our third season and after spending a huge some of money, we are within our right to expect our Norwich City to be competitive against most teams. The top 6 teams have all slipped up at times this year against the lesser clubs. Sunderland we''re able to beat Man City, even Hull beat Liverpool, yet Norwich city haven''t managed to upset the odds once this season. 

 

And anyone who thinks the West Ham and Palace games we''re more than just papering over the cracks, are sadly delusional. Two poor teams who we''re very unlucky not to beat us. We''re all over the place at the minute and relegation is inevitable.

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[quote user="It''s Character Forming"][quote user="lincoln canary"]

We''re all over the place at the minute and relegation is inevitable.

[/quote]

Ah.  But I thought we were certs for relegation last year

At times we we''re, but we managed to scrape a couple of late results to stay up. This year we are playing far worse than last. You can believe what you like, but for me when a team gets thumped as often as we are, the writing is on the wall.   

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[quote user="lincoln canary"][quote user="It''s Character Forming"][quote user="lincoln canary"]

We''re all over the place at the minute and relegation is inevitable.

[/quote]

Ah.  But I thought we were certs for relegation last year

At times we we''re, but we managed to scrape a couple of late results to stay up. This year we are playing far worse than last. You can believe what you like, but for me when a team gets thumped as often as we are, the writing is on the wall.   

[/quote]

Sigh.  We could have lost both of our last 2 games and we''d still have stayed up.

 

Last year after 14 games we had 16 points, compared to 14 points now.  It''s not a big difference.  We are 1 point behind West Brom and 4 points behind Swansea who are 11th.

 

Our season won''t be decided by our results at places like Anfield, it will be decided by the long run of fixtures against teams in the middle/bottom of the table that we now have coming up.  Anyone who thinks relegation is now inevitable has just lost their head.

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[quote user="It''s Character Forming"][quote user="lincoln canary"][quote user="It''s Character Forming"][quote user="lincoln canary"]

We''re all over the place at the minute and relegation is inevitable.

[/quote]

Ah.  But I thought we were certs for relegation last year

At times we we''re, but we managed to scrape a couple of late results to stay up. This year we are playing far worse than last. You can believe what you like, but for me when a team gets thumped as often as we are, the writing is on the wall.   

[/quote]

Sigh.  We could have lost both of our last 2 games and we''d still have stayed up.

 

Last year after 14 games we had 16 points, compared to 14 points now.  It''s not a big difference.  We are 1 point behind West Brom and 4 points behind Swansea who are 11th.

 

Our season won''t be decided by our results at places like Anfield, it will be decided by the long run of fixtures against teams in the middle/bottom of the table that we now have coming up.  Anyone who thinks relegation is now inevitable has just lost their head.

 

 

So if a relegation rival nicks a point at anfield, by your logic it doesn''t count as their season, like ours, will not be decided there. Every result counts. But for a moment lets live by your logic. Regardless of the effect on our season, are you happy to watch Norwich city just turn up and bow down to the big boys and get torn to pieces. Sounds to me like you are.

 

 

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"]Actually Cambridge I don''t think many fans do

have unrealistic expectations, but if a few do then they were so encouraged by

Alan Bowkett, who demanded a top-ten finish this season...(imagine smiley face

here). The problem sensible fans have with Hughton is not that

we are where we are, but that we are doing worse than we did under him last

season, when all the difficulties you mention also applied. In short we are

regressing, despite summer spending that should have kept us level with last

season''s performance, and dangerously so. I think the figures do bear repeating:

Last season we gained 44 points, at 1.15 points per game, we scored 41 goals at

1.078 per game and conceded 58 goals at 1.52 goals per game. Our goal difference

was -17. This season we are gaining points at 1.0 per game, which would if

continued see us finish on 38 points. We are scoring at 0.857 goals per game and

conceding at 2.0 goals per game. If that carried on we would score 33 and let in

76, which equates to a GD of -43.[/quote]

 

Wish I was sensible like them there others[;)]
 
 

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