Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Matt Morriss

Hughton, Gunn and McNally

Recommended Posts

A lot of people on here are calling for Hughton''s head already and a lot of people are calling said people idiots.

I''m on the fence with this one, Hughton''s got to be given time but a similar result v QPR will prove that something is very definitely wrong.

Gunn''s opening day disaster at home to Colchester proved one thing. That something was very very wrong. The team wasn''t prepared at all and the team selection/tactics were flawed.

Worryingly I see similarities with Hughton''s start. Pre season we had been working on a more defensive lineup and tactics, with Hughton favouring an emphasis on clean sheets as a starting point.

The Borussia game was an example of the new look defensive Norwich City. It didn''t work at all, we looked very poor and didn''t keep a clean sheet.

Yet Hughton persevered, the formation changed slightly, if not for the worse as we went with a 451 instead of the 4411 v BM.

So Hughton was ready to deploy his gameplan that he had devised pre season and drilled into the squad.

We lost 5-0.

This represents a complete catastrophe and all the work done by the coaching staff pre season culminated in complete failure on match day.

For me this is too similar to Gunn''s League 1 bow. To have a gameplan fail so dramatically proves one thing.

That the gameplan was very very wrong from the outset, or had been deployed ineptly.

I would like the people calling people idiots for wanting Hughton gone to explain the difference between Hughton''s start and Gunn''s debacle. Because for me there are too many similarities that can''t be ignored just because Hughton done well at Newcastle and Brum and should be given time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Problem is I just can''t see us beating QPRse, at the moment... sorry It was just that bad saturday... Just being honest. I''m not one of the "Hughton out-clan" nor am I one of the "doom and gloomers" (yet). But CH has got one hell of a turn around to realise!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
"This represents a complete catastrophe"Utter nonsense.  One game out of 38.  At least two, possibly three freak goals that another time would not have gone in and then chasing the game in the heat and we were going to struggle.People keep banging on about the defensive tactics.  We went 442 FOR THE WHOLE SECOND HALF FFS.last season Lambert went to Fulham, played even more defensive and also lost.Gain a memory and grow a pair.  It''s going to be a long season whoever we have as manager.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"]

For me this is too similar to Gunn''s League 1 bow. To have a gameplan fail so dramatically proves one thing.

That the gameplan was very very wrong from the outset, or had been deployed ineptly.

I would like the people calling people idiots for wanting Hughton gone to explain the difference between Hughton''s start and Gunn''s debacle. Because for me there are too many similarities that can''t be ignored just because Hughton done well at Newcastle and Brum and should be given time.[/quote]Gunn had the benefit of 19 competitive matches as manager prior to that 7-1 debacle, C.H. has had the benefit of 0 competitive matches.7-1 at home to Colchester in the third tier is a far worse result by any measure than 5-0 away to one of the best teams at home in the prem.Unlike Gunn C.H. has serious form for managing a football club, he has experienced promotion and consolidation with NUFC but possibly more pertinently revived the fortunes of a club in distress leading them to a very successful European campaign, the fifth round of the F.A. Cup and fourth in the Champs despite the arrest of its owner and all the other problems at a high level within the club.I can''t see C.H. having accomplished any of this without being adaptable and insightful hence I feel quite entitled to view anyone calling for his sacking after one game rather disparagingly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Grant Holt''s 3 year contract"]For Hucks sake... it was ONE GAME! Beat the Queens next saturday and you''ll be wanting Hughton to get manager of the year!

Wow what a brilliantly thought out and measured response. Did you even read my post in its entirety?

If we beat QPR I will not be wanting Hughton to get manager of the year primarily because I''m not a f*****g idiot, or a fickle attention seeking pinkun poster.

As you failed completely to understand my posts underlying question, I''ll repeat it for you.

Can you explain to me the difference between Hughton''s start and Gunn''s, and give your opinion as to why Hughton is the right man, despite Saturdays result.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Rootin FerHooten"]Gunn had the benefit of 19 competitive matches as manager prior to that 7-1 debacle, C.H. has had the benefit of 0 competitive matches.7-1 at home to Colchester in the third tier is a far worse result by any measure than 5-0 away to one of the best teams at home in the prem.Unlike Gunn C.H. has serious form for managing a football club, he has experienced promotion and consolidation with NUFC but possibly more pertinently revived the fortunes of a club in distress leading them to a very successful European campaign, the fifth round of the F.A. Cup and fourth in the Champs despite the arrest of its owner and all the other problems at a high level within the club.I can''t see C.H. having accomplished any of this without being adaptable and insightful hence I feel quite entitled to view anyone calling for his sacking after one game rather disparagingly.[/quote]
Quoted for truth. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote user="kellybrook"]"This represents a complete catastrophe"Utter nonsense.  One game out of 38.  At least two, possibly three freak goals that another time would not have gone in and then chasing the game in the heat and we were going to struggle.People keep banging on about the defensive tactics.  We went 442 FOR THE WHOLE SECOND HALF FFS.last season Lambert went to Fulham, played even more defensive and also lost.Gain a memory and grow a pair.  It''s going to be a long season whoever we have as manager.[/quote]

Christ another one missing the point. We''re not talking about a one off result here. We''re talking about the fruits of the pre season work, and how everything was geared up for the first game, and how it went so horribly wrong.

Again, I want your opinion on how this differs to Gunn''s 7-1 loss.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Gareth"][quote user="Rootin FerHooten"]

Gunn had the benefit of 19 competitive matches as manager prior to that 7-1 debacle, C.H. has had the benefit of 0 competitive matches.

7-1 at home to Colchester in the third tier is a far worse result by any measure than 5-0 away to one of the best teams at home in the prem.

Unlike Gunn C.H. has serious form for managing a football club, he has experienced promotion and consolidation with NUFC but possibly more pertinently revived the fortunes of a club in distress leading them to a very successful European campaign, the fifth round of the F.A. Cup and fourth in the Champs despite the arrest of its owner and all the other problems at a high level within the club.

I can''t see C.H. having accomplished any of this without being adaptable and insightful hence I feel quite entitled to view anyone calling for his sacking after one game rather disparagingly.
[/quote]


Quoted for truth. 

[/quote]

 

And to add further, Gunn''s preparation for the season was shoddy and unprofessional suggesting that (despite Gunn''s embarrassing claims) he could not turn it round and did not really know what he was doing.   The message of Colchester wasa not that Gunn lost disatrously but that having been relegated, Gunn had learnt nothing.  

 

They could not be further apart as comparators.

 

Incidentally, why does everyone quote Gunn as the precendent and not Worthy who was given every chance and then double to turn things round?   True, Worthy was sacked several years too late but few would have argued that he should not have been given at least a season after relegation (I''m one of the few as I would have sacked him on the coach back  from Fulham but that''s another story).  Most people did not begrudge Worthy that chance so why so harsh with Hughton whose big toe is a better more experienced manager than Worthy will ever be? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
No, you are missing the point.  "The fruits of pre-season work" - what romantic nonsense is that? Preseason is about fitness and a bit of tinkering, that''s about it.  A lot of teams have fantastic pre-seasons and then bomb down the league.  So what on earth have these fruits got to do with Fulham away?Sod all.The players are fit, but we didn''t play well and couldn''t get into the game.  Has happened before and will happen again. I again also say there were a couple at least fluke goals in there, the goaline one could have gone the other way, Duff could easily have been given offside and the deflection is pure luck.The huge difference between Gunn and Hughton is of course, should people choose to see it, that Hughton managed a Champ club to a decent season last year.  Gunn as a nobody and the rumours of poor practises off the pitch were all over the place even before a ball was kicked.Totally incomparable regimes and situations.  Stop bloody panicking.

[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="kellybrook"]"This represents a complete catastrophe"Utter nonsense.  One game out of 38.  At least two, possibly three freak goals that another time would not have gone in and then chasing the game in the heat and we were going to struggle.People keep banging on about the defensive tactics.  We went 442 FOR THE WHOLE SECOND HALF FFS.last season Lambert went to Fulham, played even more defensive and also lost.Gain a memory and grow a pair.  It''s going to be a long season whoever we have as manager.[/quote]

Christ another one missing the point. We''re not talking about a one off result here. We''re talking about the fruits of the pre season work, and how everything was geared up for the first game, and how it went so horribly wrong.

Again, I want your opinion on how this differs to Gunn''s 7-1 loss.[/quote]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Shock news just in, Huckerbys boots Matt gets a strop on because folks disagree with him....[:D]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I cannot quite adjust my thinking to the fact that Saturday''s result at Premiership stalwarts Fulham, can in any way be compared to a 1-7 drubbing by lowly Colchester, with such stars as Kevin Lisbie in attack, at the Carra.

 

Admittedly, we have invested a bit since the, but comparisons? Not in my book.

 

Clearly the tactics were wrong, but PL was not always spot-on in this respect, but team selection was fair enough (for the start, at least.)

 

The heat didn''t help when chasing a game.

 

The second goal was the killer and the time when serious changes should have been made immediately IMO. After the third, it didn''t matter. 

 

 

Inquest over, for me at least.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="BroadstairsR"]

I cannot quite adjust my thinking to the fact that Saturday''s result at Premiership stalwarts Fulham, can in any way be compared to a 1-7 drubbing by lowly Colchester, with such stars as Kevin Lisbie in attack, at the Carra.

 

Admittedly, we have invested a bit since the, but comparisons? Not in my book.

 

Clearly the tactics were wrong, but PL was not always spot-on in this respect, but team selection was fair enough (for the start, at least.)

 

The heat didn''t help when chasing a game.

 

The second goal was the killer and the time when serious changes should have been made immediately IMO. After the third, it didn''t matter. 

 

 

Inquest over, for me at least.

[/quote]
We conceded the second just before half time and brought Morison on immediately after half time. Looking back on it now, Snodgrass should have came of as well in favour of Bennett.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Also to add Fulham''s home form is damned impressive. Last season they lost just 4 home games (Everton, Man Utd, Swansea and Tottenham) and got some fantastic results against Arsenal (2-1 Fulham), Chelsea (1-1), Liverpool (1-0), Man City (2-2) and Newcastle Utd. (5-2 Fulham) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
="kellybrook"] No, you are missing the point.  "The fruits of pre-season work" - what romantic nonsense is that? Preseason is about fitness and a bit of tinkering, that''s about it.  A lot of teams have fantastic pre-seasons and then bomb down the league.  So what on earth have these fruits got to do with Fulham away? Sod all.

What? are you insane or something? The fruits of pre season was a bl**dy phrase. It wasnt meant to be romantic nonsense. Unbelievable.

Ill dumb it down for you so you can understand. What hooton done did in traynun soo the players wer ready fer the fst game.

And it has everything to do with the big kick off, you obviously have no clue how the modern game works. Pre season is not just about fitness. Fitness is a part of it, the other equally important and relevant part is preparing the team for the first match and drilling into the squad the tactics and how they are to be setup to play, and individual players instruction and expectation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Morison was one change Gareth. I said ''changes.''

 

It was also the wrong change too as Morison needs supply in the box, as does Holt. What is the Vaughan situation amounting to? I would have taken off Pilkington at half time as well and perhaps even Johnson for Jacko. It was time to "go for it." I''m no tactician though, as is obvious. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"] I''m on the fence with this one, Hughton''s got to be given time.[/quote]

Pathetic and it better bloody change or ill be wanting Hughton gone.

Just found this which you posted yesterday on another thread so seems to me that you are not exactly sitting on the fence.

Now Matt if you respond stick to topic and try not to go into your usual rant as it is me who posted.[:D]

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="morty"]Shock news just in, Huckerbys boots Matt gets a strop on because folks disagree with him....[:D][/quote]

Shut up you fool, im not getting a strop on because people disagree, rather the people who have failed to answer the question and just jumped on the ''another negative poster'' bandwagon.

On the contrary the posts by Gareth and others have been pertinent and wanted.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="TIL 1010"]

[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"] I''m on the fence with this one, Hughton''s got to be given time.[/quote]

Pathetic and it better bloody change or ill be wanting Hughton gone.

Just found this which you posted yesterday on another thread so seems to me that you are not exactly sitting on the fence.

Now Matt if you respond stick to topic and try not to go into your usual rant as it is me who posted.[:D]

 

 

 

[/quote]

Sorry Tilson i fail to see the point your making here. No where have i said Hughton should be sacked. What i said was if it doesnt change then ill be wanting him gone.

Are you saying if we lose the next 10 games you wont want Hughton gone either?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="morty"]Shock news just in, Huckerbys boots Matt gets a strop on because folks disagree with him....[:D][/quote]

Shut up you fool, im not getting a strop on because people disagree, rather the people who have failed to answer the question and just jumped on the ''another negative poster'' bandwagon.

On the contrary the posts by Gareth and others have been pertinent and wanted.[/quote]"Shut up you fool"Yeah, totally negated my point there....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Its people like you that have ruined this once fine forum.

Every post degenerates into catty verbal arguments and tossers like Tilson dragging up something someones said in another post " you said this so im gonna call you a prat". Its pathetic.

Why does it seem impossible for someone to post their opinion genuinely wanting some constructive answers. All I wanted is people to put my mind at rest and offer me some hope. I wanted people to tell me why im wrong to think Hughtons start is worryingly similar to Gunns.

What do i get? People ignoring the question and just getting on their high horse cause someone posted something negative and perennial devils advocates trawling up other posts trying to twist and stir things.

This forum has seriously gone downhill due to the words of certain people.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"]Its people like you that have ruined this once fine forum.

Every post degenerates into catty verbal arguments and tossers like Tilson dragging up something someones said in another post " you said this so im gonna call you a prat". Its pathetic.

Why does it seem impossible for someone to post their opinion genuinely wanting some constructive answers. All I wanted is people to put my mind at rest and offer me some hope. I wanted people to tell me why im wrong to think Hughtons start is worryingly similar to Gunns.

What do i get? People ignoring the question and just getting on their high horse cause someone posted something negative and perennial devils advocates trawling up other posts trying to twist and stir things.

This forum has seriously gone downhill due to the words of certain people.[/quote]Point proved I think.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="morty"][quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"][quote user="morty"]Shock news just in, Huckerbys boots Matt gets a strop on because folks disagree with him....[:D][/quote]

Shut up you fool, im not getting a strop on because people disagree, rather the people who have failed to answer the question and just jumped on the ''another negative poster'' bandwagon.

On the contrary the posts by Gareth and others have been pertinent and wanted.[/quote]"Shut up you fool"Yeah, totally negated my point there....[/quote]

Yawn...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote user="morty"][quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"]Its people like you that have ruined this once fine forum.

Every post degenerates into catty verbal arguments and tossers like Tilson dragging up something someones said in another post " you said this so im gonna call you a prat". Its pathetic.

Why does it seem impossible for someone to post their opinion genuinely wanting some constructive answers. All I wanted is people to put my mind at rest and offer me some hope. I wanted people to tell me why im wrong to think Hughtons start is worryingly similar to Gunns.

What do i get? People ignoring the question and just getting on their high horse cause someone posted something negative and perennial devils advocates trawling up other posts trying to twist and stir things.

This forum has seriously gone downhill due to the words of certain people.[/quote]Point proved I think.[/quote]

haha, oh the irony!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why do some posters on this illustrious Board spend more time posting about other posters, rather than about our Club or the issues in hand?

 

Do they realise just how tediously dull this is for others who want genuine debate, not continuous insults. There is aPM facility after all. 

 

This was a good thread until the crap started.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You start a thread and ask people for their OPINIONS AND VIEWS on what YOU posted.In less than two pages you have abused four seperate posters,Grants 3 yr Contract,Kellybrook,Morty and myself who have dared to question what you posted.

I did not call you a prat as you indicated and i copied and pasted your exact words on another thread so it is not " trawling up other posts trying to twist and stir things"

My last experience of you showed you up as a keyboard warrior who needs to grow a pair and discuss your vitriol towards me face to face so rather pointless me making the offer to talk over a pint before or after the QPR game.You know i drink in The Nelson but it would not really be too much effort to go to The Coach and Horses for me.

Sits back and waits for more childish name calling from behind the computer screen...........

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote user="Huckerbys Boots - Matt"]Its people like you that have ruined this once fine forum. Every post degenerates into catty verbal arguments and tossers like Tilson dragging up something someones said in another post " you said this so im gonna call you a prat". Its pathetic. Why does it seem impossible for someone to post their opinion genuinely wanting some constructive answers. All I wanted is people to put my mind at rest and offer me some hope. I wanted people to tell me why im wrong to think Hughtons start is worryingly similar to Gunns. What do i get? People ignoring the question and just getting on their high horse cause someone posted something negative and perennial devils advocates trawling up other posts trying to twist and stir things. This forum has seriously gone downhill due to the words of certain people.[/quote]

 

You also got a number of people including me engaging with your points but rather than discuss with those who''ve challenged your views you''d rather argue with Tilly and Morty and play the victim.  Mr Pot can I introduce you to my friend Mr Kettle?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="TIL 1010"]

You start a thread and ask people for their OPINIONS AND VIEWS on what YOU posted.In less than two pages you have abused four seperate posters,Grants 3 yr Contract,Kellybrook,Morty and myself who have dared to question what you posted.

I did not call you a prat as you indicated and i copied and pasted your exact words on another thread so it is not " trawling up other posts trying to twist and stir things"

My last experience of you showed you up as a keyboard warrior who needs to grow a pair and discuss your vitriol towards me face to face so rather pointless me making the offer to talk over a pint before or after the QPR game.You know i drink in The Nelson but it would not really be too much effort to go to The Coach and Horses for me.

Sits back and waits for more childish name calling from behind the computer screen...........

[/quote]Are you saying that you''ve never done that? [;)]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="BroadstairsR"]

Why do some posters on this illustrious Board spend more time posting about other posters, rather than about our Club or the issues in hand?

 

Do they realise just how tediously dull this is for others who want genuine debate, not continuous insults. There is aPM facility after all. 

 

This was a good thread until the crap started.

[/quote]

Broadstairs take a step take and look who is throwing the insults around...Who called Morty a prat and me a tosser ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...