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lake district canary

Holiday Inn for sale

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Talk about a closed mind -

[quote user="lake district canary"]"I''m sure you''re right on all points.  However, it won''t stop me"[/quote]

I think you are likely to get more sense out of a Jehovah''s Witness with his tales of ''imaginary friends'' than you will here.

ps why has this dimwit not considered what it would cost to put a roof over these temporary seats - it does rain quite often during the season ?

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[quote user="City1st"]Talk about a closed mind -[quote user="lake district canary"]"I''m sure you''re right on all points.  However, it won''t stop me"[/quote]I think you are likely to get more sense out of a Jehovah''s Witness with his tales of ''imaginary friends'' than you will here.ps why has this dimwit not considered what it would cost to put a roof over these temporary seats - it does rain quite often during the season ?[/quote]

"I''m sure you''re right on all points.  However, it won''t stop me"   Congratulations for taking yet another sentence out of context and putting your own meaning on to it.   In fact you''re something of an expert on that aren''t you?     Also, this dimwit would consider that when it rains people get wet.   It''s not rocket science, City 1st.    Rain happens.   Ever sat near the front of a stand when the wind blows the rain in?   Not pleasant.  Its an outdoor sport.  

[quote user="nutty nigel"]Always the victim....[/quote]

Ahh......they''re all here now.    How nice.

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[quote user="lake district canary"]


Well, officer,

[/quote]

That was 20 years ago so do keep up.

Anyway all these alterations you so desire to make the hotel more easy on the eye and to accommodate more fans in rooms, have you any ideas on what the hotel do with these rooms on the other 346 days of the year when there are no games ?

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[quote user="TIL 1010"]Anyway all these alterations you so desire to make the hotel more easy on the eye and to accommodate more fans in rooms, have you any ideas on what the hotel do with these rooms on the other 346 days of the year when there are no games ?[/quote]

They will still be rooms whether there is a match on or not.   If safe balconies could be attached too, these rooms would have even better outlook on summer days when there are no matches.   http://q-ec.bstatic.com/images/hotel/max1024x768/504/5043861.jpg   http://doubletree3.hilton.com/resources/media/dt/LTNDTDI/en_US/img/shared/full_page_image_gallery/main/di_pitchfacingroom01_3_677x380_FitToBoxSmallDimension_Center.jpgTom Cavendish posted these earlier.   Carrow Rd and MK Dons.  At MK, still a bedroom and still viewing the pitch and with a balcony.   Maybe these things were taken into consideration when the hotel was built, but I doubt it.   Things were very different when the hotel was built.  It could be done.     

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="City1st"]Talk about a closed mind -[quote user="lake district canary"]"I''m sure you''re right on all points.  However, it won''t stop me"[/quote]I think you are likely to get more sense out of a Jehovah''s Witness with his tales of ''imaginary friends'' than you will here.ps why has this dimwit not considered what it would cost to put a roof over these temporary seats - it does rain quite often during the season ?[/quote]

"I''m sure you''re right on all points.  However, it won''t stop me"   Congratulations for taking yet another sentence out of context and putting your own meaning on to it.   In fact you''re something of an expert on that aren''t you?     Also, this dimwit would consider that when it rains people get wet.   It''s not rocket science, City 1st.    Rain happens.   Ever sat near the front of a stand when the wind blows the rain in?   Not pleasant.  Its an outdoor sport.  

[/quote]

"I''m sure you''re right on all points.  However, it won''t stop me and I

think the majority of fans wishing the corner could be infilled in some

way, or at  least, disguise what to most of us is an eyesore.
"you are behaving like a petulamt childas stated elsewhere, and also by posters on here, no one, get it  NO ONE is happy with the hotel .. all fans I''m sure would like the hotel replaced with seatingbut, and is the the pointthe rest of us are aware of why it is there, how it got there and what can and can''t be doneall you are doing is posting up sh ite, like a child who can''t quite grasp why the grown up world isn''t fairso why not stop stamping your little foot, stop making snide attacks upon the club ...... and if you have to regal us with more of your whining at least have the curtesy to check your facts and figures first, asvirtually every other poster on here has ?

and as to the rain then you are even more stupid than this thread would suggest  - there is a huge difference between rain blowing into a covered area and rain falling directly onto seating, before and during the game - likewise with snow ...... there is also the matter of safety which would have to be considered, something insurance would would look at in a different light to what exists nowthis is what happens in the grown up world, the club and consequently the directors have a ''duty of care'', they cannot ignore those responsibilities simply to placate the whinging of some fan who rarely turns up at the ground

so what not do what the rest of us do, watch the bloody game instead !

 

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Oh dear god LDC, now you''re just being petulant.

Why do you keep demanding people make reasoned arguments when they have? The facts and figures are all out there to see, yet you keep whinging about how the hotel has to go.

You bang on about how people are using ad hom attacks yet you in this thread you have called people twits and told them to f*** off. Why are you shocked when people bite back?

The hotel is staying- and this isn''t just an opinion on this forum- it has been made clear, on this thread and elsewhere, that is has to stay due to a variety of reasons.

"so why not stop stamping your little foot, stop making snide attacks upon the club ...... and if you have to regal us with more of your whining at least have the curtesy to check your facts and figures first, asvirtually every other poster on here has ?"

Exactly.

Remind you of anyone?

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As a side issue, the no drinking in rooms during games amuses me.

 

I suppose Holiday Inn have the right to state conditions of residence, but is it legally enforceable? It''s a hotel room, not a seat in a stadium after all. If somebody refused to adhere, whilst being perfectly behaved, is there anything the hotel could do?

 

Once the final whistle goes can guests then open a beer? Seems perfectly stupid to me. 

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The title is misleading as well, the holiday inn is NOT for sale. If it was then maybe things would be a bit simpler, but it isn''t.

Buying the hotel would require substantial amounts of money for very little in return regarding seats. The money can be best spent elsewhere.

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[quote user="First acolyte the east coast role model"]Oh dear god LDC, now you''re just being petulant.

Why do you keep demanding people make reasoned arguments when they have? The facts and figures are all out there to see, yet you keep whinging about how the hotel has to go.

You bang on about how people are using ad hom attacks yet you in this thread you have called people twits and told them to f*** off. Why are you shocked when people bite back?

The hotel is staying- and this isn''t just an opinion on this forum- it has been made clear, on this thread and elsewhere, that is has to stay due to a variety of reasons.

"so why not stop stamping your little foot, stop making snide attacks upon the club ...... and if you have to regal us with more of your whining at least have the curtesy to check your facts and figures first, asvirtually every other poster on here has ?"

Exactly.

Remind you of anyone?[/quote]

I refer you to Til, who is  at least asking questions.  You on the other hand have nothing to offer, so why bother?   Have you looked at the photos of MK Dons and the balconies they have?   Have you listened to the poster that suggested a safe standing area at the front of the wasted space in front of the hotel?    Have you anything to offer, or are you just hanging on the coat tails of other posters and try to catch people out?   City 1st is just as bad.  He will rubbish something by putting his own slant on what he reads and disregard anything that might actually be of merit.  Now then, looking at the photos of Carrow Rd and MK Dons, can you honestly say there is no merit in my idea of  bigger windows and/or balconies?  

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"Now then, looking at the photos of Carrow Rd and MK Dons, can you honestly say there is no merit in my idea of bigger windows and/or balconies? "

I think it is totally irrelevant as the hotel is not looking to sell, nor should we spend money on it which could be used better elsewhere.

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[quote user="lake district canary"]   City 1st is just as bad.  He will rubbish something by putting his own slant on what he reads and disregard anything that might actually be of merit.   

[/quote]

When you do put up anything of merit ...............

otherwise -"I suppose Holiday Inn have the right to state conditions of residence, but is it legally enforceable?"

I think you answered you own question - however there may also be something in one of the recent Football Acts that controls drinking whilst watching the game.

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[quote user="First acolyte the east coast role model"]The title is misleading as well, the holiday inn is NOT for sale. If it was then maybe things would be a bit simpler, but it isn''t.

Buying the hotel would require substantial amounts of money for very little in return regarding seats. The money can be best spent elsewhere.[/quote]

The title is a title, nothing more.    If anything it showed that Holiday Inns do come up for sale and that should be of interest as we have one stuck, rather obtrusively, in the corner of our stadium.    I never ever said anything about knocking it down, merely altering the frontage to allow more viewers and if possible a lower tier of seats.   What riles me is when people come on here and start throwing their weight around without considering the merits of what is being said and are more concerned with discrediting the poster than actually taking time to read it through properly and take on board any sensible ideas there may be.   To you, its fine, we shouldn''t do anything with it.  No problem.  So no need to go on the offensive which is what you and one or two others did, straight away and villify me for having the gall to suggest ways things could be improved - without spending millions. 

Sure buying the hotel is probably not an option, even if it were to be allowed to be sold, but as others have said we have a stake in a joint venture there and have some influence, if we want things to be altered and improved.   Looking at what MK Dons have done looks good to me and kind of backs up my thinking a little. We are a premiership club and should look to improve all facilities - the hotel to me is a logical area where things could be done at relatively little cost in the scheme of things.   The hotel is successful and is here to stay so why wouldn''t we be looking to improve it?  

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"To you, its fine, we shouldn''t do anything with it."

stop making up more lies to cover your lack of argumentas stated NO ONE (bar in your childike imagination) thinks it''s fine

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[quote user="lake district canary"]http://q-ec.bstatic.com/images/hotel/max1024x768/504/5043861.jpg   http://doubletree3.hilton.com/resources/media/dt/LTNDTDI/en_US/img/shared/full_page_image_gallery/main/di_pitchfacingroom01_3_677x380_FitToBoxSmallDimension_Center.jpg[/quote]People are missing the point that it would actually be in the interests of the hotel to want to at least change the pitch facing windows so that they are full height and full width because the hotel could then charge a lot more money per room.If I remember rightly, at some other stadiums the beds can be folded back into the wall and the room then becomes a hospitality box on a match day.Providing the views are good enough, then it would be in the interests of the hotel and NCFC to want to do that for some of the rooms.

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[quote user="tom cavendish"]it would actually be in the interests of the hotel to want to at least change the pitch facing windows so that they are full height and full width because the hotel could then charge a lot more money per room.[/quote]Do you really think they didn''t consider all that when they built it?

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Nice thread LDC and good to see some discussion on this issue. I have no objection to a thread such as this one being started to prompt a discussion and do not expect the OP to have all the answers or indeed to be able or inclined to undertake deeper research into issues raised by other posters during the debate.

There have been many interesting points raised and I for one have picked up on a few things I wasn''t previously aware of.

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[quote user="Ricky"]Nice thread LDC and good to see some discussion on this issue. I have no objection to a thread such as this one being started to prompt a discussion and do not expect the OP to have all the answers or indeed to be able or inclined to undertake deeper research into issues raised by other posters during the debate.

There have been many interesting points raised and I for one have picked up on a few things I wasn''t previously aware of.[/quote]

Thanks for that Ricky.  I think it is quite an important issue and I''ve learned a lot too in the process.  Seem to spend half the time dodging bullets though!

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"do not expect the OP to have all the answers or indeed to be able or inclined to undertake deeper research"

ye gods !deeper research ? a ruddy couple of clicks on the internet has found ALL that has been posted up on hereas to answers he hasn''t even a blo ody case, never mind answerswhat he has posted up is akin to him squeaking about what style he thinks Messi should play in our midfield and any attempt by others to explain that he is not our player, or is very unlikely to be our player is merely met with his bleats that we are all being too negative or have closed mindsfor those who may have just joined this thread I suggest you watch this clip from Life of Brian where Stan wants to have a baby and complains that he is being oppressed when it is explain to him why he cannot have a babyLDC''s struggle against reality(click - 40 secs in)

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="First acolyte the east coast role model"]The title is misleading as well, the holiday inn is NOT for sale. If it was then maybe things would be a bit simpler, but it isn''t.

Buying the hotel would require substantial amounts of money for very little in return regarding seats. The money can be best spent elsewhere.[/quote]

The title is a title, nothing more.    If anything it showed that Holiday Inns do come up for sale and that should be of interest as we have one stuck, rather obtrusively, in the corner of our stadium.    I never ever said anything about knocking it down, merely altering the frontage to allow more viewers and if possible a lower tier of seats.   What riles me is when people come on here and start throwing their weight around without considering the merits of what is being said and are more concerned with discrediting the poster than actually taking time to read it through properly and take on board any sensible ideas there may be.   To you, its fine, we shouldn''t do anything with it.  No problem.  So no need to go on the offensive which is what you and one or two others did, straight away and villify me for having the gall to suggest ways things could be improved - without spending millions. 

Sure buying the hotel is probably not an option, even if it were to be allowed to be sold, but as others have said we have a stake in a joint venture there and have some influence, if we want things to be altered and improved.   Looking at what MK Dons have done looks good to me and kind of backs up my thinking a little. We are a premiership club and should look to improve all facilities - the hotel to me is a logical area where things could be done at relatively little cost in the scheme of things.   The hotel is successful and is here to stay so why wouldn''t we be looking to improve it?  

[/quote]

 

There is no evidence at all we have any influence over the hotel. We have a minority stake in the joint venture, but that is all. If we had any influence then McNally presumably would have got those seats in front he wanted. The only way in which your plan would happen would happen would be if the club would convince the 70 per cent stakeholder and the hotel operator that it would be profitable FOR THEM in the long run.Your second - linked - misconception is that the hotel is one of our facilities. It isn''t. We gave up that space. It is not in any real sense part of the ground that can be updated like the other stands.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"]

There is no evidence at all we have any influence over the hotel. We have a minority stake in the joint venture, but that is all. If we had any influence then McNally presumably would have got those seats in front he wanted. The only way in which your plan would happen would happen would be if the club would convince the 70 per cent stakeholder and the hotel operator that it would be profitable FOR THEM in the long run.Your second - linked - misconception is that the hotel is one of our facilities. It isn''t. We gave up that space. It is not in any real sense part of the ground that can be updated like the other stands.

[/quote]

This is true.   Allowing more people in to view may be against some planning regulations for all I know, but on the face of it, if bigger windows/balconies were allowed and more people could pay to get in, that gives the hotel more money on match days, and the club would also get a cut of that money too.  I don''t regard the hotel as being a club facility, however, we must have some influence there.  If not then that would  have been very short sighted of Doomcaster - but maybe that wouldn''t be a surprise.     Also, we don''t really know how far McNally went in getting temporary seats put in this last season.  It could be that there would have been too many hoops to jump through, just for a temporary set up.   A longer term view may be taken.   The thought occurred to me that the way the hotel is shaped, it  may be  that the space in front of the hotel is there to allow for when  a new stand may be built and joined to the Barclay stand, leaving the hotel intact behind it.     So in that caes, if a new stand on that side is not going to be built in the next ten years, there would be no reason why changes could not be made.   If a new stand is to be built its more likely to be a new GW stand.     But that is looking unlikely too.   

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="PurpleCanary"]

There is no evidence at all we have any influence over the hotel. We have a minority stake in the joint venture, but that is all. If we had any influence then McNally presumably would have got those seats in front he wanted. The only way in which your plan would happen would happen would be if the club would convince the 70 per cent stakeholder and the hotel operator that it would be profitable FOR THEM in the long run.Your second - linked - misconception is that the hotel is one of our facilities. It isn''t. We gave up that space. It is not in any real sense part of the ground that can be updated like the other stands.

[/quote]

This is true.   Allowing more people in to view may be against some planning regulations for all I know, but on the face of it, if bigger windows/balconies were allowed and more people could pay to get in, that gives the hotel more money on match days, and the club would also get a cut of that money too.  I don''t regard the hotel as being a club facility, however, we must have some influence there.  If not then that would  have been very short sighted of Doomcaster - but maybe that wouldn''t be a surprise.     Also, we don''t really know how far McNally went in getting temporary seats put in this last season.  It could be that there would have been too many hoops to jump through, just for a temporary set up.   A longer term view may be taken.   The thought occurred to me that the way the hotel is shaped, it  may be  that the space in front of the hotel is there to allow for when  a new stand may be built and joined to the Barclay stand, leaving the hotel intact behind it.     So in that caes, if a new stand on that side is not going to be built in the next ten years, there would be no reason why changes could not be made.   If a new stand is to be built its more likely to be a new GW stand.     But that is looking unlikely too.   

[/quote]

 

This is what drives people mad about your posts, ldc. You say the hotel is one of our facilities, then admit is isn''t, but then go straight on to talking about it as if it really is by saying we must have some influence over it, when there is nothing to back that up at all. I think I''ll leave you to it.

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[quote user="tom cavendish"][quote user="lake district canary"]http://q-ec.bstatic.com/images/hotel/max1024x768/504/5043861.jpg   http://doubletree3.hilton.com/resources/media/dt/LTNDTDI/en_US/img/shared/full_page_image_gallery/main/di_pitchfacingroom01_3_677x380_FitToBoxSmallDimension_Center.jpg[/quote]People are missing the point that it would actually be in the interests of the hotel to want to at least change the pitch facing windows so that they are full height and full width because the hotel could then charge a lot more money per room.If I remember rightly, at some other stadiums the beds can be folded back into the wall and the room then becomes a hospitality box on a match day.Providing the views are good enough, then it would be in the interests of the hotel and NCFC to want to do that for some of the rooms.[/quote]Do you think people run businesses and are just happy with the status quo?  A business only succeeds if it evolves with the time it is currently in.  If Holiday Inn and the JV thought that floor to ceiling windows were a benefit I''m sure it would have been considered a long long time ago, in fact I reckon it would have been considered when the hotel was built - or am I living in a different world to you and LDC?

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[quote user="ncfcstar"]Do you think people run businesses and are just happy with the status quo?  A business only succeeds if it evolves with the time it is currently in.  If Holiday Inn and the JV thought that floor to ceiling windows were a benefit I''m sure it would have been considered a long long time ago, in fact I reckon it would have been considered when the hotel was built - or am I living in a different world to you and LDC?[/quote]

Precisely! You cut your cloth to the prevailing situation.    Six years ago we were a struggling Championship team with deep debts to deal with.   I should imagine the hotel was welcomed with open arms and with hardly any objections.   Things are undoubtedly different today, with debts being wiped out and premiership status and income.   We are therefore in a stronger position to go back to the hotel to negotiate something that may be beneficial to all parties.    It may mean spending a £1m or maybe £2m to improve the pitch side facade, but that could be recouped over time.   £1m or £2 m is not a great deal to spend and would not dent the player budget that much.  

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="ncfcstar"]Do you think people run businesses and are just happy with the status quo?  A business only succeeds if it evolves with the time it is currently in.  If Holiday Inn and the JV thought that floor to ceiling windows were a benefit I''m sure it would have been considered a long long time ago, in fact I reckon it would have been considered when the hotel was built - or am I living in a different world to you and LDC?[/quote]

Precisely! You cut your cloth to the prevailing situation.    Six years ago we were a struggling Championship team with deep debts to deal with.   I should imagine the hotel was welcomed with open arms and with hardly any objections.   Things are undoubtedly different today, with debts being wiped out and premiership status and income.   We are therefore in a stronger position to go back to the hotel to negotiate something that may be beneficial to all parties.    It may mean spending a £1m or maybe £2m to improve the pitch side facade, but that could be recouped over time.   £1m or £2 m is not a great deal to spend and would not dent the player budget that much.  

[/quote]We''re not in any position, as many have pointed our we''re minority stakeholders in a JV.  My point was if Holiday Inn thought floor to ceiling windows/a balcony profitable it would have already been done/in the pipeline.

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"we must have some influence there"

"It could be that there would have been too many hoops to jump through"

"It may be that the space in front of the hotel is there to allow for when a new stand may be built and joined to the Barclay stand, leaving the hotel intact behind it. "

These quotes sum it up for me. Speculation (which is all good and healthy normally) with not a hint of proper facts and figures anywhere.

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[quote user="ncfcstar"][quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="ncfcstar"]Do you think people run businesses and are just happy with the status quo?  A business only succeeds if it evolves with the time it is currently in.  If Holiday Inn and the JV thought that floor to ceiling windows were a benefit I''m sure it would have been considered a long long time ago, in fact I reckon it would have been considered when the hotel was built - or am I living in a different world to you and LDC?[/quote]Precisely! You cut your cloth to the prevailing situation.    Six years ago we were a struggling Championship team with deep debts to deal with.   I should imagine the hotel was welcomed with open arms and with hardly any objections.   Things are undoubtedly different today, with debts being wiped out and premiership status and income.   We are therefore in a stronger position to go back to the hotel to negotiate something that may be beneficial to all parties.    It may mean spending a £1m or maybe £2m to improve the pitch side facade, but that could be recouped over time.   £1m or £2 m is not a great deal to spend and would not dent the player budget that much.   [/quote]We''re not in any position, as many have pointed our we''re minority stakeholders in a JV.  My point was if Holiday Inn thought floor to ceiling windows/a balcony profitable it would have already been done/in the pipeline.[/quote]

Minority stake holders do have an influence though, don''t they?  At the hotel, if suggestions are put out as to how to develop the facilities, by an interested party - however small -  discussed at board level, decisions made - that is how it is done.   Who knows, changes may be in the pipeline as we speak!

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he''s given up on facts or figures as the last lot were so absurd as to be not even worthy of posting upwe are now into the realms of fevered imagination whereby a few bedrooms can be converted into such a money spinner that we could recoup a couple of million - and to what end .... so a couple of dozen extra folk can watch the game !talk about Stan''s wish to have babies this has descended into pure and unaldulterated stupidity as LDC desperately scrabbles around to save facesomething you are not likely to have much of if your two supporters are wiz and master cavendish .......

sadly, I fear we will be growing peppercorns in the Wensum Stand next, sold by students from a market stall at the Showground and stored at Norwich Airport ............ all at no cost to anyone

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[quote user="City1st"]he''s given up on facts or figures as the last lot were so absurd as to be not even worthy of posting up. we are now into the realms of fevered imagination whereby a few bedrooms can be converted into such a money spinner that we could recoup a couple of million - and to what end .... so a couple of dozen extra folk can watch the game !   talk about Stan''s wish to have babies this has descended into pure and unaldulterated stupidity as LDC desperately scrabbles around to save face.   something you are not likely to have much of if your two supporters are wiz and master cavendish ....... sadly, I fear we will be growing peppercorns in the Wensum Stand next, sold by students from a market stall at the Showground and stored at Norwich Airport ............ all at no cost to anyone[/quote]

Give it up, City 1st.  Your squawking is on the verge of gibberish.

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