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killiecanary

Neither a pantwetter nor a happy clapper...

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Reading the wildly differing polarised views being expressed on here, I find myself wondering where I stand with my own opinion as to our current situation and CH.

I haven''t been a pantwetter or a happyclapper up till now. I am not at all happy with the football we''ve played since Christmas, but also I tend to maintain a somewhat more fatalistic view of where we are in our development.

When Lambert left, my instinct was that we were likely to be in a relegation fight all season and that CH had a really difficult task on his hands - to my mind the squad was full of Championship level players who had overperformed for our first premiership season.

I think this is still the case, especially from the midfield forward.

By Christmas I was surprised with out position, but always a little wary that we could slide quite quickly. THat said I did expect us to limp ver the 40 point mark some weeks ago, so I was one thinking ''stay up - job done - improve squad int he summer''

So now that the clamour for Hoots to get the boot is growing where do I stand? I instinctively dislike the knee-jerk removal of managers for a run of poor results. If we remove CH who do we get? How do we know it''s going to be better? Given that in my view it simply is a case of us not having good enough players in most positions, what would anyone else do? Look at Wolves - sacking mangers hasn''t helped them in any way, nor has the ''messiah'' Harry Redknapp done any better with QPR - with better players I think than we have at Norwich. So why would that improve things?

So on balance, I would stick with CH - the season has panned out as I (and I suspect most realistic NCFC fans) would have anticipated at the start of the season...CH has made excellent signings in the main, and next year would be able to field his team - not a predecessor side that he obviously does not rate very highly at all in many cases.

So CH for one more season for me. I appreciate that is not going to be a popular view, and I look forward to debate - but I''d rather not deal with abuse and name-calling if its all the same to some of you!

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I think he''s made decent signings but i think tactically he''s got it wrong far too many times, far too many times at home. Wigan away we were awful, didnt have a shot on target, so next game Swansea at home he went with same eleven & we were lucky to scrape a point. Too many home draws against average teams, QPR, west ham, fulham, southampton, poor away from home against the likes of reading, stoke, villa, All them games i believe with a more positive manager we could have got something out of and probably be 5 or 6 points better off.

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[quote user="Chunky Norwich"]Is ''pantwetter'' and ''happy clapper'' the new Worthy Outer and Keep The Faither? *sigh*
[/quote]

 

Yes it seems so Chunky. But there''s no rule to say you have to "belong". I''m quite happy being nutty!

 

 

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[quote user="killiecanary"]Reading the wildly differing polarised views being expressed on here, I find myself wondering where I stand with my own opinion as to our current situation and CH.

I haven''t been a pantwetter or a happyclapper up till now. I am not at all happy with the football we''ve played since Christmas, but also I tend to maintain a somewhat more fatalistic view of where we are in our development.

When Lambert left, my instinct was that we were likely to be in a relegation fight all season and that CH had a really difficult task on his hands - to my mind the squad was full of Championship level players who had overperformed for our first premiership season.

I think this is still the case, especially from the midfield forward.

By Christmas I was surprised with out position, but always a little wary that we could slide quite quickly. THat said I did expect us to limp ver the 40 point mark some weeks ago, so I was one thinking ''stay up - job done - improve squad int he summer''

So now that the clamour for Hoots to get the boot is growing where do I stand? I instinctively dislike the knee-jerk removal of managers for a run of poor results. If we remove CH who do we get? How do we know it''s going to be better? Given that in my view it simply is a case of us not having good enough players in most positions, what would anyone else do? Look at Wolves - sacking mangers hasn''t helped them in any way, nor has the ''messiah'' Harry Redknapp done any better with QPR - with better players I think than we have at Norwich. So why would that improve things?

So on balance, I would stick with CH - the season has panned out as I (and I suspect most realistic NCFC fans) would have anticipated at the start of the season...CH has made excellent signings in the main, and next year would be able to field his team - not a predecessor side that he obviously does not rate very highly at all in many cases.

So CH for one more season for me. I appreciate that is not going to be a popular view, and I look forward to debate - but I''d rather not deal with abuse and name-calling if its all the same to some of you![/quote]pretty much how i see things tbh.... We could do worse than Hoots, by giving him the boot there is a chance we might!

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So much like the "anyone would be better than Worthy" days. And that didn''t work out too well did it? So you go Walker mk2, Rioch, Hamilton, Worthy, Grant, Roeder, Gunn, Lambert, Hughton. One in four/five is successful. And that''s not just here but pretty much everywhere. Changing the manager is probably a bigger gamble than keeping him if he is a half decent manager.

 

 

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

So much like the "anyone would be better than Worthy" days. And that didn''t work out too well did it? So you go Walker mk2, Rioch, Hamilton, Worthy, Grant, Roeder, Gunn, Lambert, Hughton. One in four/five is successful. And that''s not just here but pretty much everywhere. Changing the manager is probably a bigger gamble than keeping him if he is a half decent manager.

 

 

[/quote] I think Hoots is a half decent manager, he will prove this in time... many fans pointing the finger and playing the blame game but the squad just aint good enough!the thing that did for Worthy was the fact the squad was good enough but he failed to get the best out of it... We had a former European cup winning and world cup playing full back, an international right winger, an up and coming England goalkeeper, one of the best strikers in the land (from January) and still went down!

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Nutty - that is a very good post - 9 managers in 15 or so years makes clear the risk in changing.

Great managers are rare, and good ones don''t exactly grow on trees either.

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="Chunky Norwich"]Is ''pantwetter'' and ''happy clapper'' the new Worthy Outer and Keep The Faither? *sigh*[/quote]

 

Yes it seems so Chunky. But there''s no rule to say you have to "belong". I''m quite happy being nutty!

 

 

[/quote]I''m with you there, Nige

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That foolish group of the incongruous unwashed pant-wetting brigade, have quite rightly been consistently mocked and criticised for their concerns for NCFC, by the "Collective know it all Pink ''Un Demi-Gods"......

When these ''Demi''s'' are not consistently typing their unquestionable supreme knowledge of all things in general, including NCFC and the sport of soccerfootykickball  from within their extravagant Emerald Castles in Utopia.......

.....they are to be seen guffawing an'' snorting at how they browbeat those pant-wetting minions. Those ''Demi''s'' congratulatory and pretentiously back-slap each other, on how they control the Pink Un forum.- whilst they quaff gold flagons of ambrosia - and are surrounded by forelock tugging and cajoled, happy clapping subservient disciples - in the exclusive Hotelus Nelsonus on match days....

Posting pant-wetters must always cautiously be fully aware, that due to the ''Demi''s'' narcissistic behaviour, it''s actually, only the ''Demi''s'' personal opinions, that really count.....

 

They (or at least one of them) will be along in a minute......Just you wait an'' see....Them ''Demi''s''.....they don''t get out much......

 

   

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[quote user="Eadie4England"]I think he''s made decent signings but i think tactically he''s got it wrong far too many times, far too many times at home. Wigan away we were awful, didnt have a shot on target, so next game Swansea at home he went with same eleven & we were lucky to scrape a point. Too many home draws against average teams, QPR, west ham, fulham, southampton, poor away from home against the likes of reading, stoke, villa, All them games i believe with a more positive manager we could have got something out of and probably be 5 or 6 points better off.[/quote] QPR and Hammers, the ref cost us, Southampton, Holts last minute missed penalty cost us. if all those had gone for us we would now be on 44 points and praising CH for a successful season. fine margins between success and failure as a football manager.

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[quote user="Mello Yello"]

That foolish group of the incongruous unwashed pant-wetting brigade, have quite rightly been consistently mocked and criticised for their concerns for NCFC, by the "Collective know it all Pink ''Un Demi-Gods"......   When these ''Demi''s'' are not consistently typing their unquestionable supreme knowledge of all things in general, including NCFC and the sport of soccerfootykickball  from within their extravagant Emerald Castles in Utopia...........they are to be seen guffawing an'' snorting at how they browbeat those pant-wetting minions. Those ''Demi''s'' congratulatory and pretentiously back-slap each other, on how they control the Pink Un forum.- whilst they quaff gold flagons of ambrosia - and are surrounded by forelock tugging and cajoled, happy clapping subservient disciples - in the exclusive Hotelus Nelsonus on match days....  Posting pant-wetters must always cautiously be fully aware, that due to the ''Demi''s'' narcissistic behaviour, it''s actually, only the ''Demi''s'' personal opinions, that really count.....  They (or at least one of them) will be along in a minute......Just you wait an'' see....Them ''Demi''s''.....they don''t get out much...... 

[/quote]

Love the rhetoric,  Mello,  I have been a supporter of Hughton since the day he was appointed and despite what a lot of people think, still think he has plenty to offer, given the time to build the quality in to the team that he wants.  There is room for opinions  both for and against Hughton - we all have the right to post what we think.   The Pantwetting / happyclappy labels are just puerile attempts at dividing the fans and making people with opposing views look stupid.   It really does the opposite, make them look stupid, but they would never agree with that.    The truth is often somewhere in the middle, but people with the middle view are disliked by the self appointed hierachy of both extremes, because the nature of the board is to have extremes and it does their cudos no good.  They need someone to argue against or just ridicule with their petty labels.

They think they are clever, but - and they don''t realise it -  it just makes them look stupid.

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I agree with you (and Chunk and Nutty!)

But in one way it does more than make people look stupid - the support is very much dividing into 2 groups. I thought the atmosphere in the Barclay on Saturday was pretty unpleasant at times - City fans were arguing with each other, some booing, some chanting anti-Hughton songs. That has to transmit itself to the players, when we are all supposed to be pushing for the one final win. We cannot afford to be arguing with each other at this point, and I hope that all supporters, of whatever persuasion, simply back the team to the hilt on Saturday - and by that I mean even if we go a goal behind - the support was great against Villa until we conceded!

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[quote user="star_manic"]if all those had gone for us we would now be on 44 points and praising CH for a successful season. fine margins between success and failure as a football manager.[/quote]I''d be praising him for keeping us up (but that was the least we should have expected surely?), but decrying him for the football he''s introduced in order to acheive it, and hoping that either way a suitable replacement was found who could do the same job of keeping us in the league (or even pushing for mid-table/Europe in future seasons), but without having us play dogs**t football to do it...

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I''m not sure it was the least we could have expected Indy - I didn''t expect it to be a walk in the park. I agree with you that the football hasn''t been enjoyable but I was kind of hoping that he was building his team from the back, with more impressive CH signings to come to improve the attacking quality for next season - hence my preference for keeping him for a season to see how that develops.

One thing I had sort of forgotten is how inexperienced Hughton is as a manager - I''m sure he has made mistakes, but I hope that he would learn from these as he gains in experience.

If he keeps us up I think he will have done the job he set out to do and achieve the target he was set by McNally.

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This weekend has left me on the fence with Hughton, but there are still a couple of things worth mentioning; It wasnt Hughton''s fault Holt missed the penalty against Southampton, Nor was it his for the sending off and genral Ref performance at Sunderland. I think, despite my indiference to if he stays or not, he will be given another season and I think there is the potential for us to improve, but this summer really is squad upgrade time. We have players that just cant make it into the first team on the books who need to go, and we need true competetion for spots... sorry if that means a few fan favorites like Wes find them down then pecking order, but so be it! We cant have half the squad made up of players that just arnt good enough to start or really stake a claim as a premire league footballer. Thats meant in the greatest respect as I still think many of our players are top 6 championship players... but its that old chessnut of being almost too good for one league, yet not quite good enough for the one above.

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