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Matt Morriss

Win changes nothing

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To add I feel Wes brought a bit of that back Saturday. Maybe who-tons learning who knows. I just feel it''s taken him far to long to learn it. And indecision in this league can cost everything

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[quote user="chicken"]@Huckerby''s boots: I provided the debate you sorely wanted but I see you have chosen to prefer insulting others. My best advice for any internet forum is that if you want to have reasoned debate without insult that you ignore those that you feel are being antagonistic and engage with those who are opening debate.

However all I can take from this thread is that you are just looking to wind people up.

@Norwich or die tryin!: "Yesterday was the worst iv ever seen us play and win."

That shocks me. I have seen games where we have barely put a move together to win with a scrappy goal from a corner or some-such. I remember the game away to Reading on our promotion season where we had failed to break down a resolute Reading defence and to create any sort of meaningful effort on goal only for the ball to hit the ref, Mulryne to turn and volley the ball past the keeper and into the net.

I have also witnessed some pretty woeful Norwich teams grind out some ugly, horrific wins that even on cold winter nights under the floodlights meant you had to cover your eyes at times, like a horror show.

@alex ncfc: "positional placing means naff all at this stage of the seasons, it''s about points on the board, and we are still right in the mix down the bottom."

Actually that is not true. It''s about both and risk. Say you have Man City next - would you rather be 4 points clear of the relegation zone but in 16th or four points clear in say 10th? The more teams we put between ourselves and the relegation zone the better, especially when you have a tough fixture coming up next. It means there are teams bellow us that need results more than us, each one is like a lifeline.

Also -"Plus our goal difference tells you everything and sticks out like a sore thumb."

Ahh, but like positioning, goal difference doesn''t tell you everything. We have played Man City, Arsenal and Chelsea - the goal difference from those games alone is -12. There are teams in or around us who have only played two of the perceived top four (Arsenal, Chelsea, Man Utd, Man City) so far and whose goal difference is marginally better. Now I am not saying being beaten by Man City 7-0 was a good performance or result, just that goal difference in itself is no indicator of anything in terms of the league table. You are better comparing like for like to find a good measure.

As for people saying silly things about Palace and Pulis - to prove your point you are totally discrediting a team that are fighting for their lives and have absolutely nothing to lose. They certainly didn''t just role over yesterday, they fought and in the second half dug in really well - but at the end of the day lacked any sort of real quality to hurt us. That doesn''t make them poor. Poor teams can still be well disciplined in defence. Defending is far easier to coach and instil in players than trying to show and coach players how to be creative and skill full.

It has been said that good teams win no matter what, they can win convincingly, they can win ugly and sometimes, despite not playing at their best for 90mins they can grind out a win.

Yesterday we dominated the first half bar perhaps one counter attack. To the point that we really probably should have had more goals.

There is only two ways it can go after that in the second half, the opposition will dig in and make it harder and give you more of a game of it or they won''t and you''ll continue to have success. It''s football. They made things harder for us but thats about it - 60% possession doesn''t suggest they had the ball for very long.[/quote]

I love the fact that you conveniently chose to ignore that im just responding to the original taunts, insults and abuse from the usual suspects and make it out that im the only one hurling insults around. Facts are that i do not start with the insults, but i certainly respond in the same manner. And why not? when im called a cry baby, an idiot and arrogant do you expect me to just sit here and not respond in the same manner?

Its easy to push forward your argument when you choose to ignore the facts and only highlight the points that strengthen your view.

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I replied to your opening post in exactly the same manner you wrote that post in. you then went off on one as per. None of this bothers me. I''m as happy trading insults with you as I am debating with others.

 

 

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what it all boils down to is the manager is tasked with ensuring the team win the game.

I doubt Chris Hughton''s job description says it needs to be "pretty"...

should we finish where the board hinted at a few weeks ask them whether they care if we did it playing like Brazil or not.

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My opinion is that I don''t think Hughton is a good manager.

I still don''t think he is a good manager and would, ideally, like someone else.

But I am very pleased that we won. And I hope we win tomorrow, like I do with every match.

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[quote user="Tumbleweed"]My opinion is that I don''t think Hughton is a good manager.

I still don''t think he is a good manager and would, ideally, like someone else.

But I am very pleased that we won. And I hope we win tomorrow, like I do with every match.[/quote]

At what stage would you think he was a good manager?   If we start scoring one or two more and carry on winning a few matches, keeping us respectably placed in the league for the rest of the season, would that not constitute good management?   

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Absolutely, those things will help. For me it''s a number of things, including the constant praising of the oppo, the late substitutions, just feeling the team can be a credible force and look "up for it". I''d be delighted if he turned it around, but at the moment I just have too many concerns (these and others). My mind is always open though, and I suppose the manager is just as capable of improving and learning in his job as I am in mine.

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The attitude to fan criticism of Hughton by the board and players is probably best demonstrated by McNally deleting his Twitter account following then incessant criticisms and the players not coming onto Twitter half as much as they used to.

The fact is that Hughton is a decent manager. He''s not a brilliant one, certainly, but he''s only been managing for a few years and there''s every sign that he''s developing and he has gotten off to a good start here.

He did a great job getting us to 11th last year with the team, with an outrageously good unbeaten run and some incredible wins against teams I wouldn''t have dreamt we could have beaten.

Prozone has had us down as having the toughest run of games for the start of the season. Every time that things have looked to start clicking it has been disrupted by international breaks or coming onto a game against one of the top teams. I think confidence in the team is probably not great, doubtless in no small part to the negative and vocal attitude of a minority of fans undermining it and some nasty batterings like Man City (note Tottenham experienced a very similar fate against them recently). I read an article where someone thought Hooper looked like he thought he was offside after his goal against CP because the response of the crowd was so muted and that about sums it up.

As it stands, we''re in an okay position in the league and on target for 40+ points. There are glimmers of something very very promising coming through.

Patience is required. Sacking managers is something you only do in only two scenarios: a)When things really are disastrous (they''re not for us by any stretch of the imagination) or b)if someone comes along who really represents a major positive step, like Pochettino at Southampton. Other than that, stability should be of paramount importance. It''s no coincidence that the biggest managerial successes in the Premier League, Alex Ferguson, Arsene Wenger and David Moyes, had long long tenures there and Alex Ferguson is a perfect example of why you shouldn''t get hysterical over things going amazingly in the early days as his first few seasons at Man U were decidedly lacklustre.

I would like a top 10 finish this season, but personally anything above 17th will be okay by me until we''re strong enough to start making a bid for Champions League football.

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He''s right though, we have come a long way in a short space of time. We''ve now reached a point where it''s tougher to improve any further without billions of pounds of investment. I am happy to live life as a mid/lower prem team. I think after a slow start, things are looking up.

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"So I go back to the original headline, the palace win changes nothing.

Same result, same old Hughton mistakes."

Are you still spouting this bollocks?

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[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"]So I go back to the original headline, the palace win changes nothing.

Same result, same old Hughton mistakes.[/quote]But neither does the loss tonight.Both totally expected results. Disappointing goal difference thanks to Suarez magic but still the 3 point from the 2 games that I expected.

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[quote user="QHcanary"]"So I go back to the original headline, the palace win changes nothing.

Same result, same old Hughton mistakes."

Are you still spouting this bollocks?[/quote]

Please explain why it''s b****** id love to hear it.

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[quote user="Lord Eddard Stark"]You are right Matt the Palace win did change nothing.

Same fickle fans, same pathetic overreaction.[/quote]

I''m not fickle mate, I''ve had the same opinion for 18 months. And overreaction? Well then I''ve been overreacting for 12 months now.

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[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="QHcanary"]"So I go back to the original headline, the palace win changes nothing.

Same result, same old Hughton mistakes."

Are you still spouting this bollocks?[/quote]

Please explain why it''s b****** id love to hear it.[/quote]Tell us how Hughtons mistake caused Suarez''s 42 yarder.

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"Please explain why it''s b****** id love to hear it."

It changed plenty, and you know it. It was the difference between potentially being in he relegation zone after tonight, and there being no chance of that. As it is it''s the difference between us being precariously close to the bottom 3 and being assured that we still won''t be there after the west brom game, whatever the result.

I have been tipped over th edge of wanting him gone tonight, but if he stays and we go on to stay up comfortably then I''m happy to be proven wrong. That won''t be the case for many on here. They''ll never, ever change their minds. Well, all except one.

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HEAR HEAR h.b Matt, but you can''t tell them anything half of these clowns would want Roeder as a replacement as they know sooo sooo much about football. Keep banging the drum and when he''s gone next 3-4 weeks they''ll have to conceded that McNice even finally agree''s with US (the more knowledgeable) peace out bro!!

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[quote user="ricardo"][quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="QHcanary"]"So I go back to the original headline, the palace win changes nothing.

Same result, same old Hughton mistakes."

Are you still spouting this bollocks?[/quote]

Please explain why it''s b****** id love to hear it.[/quote]Tell us how Hughtons mistake caused Suarez''s 42 yarder.[/quote]

Hahaha gladly, cause it''s Hughtons coaching and backroom staff. failing to drill into the centre backs do not back off from a world class striker like Suarez and give him all the time in the world to shoot at will. Something he has done previously which we have failed to learn from. Christ almighty you lot just don''t get it do you.

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[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="ricardo"][quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="QHcanary"]"So I go back to the original headline, the palace win changes nothing.

Same result, same old Hughton mistakes."

Are you still spouting this bollocks?[/quote]

Please explain why it''s b****** id love to hear it.[/quote]Tell us how Hughtons mistake caused Suarez''s 42 yarder.[/quote]

Hahaha gladly, cause it''s Hughtons coaching and backroom staff. failing to drill into the centre backs do not back off from a world class striker like Suarez and give him all the time in the world to shoot at will. Something he has done previously which we have failed to learn from. Christ almighty you lot just don''t get it do you.[/quote]
Haha so true. The usual suspects on here just cower and accept defeat as though we should have no control over it. They didn''t have Sturridge so Suarez should have been our main focus, and we shouldn''t have given him an inch. There are no excuses,

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"Haha so true. The usual suspects on here just cower and accept defeat as though we should have no control over it. They didn''t have Sturridge so Suarez should have been our main focus, and we shouldn''t have given him an inch. There are no excuses,"

Southampton, 2nd best defence in the League, concede an even easier goal to Delph (only 25 yards out).

Sack Pochettino??

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Why??

If the 2nd best defence in the premier league can''t stop a midfielder who hasn''t scored before, why should it be so simple for us to stop an even more amazing shot from a player like Suarez???

Perhaps some shots are genuinely unstoppable????

Tell you what, though, I am starting to worry about Fer. He''s looking a bit too relaxed at times ...

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[quote user="ron obvious"]Why??

If the 2nd best defence in the premier league can''t stop a midfielder who hasn''t scored before, why should it be so simple for us to stop an even more amazing shot from a player like Suarez???

Perhaps some shots are genuinely unstoppable????

Tell you what, though, I am starting to worry about Fer. He''s looking a bit too relaxed at times ...[/quote]
You''ve answered your own problem Ron. Delph isn''t know for scoring, and won''t have been ear marked as a danger man before KO. Suarez is a known scorer, even more reason to restrict him!!!! Really this is basic logic. Southampton with a great defensive record, unlike ours which is equal worst in the league, only lost by 1 goal - not a thrashing. So please tell me your point while you find that leg to stand on?

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[quote user="SeattleCanary"][quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="ricardo"][quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="QHcanary"]"So I go back to the original headline, the palace win changes nothing.

Same result, same old Hughton mistakes."

Are you still spouting this bollocks?[/quote]

Please explain why it''s b****** id love to hear it.[/quote]Tell us how Hughtons mistake caused Suarez''s 42 yarder.[/quote]

Hahaha gladly, cause it''s Hughtons coaching and backroom staff. failing to drill into the centre backs do not back off from a world class striker like Suarez and give him all the time in the world to shoot at will. Something he has done previously which we have failed to learn from. Christ almighty you lot just don''t get it do you.[/quote]
Haha so true. The usual suspects on here just cower and accept defeat as though we should have no control over it. They didn''t have Sturridge so Suarez should have been our main focus, and we shouldn''t have given him an inch. There are no excuses,

[/quote]

 

Who are these usual suspects Seattle? If you''re going to question Norwich supporters in that way at least have the bottle to name them. "usual suspects" is the language of a coward my man. And we don''t need such cowardly people following our club...

 

 

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[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="SeattleCanary"][quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="ricardo"][quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="QHcanary"]"So I go back to the original headline, the palace win changes nothing.

Same result, same old Hughton mistakes."

Are you still spouting this bollocks?[/quote]

Please explain why it''s b****** id love to hear it.[/quote]Tell us how Hughtons mistake caused Suarez''s 42 yarder.[/quote]

Hahaha gladly, cause it''s Hughtons coaching and backroom staff. failing to drill into the centre backs do not back off from a world class striker like Suarez and give him all the time in the world to shoot at will. Something he has done previously which we have failed to learn from. Christ almighty you lot just don''t get it do you.[/quote]
Haha so true. The usual suspects on here just cower and accept defeat as though we should have no control over it. They didn''t have Sturridge so Suarez should have been our main focus, and we shouldn''t have given him an inch. There are no excuses,

[/quote]

 

Who are these usual suspects Seattle? If you''re going to question Norwich supporters in that way at least have the bottle to name them. "usual suspects" is the language of a coward my man. And we don''t need such cowardly people following our club...

 

 

[/quote]
I''m no coward my friend. I was merely generalising to be polite. But if you would like, I mostly class you, Ricardo, Morty and Mrs. Miggins in that category. I do not believe it is a coward who is willing to look at a situation that isn''t working and want to implement change. Those with their heads in the sand are the cowards. I''d be scared to be involved with an organisation led by any of you guys, especially if things warranted a strong leader. The ostrich approach is used by the weak, cowardly and with little self initiative. That isn''t my style, and it isn''t how I live my life. It seems those fans that stand behind Hughton do so because they honestly do not know what else to do, and just hope things will get better all by themselves.
That - in my opinion - is weak and cowardly, and I have no time or respect for people like Hughton and those that support his ideals.
Does that explain my view point better?

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My point is that some goals are simply unstoppable. How far back are we supposed to perpetually man-mark him - 40 yards?50 ?60?

Occasionally (very occasionally) players lob the goalie from the half way line - are you supposed to base your tactics around that?

What people seem to be asking is that we only worry about Suarez. Unfortunately Liverpool have several other players just as capable of scoring, so it''s no good putting extra men on him & leaving us open elsewhere.

It is weird how he completely dominates us though; I think it just goes to show the way confidence bolsters a striker''s instincts. Suarez just "knows" he''s going to score against us, so he''s fearless & will try anything.

We do not get close enough to players when defending, though. We look neat & tidy - but lacking in bite & drive.

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