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Capt_Canary

The Clear Out To Begin

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Assuming Elliott Ward, Leon Barnett, Chris Martin are going who else do you think may go?

In the current 25 man squad we have Leon Barnett, David Fox, Simeon Jackson, Jacob Butterfield, Andrew Surman and Kei Kamara.

That is six players potentially who may not be involved next year and deemed surplus to requirements.

Van Wolfswinkel means 5 places up for grabs, it would appear we may sign a centre- back in Curtis Davies or Dragovic of Basel leaving four places.

Houghton obviously wants to strengthen midfielder with a winger, attacking midfielder and maybe holding player not to mention another striker perhaps?

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Don''t forget Vaughn, he''s one of the few I''d consider having another look at.I''d have Kei. Fox and Barnett at a push, as squad fillers.

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Morty would you accept only two more new faces in summer in addition o Wolfswinkel?

If you accept them as squad fillers there wont be any more room?

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[quote user="Capt_Canary"]Morty would you accept only two more new faces in summer in addition o Wolfswinkel?

If you accept them as squad fillers there wont be any more room?[/quote]I am not so sure we will buy 5 good quality players, circa 3, 4 or 5 million pounds apiece.You can''t expect to have 25 world class players in the squad, theres always going to be room for hard workers and possible improvers.

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Signing too many players could change the atmosphere in the dressing room - and that atmosphere has been a massive part of our successes in recent times

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That''s 9/10 players roughly who in theory may not get a look in, in the first team squad.

I can''t see them all going just for the sake of it, purely because some are just fillers. And it makes no sense in getting rid and then spending money on another filler.

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I''d be surprised if Tierney isn''t in that list of players offloaded. CH hasn''t utilised him all season, though he was on the bench today.

Tbh there are several big decisions to be made - I cant help but think one of Ruddy or Bunn will be off, both might quite reasonably want to be first choice wherever they are.

Age is also crucial - whether new guys have to be part of the ''named 25'' + some of our other current squad players are getting there, aren''t they (Korey?).

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Fitness is the only problem with Ayala, clearly a great footballer but, like Vaughan, if he can''t stay fit then he''s not worth it.

R Bennett really stepped up today too which was good to see, possibly a better prospect in the long term. I can''t see us keeping both if we bring in Curtis Davies, which seems like a likely avenue

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Don''t forget don''t Smith, Rudd and Adeyemi now count in the squad?

I would personally lose, Chris Martin, Tierney, Ward, Barnett, Jackson and Vaughan.

I would potentially keep Surman and Fox depending on who comes in but can see both being required to free up space.

I''d sign Garrido and personally Kamara.

I''d like to see another good CB (Davis seems an obvious target and fit), a quality central midfielder, another quality striker and at least one winger (left side priority).

If bargains are out there outside of that list then lets of course snap them up!

I really think this window needs to be a quality over quantity approach to upgrading the team.

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Don''t forget that players like Rudd Korey Smith Adeyemi and Francombe would no longer count as under 21s and if we kept them would either have to be named in the 25 or again shipped out on loan all year. Think most will go.

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The squad all depends who we are buying, for example if we signed someone like Will Hughes then he wouldn''t count as a squad member. However, if they''re over 21 then naturally means more squad fillers need to go.

I''ll keep:

3 - Ruddy/Bunn/Camp.

6 - Martin/Whittaker/Garrido

9 - Bassong/Turner/Bennett

12 Tettey/Johnson/ and maybe Korey Smith to see where he is pre-season.

17 Snoddy/Pilks/E.Bennett/Wes/Howson

21 Rvw/Kamara/Holt/Becchio

Rudd/Steer both out on loan.

Jackson

Surman

Fox

Barnett

Butterfield

Tierney

Francomb

Ward

C.Martin

Vaughan

Ayala

Adeyemi

However, it''s hell of a list of players to get rid of, and would mean only 4 squad players signing and from the 21, would need another LB and CB. Guess the other two you would say depends if we play 4231 or 442.

If Korey not upto the grade as back up defensive mid, would get rid and make it 5 arriving in the summer.

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Also I have never quite got the rating of Ayala . Every time I''vewatched him he like likely to concede a penalty. Not sure if he is still injured but doesn''t even seem to have got on the bench since Davies took over. I think that IF we stay up there will be a pretty big turnover especially as some players won''t want to spend a second year kicking their heels on the bench

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I think that we should keep Surman. At times his link up play with the likes of Hoolahan and Pilkington has made us unplayable. He''s been unlucky with injuries but he''s a player who I feel at 26ish is about to come into his prime. I definitely feel fans are blind to his talent. Certainly rather keep him than Fox or Vaughan.

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Keeper for next season:

Ruddy, Bunn

FB:

Martin, Whittaker, Garrido +1

CB

Bassong, Turner, Bennett + 1 (Davies)

Wingers

Pilks, Snoddy , Bennett + 2

CM

Tettey, Johnson, Howson + 2

AM

Hoolahan + 1

Forwards

RVW, + 3

So by my rekoning the following will be sold or released:

Martin, Fox, Surman, Smith, Ward, Barnett, Camp, Jackson, Holt, Kamara, Becchio, Tierney, Vaughan, Francombe

The following will be loaned:

Ayala, Steer, Rudd, Adiyemi, Butterfield, The Murphy''s

If we can raise £4m from the sales then that will pay for Davies so that just leaves £50m to be spent on the rest of the squad.

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I dont think Surman being let go is anywhere near certain, we just dont know how much game time he would have been given had he been fit all season, there have been times when Hughton has looked to get him involved, certainly more players like Fox, Tierney and Butterfield rightly or wrongly.

 

I think it''s almost certain that Vaughan, Martin, Barnett, Ayala and Ward will all be let go. There might even been one or two in or around the first team that transfer should a decent offer come in and Hughton has what he see''s an upgraded replacement to bring in.

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But its not as easy as just writing a list of 6-8 players and saying we should release/sell those.

 

Firstly they have to want to go. And, assuming some on the list are still under contract and on Prem wages but can''t get near a Prem team would therefore be of little interest to another Prem team, are they going to want to drop to the Championship for less wages? Bet there''ll be a few who won''t fancy that, they''ll convince themselves they want to "fight for their place" under the guise of being in a comfort zone-settled and being paid a salary they might never come near earning again.

 

I''m not suggesting we have any Winston Bogardes at the club but if you''re under contract there is no reason for anyone to think a player perceived as surplus to requirements should decide he ought to do the "decent thing" and allow himself to be shipped out to somewhere he doesn''t want to go for less money!

 

Elliott Ward is an exception-contract nearly up and as good as gone already. But with players like Surman, Fox, Butterfield and Becchio et al, its not as simple as saying "...sell Surman, Fox, Butterfield and Becchio for ''x million and buy...."   -as they may all see themselves as settle here and prepared for another season at Carrow Road regardless. We could release them of course-but that, for someone like Surman, would be a few years money and an expense that may be so great its better to keep them here anyway.

 

Ward has gone, Camp probably won''t be retained and Chris Martin will likely not have his year option taken up. But as for the others-someone is going to want to have them and pay both us what we want and what the player expects and they are going to want to leave. It isn''t going to be that straight forward. Cardiff''s owners are talking about spending £25 Million, do you think they''ve earmarked some of that for Leon-or will they, like us, now be looking for better players and a better standard than what Leon can now offer them? So he may be back as well.

 

Don''t think it''ll be quite as hectic over the Summer in terms of outs and ins as we''d expect it to be.

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Jersey, you reckno we''ll sigh 3 forwards, an attacking midfielder, two wingers, two central midfielders, a full back AND a centre back all in the summer?!

Are you out of your mind?!

Kamara will sign. Becchio is on a three year deal and will stay, Holt is still valued here. Yes he''s been off the boil lately but as yesterday showed, he''s still a massive leader for the team.

The only strikers to leave will be C Martin and Vaughan, unless Hughton has decided he see''s potential in either of them from their loan periods

Surman has quality, and would be worth keeping, he''s been unfortunate with injury. I wouldn''t even be surprised if we keep one of Fox or Korey Smith too, they would be great back-up for our main midfielders.

Camp is only here ''til the end of the season, and I expect that to remain the same. With Rudd slipping into the age where he counts as a player, it would be worth including him instead of a third keeper from outside the club.

I think people who think we''re going to sell half our squad and bring in around 10 new players are deluded. You can''t kill the atmosphere in the squad, you have to change the squad carefully and slowly over time. Too many arrivals will deter the dressing room closeness, and affect performances.

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We need more pace in the team, and a central midfielder who can dictate play and tempo. We can not play another season with two dull and skilless def mids.

Also another 2 forwards, as Holt will be impact sub next season.

At least one winger with pace, and 2 fullbacks.

Garrido off, Surman too slow, will be off.

Tierney, Barnett, Ward, Jackson, Chris Martin, Ayala off.

Fox off, not fancied by Hughton.

Camp off, possibly also Bunn who is not good enough.

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The togetherness from the promotion seasons are gone now, as Hughton as shown no interest to utilize the squad, and fringe players are never getting a look-in.

Likely we will have to sacrifice the "cosy athmosphere" for a mote competitive environment, meaning upgrades of players.

Onwards and upwards, no time for sentiment

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"Don''t think it''ll be quite as hectic over the Summer in terms of outs and ins as we''d expect it to be."

Great post Shuck. What we need now is quality in a couple of positions, to give competition to strikers and midfield. Defence is as good as any other in mid-table I''d say. I''d be happy with 2 or 3 big signings to help to improve on what he have.

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[quote user="morty"]Don''t forget Vaughn, he''s one of the few I''d consider having another look at.


[/quote]

Vaughan''s other half hated it down here and within a couple of months moved back to Liverpool and took the kids with her. That is why he left for Huddersfield which is just an hour or so along the M62. You won''t be seeing him again in a City shirt.

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Did you see the Greeno moment in the QPR match yesterday. Far to prone to booboos. Nein danke.

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I wouldn''t want Green here - I wouldn''t rate him as better than Ruddy or Bunn

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To stay:

Ruddy, Bunn, Whittaker, R.Martin, R.Bennett, Turner, Bassong, E.Bennett, Pilkington, Snodgrass, Hoolahan, RVW

Anyone else could be in danger of being surplus to requirements.

I dont think Francomb, Adeyemi or K.Smith will be able to cut it whilst remain in the premier league. Definately think Rudd & Steer both need a season long loan either league 1 or championship level so maybe keep hold of Camp has 3rd choice.

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[quote user="blahblahblah"]"What we need now is quality in a couple of positions, [/quote]

 

Agreed.   For me its

LB - Garrido A N Other

CB - release Barnett - +1 other

CM - Most obvious area in need of improvement - 2 at starting 11 quality for me.

Attackers - ok with what we have if we keep Kei,  but if finances stretch to a younger better wes then great - if not we have quality here.

So beyond getting Garrido & Kei on the books thats 4 more new faces (and I suspect one will be a season long loan on a try before you buy basis which is good for finances) 

 

Plus of course replacing any of the current 25 who may or may not move on (Martin to Villa, Holt heading north,  Ruddy, Pilkington) 

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