William Darby 0 Posted April 27, 2014 I find it funny that, at the time Wiz was constantly mis-quoted as saying ''will relegate us''Now we probably will. It gets flopped back to the correct ''could relegate us'' and is used to have a another dig at him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
# 0 Posted April 28, 2014 [quote user="Private Frazer"]I find it funny that, at the time Wiz was constantly mis-quoted as saying ''will relegate us'' Now we probably will. It gets flopped back to the correct ''could relegate us'' and is used to have a another dig at him.[/quote] Ah, but a prophet is never regornized in his own village Frazer.[;)] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 997 Posted April 28, 2014 "Would" or "Could", which word you use does not really make much difference, it looks very much like beating West Ham saved Chris Hughtons skin at the time, so for me I agree with the OP (I did not at the time) beating WHU could relegate us...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lappinitup 629 Posted April 28, 2014 [quote user="Wiz"][quote user="Private Frazer"]I find it funny that, at the time Wiz was constantly mis-quoted as saying ''will relegate us'' Now we probably will. It gets flopped back to the correct ''could relegate us'' and is used to have a another dig at him.[/quote] Ah, but a prophet is never regornized in his own village Frazer.[;)][/quote]But the idiot is Wiz. [:D] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TCCANARY 263 Posted April 28, 2014 [quote user="Wiz"][quote user="Private Frazer"]I find it funny that, at the time Wiz was constantly mis-quoted as saying ''will relegate us'' Now we probably will. It gets flopped back to the correct ''could relegate us'' and is used to have a another dig at him.[/quote] Ah, but a prophet is never regornized in his own village Frazer.[;)][/quote] But an idiot is although I''ve got a feeling that in your village you all take turns in being the idiot. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nutty nigel 7,351 Posted April 28, 2014 [quote user="Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB"]"Would" or "Could", which word you use does not really make much difference, it looks very much like beating West Ham saved Chris Hughtons skin at the time, so for me I agree with the OP (I did not at the time) beating WHU could relegate us......[/quote] But by the same token losing to West Ham could have relegated us weeks ago. There''s absolutely nothing to suggest that a change would have made up those three points let alone any more. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Satoshi Nakamoto 0 Posted April 28, 2014 I think had we replaced Hughton at the time with anyone or anything else such as a stuffed alligator or the "inanimate boron rod" somebody suggested on another thread, we would have more points than we do now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Satoshi Nakamoto 0 Posted April 28, 2014 So if beating West Ham spared Hughton the sack, then that victory was a mortal self - inflicted wound and it has relegated us. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Smith 2,290 Posted April 28, 2014 That game summed up our problem under Hughton and also why he was allowed to continue to inflict his damage for as long as he was.As I recall a terrible team selection and tactics (going 4 in midfield against a side with 6 midfielders) and we were incredibly lucky they were not out of sight at half time. He was surely on his way out and we hadn''t started the second half any better but then their keeper needlessly dropped the ball and cleaned out Hooper giving us a penalty and a lifeline and a surge of second half attacking spirit rarely seen under Hughton. The most telling point being that we didn''t get back in the game due to tactics or some inspired Hughton team talk but rather a lucky break which saw us turn things around and ultimately kept him in his job.The thing with surviving due to scraping results in "must win home games" (which under Hughton is the only way it would ever be since we surrendered so abjectly away most weeks) is that it will only work if you have winnable games at regular intervals. Thats why the end of this season looked so intimidating because it was clear that after WBA there were no get out of jail free fixtures left. That''s why any failure to beat Stoke and/or WBA was always going to be so damaging to us and so it has proven. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TCCANARY 263 Posted April 28, 2014 [quote user="Jim Smith"]That game summed up our problem under Hughton and also why he was allowed to continue to inflict his damage for as long as he was. As I recall a terrible team selection and tactics (going 4 in midfield against a side with 6 midfielders) and we were incredibly lucky they were not out of sight at half time. He was surely on his way out and we hadn''t started the second half any better but then their keeper needlessly dropped the ball and cleaned out Hooper giving us a penalty and a lifeline and a surge of second half attacking spirit rarely seen under Hughton. The most telling point being that we didn''t get back in the game due to tactics or some inspired Hughton team talk but rather a lucky break which saw us turn things around and ultimately kept him in his job. The thing with surviving due to scraping results in "must win home games" (which under Hughton is the only way it would ever be since we surrendered so abjectly away most weeks) is that it will only work if you have winnable games at regular intervals. Thats why the end of this season looked so intimidating because it was clear that after WBA there were no get out of jail free fixtures left. That''s why any failure to beat Stoke and/or WBA was always going to be so damaging to us and so it has proven.[/quote] So you know for a fact what the team talk contained? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Smith 2,290 Posted April 28, 2014 [quote user="TCCANARY"][quote user="Jim Smith"]That game summed up our problem under Hughton and also why he was allowed to continue to inflict his damage for as long as he was. As I recall a terrible team selection and tactics (going 4 in midfield against a side with 6 midfielders) and we were incredibly lucky they were not out of sight at half time. He was surely on his way out and we hadn''t started the second half any better but then their keeper needlessly dropped the ball and cleaned out Hooper giving us a penalty and a lifeline and a surge of second half attacking spirit rarely seen under Hughton. The most telling point being that we didn''t get back in the game due to tactics or some inspired Hughton team talk but rather a lucky break which saw us turn things around and ultimately kept him in his job. The thing with surviving due to scraping results in "must win home games" (which under Hughton is the only way it would ever be since we surrendered so abjectly away most weeks) is that it will only work if you have winnable games at regular intervals. Thats why the end of this season looked so intimidating because it was clear that after WBA there were no get out of jail free fixtures left. That''s why any failure to beat Stoke and/or WBA was always going to be so damaging to us and so it has proven.[/quote] So you know for a fact what the team talk contained?  [/quote]Well if it transpires that the team talk involved Hooper being instructed to stand next to the keeper and win a spawny penalty against the run of play then i will hold my hands up on this one and admit i was wrong but there was no discernable difference in performance level until we go that lucky break.In my opinion (and no I have not actually heard what was said) its very, very clear to anyone who has watched us this season that the response after half time against Liverpool recently was in a different universe to anything we saw under Hughton during his tenure. I just don;t believe he fired them up. i think his half time teamtalks were probably more about keeping our shape and not getting carried away. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TCCANARY 263 Posted April 28, 2014 But we beat West Ham & lost to Liverpool making the tactics against West Ham in the second half better. And as it''s only your opinion you should have started the first paragraph stating that as well, where you saw ''no discernible difference'' & ''against the run of play'' others saw a switch in the midfield and emphasis on getting the ball into the box quicker, but then again it''s only opinion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Smith 2,290 Posted April 28, 2014 [quote user="TCCANARY"]  But we beat West Ham & lost to Liverpool making the tactics against West Ham in the second half better. And as it''s only your opinion you should have started the first paragraph stating that as well, where you saw ''no discernible difference'' & ''against the run of play'' others saw a switch in the midfield and emphasis on getting the ball into the box quicker, but then again it''s only opinion.   [/quote]Well if that''s how others saw it then they are entitled to their opinion but I would respectfully disagree. My view is we got a (rare) lucky break that sparked us into life in that game. Until the penalty the second half was progressing very much like the appalling first half. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Smith 2,290 Posted April 28, 2014 [quote user="TCCANARY"]  But we beat West Ham & lost to Liverpool making the tactics against West Ham in the second half better. And as it''s only your opinion you should have started the first paragraph stating that as well, where you saw ''no discernible difference'' & ''against the run of play'' others saw a switch in the midfield and emphasis on getting the ball into the box quicker, but then again it''s only opinion.   [/quote]Well if that''s how others saw it then they are entitled to their opinion but I would respectfully disagree. My view is we got a (rare) lucky break that sparked us into life in that game. Until the penalty the second half was progressing very much like the appalling first half. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TCCANARY 263 Posted April 28, 2014 [quote user="Jim Smith"][quote user="TCCANARY"] But we beat West Ham & lost to Liverpool making the tactics against West Ham in the second half better. And as it''s only your opinion you should have started the first paragraph stating that as well, where you saw ''no discernible difference'' & ''against the run of play'' others saw a switch in the midfield and emphasis on getting the ball into the box quicker, but then again it''s only opinion. [/quote] Well if that''s how others saw it then they are entitled to their opinion but I would respectfully disagree. My view is we got a (rare) lucky break that sparked us into life in that game. Until the penalty the second half was progressing very much like the appalling first half.[/quote] The second half was only nine minutes old when we got the penalty, that''s hardly any time at all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 997 Posted April 28, 2014 You want to talk Chris Hughtons tactics TCC?, explain the capitulation to a very poor Fulham side at home (still rankles with me), 1-0 up and the opposition there for the taking, what do we do, go for the kill, nah we "shut up shop" and lose 2-1 to a side that are so poor defensively Hull stuck six past them in the very next game........... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nutty nigel 7,351 Posted April 28, 2014 As people say what would have happened is only opinion. But my old buddy Jim likes to put anything positive that did happen down to luck. I would say it''s pretty impossible to get 32 points from 33 games in this league through luck. We also did have 2nd half performances equal to that against Liverpool. I would say the second halves against Chelsea and Man City were equally as good. In fact the second half against Chelsea was probably better. IMO the idea that somone tactically inept could get any points in a league that contains so many world class coaches and players is laughable. But getting back to facts if we hadn''t beaten West Ham we''d have 29 points now. So all that''s left to cling on to is the belief that a new manager could have got 3 more points than Hughton from the following games which I think is unlikely. Having only 32 points with those 5 games remaining made rolling the dice a reasobale gamble but it hasn''t paid off yet. And SOBs opinion about Fulham is reasonable but we didn''t put it right in the return fixture. I woulod say we played better in the away games at West Ham and Cardiff. IMO Hughton was responsible for the squad that hasn''t been good enough. It''s not impossible that 32 points from 33 games was in fact an achievement. Again my opinion but I believe whatever happened in the last few games he would have been gone in the summer. His job being the price he paid for not making us better equipped to compete. Because of the severity of the situation the dice was rolled. But ultimately only the players can keep us up. They now have 2 games to do it but will have to apply themselves better than they have dome before andafter Hughton was sacked. And that would be ther case whoever was manager. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TCCANARY 263 Posted April 29, 2014 [quote user="Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB"]You want to talk Chris Hughtons tactics TCC?, explain the capitulation to a very poor Fulham side at home (still rankles with me), 1-0 up and the opposition there for the taking, what do we do, go for the kill, nah we "shut up shop" and lose 2-1 to a side that are so poor defensively Hull stuck six past them in the very next game...........[/quote] Good examples of where the tactics didn''t work and the manager should take the blame but you must also be prepared to praise the manager when the tactics do work don''t put it down to luck and ''spawny'' penalties as Jim has. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Worthy Nigelton 1,015 Posted April 29, 2014 Whatever you say, Wiz was right, and 90% of Norwich fans agree with him. Beating West Ham probably has relegated us. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,585 Posted April 29, 2014 [quote user="Worthy Nigelton"]Whatever you say, Wiz was right, and 90% of Norwich fans agree with him. Beating West Ham probably has relegated us.[/quote]Nope, losing to West Brom was what done it! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
morty 0 Posted April 29, 2014 [quote user="Herman "][quote user="Worthy Nigelton"]Whatever you say, Wiz was right, and 90% of Norwich fans agree with him. Beating West Ham probably has relegated us.[/quote]Nope, losing to West Brom was what done it![/quote][Y] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 997 Posted April 30, 2014 With the new manger in charge we would have beaten WBA (and Fulham0 and we would now be safe....... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nutty nigel 7,351 Posted April 30, 2014 Maybe. But we may have lost to Spurs and Man Citeh. Bottom line for me is that with the so called shackles off and the so called dead cat bounce nothing has changed. We failed to score at Fulham and capitulated at OT. In between we had a spirited second half performance at home to Liverpool. Something we''d done previously at home to big teams. Ultimately no points though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hoolahans Left Foot 0 Posted April 30, 2014 I would rather have lost so Houghton got sacked............................ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
William Darby 0 Posted May 7, 2014 There you go we beat Wet Spam and got relegated................Thread Locked.......................... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tetteys Jig 830 Posted May 7, 2014 This thread was the most accurate thing I''ve read all season in hindsight. Along with that RVW article in August. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,585 Posted May 7, 2014 ...and all it took was about 40,000 posts to predict something . Well done [Y] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
William Darby 0 Posted May 7, 2014 No Names, but this is a good bit of bants in the thread.........................................................................."So the Op''s worst case scenario is which of the following exactly?We win, Hughton stays and we win and draw a few more games reaching a strong mid-table position by Xmas.Or......We win, Hughton stays then we lose, lose lose, lose, lose, lose,lose, lose and the Board don''t even notice the losses until Xmas.Because I think I could guess which is the more unlikely scenario"........................................................................ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
William Darby 0 Posted May 7, 2014 I bet he guessed wrongly. lol Share this post Link to post Share on other sites