Reasons why Holty shouldnt be picked for England...

[Shankslad 0]

[quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"]

I love Grant Holt as much as anyone, but he does in NO WAY represent the furure for England.

[/quote]

 

Oh but I believe his selection could represent the future for England, or at least be beneficial to the future.   Not just because he has earned it on merit but I believe his inclusion would be

good for English football as a whole. It would provide inspiration and

motivation to so many young players particularly those at the start of their

careers in the lower leagues, showing just what can be achieved through

dedication, determination and hard work.If the FA had any sense they

would automatically include him without any hesitation whatsoever. Unfortunately

I think they may be rather lacking in the common sense stakes! Preferring to

stick with the regular premier posing primma donnas who seem to think selection

for the national squad is a commitment with a few extra quid rather than an

honour, who only want to play if it maintains or increases their market value.

If selection doesn''t give some benefit like that they choose to "Retire" from

international football - to which I say "who the **** said you were going to be

selected anyway?"

[Ruddygore 0]

*Sorry 31 now!!

[henrik 0]

Everybody always talks about "the future" when discussing England team selections. Does anybody else out there think that whilst you always have to have an eye on "the future", you are, if you''re guided only by that, at huge risk of missing out on the NOW!!!For me, I want to see Grant Holt selected. He deserves it, and for those non-Norwich fans that think he''s only a traditional number 9, what a load of baloney, yes he uses his strength, but the guy fills me with confidence when he has the ball at his feet that a) he won''t lose it easily, and b) he''ll pick a pass. He can finish, as demonstrated time and time again (look at the ease in which he strikes the ball in front of goal) and MORE IMPORTANTLY, when talking about representing your country, we would finally see someone pull on the shirt with pride - something every Englishman throughout the land has been crying out for ever since the likes of Stuart Pearce retired. So come on new England manager, whoever you are, remember, fortune favours the brave. There are far more reasons to pick him than not, however, I suspect that, the cartel, that is the FA will scupper that in favour of those players that have celebrity status!!!!!

[Reggie Strayshun 0]

[quote user="Shankslad"][quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"]

I love Grant Holt as much as anyone, but he does in NO WAY represent the furure for England.

[/quote]

 

 Preferring to stick with the regular premier posing primma donnas who seem to think selection for the national squad is a commitment with a few extra quid rather than an honour, who only want to play if it maintains or increases their market value.[/quote]

 

Well, Shankslad, if whoever is in charge sticks with Cole, Lampard, Terry, Barry et al, I''ll certainly agree with you. If these people who''ve been tried several times before and been found wanting are the FA''s idea of a squad, then, yes, you might as well take Grant Holt etc. They can''t do any worse.

 

But what this (Euro 2012) represents is a golden opportunity to blood some of the very promising raft of young talent in a Tournament situation. It''s not very often that you have such an opportunity, so on the basis that as many people are saying "we''ve got nothing to lose", then it strikes me as sensible to look at people who might just represent the future. I just cannot see how anyone could claim in all seriousness that Grant Holt represents that.

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,557]

[quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"][quote user="Shankslad"][quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"]

I love Grant Holt as much as anyone, but he does in NO WAY represent the furure for England.

[/quote]

 

 Preferring to stick with the regular premier posing primma donnas who seem to think selection for the national squad is a commitment with a few extra quid rather than an honour, who only want to play if it maintains or increases their market value.[/quote]

 

Well, Shankslad, if whoever is in charge sticks with Cole, Lampard, Terry, Barry et al, I''ll certainly agree with you. If these people who''ve been tried several times before and been found wanting are the FA''s idea of a squad, then, yes, you might as well take Grant Holt etc. They can''t do any worse.

 

But what this (Euro 2012) represents is a golden opportunity to blood some of the very promising raft of young talent in a Tournament situation. It''s not very often that you have such an opportunity, so on the basis that as many people are saying "we''ve got nothing to lose", then it strikes me as sensible to look at people who might just represent the future. I just cannot see how anyone could claim in all seriousness that Grant Holt represents that.

[/quote]

Ashely Cole has always performed well on the pitch for England - he is just a bit of a tit off the pitch.

 

I do argee with you that this is a great chance - at the Euros 4 years ago Germany decieded they would cast away many of their older players who weren''t delievering and bring through the raw, but exciting players in their U21 squad - that team then reached the final of the Euros and were probably the second best team at the World Cup 2 years ago. England need to shake things up and look at least 2 to 4 years ahead (which they have never done). There is a core of good team with players such as Richards, Walker, Jones, Smalling, Wilshere, Walcott, Welbeck, Sturridge and Chamberlain - taking one or two younger players won''t help, but shaking things up with 6 or 7 could really spark some fresh ideas from England.

[PurpleCanary 5,558]

[quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"][quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"][quote user="Shankslad"][quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"]

I love Grant Holt as much as anyone, but he does in NO WAY represent the furure for England.

[/quote]

 

 Preferring to stick with the regular premier posing primma donnas who seem to think selection for the national squad is a commitment with a few extra quid rather than an honour, who only want to play if it maintains or increases their market value.[/quote]

 

Well, Shankslad, if whoever is in charge sticks with Cole, Lampard, Terry, Barry et al, I''ll certainly agree with you. If these people who''ve been tried several times before and been found wanting are the FA''s idea of a squad, then, yes, you might as well take Grant Holt etc. They can''t do any worse.

 

But what this (Euro 2012) represents is a golden opportunity to blood some of the very promising raft of young talent in a Tournament situation. It''s not very often that you have such an opportunity, so on the basis that as many people are saying "we''ve got nothing to lose", then it strikes me as sensible to look at people who might just represent the future. I just cannot see how anyone could claim in all seriousness that Grant Holt represents that.

[/quote]

Ashely Cole has always performed well on the pitch for England - he is just a bit of a tit off the pitch.

 

I do argee with you that this is a great chance - at the Euros 4 years ago Germany decieded they would cast away many of their older players who weren''t delievering and bring through the raw, but exciting players in their U21 squad - that team then reached the final of the Euros and were probably the second best team at the World Cup 2 years ago. England need to shake things up and look at least 2 to 4 years ahead (which they have never done). There is a core of good team with players such as Richards, Walker, Jones, Smalling, Wilshere, Walcott, Welbeck, Sturridge and Chamberlain - taking one or two younger players won''t help, but shaking things up with 6 or 7 could really spark some fresh ideas from England.

[/quote]

 

Lucky is the fan who doesn''t have the burden of supporting England. So I ask out of academic interest - are these youngsters that good? Because this happens every time England are in a slump, and particularly (although that is not the case here) when they haven''t qualified for a tournament. There is always talk from pundits about an exciting crop of young players champing at the bit to be given a chance. What has been the case in the past is that the youngsters get (over-) written up by the London and the north-west press, and the reality, when they get to play, is less exciting.

 

This lot may be different. They may be as good as the pundits say. I have no real idea since I think I have only seen Jones and Welbeck play, and  Welbeck didn''t look a future world star that one time.

[Reggie Strayshun 0]

[quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"]

I do argee with you that this is a great chance - at the Euros 4 years ago Germany decieded they would cast away many of their older players who weren''t delievering and bring through the raw, but exciting players in their U21 squad - that team then reached the final of the Euros and were probably the second best team at the World Cup 2 years ago. England need to shake things up and look at least 2 to 4 years ahead (which they have never done). There is a core of good team with players such as Richards, Walker, Jones, Smalling, Wilshere, Walcott, Welbeck, Sturridge and Chamberlain - taking one or two younger players won''t help, but shaking things up with 6 or 7 could really spark some fresh ideas from England.

[/quote]

 

I guess that''s what a number of us are getting at BYG. If  current England were one big, bustling centre forward away from an absolute team of world-beaters, then I''d say, take Grant Holt  to Ukraine like a shot. But they aren''t. They are a country mile from it. So, as you say, now is the time to blood the types of players you mention with a view to the future. You mention Germany, but recent history is littered with other examples. Do you think the current Spanish team just came together by chance ? They blooded the Xavis, Iniestas, Piqués of this world years ago. The French did the same in the 90''s . England did it with Rugby in the late 90''s/ early 00''s. Poor old Holty''s been unlucky. His peak in Prem form has just come too late. Just one of those things I''m afraid.

[Ruddygore 0]

EPPS - I confess to having no knowledge of when Spain''s current crop of wunderkind were first blooded as youngsters but I''m sure you''ll know whether the whole team were untried youngsters?

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,557]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"][quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"][quote user="Shankslad"][quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"]

I love Grant Holt as much as anyone, but he does in NO WAY represent the furure for England.

[/quote]

 

 Preferring to stick with the regular premier posing primma donnas who seem to think selection for the national squad is a commitment with a few extra quid rather than an honour, who only want to play if it maintains or increases their market value.[/quote]

 

Well, Shankslad, if whoever is in charge sticks with Cole, Lampard, Terry, Barry et al, I''ll certainly agree with you. If these people who''ve been tried several times before and been found wanting are the FA''s idea of a squad, then, yes, you might as well take Grant Holt etc. They can''t do any worse.

 

But what this (Euro 2012) represents is a golden opportunity to blood some of the very promising raft of young talent in a Tournament situation. It''s not very often that you have such an opportunity, so on the basis that as many people are saying "we''ve got nothing to lose", then it strikes me as sensible to look at people who might just represent the future. I just cannot see how anyone could claim in all seriousness that Grant Holt represents that.

[/quote]

Ashely Cole has always performed well on the pitch for England - he is just a bit of a tit off the pitch.

 

I do argee with you that this is a great chance - at the Euros 4 years ago Germany decieded they would cast away many of their older players who weren''t delievering and bring through the raw, but exciting players in their U21 squad - that team then reached the final of the Euros and were probably the second best team at the World Cup 2 years ago. England need to shake things up and look at least 2 to 4 years ahead (which they have never done). There is a core of good team with players such as Richards, Walker, Jones, Smalling, Wilshere, Walcott, Welbeck, Sturridge and Chamberlain - taking one or two younger players won''t help, but shaking things up with 6 or 7 could really spark some fresh ideas from England.

[/quote]

 

Lucky is the fan who doesn''t have the burden of supporting England. So I ask out of academic interest - are these youngsters that good? Because this happens every time England are in a slump, and particularly (although that is not the case here) when they haven''t qualified for a tournament. There is always talk from pundits about an exciting crop of young players champing at the bit to be given a chance. What has been the case in the past is that the youngsters get (over-) written up by the London and the north-west press, and the reality, when they get to play, is less exciting.

 

This lot may be different. They may be as good as the pundits say. I have no real idea since I think I have only seen Jones and Welbeck play, and  Welbeck didn''t look a future world star that one time.

[/quote]

In all honest PC, they aren''t good enough to win the Euros or a World Cup.

 

With Hart, Richards, Jones, Smalling, Cole there is a pretty solid defence but midfield looks very weak to me.

 

Welbeck has a lot of potential, he does the difficult things well, his positioning and movement are both superb (and you don''t get into the Man U team ahead of Hernandez on luck) but the simple things sometimes escape him with a poor pass or wayward finish. If you saw the Chelsea v Man U game Welbeck was fantasic in the 2nd half - but like all young players his performances go up and down.

 

Walcott is in the form of his life right now and if he can turn this kind of performance out for a long period of time he is a player any defence would be scared of. Apart from Wilshere I wouldn''t say any of the younger England players are what could be or will be called ''World Class'', where as Lampard, Gerrard, A. Cole, Terry and Rooney all were at somepoint in their careers. However, the lack of this ''Golden Generation'' might be a benefit to England in the long run.

[Shack Attack 0]

[quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"]

So, as you say, now is the time to blood the types of players you mention with a view to the future. You mention Germany, but recent history is littered with other examples. Do you think the current Spanish team just came together by chance ? They blooded the Xavis, Iniestas, Piqués of this world years ago. The French did the same in the 90''s . England did it with Rugby in the late 90''s/ early 00''s. [/quote]

 

These examples of nations who have built teams for the future tend to not be as clear cut as just discarding older players and building a new team though. There are often outside circumstances that help you along the way of which there appear to be none which would benefit England right now. Germany rebuilt their side out of the shambles of their Euro 2000 showing but they had the benefit of knowing that they would host the 2006 World Cup and therefore would not have to qualify. Likewise the French success in 1998 came on home soil after they had cleared out the old squad who had failed to qualify for the 1994 World Cup in the US. Both countries also had built excellent coaching and teaching facilities (The French facilities at Clairefontaine being the inspiration for our FA wanting to build a national football centre) which this country still lacks. As for Spain, their success is as much down to Barcelona and La Masia as it is to any foward thinking from the Spanish FA.

 

I guess what I''m trying to say is that clearing out the old guard and replacing them with new players might be a step in the right direction it will not guarantee success. The young players that so many wish to see brought in will doubtless be inconsistent in their performance as befits most youngsters and if you miss out on qualification for one tournament it can start to affect your ability to qualify for future ones. Unless we are going to radically change the way we coach our kids then we will never win anything anyway. Why should Grant Holt miss out on the opportunity to represent his country so that a bunch of young players who will no doubt make the same mistakes as the last ''golden generation'' get some experience. If he could score a couple of goals on the way to a glorious semi-final defeat it would probably be enough to get him an OBE into the bargain [;)]

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

Spoke to Holty after watching the boys train at Colney this morning.He told me that his wife wont be happy if he gets called up to the EURO''s as it would mess their summer hols up!Can we add that to the list of reasons as to why he shouldnt get called up? [;)]

[Son Ova Gunn 165]

Just a question, but do some of you guys think you maybe over estimating the development potential of these championships. I mean, smalling, jones, wellbeck, sturridge etc play week in week out against teams of equal quality of ukrain, sweden and france, in front of crowds possibly larger than that of the euro''s. There training is done by proffessional that are most probably far superior to that of englands and the pressure of knockout tournements will have been experience dozens of time before, most notibly in the under 21''s. Will playing 1 or 2, or even 4 or 5 youngester in this summers competion really help us win a world cup in 4 years time or will crashing out of the group stages just teach them how to hide behind the manager and re-inforce a growing opinion that we just arn''t that good. I say there is more chance of damaging thier chances of becoming world class players than improving it by throwing them into the international spotlight before the 1. deserve it and 2. are ready for it.

[CantonsHero 0]

Trying to always develop the future leads to "Arsenal". A very good team with a lot of potential, but not really ever lived up to.

Integrating the best of the future into your experienced and strong team leads to "Manchester United" who are likely to be winning the title again this year.

At International tournaments you play the best right now for these three weeks. Then you do the same 2 years later.

I long for the days gone by when the youngsters came into the clubs looking up to the experienced lads. (We do seem to have that at Norwich with our first team lads looking up to Drury, Holt and Wilbrahamovic). That''s how they grow; not artificially lumping 20 of them together with Lampard and Rooney and hoping for magic.

[grantroederdisaster 0]

"Building for the future!"

 

"Blood the young ones!"

 

"Holts not the future for England!"

 

All 3 are boll*cky comments that make my blood boil!

 

Any England team/squad in whatever sport should include the best available players end of and at the moment that should include Grant Holt AND John Ruddy! 

 

Thats why I throw caution to the wind when going on about Jed Steer and Declan Rudd cause while they are good prospects they are a long way from being good enough to be our regular no1s!

[lake district canary 0]

Don''t forget the old adage :  If you''re  old enough you''re good enough!    [8-)]

 

Is Holty old enough?    Of course he is.

 

Get him in there.

 

 

 

[Reggie Strayshun 0]

[quote user="grantroederdisaster"]

"Building for the future!"

 

"Blood the young ones!"

 

"Holts not the future for England!"

 

All 3 are boll*cky comments that make my blood boil!

 

Any England team/squad in whatever sport should include the best available players end of and at the moment that should include Grant Holt AND John Ruddy! 

 

Thats why I throw caution to the wind when going on about Jed Steer and Declan Rudd cause while they are good prospects they are a long way from being good enough to be our regular no1s!

[/quote]

 

Easy to make crass , from the hip comments like that , disaster, without actually putting any reasoning behind them.

I suppose this is a discussion that could run and run, and the truth is there is no right nor wrong about it. In the end, the only opinion that really matters is whoever is the England Manager next month. It is his reputation that will be on the line as he, not you ,is the one who has to "throw caution to the wind".

 

Your snide rejection of "building for the future" tends to rather fly in the face of what Paul Lambert has done here at Norwich.  He has been a shining example of looking to the future and blooding young players and trusting your own judgement that they will come good. OK, Grant Holt has been a slight exception to that rule, but I''m sure he did not bring Holt in to Carrow Rd just for the odd game in Lge One. Instead he saw him as an integral part of his plan to move City up the divisions.

 

I''d just like a reasoned explanation as to how you would see a 31 year old striker, untried at international level as the "future for England".

 

[Mr Jenkins 0]

[quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"][quote user="grantroederdisaster"]

"Building for the future!"

 

"Blood the young ones!"

 

"Holts not the future for England!"

 

All 3 are boll*cky comments that make my blood boil!

 

Any England team/squad in whatever sport should include the best available players end of and at the moment that should include Grant Holt AND John Ruddy! 

 

Thats why I throw caution to the wind when going on about Jed Steer and Declan Rudd cause while they are good prospects they are a long way from being good enough to be our regular no1s!

[/quote]

 

Easy to make crass , from the hip comments like that , disaster, without actually putting any reasoning behind them.

I suppose this is a discussion that could run and run, and the truth is there is no right nor wrong about it. In the end, the only opinion that really matters is whoever is the England Manager next month. It is his reputation that will be on the line as he, not you ,is the one who has to "throw caution to the wind".

 

Your snide rejection of "building for the future" tends to rather fly in the face of what Paul Lambert has done here at Norwich.  He has been a shining example of looking to the future and blooding young players and trusting your own judgement that they will come good. OK, Grant Holt has been a slight exception to that rule, but I''m sure he did not bring Holt in to Carrow Rd just for the odd game in Lge One. Instead he saw him as an integral part of his plan to move City up the divisions.

 

I''d just like a reasoned explanation as to how you would see a 31 year old striker, untried at international level as the "future for England".

 

[/quote]

On current form he is more  likely to score goals than any other English striker apart from Rooney. England must build for the future but they also need a bit of success short term to lift the fans and the team. A short term solution for the Euros followed by a longer term strategy to build a new younger team for the future. Thats the way I see the current situation, which as we all know is far from ideal.[:)]

[ron obvious 1,502]

EPPS:

''I''d just like a reasoned explanation as to how you would see a 31 year old striker, untried at international level as the "future for England".''

So a 33 year old striker has never scored in the World Cup? Is that true?

I would have thought planning for 2014 is plenty far enough ahead.

Holt has become an exception to Lambert''s rule because his only rules are 1) are they good enough, & 2) do they want it enough. Age is not the main criterion, nor should it be for England.

As Nutty says, Holt has so much more to his game than people give him credit for. I think he should be going.

[Reggie Strayshun 0]

[quote user="ron obvious"]'' So a 33 year old striker has never scored in the World Cup? Is that true? I would have thought planning for 2014 is plenty far enough ahead. .[/quote]

 

No doubt they have, Ron. I''m sure you are itching to name names. But I''ll wager there have not been many who''ve scored regularly at that level from an untried position.

 

Tournament football is a very different animal to regular games, and, it just seems more sensible to me to give tournament experience to people who could be regular performers over the next 2-4 years. Clearly you disagree. Fair enough. Your loyalty to Norwich and Holt is touching . I''d back Holty in any Norwich situation, but, I''m sorry, I do not wear yellow tinted specs enough to not see the wider, England, picture.

[PurpleCanary 5,558]

[quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"]

[quote user="ron obvious"]'' So a 33 year old striker has never scored in the World Cup? Is that true? I would have thought planning for 2014 is plenty far enough ahead. .[/quote]

 

No doubt they have, Ron. I''m sure you are itching to name names. But I''ll wager there have not been many who''ve scored regularly at that level from an untried position.

 

Tournament football is a very different animal to regular games, and, it just seems more sensible to me to give tournament experience to people who could be regular performers over the next 2-4 years. Clearly you disagree. Fair enough. Your loyalty to Norwich and Holt is touching . I''d back Holty in any Norwich situation, but, I''m sorry, I do not wear yellow tinted specs enough to not see the wider, England, picture.

[/quote]

Holt is a spring chicken by comparison to...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZtx3tkJqso

[nutty nigel 7,533]

Eric - What about that guy who played for Cameroon? Didn''t he score a World Cup goal when he was 42? Although a lot of people reckoned he was nearer 62 because he went to school with Finidi George[;)]

 

 

[nutty nigel 7,533]

Great minds Purple[;)]

[PurpleCanary 5,558]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]Great minds Purple[;)][/quote]

 

But one not quite as quick as the other, nutty![:P]

[PurpleCanary 5,558]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"]

[quote user="ron obvious"]'' So a 33 year old striker has never scored in the World Cup? Is that true? I would have thought planning for 2014 is plenty far enough ahead. .[/quote]

 

No doubt they have, Ron. I''m sure you are itching to name names. But I''ll wager there have not been many who''ve scored regularly at that level from an untried position.

 

Tournament football is a very different animal to regular games, and, it just seems more sensible to me to give tournament experience to people who could be regular performers over the next 2-4 years. Clearly you disagree. Fair enough. Your loyalty to Norwich and Holt is touching . I''d back Holty in any Norwich situation, but, I''m sorry, I do not wear yellow tinted specs enough to not see the wider, England, picture.

[/quote]

Holt is a spring chicken by comparison to...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZtx3tkJqso

[/quote]

 

And Nils Liedholm scored a goal in a World Cup final when he was nearly 36. But that in other times, and he was an exceptional player. I am not arguing against you, Eric. Really just using this an excuse for some evocative footage from an era that does seem so long ago:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Syncd5yq8o4

[Reggie Strayshun 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Eric - What about that guy who played for Cameroon? Didn''t he score a World Cup goal when he was 42? Although a lot of people reckoned he was nearer 62 because he went to school with Finidi George[;)]

 

 

[/quote]

 

Indeed Nutty. Whatever the rights and wrongs of this, and whether GH gets to play for England or not, let us all console ourselves that, at 31, Holty is a mere babe in arms if compared to some of the geriatrics who''ve pulled on the demonic blue shirt this season.

[sjs7 0]

I think Holt''s goals and his general performance levels this season alone are deserving of some sort of International recognition, especially when you consider the lack of form for most other potential England strikers (young and old).... for me i would at least expect him to get a call to the provisional Euro squad and some time in the friendlies as reward for being the 2nd highest scoring englishman.

Good luck Holty :)

[lake district canary 0]

[quote user="sjs7"]I think Holt''s goals and his general performance levels this season alone are deserving of some sort of International recognition, especially when you consider the lack of form for most other potential England strikers (young and old).... for me i would at least expect him to get a call to the provisional Euro squad and some time in the friendlies as reward for being the 2nd highest scoring englishman. Good luck Holty :)[/quote]

 

 

Yes, I think he should at least be given a chance in a friendly - just to see if he can make an impact - yes - as a reward - but more  to see if he would be a genuine prospect for the Euros.  If they don''t try him they won''t know if they are missing out!  He is the second highest English scorer so it is  almost a duty to at least give him a try - or they are not doing their job properly.

 

 

 

[Davo 0]

I have mixed feelings about Holt going tot he Euro''s.

I have a belief that the highest two English scorers in a top European league in that season should go to a tournament. The other two/three slots should go the best of the rest to fit the tactical system.

Other than that the main reason I can see for Holty getting a chance at England is the effect he has on those around him. It''s noticeable when he''s not in the side, sure when Morison was on fire earlier in the season we didn''t miss him too much but even then when he came on he made a difference. He''s a leader. He leads from the front and his work ethic is infectious. When the team see him running back, covering and making tackles in the fullback position it can give the whole team a little boost. He directs the team from the front telling men to move wider pointing to people they should be marking and pointing out passes. With the type of character he is I don''t think he would be any different in an England shirt, he is who he is and he certainly knows Football. He also has the desire to win every game and will put his body where other players wouldn''t. His goal against Liverpool could you imagine Wellbeck, Carroll or any other player having that extra bit of desire to just get his head in front of the keeper like he did for that goal? I''m not sure I can.

The down side is while his game is not based on pace it is based on stamina and he could be in need of a rest to be ready for next season and I would hate for him to get injured.

As for the argument about the younger players needing tournament experience, what about the Olympics? All these future England "stars" will get a chance there to show what they have got. I know some people will say "well it''s only the Olympics" and "it''s not a real football tournament" I would say tell that to the Brazilians who take it seriously every year or Argentina who were taken to court over the availability of Messi. Barca won the case but Messi wanted to go and persuaded Guardiola to let him.

I think we should put the best squad of England players together for this tournament. Then those with "potential" should go to the olympics where they can show if they are good enough or not against other pro''s who are a similar age.

Davo