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ARCHIEGEMMELL

Is Holt Really A Striker?

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Now...I don''t want to knock our so called talisman.But is he really a premiership centre-forward?  At this level you need to be ruthlessly efficient and have the composure to finish in any given situation. Does this sound like our Grant? I don''t think so!  Every time he wins or receives the ball he is always too far out of position...either at the left or right corner flag. In essence it is like us playing a six man midfield. Defensively it makes us very hard to break down but more or less nullifies our attack.   Now I know I have almost committed social networking suicide with the delusional masses on here  but I feel we should utilise the squad more and rotate our strikers. I mean...what is the point in bringing on Morison or especially Jackson to play out the last few seconds of a game? They will never get their match sharpness.  Now if Holt was racking up the goals at this level and with the amount of match time he has had he should be in double figures by now...I wouldn''t be having this discussion.  I believe Hughton needs to start using his subs wisely and to not be too afraid of mixing it up a bit if his plan ''A'' doesn''t appear to be working.  Now...I am not saying that Holt isn''t a useful acquisition to the team (he does link play and hold the ball up well) but for the lone striker I don''t think he has enough in his arsenal and we already have enough midfielders out on the park!

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Perhaps we could have a sticky post at the top of the board entitled "Grant Holt''s role in Hughton''s Norwich" that peoplecan refer to when they feel the need to post one of these threads. I for one am bored of explaining it now...

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He should be in double figures?

Only five are, and all bar one are established Premierhaip goal scores.

Holt scored 15 last season, we play dfferent,y this season and he''s not getting half as many chances.

He is playing how Hughton tells him to play, the ''lack'' of goals is because of this, we could be playing anyone up front, but playing the same kind of football they''d hardly have any more goals than Holt. It''s not his problem, it''s the system. If it were his problem, Morison would have been starting weeks ago.

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I admire your spirit GP but this one isn''t worth the bother. Someone who comes on here and kicks off by insulting posters and then criticises our club''s talisman isn''t here for debate. Except maybe  mass debate.

 

Now Archie, I''m sure you have the answer to my holiday problem...

 

What feckin'' day are you emptying my bin this week?

 

 

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His problem is that he is more than just a striker. Therefore he maybe wont get as many goals as say Darren Bent. I do think we should look to getting a classy robust, pacy out and out striker to give a better option for his partner. A tevezesque player but at our level

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I might not be the sharpest tool but can you define "we play differently"to me. I might have missed something here but in football isn''t the goal(pardon the pun) to put the ball into the net.  Now...scoring 15 goals last season was a fantastic achievement for a footballer of Holt''s ability but no more than I would expect from a gifted midfielder to score during a season.  You mentioned ''top five'' and I would like to draw your attention to Michu. He was purchased for a modest sum from a small club called Rayo Vallecano! Probably not too dissimilar to a club of our stature. I believe he is joint leading Premiership goalscorer...but I could be wrong...I am not too hot with stats!  The point I am trying to make here is he (Michu) seems to have (early days yet) a predatory instict at this level. Something I believe Holt doesn''t possess. His spatial awareness and the timing of his runs and being in the right place at the right time has absolutely nothing to do with a change of system. That''s why I made a reference to Holt drifting over to the corner a flag way too often to be effective.  Now...I would love to be a spectator at the Norwich training ground or even  a fly on the wall during half time, but do you honestly expect me to believe that Hughton is doing his damnedest to coach the ability of scoring goals out of Grant Holt in order to fit into our so called ''New System''.   He''s a striker for gods sake...he should know  where the back of the net is regardless of what system the manager wants the team to play!

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"insulting posters"...why or whom have I insulted???   You must be very sensitive...all I am doing is instigating a debate. By the sounds of it...it''s not your bins that need to be getting emptied! Speak to the wife!

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Good question - what is the definition of a good Premiership striker ?

A player that scores 15 league goals in his first season in the prem ?

I suppose a midfielder from a top 6 club could score 15 goals in a season - this midfielder would cost about 50mil. And who am I to make such outrageous claims ! I just go by what they write in the national newspapers and what the say on TV.

And also the fact that among his goals were those against Man U, Arsenal, Liverpool, Chelsea & Everton. All classy finishes as well.

Hughton has exchanged goals for points. Holt could easily repeat his scoring feat of last season - but we''d have Hoolahan & Fox in midfield, another striker with Holt and E Bennett attacking at rightback. Forget about defending !

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As has already been stated, no he isn''t a striker he''s so much more than that to the team. He makes it possible for others to score. In our 4-2-3-1 system we effectively have 4 strikers when on the offensive and the biggest testament to Holtys role working is that snodgrass, pilks and wes are scoring goals.

Holt will score some (mainly from set pieces as he''ll have the chance to be in the box) but in this system he simply won''t score as many as last season. That said he plays the role exactly as he should imo and that was clearly evident in the difference from the west brom game to Wednesday.

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Holt is pretty much a one man team when he''s on form.    He scores, he makes goals for others to score, he gives opposition defenders a torrid time - and he can defend.   That is why he is so good for the team.      To answer the op, who''s name is frankly bizarre for a Norwich supporter,  is Holt really a striker?   No, he''s much more than that.

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[quote user="ARCHIEGEMMELL"]
  He''s a striker for gods sake.
[/quote]

Bearing in mind the thread title i smell troll.

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As a casual observer it seems to me the intelligence level of the OP may be a little bit too far in advance of some of the responders!

 

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well he is not a keeper,  full or centre back,  centre or wide midfielder and a winger,   which makes him either a striker or forward.

 

unquestionably the best we have at the club.

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[quote user="Shankslad"]

As a casual observer it seems to me the intelligence level of the OP may be a little bit too far in advance of some of the responders!

 

[/quote]

 

I suspect you''re probably right Armitage but it''s a little unfair to be critical of proven and valuable Canaries fans at the expense of an obvious troll. Perhaps Mungo has a point and casual observers is the price we pay for success.

 

[quote user="ARCHIEGEMMELL"]
Now...I would love to be a spectator at the Norwich training ground [/quote]

Obvious troll is obvious.

Now please be a good lad and tell me what day you''re emptying my feckin'' bin.

 

 

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[quote user="ARCHIEGEMMELL"]"insulting posters"...why or whom have I insulted???[/quote]How about your very first post on this board.....[quote user="ARCHIEGEMMELL"]Now I know I have almost committed social

networking suicide with the delusional masses on here...[/quote][:S]

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No its a small market town, with overinflated prices, populated by Londoners, who hope one day to bump into a local person. Grant Holt is a striker.

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Spot on, Archie! He scored goals for fun in the Championship and below, and even in the Premiership last year, but this year he is struggling.

 

It may be that defenders have had a chance to work him out, and it could be that with the present system, with a single striker, he cannot entirely be the striker we need.

 

He makes a great contribution, both on and off the field. He is regularly back in defence, chasing balls down the wings and providing crosses. He never gives up. I am sure that he inspires the rest of the team. He is indeed our talisman. The fact remains that, howver, that he misses a high proportion of chances which fall his way. His finishing is not clinical enough.

 

We need another good striker, but if we sign one I am not sure how we can incorporate him into the present team shape and also include Holt. This is CHs problem.

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Thank you Salopian...you have have grasped the point I was trying to make without any unnecessary bias or emotion.  I was never my intention to suggest Holt no longer has a role to play in the team but we should be utilizing more of what we have on the bench because he has not been too prolific so far this season...and it will also keep him fresh and match fit.  It''s a pity we don''t have someone like yourself to assist with team selection, scouting and tactics but thank you for level headed reply.

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Hello Nigel...your name suggests to me a hard outer shell with not too much between your ears!   I believe I might have to justify my entitlement to post on here to certain individuals.   Firstly...I have followed Norwich for almost 30 years and can remember the successful teams of the eighties and nineties. Our 1985 ''Milk Cup'' triumph over Sunderland and our semi final exit to Everton in the FA Cup! Our success in the nineties under Mike Walker culminating in our highest ever finish in the Premiership.  Somebody also questioned my allegiance to the flag due to my name. Now...I never expected people to take profile names literally! But I will explain.I possess the surname (Gemmell) and if you were growing up as a kid and playing a lot of football then I will let you deduce the rest!  Regarding your bin problem...I  would contact your local council as I do not live in your area. My bins were emptied on Friday...but as I explained I don''t believe this is your problem...speak to the missus!!

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[quote user="ARCHIEGEMMELL"]Hello Nigel...your name suggests to me a hard outer shell with not too much between your ears!   I believe I might have to justify my entitlement to post on here to certain individuals.   Firstly...I have followed Norwich for almost 30 years and can remember the successful teams of the eighties and nineties. Our 1985 ''Milk Cup'' triumph over Sunderland and our semi final exit to Everton in the FA Cup! Our success in the nineties under Mike Walker culminating in our highest ever finish in the Premiership.  Somebody also questioned my allegiance to the flag due to my name. Now...I never expected people to take profile names literally! But I will explain.I possess the surname (Gemmell) and if you were growing up as a kid and playing a lot of football then I will let you deduce the rest!  Regarding your bin problem...I  would contact your local council as I do not live in your area. My bins were emptied on Friday...but as I explained I don''t believe this is your problem...speak to the missus!![/quote]Do you sit in the Sandpit?

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[quote user="Merry Christmas"]Holt is pretty much a one man team when he''s on form.    He scores, he makes goals for others to score, he gives opposition defenders a torrid time - and he can defend.   That is why he is so good for the team.      To answer the op, who''s name is frankly bizarre for a Norwich supporter,  is Holt really a striker?   No, he''s much more than that.

[/quote]

This...

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[quote user="ARCHIEGEMMELL"]Now...I don''t want to knock our so called talisman.But is he really a premiership centre-forward?[/quote]You are Colin Calderwood and I claim my £5.

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[quote user="ARCHIEGEMMELL"]Hello Nigel...your name suggests to me a hard outer shell with not too much between your ears!

   I believe I might have to justify my entitlement to post on here to certain individuals.

  Firstly...I have followed Norwich for almost 30 years and can remember the successful teams of the eighties and nineties. Our 1985 ''Milk Cup'' triumph over Sunderland and our semi final exit to Everton in the FA Cup! Our success in the nineties under Mike Walker culminating in our highest ever finish in the Premiership.

  Somebody also questioned my allegiance to the flag due to my name. Now...I never expected people to take profile names literally! But I will explain.I possess the surname (Gemmell) and if you were growing up as a kid and playing a lot of football then I will let you deduce the rest!

  Regarding your bin problem...I  would contact your local council as I do not live in your area. My bins were emptied on Friday...but as I explained I don''t believe this is your problem...speak to the missus!!
[/quote]

 

You don''t need to justify anything. Your posts tell us all we need to know. Great gloss of our history BTW. Nobody could have known so much if that hadn''t lived every glorious second..

 

Now before I get bored with you...

 

What day this week are you emptying my feckin'' bin??? And could you be more explicit than your generalisations about our great clubs glorious past.

 

 

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Regarding Nigel...you are so right...I couldn''t be more explicit! It would mean having to go back to basics and dumbing right down to its most primitive form to accommodate!  Like...flogging a dead horse...I would be wasting my time because you probably still wouldn''t grasp it. Time for the dunce''s hat...me thinks!

Au-revoir my foe...I''m soooo bored now...I need a more stimulating challenge!

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So long, farewell, I guess I have to be thankful for small mercies but I still don''t know what day to put my bin out. Or even what feckin'' colour is next. Blue I guess......

 

 

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Archie in one post seems to totally dismiss our change of system and simply say that Holt should still score as many goals as he has in the last 3 seasons, which, by the way, is about 70.

It''s fairly simple, if you are playing up front on your own in a team where the full backs don''t get forward much and the team is trying to set up to be hard to beat, you aren''t going to get as many chances and consequently you probably won''t score as many goals. The point is, we are conceding fewer (in general) than last season and the system has got us a record of W6, D7, L7 from 20 games which is a more than adequate haul.

Put simply, points are more important than goals. We are getting good results as a whole and look odds-on to survive in the league with a few games to spare, some achievement given the upheaval of a change of manager and a dramatic change in playing style.

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