the thing that worries me most of all about a high turnover of manager

[henrik 0]

Is the youth system. Different managers have different ideas and it feels to me that every time a new manager comes in tthe youth system gets played around with meaning you have to start back at square one. Thus meaning good youth team players are always 7-8 years away and never materialise. If we are going to compete in the premiership long term this has to be strong and reliable, we need our own supply of quality to remain competitive.Back in the 80''s and early 90''s we had a lot more stability in this way and managed to produce a fairly regular supply of useful players.This isn''t a paranoid post about the possibility of Lamberts future but it is a concern about the long term sustainability of our club as a premiership side.

[nutty nigel 7,533]

Great post henrik. But the problems since the early 90s haven''t all been down to the high turnover of managers. There''s also been a high influx of foreign players. A massive jump in the standard required to make the grade and changes in rules which haven''t helped us. With us now looking to become a grade one academy and some stability throughout the club and with the possibility of clubs having to become more self-financing could all put us in a better position.

 

 

[GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary 1,749]

In reality the percentage of the team that is made up of youth team players has always been small. If your a Premiership team I would suggest that it is even smaller. When we were in League One ,players coming through the youth setup only had to be of League One or above to get into the side i.e Chris Martin or Korey Smith ,as a Premier League club any player soming through has to be be of an exceptional standard to get anywhere near, hence the intake will probably decrease if anything?

[Aggy 755]

I don''t know if there''ll be such a huge change each time. Certain training techniques and the like might do, but I don''t know if they''d put players back 7 years or so?

A quality player will shine in any set up, whilst an average player might fade into averageness if the system no longer suits him exactly. How much can the manager change that will put a player back? If it''s the structure of the academy, then surely the player fits into the new structure and his talent shines through, just in a different set up?

I think it''s also worth remembering as well that we have brought a few players through who are of a reasonable quality - Chris Martin has had a decent season in the championship at Palace, Joe Lewis likewise, we''ve got the likes of Korey Smith and Adeyemi who look like they could be decent championship players if not more in the future, Rudd and Steer as well. Whilst none of those players are in the Bellamy or Sutton league, they are decent enough players. How many quality players have similar clubs to us brought through in the past 10 years? I''d be interested to know.

For me, it''s the lack of quality that we have been able to attract and the instant-success nature of modern football that limits the chances of youths, rather than the number of managers coming in and changing things.

[greendoor 16]

In my opinion our main problem with the acadamy has been the in ablilty to servay alot of young player, because previous to the grading system you could only scout players from a small distance from Norwich.

With this area being a rural and the city itself being relatively small there has not been alot to pick and choose from.

Other clubs of a similar size (West Brom) would have a much larger choice of players because of location. But with the new grading system we can atract players from a larger area so I expect the quality of youth products to improve in the near future.

[yellow blood 0]

[quote user="GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary"]

In reality the percentage of the team that is made up of youth team players has always been small. If your a Premiership team I would suggest that it is even smaller. When we were in League One ,players coming through the youth setup only had to be of League One or above to get into the side i.e Chris Martin or Korey Smith ,as a Premier League club any player soming through has to be be of an exceptional standard to get anywhere near, hence the intake will probably decrease if anything?

[/quote]

This post makes me sad [:''(]

[GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary 1,749]

[quote user="yellow blood"][quote user="GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary"]

In reality the percentage of the team that is made up of youth team players has always been small. If your a Premiership team I would suggest that it is even smaller. When we were in League One ,players coming through the youth setup only had to be of League One or above to get into the side i.e Chris Martin or Korey Smith ,as a Premier League club any player soming through has to be be of an exceptional standard to get anywhere near, hence the intake will probably decrease if anything?

[/quote]

This post makes me sad [:''(]

[/quote]

but why??.....surely it''s a good thing that we''re in the Premier League?.....and if a by-product of that is that academy players have to be of a higher standard to get in the team then so be it?!

[N city till I die 0]

Absolute tosh first post.

Its to do with all the foreigners coming over here to play.

simple as that.

[yellow blood 0]

[quote user="GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary"][quote user="yellow blood"][quote user="GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary"]

In reality the percentage of the team that is made up of youth team players has always been small. If your a Premiership team I would suggest that it is even smaller. When we were in League One ,players coming through the youth setup only had to be of League One or above to get into the side i.e Chris Martin or Korey Smith ,as a Premier League club any player soming through has to be be of an exceptional standard to get anywhere near, hence the intake will probably decrease if anything?

[/quote]

This post makes me sad [:''(]

[/quote]

but why??.....surely it''s a good thing that we''re in the Premier League?.....and if a by-product of that is that academy players have to be of a higher standard to get in the team then so be it?!

[/quote]

The Premier League thing isn''t what makes me sad, it''s the fact that you said that youth team players are unlikely to come through to play in the premiership. Surely players have to come from somewhere and why not through our own Academy? It''s sad that in this day and age,  people are more willing to buy in players than grow them. Shows how difficult it is for a youngster these days to make it within the game.

[henrik 0]

I''m sorry but its absolute tosh blaming the quality of Norwich City''s youth production system on foreigners. However did you dream that one up?

[nutty nigel 7,533]

Don''t worry about that Henrik. I''m sure the amount of foreigners has contributed but as other posters have said there are lots of other reasons. Getting category one status will give us the best opportunity for many years to bring some quality players through. But it doesn''t come cheap. Luckily all you posters can help there by becoming involved in the Rays Funds threads next season[Y]

 

 

[YankeeCanary 0]

 

Nutty,  I am curious as to how Crewe manage to do such a sterling job out of their Academy. Perhaps geographic location has something to do with it but are there other things that we can learn from them?  

[Shyster 0]

Clubs spend millions on foreign players, but surely a better way to go would be the investment in top foreign coaching for any scouted talent? It''s the technical side of the English game that needs improving upon - our youngsters seem to lack creative and innovative teaching methods - of course great footballers are born gifted, but Messi wouldn''t be the incredible player he is without the benefit of exemplary Spanish coaching when he was a nipper.

[Shyster 0]

[quote user="YankeeCanary"]

 

Nutty,  I am curious as to how Crewe manage to do such a sterling job out of their Academy. Perhaps geographic location has something to do with it but are there other things that we can learn from them?  

[/quote]

Dario Gradi (Italian coach)

[nutty nigel 7,533]

[quote user="YankeeCanary"]

 

Nutty,  I am curious as to how Crewe manage to do such a sterling job out of their Academy. Perhaps geographic location has something to do with it but are there other things that we can learn from them?  

[/quote]

Crewe''s record in this field is phenomenal and there probably is something we can learn. Their location is an advantage but they must have something else because their record seems to be much better than Port Vale or even Stoke who are geographically close by.

 

[Aggy 755]

Dario Gradi, Italian coach, Shyster?

Gradi was born in Italy, but moved back to England well before he was in his teens, studied as a PE teacher at Loughborough University, and then went into coaching in England.

I''m not sure that there was much of an Italian education there!

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,557]

A high turnover of managers shouldn''t have that much impact on the academy in all honesty - coaches like Ricky Martin, Neil Adams and Gary Holt are there to provide stability and keep things ticking over.

 

With Rudd, Steer and Chris Martin all playing games for the first team this year the state of the academy probably isn''t as bad as some have made out - the possible recuritment area for Norwich City will always prove problematic so the new academy system could be a vital change (although we probably won''t see any great improvements for 6 or 7 years while the changes filter through).

 

Roeder said he was shocked at how poorly the youth system was being run when he was manager at Norwich - which again suggests we may be waiting a little while for any real talent to emerge. Now we are amoungst the big boys I would expect the club to go out and poach some of the better 15/16/17 year old players from other academies and give them a little fine tuning.