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I love how the scummers still see us as big rivals

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Our impoversihed neighbours maybe in for rather a shock when their season ticket sales are announced if they are) because word has it they are well down, againthis time far worseperhaps they could move in with Colchester ... or close a couple of stands

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I used to think a derby in the EPL would be a good thing. However, after comfortably staying up and a massive win at Spurs (and one or two other big results) I really couldn''t give a Donald Duck about them.  I really haven''t missed derby day.

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They are still our rivals and always will be. The gulf between us and them when they finished 5th in the Premier League and we were in the 1st Division was arguably wider. The difference is that we arent going to squander money on Finidi George and Matteo Sereni! I think in terms of support and fanbase we are definitely ahead of them. They have average 18,000 this year compared to our 26,000 in League 1. But if we can secure Premiership football for a couple of years that would totally entrench the situation.  

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It''s amazing that you care so little about them that you create a topic about it. They are still our rivals even if the case is like it is now and taking the pee out of them and gloating over them for being in a lower league.

Rivalries is one of the things that makes football as interesting as it is. Without Ipswich as our rivals we don''t have anyone else who we have such a mutual hatred towards to fuel a rivalry.

Davo

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" The gulf between us and them when they finished 5th in the Premier League and we were in the 1st Division was arguably wider."Ye gods, are you serious ! There is now a massive difference between the clubs. Go back to 2001 and rough figures have -City''s income of around £15 against the binners £30m in the Premiere LeagueOur debts were around £5m, theirs around £9m - neither figure includes ground redevelopment borrowingsOur income was about three times our debt, as was theirs2012  City''s income of around £75m against the binners £16m (June 2012)Our debts are around £16m, theirs £65m (both May 2011)there is every likely hood that our debt will have seen a huge reduction where theirs will have risen even furtherThey have gone from having a debt one third of their income to a debt 4 or 5 times their incomeIn 2001 there was not the enormous gap between the two divisions as there is now. Next season the three relegated clubs will have, in parachute money alone, more than the paupers will have in TOTAL income. There is little chance of them getting anywhere near the playoffs never mind doing what we did shortly after theirv time in the Premier League, winning the title.To keep themselves afloat they are selling any players who can fetch a bit money, the youth system is being dismatled and the gates and income are still falling year in year out.In the many decades that I have follow City I have never seen either club have such an enormous difference in standing as things are at the moment. And with another season in the Premier League and the consequent clearing of our debts plus a back up of £48m in parachute payments were we to drop out of the Premier League, the gap is only going to widen even more than it is now. It should also be borne in mind that their rather lowly position has only been maintained by spending way above their earnings for a fair few recent years. That is to end this summer, so without that bailout you will see ever further cuts, more old hasbeens patching up the squad and even less rustics sitting forlornly in the tumbleweed blown seats of poorman road gazing round as their grubby little club sinks further down the plughole.

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They nearly qualfied for Champions League, we went very close to tumbling out of the league but for a win near the end of the season against Tranmere. (Take a bow Brian McGovern). We are currently on for a very solid top half/mid table finish and they will finish low mid table in the Championship. The gulf was bigger back then without doubt in terms of probable league finish. You can''t dispute that. I take your point about the financial aspect, but they would have made money from being in Europe and its all relative. The amount of money in the Premiership still dwarfed what was on offer in the First Division at the time.

 

The crucial thing is how you utilise that money. The key thing was that Ipswich blew all that money on complete mercenaries and broke up the team spirit and togetherness which carried them through the season before. We are not going go down that road and I would expect players in the Howson/Bennett template to arrive again in the summer which is exactly what is required. If we do that we have a fantastic chance of establishing ourselves and continuing to hammer into the debt. If we do that, then this club will be truly lightyears ahead of Ipswich.

 

 

  

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"They nearly qualfied for Champions League, we went very close to

tumbling out of the league but for a win near the end of the season

against Tranmere
"eh !They finished 5th, there''s nothing to say we won''t finish 7th - hardly some ''bigger gulf, old guff more like. Talking of old guff, how on earth can you claim "we went very close to tumbling out of the league" ? We finished 15th, a position the binners currently occupy !  The win at home to Sheff Wed and the draw at Wimbledon after the Tranmere game might have also helped (in fact the three points against Tramnmere made no difference either way).  So in purely footballing terms the clubs are in relatively similar positions, pretty much like for like across the seasons."The amount of money in the Premiership still dwarfed what was on offer in the First Division at the time"eh ?As stated, their income was twice ours at the time. Our income is now expected to be 4 or 5 times theirs for this season. So even without their horrendous debts the gap is over twice as big as before. Factor in the debts and you have a 5 times difference (in fact in 2001 or debt was still smaller than theirs). You have also overlooked the direction both clubs were, and are, going. The paupers had just lumbered themselves with £25m debt, we are currently about to become debt free. In 2001 we were heading for a playoff place, 8th place and then walking away with the title. Can you seriously see the papuers achieving any of that or even looking like that ?"and continuing to hammer into the debt. If we do that, then this club will be truly lightyears ahead of Ipswich"The debt is scheduled to be paid off by Oct 2013, that will happen irrespective of what happens next season. We are already light years ahead of the paupers in money, attendances, youth development, playing squad, management, running of the club, income and every other area you care to choose, and have been for somewhile"The crucial thing is how you utilise that money"er no, he crucial thing'' is you being able to substantiate your claim - a claim that seeks to dispute the huge and ever widening gap between our two clubs ........ for whatever reason, probably only known to yourself

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[quote user="City1st"]" It should also be borne in mind that their rather lowly position has only been maintained by spending way above their earnings for a fair few recent years. That is to end this summer, so without that bailout you will see ever further cuts, more old hasbeens patching up the squad and even less rustics sitting forlornly in the tumbleweed blown seats of poorman road gazing round as their grubby little club sinks further down the plughole.




[/quote]

 

As good a paragraph about the Binners and their desperation as has been posted on this forum for some time, City 1st .

 

Absolute quality.

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[quote user="Davo"]It''s amazing that you care so little about them that you create a topic about it. They are still our rivals even if the case is like it is now and taking the pee out of them and gloating over them for being in a lower league.

Rivalries is one of the things that makes football as interesting as it is. Without Ipswich as our rivals we don''t have anyone else who we have such a mutual hatred towards to fuel a rivalry.

Davo[/quote]Indeed, sounds like you still care to create a thread about them.One of my best friends is a Pompey fan. Four years back they were in FA cup finals, comfortable in the Premier league - Southampton were in administration in league one. Today Portsmouth have gone through their second administration and are headed to league 1 - Southampton are premier league bound. These things have a habit of turning around. (EG - Scummers waving notes at us in 2009) 

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Enjoy the Premiership while you can. We may enjoy ten or more years back in the top flight, or it might be only two or three. Who knows? It''s best not too get too complacent or arrogant, as these things have a habit of coming back and biting you in the backside.

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When 1p5swich finished 5th it was their first season back in the PL, and this first season is often founded on pure adrenalin, regardless of where the team finished (cue Hull City).  The second season, 1p5swich went back down.  The second season is very tough - you have to do it all over again.I hope we don''t suffer the same fate.  The signs are very good, but you just never know.  But yes, the longer we survive in the PL, the greater the gulf will become between us and them.  Financially it''s collosal, which then spills over to other areas where the gulf will increase.  Had we been relegated this season, the total income once the parachute payments dried up would have been £90m.  So with at least one extra season in the PL, that figure now rises to £130m.  Survive for a second time next season and it''s not only £170m, it''s also likely to mean becoming debt free AND the chance to expand the stadium.The time for 1p5swich will come again; history tells us this is the case with football, it''s just a case of how long before it does.

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[quote user="Julius Sieze-Her"]Enjoy the Premiership while you can. We may enjoy ten or more years back in the top flight, or it might be only two or three. Who knows? It''s best not too get too complacent or arrogant, as these things have a habit of coming back and biting you in the backside.[/quote]Perfect.... 10/10[*]They are just another team.

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Enjoy being where we are. Enjoy seeing them where they are. Rub their noses in it and have fun. Because if the unthinkable happens and our roles are reversed in the future they will be doing it to us.

 

I don''t get all this pro-scum nonsense on this board. When  they got Mucus we had supposed City fans heralding their ambition. When we lost there and got relegated we had supposed City fans using them as a stick to beat our club. And now it''s obvious that we have more ambition and are light years ahead of them in every way we have City fans wanting us to "wind our necks in"!

 

Let''s hear what bluemike, chabal and portwan king have to say[:-*] They still come here you know. They have a little peep but never post. They used to have plenty to say.

 

TBH I do miss the derby games. But I can console myself that while we are winning at places like White Hart Lane they are losing at home to mid-table Championship teams. Maybe they would like to play us in a preseason friendly? I''m sure we could manage that instead of playing Dereham or Gorleston[;)]

 

 

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Enjoy being where we are. Enjoy seeing them where they are. Rub their noses in it and have fun. Because if the unthinkable happens and our roles are reversed in the future they will be doing it to us.

 

I don''t get all this pro-scum nonsense on this board. When  they got Mucus we had supposed City fans heralding their ambition. When we lost there and got relegated we had supposed City fans using them as a stick to beat our club. And now it''s obvious that we have more ambition and are light years ahead of them in every way we have City fans wanting us to "wind our necks in"!

 

Let''s hear what bluemike, chabal and portwan king have to say[:-*] They still come here you know. They have a little peep but never post. They used to have plenty to say.

 

TBH I do miss the derby games. But I can console myself that while we are winning at places like White Hart Lane they are losing at home to mid-table Championship teams. Maybe they would like to play us in a preseason friendly? I''m sure we could manage that instead of playing Dereham or Gorleston[;)]

 

 

[/quote]

 

And ideally we would be having those derby games in the Premier League.

 

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[quote user="City1st"]" The gulf between us and them when they finished 5th in the Premier League and we were in the 1st Division was arguably wider."Ye gods, are you serious ! There is now a massive difference between the clubs. Go back to 2001 and rough figures have -City''s income of around £15 against the binners £30m in the Premiere LeagueOur debts were around £5m, theirs around £9m - neither figure includes ground redevelopment borrowingsOur income was about three times our debt, as was theirs2012  City''s income of around £75m against the binners £16m (June 2012)Our debts are around £16m, theirs £65m (both May 2011)there is every likely hood that our debt will have seen a huge reduction where theirs will have risen even furtherThey have gone from having a debt one third of their income to a debt 4 or 5 times their incomeIn 2001 there was not the enormous gap between the two divisions as there is now. Next season the three relegated clubs will have, in parachute money alone, more than the paupers will have in TOTAL income. There is little chance of them getting anywhere near the playoffs never mind doing what we did shortly after theirv time in the Premier League, winning the title.To keep themselves afloat they are selling any players who can fetch a bit money, the youth system is being dismatled and the gates and income are still falling year in year out.In the many decades that I have follow City I have never seen either club have such an enormous difference in standing as things are at the moment. And with another season in the Premier League and the consequent clearing of our debts plus a back up of £48m in parachute payments were we to drop out of the Premier League, the gap is only going to widen even more than it is now. It should also be borne in mind that their rather lowly position has only been maintained by spending way above their earnings for a fair few recent years. That is to end this summer, so without that bailout you will see ever further cuts, more old hasbeens patching up the squad and even less rustics sitting forlornly in the tumbleweed blown seats of poorman road gazing round as their grubby little club sinks further down the plughole.

[/quote]Thanks City 1st. The picture you paint makes old Ricardo''s heart feel a lovely warm glow. I shall dream tonight of tumbleweed blowing round Poorman Rd.[:D]

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Enjoy being where we are. Enjoy seeing them where they are. Rub their noses in it and have fun. Because if the unthinkable happens and our roles are reversed in the future they will be doing it to us.

 

I don''t get all this pro-scum nonsense on this board. When  they got Mucus we had supposed City fans heralding their ambition. When we lost there and got relegated we had supposed City fans using them as a stick to beat our club. And now it''s obvious that we have more ambition and are light years ahead of them in every way we have City fans wanting us to "wind our necks in"!

 

Let''s hear what bluemike, chabal and portwan king have to say[:-*] They still come here you know. They have a little peep but never post. They used to have plenty to say.

 

TBH I do miss the derby games. But I can console myself that while we are winning at places like White Hart Lane they are losing at home to mid-table Championship teams. Maybe they would like to play us in a preseason friendly? I''m sure we could manage that instead of playing Dereham or Gorleston[;)]

 

 

[/quote]

 

And ideally we would be having those derby games in the Premier League.

 

[/quote]

 

Don''t think I ''ve actually seen anything on this thread that could be described as "pro-scum" Nutty. Come to that, apart from the confused ramblings of BlueMike and his pals, there''s nothing of it on this board ,full-stop.

 

BUT......Purple does have a point. For those of us who do miss the derby games, there''s only two realistic possibilities of getting them back (in League form at least) ;

They take place as a Premier League fixture (which will require the Binners to be promoted)

 

or,  They take place as a Championship fixture ( which will require us to be relegated)

 

So....it''s make your minds up time , folks !

 

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There may have been some worth in playing them when we were roughly ''equal'' but now there is little pointTheir collapse is so comprehensive that it would take an even greater collapse on our part for us to be playing them in a league game.It''s too easy to gloss over what a mess they really are in. Perhaps when the Olympics are over and the belt is tightened even further the true picture will emerge. Their constant failure to invest has left poorman road a dustbowl as far as promise and possibility go.As nutty has said, we should accept that the odd pre season friendly is the best the bin lovers either side of the line are going to get.

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[quote user="Eric Pickles Pie Supplier"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Enjoy being where we are. Enjoy seeing them where they are. Rub their noses in it and have fun. Because if the unthinkable happens and our roles are reversed in the future they will be doing it to us.

 

I don''t get all this pro-scum nonsense on this board. When  they got Mucus we had supposed City fans heralding their ambition. When we lost there and got relegated we had supposed City fans using them as a stick to beat our club. And now it''s obvious that we have more ambition and are light years ahead of them in every way we have City fans wanting us to "wind our necks in"!

 

Let''s hear what bluemike, chabal and portwan king have to say[:-*] They still come here you know. They have a little peep but never post. They used to have plenty to say.

 

TBH I do miss the derby games. But I can console myself that while we are winning at places like White Hart Lane they are losing at home to mid-table Championship teams. Maybe they would like to play us in a preseason friendly? I''m sure we could manage that instead of playing Dereham or Gorleston[;)]

 

 

[/quote]

 

And ideally we would be having those derby games in the Premier League.

 

[/quote]

 

Don''t think I ''ve actually seen anything on this thread that could be described as "pro-scum" Nutty. Come to that, apart from the confused ramblings of BlueMike and his pals, there''s nothing of it on this board ,full-stop.

 

BUT......Purple does have a point. For those of us who do miss the derby games, there''s only two realistic possibilities of getting them back (in League form at least) ;

They take place as a Premier League fixture (which will require the Binners to be promoted)

 

or,  They take place as a Championship fixture ( which will require us to be relegated)

 

So....it''s make your minds up time , folks !

 

[/quote]

Fair point Eric. Maybe that was a poor choice of words.

 

Replace that line with "I don''t get all this "they were just as far ahead of us in 2001" nonsense. Or the sentiments of "leaving them alone in case it comes back to bite us". It didn''t stop them in 2001 or 2009. It''s part of that rivalry which includes the derby games.

 

 

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I''ve been misunderstood I think. Not for the first time [;)]Obviously we''ll have the rivalry in a local sense but we are a premier league side now and ITFC are, well... no where near promotion at the moment.If we stay in the premiership for 3 or 4 seasons and they continue to languish, the gulf (financially at the very least) will be massive. Oh but it''s ok because they''ve got the millions of Marcus Evans behind them[:D]

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NN - Perhaps I just dont take the rivalry as seriously. Two of my best friends are Ipswich fans, and frankly other than the fact it is a local rivalry I have nothing against Ipswich as a whole. When we play of course I will celebrate like no other game, but right now I dont really concern myself with them. The likes of Leeds and Wolves I have far greater dislike for.And just because they gave us stick in 2001 or 2009 it doesnt mean I need to do it back, its not really in my nature to gloat. And hopefully as you may know, I have never used Ipswich as a stick to beat us with.

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I''m not really clued up on Ipswich''s finances and debt levels (why would I be? I''m a Norwich fan!) and I see posts on here about them having debts from anything of £40m to £65m but my Ipswich supporting mate is adamant they have no debt what so ever because Marcus Evans took it away when he brought them.  Who is correct?  Can someone fill me in?

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Riddled with debt. Evans is royally screwing them over (I''ll leave it to City 1st to go into details). Surprised that some of the Binners are still in denial. I hope for their sakes they''ve still got all those notes they were waving at us, they might need to have a wip round to make it through next season.

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[quote]I''m not really clued up on Ipswich''s finances and debt levels (why would I be? I''m a Norwich fan!) and I see posts on here about them having debts from anything of £40m to £65m but my Ipswich supporting mate is adamant they have no debt what so ever because Marcus Evans took it away when he brought them.  Who is correct?  Can someone fill me in? [/quote]I can''t say I have ever seen a £40m quotedThe figure usually

recently quoted is £65m - which is the fugure the club''s accounts state

that they were in debt, as of May 2011So either their clubs external auditors, club secretary and board of directors etc are lying .... or you friend is...................

though he may simply be from suffolk and reading newspapers, where such

infornation is regularly published, is beyond him

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Like spots... I outgrew all of this hatred of Ipswich many years ago. They are just another football team like Birmingham and the only time they enter my thinking is when we play them.  Sometimes we beat them and sometimes they beat us.... and either way it''s just three points.I''m amazed that grown men still carry this juvenile tripe around with them.

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[quote user="City1st"][quote]I''m not really clued up on Ipswich''s finances and debt levels (why would I be? I''m a Norwich fan!) and I see posts on here about them having debts from anything of £40m to £65m but my Ipswich supporting mate is adamant they have no debt what so ever because Marcus Evans took it away when he brought them.  Who is correct?  Can someone fill me in? [/quote]

I can''t say I have ever seen a £40m quoted

The figure usually recently quoted is £65m - which is the fugure the club''s accounts state that they were in debt, as of May 2011

So either their clubs external auditors, club secretary and board of directors etc are lying .... or you friend is

................... though he may simply be from suffolk and reading newspapers, where such infornation is regularly published, is beyond him
[/quote]

 

Fair enough, thanks for filling me in!

 

If they''re in so much debt how come there isnt a big hooha about thier finances in the media like Pompey and other clubs?  I assume when Evans leaves is when they will really be in messy stuff.

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[City1st"]Our impoversihed neighbours maybe in for rather a shock when their season ticket sales are announced if they are) because word has it they are well down, againthis time far worseperhaps they could move in with Colchester ... or close a couple of stands

 

 

When I''ve seen their highlights on tv I thought they had closed a couple of the stands!

 

 

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[quote user="Boyo"]

If they''re in so much debt how come there isnt a big hooha about thier finances in the media like Pompey and other clubs?  I assume when Evans leaves is when they will really be in messy stuff.

[/quote]

 

Partly, perhaps, because Ipswich aren''t in the Premier League. Just not as newsworthy. Another factor may be that because, as I understand the situation from other posters who have studied this, most or all of Ipswich''s debt is owed to its owner. Rather as with Bolton, which owes more than £100m but mainly to its owner. Fulham owes around £160m, but all or virtually all to Fayed.

 

Depending on the owner, and their plans (and I have no idea what Marcus Evans''s intentions are, of course, although his charging interest, as I gather he does, might be a clue) that is potentially less dangerous than owing money to banks, who will always want it back, or the Inland Revenue. It is owing money to outside institutions that tends to drive clubs into administration. We were not close to that, but our problems, such as they were, were not because we owed money to Smith and Jones and Foulger. They were caused by owing money to the banks.

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What other clubs ? Portsmouth and Rangers went into administration, hence the ''big hooha''they already are in ''messy stuff''

ps it''s not "If they''re in so much debt", they are -skint binnersor perhaps this lot are lying as well

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