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scotty is here LOL

Thought Mcnally Denied intrest ?

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="CambridgeCanary"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="CambridgeCanary"]

I have strong views about many issues raised here and like many my views can be contradictory.  No one is beyond redemption but football is not above morality.

 

Yet, I want to make a more specific point.  I have been in many business scenarios where people have got very excited about a project only for someone to raise an obvious moral or practical problem which had been overlooked in the general exciment.  That "Is this really a good idea" moment.

 

It is entirely possible that someone thought that considering this guy was a good idea and talks were held.  What matters is that someone had the lightbulb moment and the deal did not proceed to an offer. 

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Yes, I recognise that kind of situation you mention, but you don''t know that is why we didn''t carry on to make a bid in this case. Based on Mboyo''s version of events (which McNally could have now denied but hasn''t so far) a probable scenario is that we approached his club and got permission to talk to Mboyo, and outlined a offer of personal terms and the like. He then told us he wanted to stay in Belgium for the remainder of the season. Accordingly we realised there was no point in making a bid to the club because the player had in effect turned us down.

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Quite right Purple.  I was extrapolating; something I have criticised others for.

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Cambridge, I have been in exactly the kind of situation you describe, where all the discussion is about the legality or otherwise of a potential decison/action and someone (possibly even me!) has piped up with an annoying question about the morality of the issue.

In this case I cannot believe we did not know of Mboyo''s past at the outset. You may be right that later on someone piped up, or the moral case grew stronger and took over the argument. But my suspicion is as above, that it was the player who effectively ended our interest, at least until the summer.

I think this has been a good discussion and it is known that McNally keeps an eye on the message-boards, so people''s views here may be counting for something.

For myself I still would want to know at least five things.

Firstly, what was Mboyo''s part in the rape. Was it active or passive, as a spectator?

Was he treated over-leniently by the Belgian judicial/penal system because of his talent, or is that the usual way there, to try to encourage (successfully in this case) criminals to go straight?

What is the view of John Collins, the Charleroi manager who gave Mboyo a chance, as to the genuineness or otherwise of his moral reformation.

What is the view of the victim as to Mboyo''s apparent reformation and the fact that he is able to play and earn very good money as a footballer? I would place a fair bit of weight on that.

Has Mboyo, once released, used his privileged position as a footballer to try to convince gang members and the like to give up that criminal way of life? Another important factor for me.

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I agree with these questions Purple. This is such a hard issue to grapple with because the fact is we simply do not know the facts and for me those facts are all important.

Notwithstanding that the range of posts and views in this thread are perhaps a reason of why we should not sign this player as it is clear his signing would be controversial and potentially divisive. I am not convinced our need to sign him is so acute as to make it worth the hassle/risk!

Bethnal above had alluded to the fact that this guy was convicted for not telling the police about what he knew was going on and that he did not actually participate in the rape that occurred. IF that is the case then for me that does make a difference. Of course he''s still highly culpable for not telling the police and that should not be excused for that at all but when looked at objectively if not grassing up his fellow gang members was basically his crime is he as culpable as the people who locked the girl up and actively participated in the rape? i know that if I knew such a crime was being committed then i would go to the police immediately but then I have never been a member of a Brussels street gang and do not know what that entails!

I consider myself to be far from a liberal (in fact i would label myself as right wing) but i do believe that the purpose of prison has to at least partially be to rehabilitate and where possible enable those who have served their time to come out and rejoin society. There are arguably some crimes where they do not deserve that chance. Gang rape of a minor is possibly one of those depending on the circumstances. the question here though has to be what were the circumstances and what were the facts because without knowing those none of us are really qualified to judge whether or not he deserves a second chance.

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