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First Wizard

Time Ripe For Euro League?.

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To most City supporters it has become self evident that the Premiership is no longer a level playing field.

Few clubs can compete with the spending power of Chelski, Manure and Arsenal. Yankee Canary sowed a thought in my mind recently when he described Arsenal''s demolishing of Palace.

These clubs can buy any home grown or foreign talent they want, and the rest, like City, can go to hell as far as they are concerned.

For some time now, the idea of a European Super League has been muted, well, it can''t come quick enough for me!.

Sour grapes?, without a doubt, especially when some naive posters on here, insist on comparing us with those teams!.

Yes, you would lose certain ''glamour'' games. Yes, they would still persuade young talent to join them on their fat cat crusade.

But City supporters and other teams fans, might be able to stop writing off 18 bloody points a season, so bring it on, pronto please.

Then our beloved game might just start to resemble the ''fair play'' thesis it once had. Rather than the ''have and have not'' league which is the premiership today!.

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[quote]To most City supporters it has become self evident that the Premiership is no longer a level playing field. Few clubs can compete with the spending power of Chelski, Manure and Arsenal. Yankee Canary...[/quote]

Sometimes I wish you''d get muted

Seriously, the premiership has never been a level playing field. It''s one of the best leagues in the world, but while that makes it difficult to get wins, it also makes it that much more exiting when the wins come. Anyway, I doubt you''d be making this argument if we had 3 more points right now.

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[quote]Sometimes I wish you''d get muted Seriously, the premiership has never been a level playing field. It''s one of the best leagues in the world, but while that makes it difficult to get wins, it also m...[/quote]

Had you known me a bit longer Bunny, you would know that I very rarely change my stance, even if I''m wrong!.

Even if we were in the top 5, I would feel just the same about this.

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Personally, I do not think the fans of the big three would want a Euro league, it would be expensive and more time consuming to go to away games and they would lose out on the local rivalry. Banter between fans would also be less evident in the stadiums and also socially, as you are not going to meet supporters of the other teams at work/ in pubs etc.

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[quote]Wiz is allowed to say what he wants. its a message board[/quote]

If you''re referring to my first comment (with a winky smiley to show I wasn''t being serious), it was in response to 1st Wizard''s misspelling of "mooted"...

1st Wiz: don''t you think the premiership would lose its attraction if we couldn''t compete with the best teams in the country? I mean I''m sure a Euro superleague would be welcomed by the bigger teams, who would get even more revenue than before, but I don''t see what''s in it for the smaller teams who would be left behind.

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Its not often i say this but i totally agree with wiz on this one.

the premiership was a 3 horse race before a ball was kicked this season and with the additional income generated for those qualifying for the champions league season after season the enormous gulf in wealth between clubs has made the premiership as uncompetitive as it is in Scotland and it is only going to get worse.

Each team plays 38 games and for what? To see which team can challenge Liverpool for 4th place and which of the 3 promoted clubs can survive. Ok so there''s an occasional shock but lets face it - as Wiz says - some games are a write-off before a whilstle is blown and we have paid £100 to travel to Old Trafford, Stamford Bridge and inevitably Highbury without a prayer.

I couldn''t give a toss if we don''t participate in the same league as Moan U, Chelski and Arsenhole and their supporters have complete contempt for the non-runners and I for one could do without their patronising. There are plenty of of other clubs in London and the North-West for those that live there and perhaps the remaining supporters who support them for their succees and for no other reason could switch their allegiance to a local club - even Ipswich!

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also I think as soon as you introduce another league of any kind the Premiership isn''t really the premiership anymore is it.  It''s just another league on the way to the super league.  The Sky money would be less, sponsorship money would be less, merchandise purchases in Britain would be less, gate receipts would be less.  Before you know it the now lower, poorer clubs like us would just be even less well off as we wouldn''t be getting as much TV money because SKY would want to have the super league.   As far as neutrals go watching footy on TV which would they prefer to see:   Man Utd Vs Real Madrid or Norwich V Birmingham.

Wiz I''m afraid we would not gain much by getting rid of the top boys into another league, I think we would lose more.

The other big deciding factor as someone else pointed out is the club''s in question increased expenditure on travelling and accomodation, drop in their own fans attendance to away matches etc. would mean they would be worse off too.  

Big investors are more likely to invest into a Premiership club as there would be too many expenses and risks involved with Euro Super League clubs and then you would just end with another 1 or 2 massive clubs winning the Premiership anyway.  Catch 22.

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Seems a bit of a defeatist attitude. You seem to be suggesting that we shouldn''t even try to compete with the big boys, because they''ll always beat us. What about Palace''s draw with Arsenal at the beginning of the season? If we''d done something similar to one of the big 3, would anyone be suggesting this now? I doubt it. Sport isn''t supposed to be a level playing field. It''s about competition.

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Well! Wiz, to escape from competing with the big boys may well be easier than beating them. As Stevenage Fan suggests I feel also that it would be a two edged sword, where revenue would be chanelled into the European league, and Sky with it''s undoubted clout would further grab money that could be used to bolster the underfunded poorer teams at the bottom end of the now Prem. Though I for one would never expect the likes of Norwich to beat any of the big 5, I always relish the chance of a spirited struggle against their like. You have mentioned the Walker era with affection and you will not have forgotten the thrill of seeing the spectacle of Norwich playing against Bayern Munich. That era was the stuff of ledgends and that type of spectacle would be gone sadly, for ever, along with more money for the big boys.

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[quote]also I think as soon as you introduce another league of any kind the Premiership isn''t really the premiership anymore is it. It''s just another league on the way to the super league. The Sky money wo...[/quote]

Spot on stevenagefan could not have out it better myself.

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I agree entirely with your theme for a level playing field Wiz.

However I don''t believe moving the best three teams out would have the effect you desire because when they are gone the fourth,fifth and sixth teams would then become the best and too big for the league and so forth. Also the quality of league would lessen.

In an attempt to offer a constructive alternative I would suggest a wage/transfer spending cap should be applied.

The criteria for calculating the limit to be related to the attendance each club averages over a given period.

Most supporters would readily accept that those clubs drawing the biggest crowds should have the bigger player budget.

Any additional monies from other sources like T.V.payments and shop sales should be spent to improve the respective grounds, facilities and youth team academies.

Controversially I would also suggest that all promoted clubs should have a first season amnesty from relegation to help themselves become established and hopefully better equipped to face the big guns. I have no ulterior motive here of course.

 

 

 

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I don''t like the idea of this at all.

Teams will always, somehow, break away from the pack. Whether this be through great management, or simply throwing stupid amounts of cash about. You cannot keep teams down, someone will always prosper.

Creating a European league wouldn''t work; prices for games are high enough as it is, without having to play for a plane ticket every other week. Even supporters of the big clubs wouldn''t accept this. It simply wont happen.

Also, I like the fact we have somewhere to go. Creating a league where there is a much of a muchness would be dull. Even the Championship has good teams and bad teams. We have something to aim for at Norwich; continuous Premiership football. That''s the long-term goal.

I can see the benefits, but overall it''s not a good idea. I don''t like it anyway!

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Even though I hate the sight of them if they did ever leave the prem would become just like the chumpionship, all the sky money would disappear and many teams would be in dire straights. They are head and shoulders above the rest but I do feel that teams are beaten before they go on the pitch, until other teams start to believe they can beat them they never will. Bolton have beaten Arse and Manure quite regulary over the years even though they have inferior players, this is down to having a manager who has excellent motivational skills hence making them believe they can win. Wolves beat manure at molineux last year and if we get our act together I certainly wouldn''t totally rule out 3 points against Chelski or Manure.

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[quote]If you''re referring to my first comment (with a winky smiley to show I wasn''t being serious), it was in response to 1st Wizard''s misspelling of "mooted"... 1st Wiz: don''t you think the premiership w...[/quote]

Bunny & Beelsie: You have both, and indeed a lot of you have raised the argument that it would devalue the premiership, and of course you''re right.

That''s why I mentioned the phrase, sour grapes.

But I do get so fed up with their bloody primadonna antics (Rooney please note!) that I was thinking of a quick fix solution to my frustrations and ignoring other issues.

Its not fair, refs and blind linesmen tend to lean towards them (especially with Sir Fergie going mad on the touchline!) also the media seem to back them, no matter what they do. 

The best option for me maybe, and following your recommendations, is to go for the odd miracle happening from time to time!.

Thank you all for you wise input on this, it is duly noted.

Boo Hoo, sob sob.   

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Wiz, you didn''t mention the other proposal that had been knocking around and that was Premier League 2. Move the "stratospheric" teams into a top tier and the lesser teams into a lower level Premier League. That would put City in the lower level Premier League, but put Arsenal, Chelsea (a team I DID NOT liken us to if you bothered to actually read my text), Man U, Liverpool plus ?Personally I''d be happier if it stayed as it is. Bring on the Arsenals, Chelseas and so forth. City might get a cuffing but at least the punters get to see the Premier League top stars.The thing I think you would also find with a Euro-Super League is that much more of the TV money would go there instead of the nation''s top league.Aren''t the punters getting an effective European League at the moment anyway with the changes that were made to the group stages of the Champions League (a competition now devalued in my opinion due to the presence of non-champions) PLUS the group stage changes that were made to the UEFA Cup. Maybe you''ll see a new Euro-cup competition called the "Real Champions League" with only champions present with the Champions League relegated to being the "Lesser Champions League" and the UEFA Cup staying the same....

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