If Hughton Manages To Keep Us Up This Year...

[GenerationA47 747]

Ha, ha Canarygirl. Although if you''re actually a girl i''ll eat my HRT pills.

My thoughts on this debate are manifold (not to say chaotic and possibly highly unoriginal although I claim first use of the word ''manifold'' in this thread, will fight you if you deny me that, mofo''s):

1. Why would anybody seriously refer to unicorns, Mungo''s City (home end) match ticket stubs, or 2nd season syndrome:

http://blogs.montrealgazette.com/2012/08/14/second-season-syndrome/

We are talking out of the 20 promoted teams since 2000 who survived year one in the Prem, 4 have dropped out after year two. So 4 out of 5 clubs survive their second season. Not exactly a very common syndrome. Whether they match their year one finishing position in year two is another question, which would be interesting to see the stats for but ui hen''t gawtem.

2. Although winning League 2 was not done against a backdrop of high quality in that division, it was still a great achievement for many reasons: Lambert inherited low team morale, some average players, and had no preparation with our club- CH at least had this summer and a chance to bring his own players in (without taking anything away from all the good things CH did with his opportunity).

3a. The reason why people hypothetically compare past managers with other past or current managers is because for all our sins we''re football fans, we find it interesting, diverting, amusing, not to say informative. It doesn''t mean we''re living in the past or are trying to undermine the present team, it means we care about our club and this is just one way of expressing it.

3b. It is very commendable and endearing that some fans become infected with the manager and players'' public statements of positive psychology, to the extent that those fans are always 100% focussed on the next game, the last one is behind them now, and we can beat any team on our day as at the end of the day it is 11 v. 11 men when they step out on the pitch.

I simply beg their allowance that not all of us are so directly involved with the team dynamics or personally influential on its performance, and we reserve the right to noisily support them during the match and when in the presence of the Blue, Gold or White enemy, but afterwards to engage in balanced discussions including appropriate criticism and even on occasion comparative analysis of past teams and managers :-p

4. I have faith that CH is going to keep us up (just) in his first season and that would be almost as impressive as 12th under Lambert. This is because he will have got the players old and new playing more his way within the first quarter of a season, as well as learning to adapt ''his way'' to his players and increasingly the teams we are facing.

5. Er...

6. That''s it.

[GenerationA47 747]

*League 1

I seem inadvertently to have gifted us a second relegation and a third promotion, that have somehow been well kept secret by Timelord Duncan Edwards

[kellybrook 0]

If Hughton keeps us clear of the relegation zone that will be a great achievement.  We will have survived the second season and have 60 million quid in our pocket. Stop comparing Hughton to Lambert, the situations are totally different.  Lambert jumped ship because he could see our squad and buying power was very limited for this season.  Hughton has brought in Bassong and Tettey and both look bargains.Give the guy som frigging credit and forget Lambert.

[lake district canary 0]

[quote user="GenerationA47"]Ha, ha Canarygirl. 1. Why would anybody seriously refer to unicorns, Mungo''s City (home end) match ticket stubs, or 2nd season syndrome:

http://blogs.montrealgazette.com/2012/08/14/second-season-syndrome/

We are talking out of the 20 promoted teams since 2000 who survived year one in the Prem, 4 have dropped out after year two. So 4 out of 5 clubs survive their second season. Not exactly a very common syndrome. Whether they match their year one finishing position in year two is another question, which would be interesting to see the stats for but ui hen''t gawtem.

2. Although winning League 2 was not done against a backdrop of high quality in that division, it was still a great achievement for many reasons: Lambert inherited low team morale, some average players, and had no preparation with our club- CH at least had this summer and a chance to bring his own players in (without taking anything away from all the good things CH did with his opportunity).

3a. The reason why people hypothetically compare past managers with other past or current managers is because for all our sins we''re football fans, we find it interesting, diverting, amusing, not to say informative. It doesn''t mean we''re living in the past or are trying to undermine the present team, it means we care about our club and this is just one way of expressing it.

3b. It is very commendable and endearing that some fans become infected with the manager and players'' public statements of positive psychology, to the extent that those fans are always 100% focussed on the next game, the last one is behind them now, and we can beat any team on our day as at the end of the day it is 11 v. 11 men when they step out on the pitch.

I simply beg their allowance that not all of us are so directly involved with the team dynamics or personally influential on its performance, and we reserve the right to noisily support them during the match and when in the presence of the Blue, Gold or White enemy, but afterwards to engage in balanced discussions including appropriate criticism and even on occasion comparative analysis of past teams and managers :-p

4. I have faith that CH is going to keep us up (just) in his first season and that would be almost as impressive as 12th under Lambert. This is because he will have got the players old and new playing more his way within the first quarter of a season, as well as learning to adapt ''his way'' to his players and increasingly the teams we are facing.

5. Er...

6. That''s it.[/quote]

Wow, that''s some post.  On point 3b,  surely people can do both put the last game behind them and take each match as it comes and be able to compare with past matches/managers etc?     Also, I am a firm believer that the attitude of the crowd has a direct influence on the team.  We are not spectators at a match - we go to be emotionally involved with what we are seeing.     If we aren''t - and are just spectators - what is the point in going?  

[GenerationA47 747]

Right on cue, a fine example (thanks, kelly! bootiful) of that noble school of thought.

If we stoop to discuss their deeds of yore... surely they must wilt and perish and pass from this world, as the dark night follows the day

And I say to ye, do not mention His name, for verily it is accursed and so shall ye be, yea, even unto the ends of the Earth, ye ruddy binners

Credit to others is debit from Chris Hughton - always. Just don''t give Chris an overdraft for Christmas, ok?

and the killer-

You just can''t compare... but we are probably doing better now than we would have under Judas anyway. Now shut up and let me get on with my new debate shutdown exercises! What do you think this is, you negative morons, some kind of friggin discussion forum?!!

[GenerationA47 747]

LDC, I know, it''s like pink ''un constipation- I save it all up, then all my old squit comes pouring out at once.

To respond, people can focus on what they desire to; I merely question their apparent need for all others to conform to that mentality.

And indeed, I do respectfully question the effect that them exercising that mentality can have on the outcomes we all want. I refer you to my point above about giving noisy support during the game, my past criticisms of booing our own players, incomprehension of always watching us play in resolute silence or clapping opposition players, etc. These things can actually affect the club in my view; idle internet discussions like this can''t (i don''t buy the "players might come on here and cry" line!).

Much as your own optimistic outlook is at times a welcome breath of fresh air on this site, I take it as an extreme ideology from some fans that states you can''t actively - and emotionally - support our team whilst still debating negatives and future uncertainties, likewise sometimes citing past positives too.

In my view it is a ridiculous position to exclude the middle ground for some reason, yet this happens very often and very easily. Oh well, other than triggering my over-long posts I don''t let it affect me! ;-)

On the flipside there are those who throw around happy clapper playground insults, or only come out to play when we lose and say we''re definitely going down after a bad run, or constantly start inconsequential and irrelevant Lambert threads. For me, they are the opposite extreme and can be equally unhelpful.

[lake district canary 0]

You  have to admit that its all part of life''s rich pattern.   You get a complete cross section of fans on here - and for me that is what is good.    From the total numpties like Mungo to the erudite and  knowledgeable intelligent posts of such as purple.  The extreme views of the "toys out of the pram" brigade are quite funny in a serious sort of way - its so predictable, but it is harmful too.    It sets a train of thought that alot will buy in to - and it needs the so called happy clappies to come out to redress the balance.   The truth is nearly always somewhere in the middle ground - its just that the noisy minority get noticed more.   I will always try to see a positive side - if there is one  - and will put that message out there if I can - mainly to see if I can get the reactionaries to think a little bit more about their position.    A pointless task, you might think, but I''m not a football expert, just a City fan who wants to see the best for our club - and one thing I do know is that negativity and abuse of players/managers etc will get us nowhere.  

If Lord Lambert of Norwich - before he abdicated - taught us anything - it was how being  positive is a good way to go about things.  A pity more of that hasn''t rubbed off on to some of our fans.      Life for me is a learning process.   I fear that those that see things in black and white  have closed their minds to the possibilities and potential of new situations.  It is the easiest thing in the world to be negative - a bit more difficult, maybe to be positive - but for me,  I would far rather see the good in a situation than  the bad.   

You''ve set me off on one A47,  but I think there''s room for all views on here - but if people spout extreme points of view - then they should expect the opposite response.  It is a good board imo -  except for mungo - but then nothing''s pefect..............................[:(]

[Roodge 0]

What Lambert did above all else he managed to galvanize this city county & club got people buzzing if you like, in a way that hasnt been seen for years here. Compare this tro the start of this season, everybody seems to be in a state of high anxiety, & slightly worried. The ground is quieter, people sit like zombies watching telievision, slightly harsh I know, but come on , if we are to succeed, & Chris Hughton to succeed, we have to get behind the manager & team like last season, shout sing & encourage, make it unpleasant for the opposition, that is our 12th man. Fortress time. Chris Hughton is the best man for the job, the spurs fans know we got a good''un here, we all got to raise our game a bit. LETS BE AVIN U. Lets make some NOISE. Its not about Lambert, or anyone else, its about our club, we sink or swim together. We have a massive part to play in this too.

[crabbycanary 2]

Were you at the Arsenal game?

[Roodge 0]

Crabby, no I wasnt, I am not a season ticket holder unfortunately. Yes I hear you, the crowd was immense, & look how it lifted the team. I was at the spurs game though, & cant remember Carrow road being so quiet. Used to have season tickets with me dad for 25 years in the main stand, those farmers & cigar smokers used to get prettty nasty the rumble of feet on the wooden floors & cushions thrown onto the pitch at bad refereeing decisions. One of the reasons Carrow Road is a hard place to play at, is the close proximity of the crowd to the pitch, those players hear every word aimed at them.