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SeattleCanary

To clear up the "Hughton out" reasoning!

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I know there are a lot of posts about the game on here.

My post is simple, i want to set the record straight from my perspective. I''m sick of people slating the "Hughton out" brigade saying those people should get behind him and the team.

Obviously we want to, and should. But all these fans calling others pant wetters, and saying we should give him time to gel the team etc. Thats what pre season is for firstly. Most importantly, no one would give a sh*t if we lost if we tried hard and played proper football!!

We''ve lost games under Lambert but no one called for his head because we were generally unlucky or it wasnt our day. Today we were our own enemy, and weren''t unlucky, just piss poor.

I can see the negativity in the passing, there is no attempted threaded through balls, no one-twos, not even any real crosses any more. THIS IS BASIC STUFF FFS!!!

So to all of you "supporters" of this tripe on facebook and here and everywhere saying the players need time, or we aren''t at full strength yet, or it was an off day, i couldn''t disagree more. I am now firmly in the out camp, as it doesnt matter who we buy or play in our team, if you set up tactically and play the way we do we won''t win another game on merit this season, maybe just pot luck.

Why support a manager who fields players just to handicap them?

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[quote user="SeattleCanary"]I know there are a lot of posts about the game on here.

My post is simple, i want to set the record straight from my perspective. I''m sick of people slating the "Hughton out" brigade saying those people should get behind him and the team.

Obviously we want to, and should. But all these fans calling others pant wetters, and saying we should give him time to gel the team etc. Thats what pre season is for firstly. Most importantly, no one would give a sh*t if we lost if we tried hard and played proper football!!

We''ve lost games under Lambert but no one called for his head because we were generally unlucky or it wasnt our day. Today we were our own enemy, and weren''t unlucky, just piss poor.

I can see the negativity in the passing, there is no attempted threaded through balls, no one-twos, not even any real crosses any more. THIS IS BASIC STUFF FFS!!!

So to all of you "supporters" of this tripe on facebook and here and everywhere saying the players need time, or we aren''t at full strength yet, or it was an off day, i couldn''t disagree more. I am now firmly in the out camp, as it doesnt matter who we buy or play in our team, if you set up tactically and play the way we do we won''t win another game on merit this season, maybe just pot luck.

Why support a manager who fields players just to handicap them?[/quote]

it''s one game.

it went wrong, we move on and look for improvement.

we finished 11th last season.

go and support villa if you miss lambert so much.

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Our poor form that saw 2 wins in 20 since xmas has continued into this season, He must sort it out or he has to go, simple as.

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[quote user="super canary"][quote user="SeattleCanary"]I know there are a lot of posts about the game on here.

My post is simple, i want to set the record straight from my perspective. I''m sick of people slating the "Hughton out" brigade saying those people should get behind him and the team.

Obviously we want to, and should. But all these fans calling others pant wetters, and saying we should give him time to gel the team etc. Thats what pre season is for firstly. Most importantly, no one would give a sh*t if we lost if we tried hard and played proper football!!

We''ve lost games under Lambert but no one called for his head because we were generally unlucky or it wasnt our day. Today we were our own enemy, and weren''t unlucky, just piss poor.

I can see the negativity in the passing, there is no attempted threaded through balls, no one-twos, not even any real crosses any more. THIS IS BASIC STUFF FFS!!!

So to all of you "supporters" of this tripe on facebook and here and everywhere saying the players need time, or we aren''t at full strength yet, or it was an off day, i couldn''t disagree more. I am now firmly in the out camp, as it doesnt matter who we buy or play in our team, if you set up tactically and play the way we do we won''t win another game on merit this season, maybe just pot luck.

Why support a manager who fields players just to handicap them?[/quote]

it''s one game.

it went wrong, we move on and look for improvement.

we finished 11th last season.

go and support villa if you miss lambert so much.[/quote]

Typical response from someone who doesn''t know how to address the issues raised. Pray do tell what we were facing before the West Brom game? Relegation I believe.... 11th was a fantastic result for us considering we should have finished about 16th/17th on merit. That Man City team being mostly on the beach did us a real favour.

I do miss Lambert yes. No, I''m obviously not going to support Villa. And NO again, it isn''t just one game. It''s more like 40 games, we just had a "pot luck" 10 game unbeaten run where we won literally by the odd goal.

Please explain how so many people would be upset if it was as you said, "just one game"?

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I thought today was our worst performance since Fulham away and Sunderland away the previous season under Lambert, but let''s not get carried away after just two matches in ffs!

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[quote user="super canary"][quote user="SeattleCanary"]I know there are a lot of posts about the game on here.

My post is simple, i want to set the record straight from my perspective. I''m sick of people slating the "Hughton out" brigade saying those people should get behind him and the team.

Obviously we want to, and should. But all these fans calling others pant wetters, and saying we should give him time to gel the team etc. Thats what pre season is for firstly. Most importantly, no one would give a sh*t if we lost if we tried hard and played proper football!!

We''ve lost games under Lambert but no one called for his head because we were generally unlucky or it wasnt our day. Today we were our own enemy, and weren''t unlucky, just piss poor.

I can see the negativity in the passing, there is no attempted threaded through balls, no one-twos, not even any real crosses any more. THIS IS BASIC STUFF FFS!!!

So to all of you "supporters" of this tripe on facebook and here and everywhere saying the players need time, or we aren''t at full strength yet, or it was an off day, i couldn''t disagree more. I am now firmly in the out camp, as it doesnt matter who we buy or play in our team, if you set up tactically and play the way we do we won''t win another game on merit this season, maybe just pot luck.

Why support a manager who fields players just to handicap them?[/quote]

it''s one game.

it went wrong, we move on and look for improvement.

we finished 11th last season.

go and support villa if you miss lambert so much.[/quote]

It''s not one game though is it. That''s the problem we saw this time and time again last season. Utterly spineless, clueless performance.

Hughton is clueless tactically. We could have a Premiership all stars team and we would still struggle to create a chance because of the tactics.

Either Hughton needs to learn to play a different way and give players some creative freedom or he needs to go because he has taken us as far as he can.

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Well my confidence in Hughton certainly took a knock today. I can see what he was trying to achieve last season. Building a solid back line, getting points no matter how ugly and with us ending eleventh, he done his job.

I can also see what he is trying to achieve for us this season. Building a strong forward line, which on paper it looks like he has. But if he doesn''t use tactics that utilise these guys then patience is going to run out very quickly.

I grinned and beared a lot of drech last season with the future in mind. After today''s dreadful showing.......

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I''ll tell you what''s simple. Passing the ball. We can''t do it.

We can''t score goals if we don''t have the ball. Johnson barely completed a pass in his 45 minutes on the pitch, and the ones be did complete were to the centre halves.

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''''It''s not one game though is it. That''s the problem we saw this time and time again last season. Utterly spineless, clueless performance.

Hughton is clueless tactically. We could have a Premiership all stars team and we would still struggle to create a chance because of the tactics.

Either Hughton needs to learn to play a different way and give players some creative freedom or he needs to go because he has taken us as far as he can.''''

taken us as far as he can? that made me laugh, thanks. your right, we should be pushing for top 6 in our 2nd game of our 3rd season back in the prem. genius.

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[quote user="super canary"]what more did you all expect from last season? europe?[/quote]

Erm i expect a pro footballer to pass the ball to a team mate more often than not. I expect attack minded football, as believe it or not Super Canary thats how you win games! Not that we''d know... 2 in 20 is an awful record.

I never really respect the opinion of "oh, its an away game". its still a field isnt it? The balls still round isnt it? 11 vs 11.... oh so why is it different if we aren''t at home??

Bottom line. I couldn''t care if we were relegated, if we played to our best ability, and TRIED. But we didn''t, and haven''t for the longest time, and are fortunate to still be in this league this season. I just hoped as now it was Hughtons team, we would have progressed from last season and moved on, but we look the same if not worse.

Please find a way to justify this, i challenge you!

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Chris houghton is the worst manager in the premier league.

Over an hour against a poor hull team with 10 men! Who never looked liked scoring.

An out and out striker on the bench ( becchio) 10 men for the best part of an hour. Never even think about bringing an attacking player until elmander after 70 mins.

Useless management needs to change. Crap performance can''t lose to crap like that

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Herman''s post sums a lot of it up for me. Last season we were quite drab a lot of the time, which I accepted as a by-product of the process of improving our defence after Lambert''s gun-ho approach.

This summer Hughton went out and spent almost £20,000,000 (look at those 0''s. Look at them) on a shiny new sword to go with his doggedly-won shield.

The problem is we seem to still be trying to hide behind the shield, which is so much more disappointing when you''re facing a rookie with a blunt kitchen knife (who promptly had said knife sent off, too).

Did I take the metaphor too far?

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I actually think the players were trying, but the clueless way Hughton had set out the team their efforts looked totally disjointed. There appears to be no running off the ball. Too often our player has the ball and the rest are static. It is dead simple to close down what options that player then has.We seem to be trying to move the ball too quick, very rarely will a player keep hold of the ball through choice. RVW must be wondering what he has joined, as will one or two others.Yes we will stumble into wins and pick up points. Players don''t become bad players because of bad coaching, but it must be obvious to most that last season''s failing were not simply down to not having the quality of players required, as the same failings have been carried over to this season.And that can only be laid at the door of one man. The one with manager written on the door (the clue is in the title on the door).

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[quote user="super canary"]''''It''s not one game though is it. That''s the problem we saw this time and time again last season. Utterly spineless, clueless performance.

Hughton is clueless tactically. We could have a Premiership all stars team and we would still struggle to create a chance because of the tactics.

Either Hughton needs to learn to play a different way and give players some creative freedom or he needs to go because he has taken us as far as he can.''''

taken us as far as he can? that made me laugh, thanks. your right, we should be pushing for top 6 in our 2nd game of our 3rd season back in the prem. genius.[/quote]

Seriously. Why do you take others opinions and then go way over board Super Canary? No one mentioned Europe, we just want to see our team attempt to score goals and pass a ball properly. No one mentioned having unrealistic expectations.

Just goes to show you really have no valid argument for the points raised, as all you do is blow it out of proportion like people are expecting top 10, when in actual fact we just want to see a team performance, win draw or lose.

So time to find a new response I''d say!

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[quote user="City1st"]I actually think the players were trying, but the clueless way Hughton had set out the team their efforts looked totally disjointed. There appears to be no running off the ball. Too often our player has the ball and the rest are static. It is dead simple to close down what options that player then has.We seem to be trying to move the ball too quick, very rarely will a player keep hold of the ball through choice. RVW must be wondering what he has joined, as will one or two others.Yes we will stumble into wins and pick up points. Players don''t become bad players because of bad coaching, but it must be obvious to most that last season''s failing were not simply down to not having the quality of players required, as the same failings have been carried over to this season.And that can only be laid at the door of one man. The one with manager written on the door (the clue is in the title on the door).

[/quote]

Thank the lord! Some one who gets it!

I love our team Everything we have stood for since our drop to league one was all about passion and getting the bit between our teeth. Thats how we achieved back to back promotions and safety in this league.

These are professional players that have been brought in as they have impressed in other teams and stood out. They do not go bad over night. Watching season after season, you can see when things change, and unfortunately our play and creativity has gone massively backwards.

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Herman wrote the following post at 2013-08-24 10:24 PM:

Well my confidence in Hughton certainly took a knock today. I can see what he was trying to achieve last season. Building a solid back line, getting points no matter how ugly and with us ending eleventh, he done his job.

I can also see what he is trying to achieve for us this season. Building a strong forward line, which on paper it looks like he has. But if he doesn''t use tactics that utilise these guys then patience is going to run out very quickly.

I grinned and beared a lot of drech last season with the future in mind. After today''s dreadful showing.......

Agree wholeheartedly H, but I have to ask, have you been ion the pop? You gave me so much sh**te on this board last season as a ''pant wetter'' as did many others who are today all lamenting our leader as inadequate!

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[quote user="super canary"]''''It''s not one game though is it. That''s the problem we saw this time and time again last season. Utterly spineless, clueless performance.

Hughton is clueless tactically. We could have a Premiership all stars team and we would still struggle to create a chance because of the tactics.

Either Hughton needs to learn to play a different way and give players some creative freedom or he needs to go because he has taken us as far as he can.''''

taken us as far as he can? that made me laugh, thanks. your right, we should be pushing for top 6 in our 2nd game of our 3rd season back in the prem. genius.[/quote]

Sorry that was written for someone with at lease one working brain cell to read. Not once did I mention league position I was talking tactically. Stop exaggerating people''s arguments just because you don''t agree with them.

Genius.

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[quote user="City 2nd"]Herman wrote the following post at 2013-08-24 10:24 PM: Well my confidence in Hughton certainly took a knock today. I can see what he was trying to achieve last season. Building a solid back line, getting points no matter how ugly and with us ending eleventh, he done his job. I can also see what he is trying to achieve for us this season. Building a strong forward line, which on paper it looks like he has. But if he doesn''t use tactics that utilise these guys then patience is going to run out very quickly. I grinned and beared a lot of drech last season with the future in mind. After today''s dreadful showing.......

Agree wholeheartedly H, but I have to ask, have you been ion the pop? You gave me so much sh**te on this board last season as a ''pant wetter'' as did many others who are today all lamenting our leader as inadequate![/quote]

 

Haha,i''ll probably change my mind if we win next week[;)]

Seriously though last season was a transition season,so i thought a lot were worrying far,far too much. We didn''t have the players to go for an attacking style of play,Hughton had to go with what we had.

Today i am more frustrated as i thought there would be a change of style with the players we had available.But it was more of the same and he made it extremely difficult for us ''Drypants'' to back him up.

And i can''t tell Highland Canary to STFU this weekend,which is normally a highlight. 

 

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It is too early to judge whether CH has improved our team but we were inept today.

I think it is entirely reasonable that some on here question the management team as we were unable to pass, move or create today. This afternoon was an embarrassment.

Who do we think may be having the main influence on our quality of play? Pant wetters of Chris Hughton?

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I''ll give him a few more games before I call for blood. I desperately want him to succeed because like him. But my fondness for him as an individual can only go so far. I''m on the bubble now.

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SeattleCanary....my over exaggerated point is in response to the over exaggerated doom mongering by you and plenty of others after one bad performance. were you calling for CH to go at the end of last season? and who, as you think he should be ousted, would you like to see replace him?

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He brought on Snodgrass at half time.  He is an attacking player you idiot.[quote user="alartz"]Chris houghton is the worst manager in the premier league.

Over an hour against a poor hull team with 10 men! Who never looked liked scoring.

An out and out striker on the bench ( becchio) 10 men for the best part of an hour. Never even think about bringing an attacking player until elmander after 70 mins.

Useless management needs to change. Crap performance can''t lose to crap like that[/quote]

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[quote user="super canary"]SeattleCanary....my over exaggerated point is in response to the over exaggerated doom mongering by you and plenty of others after one bad performance. were you calling for CH to go at the end of last season? and who, as you think he should be ousted, would you like to see replace him?[/quote]

It isn''t over exaggerated. It''s warranted, fans are concerned and rightly so. I shall answer each of your points with sensible reasoning.

1. No i wasn''t calling for him to go last season, as even though he had 2 transfer windows, and still the team showed no signs of really beating a side, I believed that it was still a Lambert team and that the players were made to be playing a different style.

Last season we scored 41, and conceded 58 GD -17. The season before under Lambert we scored 52 and conceded 66 GD -14.

That isn''t a great improvement consider he is more "defensive" and his aim was to build from the back, but as many have said i saw it as a transitional season.

Now he has had his 3RD transfer window and it is predominantly his team playing, and they cannot string a pass, or create a chance, shoot at goal, cross the ball the list is ridiculously long for a Prem team, of what we are incapable of doing.

Genuinely I''d go for someone like Adkins. I believe he wouldn''t be so mild mannered and full of excuses, and blind to handicap players and play them against their strengths.

Just about anybody who is willing to try and win a game be it home or away, and not make ridiculous tactical choices.

I don''t get why you don''t understand what myself and many are saying, it should be blatantly obvious!?

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