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Why did the 'lambert Philosphy need to change?'

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Having had fantastic years under lambert, Hughton comes in and has obviously changed so much tactically. Why though? Under lambert of course we shipped goals so the defence needed addressing- albeit maybe tweaking.

Hughton of course wanted to stamp his mark on the team and their way of playing, but has that been the problem? It is a team that, although has changed personel wise, is almost unrecognisable from under lambert on a matchday. We used to give games a go and look confident. Under Hughton not so much.

Maybe Hughton changed the style of play too much. If it ain''t broke don''t mess with it!

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I did not need to and the fact that we picked a negative rather than a positive manager lays at the heart of our problems. We should have been smart like swansea and get a manager to suit the squad rather than the other way around

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We need a prolific goalscorer...Gary Doherty come on down!

Hughton seems to have just changed too much and Holt''s summer interview with McVeigh and the comments he made about Hughtons style of play seem very justified!

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I didn''t see much negativity when CH at Newcastle plundered 100 goals in the Championship.

It''s all about what you see as the best chance of getting the necessary number of points. What people forget is that even under PL the wheels were coming off at the back end of that season, we lost 7 of the last 13 games including 6-1 to Citeh, 2-0 at Blackburn and 3-0 at home to Liverpool in succession.

Clearly all managers have a different philosophy on the best way to get results. CH, at Premier League level where much of the time we play sides with better players than us, seems to prefer a more rigid style which, let''s not forget, has proved very successful at Carrow Road.

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It''s now apparent that Hughton was on a loser as soon as he got the job. Anyone would have been. The next manager won''t have things so difficult because he will only have to live up to Hughton who I read on here is our worst ever manager...,

 

 

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For years to come, I will remember the likes of the (tactical) 1-0 wins against Arsenal and Utd (under CH), far more than the parping in my pants, every time a team got within 30 yards of our goal (under PL)

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crabbycanary wrote the following post at 2013-12-06 6:00 PM:

For years to come, I will remember the likes of the (tactical) 1-0 wins against Arsenal and Utd (under CH), far more than the parping in my pants, every time a team got within 30 yards of our goal (under PL)

What football did you enjoy watching more CC over the last Three and a half seasons seasons, Lamberts NCFC or Hughtons NCFC?

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Looking back at the posts during our first season back and it seems that the diamond was cracked, 442 wasn''t working, the players being bought in we no better than what we had, we were being found out defensively, our naivety was showing and Lambert needed to change things or we''d become victims of second season syndrome.

 

Makes you think.

 

 

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[quote user="City 2nd"]crabbycanary wrote the following post at 2013-12-06 6:00 PM:

For years to come, I will remember the likes of the (tactical) 1-0 wins against Arsenal and Utd (under CH), far more than the parping in my pants, every time a team got within 30 yards of our goal (under PL)

What football did you enjoy watching more CC over the last Three and a half seasons seasons, Lamberts NCFC or Hughtons NCFC?[/quote]

Naughty, naughty.

I was talking about the Prem, where all the prizes are.

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Under Lambert we''d have been relegated last season, he knew that as well. He''s gone, he''s never coming back, get over it.

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Why? Cos he f*cked off that''s why.

Whatever, i think the style of play we had under PL in the first season back in the Prem had been sussed by the opposition before the end of that season and i suspect last season would have been even tougher were PL still manager then.

However, there is also no doubt that we are lacking self belief now when we take to the pitch away from home and its costing us dearly.

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[quote user="Beefy is a legend"]I didn''t see much negativity when CH at Newcastle plundered 100 goals in the Championship.

It''s all about what you see as the best chance of getting the necessary number of points. What people forget is that even under PL the wheels were coming off at the back end of that season, we lost 7 of the last 13 games including 6-1 to Citeh, 2-0 at Blackburn and 3-0 at home to Liverpool in succession.

Clearly all managers have a different philosophy on the best way to get results. CH, at Premier League level where much of the time we play sides with better players than us, seems to prefer a more rigid style which, let''s not forget, has proved very successful at Carrow Road.[/quote]Championship football isnt as difficult as Premier League football.

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It didn''t need to change (It''s a stupid myth, under Laundrup Swansea now play exactly the same way we used to) and I honestly don''t think that was the boards intention. Nobody on here had any idea Hughtons football would be as dour and negative as it has been. There was certainly no evidence of this at his former clubs.

Sometimes it''s as simple as some managers just don''t work out at certain clubs and that''s the case with Hughton here

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Whoareyou

We actually picked up more points in the second half of the season than the first, the job was done by March anyway, it''s no wonder we took our foot off the gas in terms of performance a bit but even so we didn''t exactly fall apart did we?

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We had a very direct (not route 1 but direct) counter-attacking style under Lambert which was ideal for away games.  I always felt other teams would suss it out.  Often we came away from games (eg WBA) with the other side feeling we had stolen the points.

 

Oddly, Villa are still playing the same style, in fact even more so if anything.  Their win at our place this season was a classic example, we had most of the play and most of the chances, but they took their chances.  It felt like they picked our pockets.  This explains why Villa have done well this year away from home but are rubbish at home.  Will Villa get sussed out and begin to struggle ?  I hope and expect they will, but time will tell.

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A case of making best use of his available resources. Our attack from the first prem season was always going to get found out eventually.

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IMO it was the correct time for Lambert to move on. He''d reached a cross roads and was without doubt in unchartered territory. In our first season he had the players playing magnificently, well above their actual level of ability. He was an inspirational leader who was able to get his players to run through walls for him and essentially over achieve. This sort of management style doesn''t have a long shelf life though and it was no doubt very tiring for the players to keep performing to their current levels. Lambert knew this. He knew he couldn''t get the same players to perform and achieve to the same standard for another premiership season. The evidence was our finish to the season, we became tired and we''re getting "found out".

 

So Lambert ceased the opportunity to join Villa. A job which would carry little pressure after the Mcleish debacle. He could hardly fail. However failure to kick on this season with the villa will see him under big pressure next year. Lambert was a leader but not  brilliant manager.

 

So I do believe we had to change the emphasis a little. We still had fairly average players of whom some we''re only championship quality. With Hughton being more of a coach, he seemed like an ideal candidate. A coach is able to analyse the game and work on players attributes and ultimately change styles. Which was needed at the time as we struggled towards the end of the first season. Despite a shaky start, using mainly the same key players for the previous season, Hughton was able to successfully change our style and pick up a lot of points during a ten game unbeaten run. Hughton managed to get the Team overachieving again, but this time it was with good coaching and clever tactics.

The problem with Hughton however, is that he isn''t a leader. He''s unable to get the players motivated and now is struggling big time. So where lambert lacked the coaching ability, Hughton lacks the leadership.

 

So the point is that neither are really good enough to take us further. We need someone new who can inspire but also who knows how to coach. I don''t know who that someone is but I wish we''d quickly find him.

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Crabby canary wrote:

I was talking about the Prem, where all the prizes are.

Ok which football did you prefer in the prem, that of Lamberts team or that of Hughtons?

You have two full seasons to compare, and an extra half season for Mr Hughton? No ducking the question, and no league position debate, which side entertained you?

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Fo the reasons stated by TCCanary, plus its actually rare for any new Manager to keep the same philosophy, they all have there own way of playing, different training methods and beliefs and have different opinions around the players they want in their squad. When the day comes and we have a new Manager it will be all change again.......the days of a certain club playing a certain way for years are just about over, just ask West Ham fans and also Man U fans...

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Yorkshire Canary wrote the following post at 06/12/2013 1:36 PM:

I did not need to and the fact that we picked a negative rather than a positive manager lays at the heart of our problems. We should have been smart like swansea and get a manager to suit the squad rather than the other way around

Your right Yorkshire, we took in a man to essentially try to consolidate the progress made under Lambert where as in fact we have regressed.

A big but understandable mistake by the board.

The real way to progress would of course have been as you suggest, the Swansea model where we would have seen a manager appointed who would develop the style of play rather than destroy it!

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[quote user="Beefy is a legend"]I didn''t see much negativity when CH at Newcastle plundered 100 goals in the Championship. .[/quote]

newcastle had a team full of premier league and international players that season,  a blind Alsatian trained by phil brown could have got them promoted

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[quote user="iron_stan"][quote user="Beefy is a legend"]I didn''t see much negativity when CH at Newcastle plundered 100 goals in the Championship. .[/quote]

newcastle had a team full of premier league and international players that season,  a blind Alsatian trained by phil brown could have got them promoted[/quote]

How come they were in that division?

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also, despite my fond dislike of mike ashley you cant deny he made that right call by getting rid of hughton when he did

sooner mcnally does the same the better

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iron_stan wrote the following post at 06/12/2013 8:15 PM:

also, despite my fond dislike of mike ashley you cant deny he made that right call by getting rid of hughton when he did

sooner mcnally does the same the better

Indeed

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the "Lambert Philosophy" has got us where we are today.. as said above the cracks had started to appear.. Lambert knew this and got out at the right time... had he have stayed we''d be a championship club now...the ethos he instilled was still prevalent last season, unfortunately now that Hughton is well established here its the mantra he is trying to change... I fully believe if Lambert was here and we had stayed up we''d still be getting similar results to now...it takes time to change a system... if hughton does leave the the seeds he has sewn will be seen in 12 months... what will a new manager add or take away from this?

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I remember Hughton saying in one of his first interviews words to the effect of '' Paul done wonderful things with this club and I want to build from this and keep the momentum going''.

The next question would be has he done this?

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The wheels falling off, Lambert knew we''d been figured out so jumped ship......... these types of reasoning are pure li''l Norwich, trying to rationalize, we''d be relegated by now, loser mentality.

What was figured out? We finished with more points than last season, and he was in demand. Who''s fans are chanting for CH to come join them?

It looks WAY more like CH has been figured out. Clog the middle and they won''t score more than 1 if you press. Then calmly pass the ball around until there''s an opening and fire away. You''ll be hard put to not score two. And if Norwich is visiting, just say Boo! and tthey''ll play scared.

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