Dose of realism needed

[HerefordCanary 0]

I think we are going to do well, but imo only if we play RVW and Hooper up front together! Otherwise we may run it close.

[SwindonCanary 455]

[quote user="lharman7"][quote user="swindoncanary"]The only objective of the board and manager next season is to remain in the Premiership. It should also be the same for the fans.  [/quote]

Then why spend? If we achieved 11th last season with the squad we had why spend the money on new signings?[/quote]Because we need to improve every season, just to maintain our status. 

[Cantiaci Canary 557]

All I want is survival and I will celebrate it just as thoroughly as I did in the past two seasons if we get it.

I''m sure we will hover just above and just inside the extended relegation scrap for most of the season.

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="The Great Mass Debater"]Im sorry but the tactics last season WERE negative. I dont know how anyone can say anything else. [/quote]

So why did we annihilate Swansea away?   How did we murder Sunderland first half at home?  How did we beat Arsenal, MU, MC and the other matches we won?   By matching superior force with battling qualities and good play, that''s how   Negative?     The only negative was the poor run after Christmas when the ability of the midfield to be able to deliver enough quality seemed to disappear for long spells. 

There''s a difference between being negative and being solid.  Hughton wants his teams to be solid throughout,  build from the back (see the Brighton thread) and play through the team.   The midfield struggled at times last season because they couldn''t do that consistently.   But to call it negative is not helpful or imo, accurate.

     

[lharman7 39]

So why did we annihilate Swansea away?   How did we murder Sunderland first half at home?  How did we beat Arsenal, MU, MC and the other matches we won?   By matching superior force with battling qualities and good play, that''s how   Negative?     The only negative was the poor run after Christmas when the ability of the midfield to be able to deliver enough quality seemed to disappear for long spells. There''s a difference between being negative and being solid.  Hughton wants his teams to be solid throughout,  build from the back (see the Brighton thread) and play through the team.   The midfield struggled at times last season because they couldn''t do that consistently.   But to call it negative is not helpful or imo, accurate.

You could say the exact polar opposite to your post.

Why did we lose 5-0 to Fulham first game, why did Liverpool put 10 past us and why did we draw so many games?

We won those games you mention purely because there was no pressure on the players and coaching staff to win so we could afford to play with freedom and attack more.

[paul moy 235]

Well, we beat Manure and Arsenal by playing well defensively, chasing them down and hitting them once or twice on the break. It was negative play.

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="paul moy"]Well, we beat Manure and Arsenal by playing well defensively, chasing them down and hitting them once or twice on the break. It was negative play. [/quote]

Soaking up attacks is not being negative, it is being solid.  It is being resilient.   After you are solid and  resilient you can then try and make the most of your attacks.   It is not negative. 

There were times last season when every style of football was on display from us.   Attacking displays, games where we had to defend, games where we were poor in midfield and attack.   Not through some underlying negativity, but as a reaction to the teams we were playing at the time.   Pressure on us was intense, especially after Christmas when we had set up such high standards before Christmas - and lets not forget that teams started coming to Carrow Rd with a bit more caution themselves, because of our good home  record.  

Too much emphasis on the word negative for me.   We don''t want to be a Blackpool, ultra attacking - and we don''t want to be a Stoke.   We want to be what Hughton wants.  A team that is balanced throughout, playing good football from front to back.   We know we can do it, with the upgrades we have we should have every confidence that we will see it this season.   Its not a given, but I will be very surprised if the football this year is not much better than last year - and for spells last year we were brilliant, as shown by our final position in the table.

[lharman7 39]

Some fair points LDC and im sure every NCFC supporter would love for our side to play a "total" brand of football.

One question; why did CH not differ very much from his style/formation when chasing a game?

[BOO 0]

"We know we can do it, with the upgrades we have we should have every confidence that we will see it this season. Its not a given, but I will be very surprised if the football this year is not much better than last year - and for spells last year we were brilliant, as shown by our final position in the table."

I also hope the football this season will be better than last, if we achieve that and get results it will be fantastic. OTBC

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="lharman7"]Some fair points LDC and im sure every NCFC supporter would love for our side to play a "total" brand of football.

One question; why did CH not differ very much from his style/formation when chasing a game?[/quote]

For me its about consistency.   Hughton seems to like keeping the same line ups with not much variation.   Keeping a consistent approach, with consistent tactics, means that everyone knows what they are doing within the framework of the team.   If he gets it working right, it will mean we won''t need to change the way we play, whether we are in front or behind in games.   If it works it works.   

[BOO 0]

Well if that is his recipe for success LDC we are in trouble. A rigid approach with little squad rotation is not what I would expect from a Premier League manager.

[paul moy 235]

[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="paul moy"]Well, we beat Manure and Arsenal by playing well defensively, chasing them down and hitting them once or twice on the break. It was negative play. [/quote]

Soaking up attacks is not being negative, it is being solid.  It is being resilient.   After you are solid and  resilient you can then try and make the most of your attacks.   It is not negative. 

There were times last season when every style of football was on display from us.   Attacking displays, games where we had to defend, games where we were poor in midfield and attack.   Not through some underlying negativity, but as a reaction to the teams we were playing at the time.   Pressure on us was intense, especially after Christmas when we had set up such high standards before Christmas - and lets not forget that teams started coming to Carrow Rd with a bit more caution themselves, because of our good home  record.  

Too much emphasis on the word negative for me.   We don''t want to be a Blackpool, ultra attacking - and we don''t want to be a Stoke.   We want to be what Hughton wants.  A team that is balanced throughout, playing good football from front to back.   We know we can do it, with the upgrades we have we should have every confidence that we will see it this season.   Its not a given, but I will be very surprised if the football this year is not much better than last year - and for spells last year we were brilliant, as shown by our final position in the table.

[/quote]OK, let''s call it good defensive play. The fact is that for over 90% of the game we were shutting down Arsenal and Manure. Defensive play for 90% of a game is negative IMO.  Effective, yes, but not the sort of football I want to watch every time as a neutral, but can bear if the result justifies the means. 

[hertfordyellow 460]

To be fair to Hughton most managers following Lambert''s style would look defensive in comparison.Hughton did have a "hold on to what we have" mentality a lot last season which did lead to us drawing matches. Maybe you are right to say "Negative" is the wrong word but we were "cautious" in many games. I don''t think he trusted the squad to go toe-to-toe attacking wise with most teams but now that he has built his own squad I think he will trust them more and thus be less cautious.Personally my expectations aren''t based on league position, but simply that we play better, retain possession a bit better and create more chances. 

[BOO 0]

, but not the sort of football I want to watch every time as a neutral,

Surely you are not a neutral Paul?

[TIL 1010 4,739]

[quote user="paul moy"] I was one of the few that actually predicted QPR would struggle.
[/quote]

Well I for one thought the world and it''s auntie thought the same as you throughout the whole of last season.

[paul moy 235]

[quote user="Vanwink"], but not the sort of football I want to watch every time as a neutral,

Surely you are not a neutral Paul?[/quote]No. What I mean is I can bear it as a Norwich fan but as a neutral watching a game between two sides I would switch off. I like to see lots of attacking play, pacey forwards, shots etc normally, but would settle for less if it means we win, as we did against Manure and Arsenal. For instance last season I would watch every Spurs game just to see Bale play... that''s what attracts me as a neutral, not defensive play.. The problem with Norwich last season is that I could see many neutrals switching off, and that is sad for us as a club IMO.

[paul moy 235]

[quote user="TIL 1010"]

[quote user="paul moy"] I was one of the few that actually predicted QPR would struggle. [/quote]

Well I for one thought the world and it''s auntie thought the same as you throughout the whole of last season.

[/quote]Nope... most thought QPR would have a great season, especially QPR fans, and one on here in particular. He doesn''t come on here any more as he surely has nothing now to crow about.

[hertfordyellow 460]

[quote user="paul moy"][quote user="TIL 1010"]

[quote user="paul moy"] I was one of the few that actually predicted QPR would struggle. [/quote]

Well I for one thought the world and it''s auntie thought the same as you throughout the whole of last season.

[/quote]Nope... most thought QPR would have a great season, especially QPR fans, and one on here in particular. He doesn''t come on here any more as he surely has nothing now to crow about. [/quote]Have to disagree with this, when I discussed the league at the start of last season with various people, all agreed they had signed badly and could be in trouble. Most people thought that they had signed players with little hunger and were looking for a last payday while putting some of the key mainstay''s noses out of joint (Mackie, Hill, Derry). Think the phrase "Championship Manager transfers" was used a lot.

[lharman7 39]

[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="lharman7"]Some fair points LDC and im sure every NCFC supporter would love for our side to play a "total" brand of football.

One question; why did CH not differ very much from his style/formation when chasing a game?[/quote]

For me its about consistency.   Hughton seems to like keeping the same line ups with not much variation.   Keeping a consistent approach, with consistent tactics, means that everyone knows what they are doing within the framework of the team.   If he gets it working right, it will mean we won''t need to change the way we play, whether we are in front or behind in games.   If it works it works.   

[/quote]

Yes agreed but there will come a time when we need to change things a little. Wether it be during a game or as the season progresses or even seasons after seasons. With playing the same way every game you leave yourself vulnerable to other teams knowing exactly how you will play.

I believe CH needs to have a plan B for some games.

Im a 4-4-2 man myself but nowadays that is classed as archaic and im not saying that we should play that formation, i am just stating that the game itself as a whole has moved away from it.

[pilksfanclub 0]

the idea that we didn''t play negative football last season is laughable. It was very negative. That isn''t necessarily a bad thing it delivered some great results. However it has to evolve this season.

Oh and in terms of where we finish mid table seems decent I think we should aim to not get near the relegation fight even if we finish lower than last season it doesn''t matter just don''t want it to be so horrific

[Dubai Mark 0]

Well City 2nd I have to beg to differ, certainly wouldnt say that you are talking utter garbage as youn can have an opinion too, but it is clear and there have been many examples over the years including at Carrow Road where a particularly negative atmosphere has definately contributed to a team''s performance and result. Many on this board will certainly remember this happening at Carrow Road, and it happens when confidence is fragile amongst the team, they dont start well in a match, maybe conceed an early goal and the crowd gets on the backs of the players to such an extent that it effects the way they play.....so, I think you need to get real!       Oh, it also works in reverse of course, that "12th man" effect can certainly help a performance, we see it often....

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

[quote user="paul moy"][quote user="HoltsDerbyDayHattrick"]QPR filled there squad with overpaid wankers and egos[/quote]Agreed, and because of that I was one of the few that actually predicted QPR would struggle.  No apologies for predicting a struggle for us based on evidence so far and of negative tactics last season that I fear will continue.  [/quote]

It''s ironic that you''re predicting that Hughton will continue to be negative...

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

[quote user="paul moy"][quote user="TIL 1010"]

[quote user="paul moy"] I was one of the few that actually predicted QPR would struggle. [/quote]

Well I for one thought the world and it''s auntie thought the same as you throughout the whole of last season.

[/quote]Nope... most thought QPR would have a great season, especially QPR fans, and one on here in particular. He doesn''t come on here any more as he surely has nothing now to crow about. [/quote]

Of course QPR fans thought they''d have a great season....You fool.

[crabbycanary 2]

Did Gareth Bale ever find out you were stalking him Paul?

[GenerationA47 751]

Very much with D Mark on that. I think to better last year''s position is a great target for us this season (so 10th as a minimum).

 

That is different from saying we ''should'' make top half (as maybe top spending clubs will adhere to) and everything else is a failure regardless of performance and circumstances, as I accept the inherent unpredictability - which as LDC says is totally part of the fun - of our own team, the 19 others and the many permutations involved in the meetings between them all.

[paul moy 235]

[quote user="Grant Holts 3 year contract"][quote user="paul moy"][quote user="HoltsDerbyDayHattrick"]QPR filled there squad with overpaid wankers and egos[/quote]Agreed, and because of that I was one of the few that actually predicted QPR would struggle.  No apologies for predicting a struggle for us based on evidence so far and of negative tactics last season that I fear will continue.  [/quote]

It''s ironic that you''re predicting that Hughton will continue to be negative...

[/quote]You obviously don''t know the meaning of ironic. Troll!!!

[paul moy 235]

[quote user="crabbycanary"]Did Gareth Bale ever find out you were stalking him Paul?[/quote]Well, that''s the sort of comment I expected so no disappointment.

[crabbycanary 2]

Touche

[Making Plans 936]

Well based on the first 45 minutes tonight we don''t need a dose of realism. No negativity & all our expectations are being met.

[ReadingCanary 0]

Is the girl in blue a Norwich supporter?