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lake district canary

Will Hughton-outers concede...

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...that maybe, just maybe, that it may be better to keep Hughton this season, given yesterday''s second half performance.   If the players can react to a situation like that, then surely there is something good there and it would be better to keep what we have than risk the upheaval and gamble of a change of manager?Shearer summed it up for me.  First half we were lacking in confidence, needed a little luck to get going, but once we got the confidence up there was only one winner.   So its got more to do with confidence than lack of ability/tactics/luck, etc etc.

I like a lot of hughton supporters were beginning to waiver as to whether he should stay, but am a lot more encouraged - after all a win is a win.......

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I''m not "Pro-Hughton" or "Anti-Hughton", I''m "Pro-Norwich City".

If we can reproduce that 2nd half performance against Newcastle and Palace then I''ll be happy for him to stay on. I do not want to be seeing any repeats of the 2 Manchester visits or yesterday''s first half display any time soon.

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What Mr B said.

A few more results like that and people will be much happier. The confidence of the team and fans needs rebuilding and that was the perfect start.

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It''s easy to say now, but I was always in the camp that it would be better for all concerned if Hughton was able to turn it round.

One swallow doesn''t make a summer and all that, but the fight and spirit shown in the second half was very encouraging.

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Excellent win, thoroughly enjoyed the second half.

The game changer was the penalty which had very little to do with CH, the players confidence improved and we played well after that.

We knew howWest Ham were going to set up and yet allowed ourselves to be

completely over run in the first half, tactically poor IMO.

Pilks was totally crocked which was obvious to anyone that was there, yet Hughton left him on the pitch for far to long and he was complicit in West Hams first goal, very poor lack of decisive action by the manager.

Another game which was much more about the players lifting themselves than managerial input.

Excellent final result which I do hope will lead to a change in our fortunes but I give the manager little credit for it.

Just think what that squad could archive if they were well managed and had tactical strategies that sent them on to the field with a tactical advantage rather than a deficit.

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All anyone wants is acceptable performance levels, and players and management coming up with tactics and application that makes us competitive on the pitch and not a laughing stock like we have been lately... it''s not a political persuasion, it''s not racial and it''s not personal... play to the level we should be capable of and everyones happy... people on here try and turn the hughton question into something it isn''t.

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Sorry Vanwink, I don''t know how you can''t give Hughton at least some credit. He obviously said SOMETHING at half time.

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I think we all know by now that "Hughton outers" aren''t will to concede on anything

 

Most of them went into Nuclear bunkers last night and were unable to fully enjoy a Norwich win, that makes the win all the sweeter for me.

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[quote user="Vanwink"]Excellent win, thoroughly enjoyed the second half.

The game changer was the penalty which had very little to do with CH, the players confidence improved and we played well after that.

We knew howWest Ham were going to set up and yet allowed ourselves to be

completely over run in the first half, tactically poor IMO.

Pilks was totally crocked which was obvious to anyone that was there, yet Hughton left him on the pitch for far to long and he was complicit in West Hams first goal, very poor lack of decisive action by the manager.

Another game which was much more about the players lifting themselves than managerial input.

Excellent final result which I do hope will lead to a change in our fortunes but I give the manager little credit for it.

Just think what that squad could archive if they were well managed and had tactical strategies that sent them on to the field with a tactical advantage rather than a deficit.[/quote]

 

...see

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What Hughton did at half time was to push the back 4 up the pitch 5-10 yards and drop the front 2 a little deeper squeezing the space their midfield where enjoying in the first half and getting us a foothold in the game. It was a subtle change but it had a big impact on the outcome of the game.

Credit where it''s due.

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As in the same way that one defeat didn''t convince me that Hughton had to go this most recent 45 minutes hasn''t swung my opinion back round.

he still has a record of only 7 wins in 32 games after all.

 

 

What I will concede is that whilst I still firmly believe that he isn''t the guy to move us on a level I now think he can keep this squad up but it will be another nail biting slog.  

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So LDC claims the high ground and gives it the told you so routine but I think it should be saved until after the next two games against Newcastle and Palace. Yesterday was indeed a far better performance from the moment Hooper confidently smashed the penalty home but the first half was dire with the same old problems evident. Yes we ALL want things to continue to improve and you do no favours LDC with attempting to keep the Inners and Outers divided with this provocative thread title also please remember that Hughton has difficulty in adding consistency to his armour.

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[quote user="TIL 1010"]So LDC claims the high ground and gives it the told you so routine but I think it should be saved until after the next two games against Newcastle and Palace. Yesterday was indeed a far better performance from the moment Hooper confidently smashed the penalty home but the first half was dire with the same old problems evident. Yes we ALL want things to continue to improve and you do no favours LDC with attempting to keep the Inners and Outers divided with this provocative thread title also please remember that Hughton has difficulty in adding consistency to his armour. [/quote]

I feel that consistency is what Hughton was trying to achieve last year.  Consistently good in the run before Christmas and then trying to maintain a consistency after Christmas, but unable to achieve the high levels of pre-Christmas.   I am sure he is trying to do the same again with improved attacking play, but the balance between consistency and potency is a hard one to achieve.

"Told you so"?  No.   Just trying to see if some people are flexible enough in their views to see that what might be good for the club may be better than their crusade to get rid of a manager whatever he does, good or bad.

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Mr Brownstone wrote the following post at 10/11/2013 9:30 AM:

What Hughton did at half time was to push the back 4 up the pitch 5-10 yards and drop the front 2 a little deeper squeezing the space their midfield where enjoying in the first half and getting us a foothold in the game. It was a subtle change but it had a big impact on the outcome of the game.

Credit where it''s due.

I agree with what you say Mr Brownstone and I do accept that we were more effective at countering their mid field dominance in the second half. However, I would have expected CH to be aware of the way West Ham play, he would not have been surprised I am sure by their mid field superiority, why didn''t we go out from the off intent on denying them space? The game could have already been lost by half time!

Pilks injury only made it worse for us and he was left on for for far too long.

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Of course there are some who want Hughton out whatever, Lakey, but it would be an absolute travesty if you were suggesting that all of us who have had severe reservations over the last few weeks/months are thus minded.

Of course I''m happy with the result. Who wouldn''t be ? But, as others have said, it was only one win against a pretty limited WHU side, and our first 45 was absolutely DIRE.

I have been consistent in saying that CH should be given till end Nov to show some evidence that he''s turning it round, and I stick to that. Welcome as last night was, and it may be that he''s been woken up to the seriousness of the plight, and the need for a different approach,but it''ll need a lot more of what we saw in the second half last night to convince me that, long term, he''s the correct man for the job.

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"]Of course there are some who want Hughton out whatever, Lakey, but it would be an absolute travesty if you were suggesting that all of us who have had severe reservations over the last few weeks/months are thus minded. [/quote]

And of course I''m not suggesting that in the slightest.  Merely trying to get through to some of the apparently closed minded few who persist in some kind of crusade which says more about them than it does about the football club and its well being.

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I don''t want to be described as an inner or an outer. I don''t agree with a lot of his management style. But Hoot deserved a proper chance this season, and wanting him out based on five games which included the four best teams in the league was ludicrous.

As for Saturday... at half time it really felt like it could be a Burnley moment. But the Jussi howler was that little bit of luck we didn''t get against Cardiff. Once the goal went in, there was only one team in it.

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The one and only problem i have with Hughton is that i have seen no progress from his tactics.

Its the same old stuff game in game out.

He is not getting the best out of the players we have.

This side has some great players, but hughton doesnt seem capable of getting the best out of them.

Its hard not to have a go at our strikers, but the reality is, there getting no service at all from the midfield.

I dont know why, but its like we dont even try to set up the front men. All our goals are comming from midfield,

The system he relies on just doesnt seem to work.

Beating wet spam, only papers over the cracks, because we were second best against them, appart from two individual moments of glory.

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I want what is best for my club and the second 45 delivered us 3 points yesterday. HOWEVER look at our performances this season and I think it would be fair to say on balance the blip in performance was those 45 compared to the dire tripe served up in other times.Can this be the catalyst for us to start turning in match winning performances? I hope so.Does this mean I am happy to let Hughton run with it no matter the results? No - for me he is still and should be on very thin ice - the 3 points really blind fans, did they see the first 45?Do I know who should replace him should he go? No - I don''t and it''s never going to be my decision.

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[quote user="Buh"]

I think we all know by now that "Hughton outers" aren''t will to concede on anything

 

Most of them went into Nuclear bunkers last night and were unable to fully enjoy a Norwich win, that makes the win all the sweeter for me.

[/quote]I could take this from Morty or Nutty Nigel who regularly argue their point but it''s funny how you''ve only appeared on here when we''ve won.... Is your surname McNally?

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some people have very short memories

nothing has really changed as the first 45 minutes showed, watch what happens away to Newcastle ;)

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some people have very short memories

nothing has really changed as the first 45 minutes showed, watch what happens away to Newcastle

Stan...what would you like to see happen away at Newcastle? I''m not trying to be an arse but I am genuinely interested?

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I don''t expect anyone to concede anything frankly. It was a game of two halves, the result count more than the performance (depending on your opinion)People who are negative will point to the first half, people looking for positives will point to the second.

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 I totally agree with the "pro Norwich city " as I said on another thread ..my genuine belief is that  most supporters feel the same ...the managers come and go ..good and bad ...  it just makes our green and yellow blood boil when we think that some one , be it a player or manager is letting "us " the club down . I am an optimist ,,, and hoping that the players can repeat that commitment , together with an increasing confidence ,,, who knows where we can go with it ? OTBC

 

[quote user="Mr Brownstone"]I''m not "Pro-Hughton" or "Anti-Hughton", I''m "Pro-Norwich City".

If we can reproduce that 2nd half performance against Newcastle and Palace then I''ll be happy for him to stay on. I do not want to be seeing any repeats of the 2 Manchester visits or yesterday''s first half display any time soon.[/quote]

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[quote user="killiecanary"]some people have very short memories

nothing has really changed as the first 45 minutes showed, watch what happens away to Newcastle

Stan...what would you like to see happen away at Newcastle? I''m not trying to be an arse but I am genuinely interested?[/quote]i would like 3 pointsbut i expect the same negative cr@p hughton has dished up for 98% of the time hes been in charge, we will set up for the draw, hoping to snatch as point, and we will lose to an in form newcastle team who we should be capable of competing with

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[quote user="morty"]I don''t expect anyone to concede anything frankly. It was a game of two halves, the result count more than the performance (depending on your opinion)People who are negative will point to the first half, people looking for positives will point to the second.[/quote]

I do wish people would stop spouting this positive/ negative people twaddle. Frankly I expect a better use of adjective from you, Morty.

As others have said, we all wish the best for NCFC, but just have different view as to how it can be attained. Just because we don''t agree with all things Chris Hughton does not make us" negative people". Any more than those who''ve had their heads turned by thirty odd minutes in the second half last evening are "positive people "

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"][quote user="morty"]I don''t expect anyone to concede anything frankly. It was a game of two halves, the result count more than the performance (depending on your opinion)People who are negative will point to the first half, people looking for positives will point to the second.[/quote]

I do wish people would stop spouting this positive/ negative people twaddle. Frankly I expect a better use of adjective from you, Morty.

As others have said, we all wish the best for NCFC, but just have different view as to how it can be attained. Just because we don''t agree with all things Chris Hughton does not make us" negative people". Any more than those who''ve had their heads turned by thirty odd minutes in the second half last evening are "positive people "[/quote]Twaddle? I think its pretty obvious that this forum has fallen into two distinct camps, people who are positive about Chris Hughton, and people are negative. And I doubt the game yesterday would make anyone take an opposite stance to what they held before.Seems to me though that some people, rather than concede that we got a good result, and just be happy for their team winning, would rather hide behind phrases like "we got lucky" and "I only want the best for Norwich City" rather than actually give the team and the manager a bit of credit.

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The jury continues to be out. I make no secret of being an outer but also concede if he actually is able to manage and effect our team tactically other than choosing the team he still has a chance to win me round.

The biggest problem we have had consistently since his arrival continues to be getting the whole team to play has a cohesive unit especially in any formation without 2 up front.

There are any number of options that could be attempted but much of the time CH has been manager has been matter of trying to squeeze highly talented square pegs into round holes.

Nobody really expects Norwich to get a result away at Old Trafford or the Etihad but we would expect a manager to have a game plan, change it if it was not working and finally throw a wild card in to try and learn something about the team and players even when the game is lost.

Fans would be far less critical if we thought CH was making progression with the squad even if it were ruling out options.

For me admitting to be a Howson sceptic last season I still feel the biggest mistake we are currently having whilst playing 4-5-1 is playing him as an AM. I concede he is a great player who must be one of the first names on the sheet but strongly feel he should not be so far forward.

He is a great runner with the ball and as yesterday, WBA and Man City have shown he can still fire his rockets from deeper.

We need an attacking midfielder with a range of passing and link up play as well as an eye for goal, this is the biggest weakness in our squad.

Ideally I would like to see Hooper behind RVW but don''t expect that to happen especially away from home.

Whilst Tettey is injured I would like to see us try to Play Fer further forward or try Snoddy or Redmond behind the Striker.

I personally cant consider the performance levels pre last Christmas high despite the results.

If Hughton can show a flexible approach and create chances then i''m happy to give him longer to prove he has the skills but it would be strange considering his inflexible tactics thus far.

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I know you''ll dismiss this as splitting hairs, Morty, but just because someone has a bit of a pessimistic feeling about CH does not make them a "person who is negative" which is what you wrote. Same with optimistic/positive.

I''d rather describe myself as someone who is sceptical about the Hughton régime . I''m not convinced that he''s the best man for the job, and I''ll reiterate that it''ll take a good deal more than 45 mins for me to be convinced otherwise.

If it makes you feel any better, OK ,I''ll agree that there may have been some actions by CH that were at least instrumental in the 2nd half improvement, but frankly, I''d rather give full credit to the team who collectivelypulled themselves up by their bootlaces and took advantage of the slice of fortune they had. Not always easy to do.

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