How far can NCFC go as a club?

[lake district canary 0]

I''m probably going to annoy afew people now, but the only limit our club has is the limit on which we set on it.   

 

''Established mid table premiership team'' is the message that seems to be coming out, with the occasional foray in a cup or even Europe.

 

Why?   Why can''t the club be a spearhead along with Swansea and other teams that copy our approach?   The more we prove a well run club with sound finances and a good forward thinking manager can do well, the more it will happen.   The top clubs are filled with foreign, skilful mercenaries who at the best blow hot and cold.  They cannot match the team spirit of a Norwich or a Swansea.    I still think that a  smaller club with a great attitude can break into this hierachy of too much money and lack of ''soul'' type clubs.   Norwich and Swansea have been a complete breath of  fresh  air this season.  I don''t see it as over achieving, I see it as a revolution.

 

The main requirement for success is belief.    If you believe it is possible to get to the top - it is possible you can get to the top.   If you say it is only possible for us to get to 7th place - then you are  limiting your ambition.  Do we want to be limited in our ambition?  I don''t think so.  Playing the best we can do, improving the squad, keeping progressing - and the main thing is believing - and you never know what can happen.     The club is on a great financial footing, we have a great manager, a great squad - and great fans.   Why shouldn''t we believe we can carry on upwards?   Realism? Realism is another word for lack of ambition.   It''s football - not anything you can pin down.   All sorts of strange things can happen.  Who would have said three years ago we would be eyeing up  7th place in the premiership in three years time? 

 

Don''t limit what you think is possible.   The top is in sight.  Aim for it.

 

 

 

 

 

[morty 0]

[quote user="lake district canary"]

I''m probably going to annoy afew people now, but the only limit our club has is the limit on which we set on it.   

 

''Established mid table premiership team'' is the message that seems to be coming out, with the occasional foray in a cup or even Europe.

 

Why?   Why can''t the club be a spearhead along with Swansea and other teams that copy our approach?   The more we prove a well run club with sound finances and a good forward thinking manager can do well, the more it will happen.   The top clubs are filled with foreign, skilful mercenaries who at the best blow hot and cold.  They cannot match the team spirit of a Norwich or a Swansea.    I still think that a  smaller club with a great attitude can break into this hierachy of too much money and lack of ''soul'' type clubs.   Norwich and Swansea have been a complete breath of  fresh  air this season.  I don''t see it as over achieving, I see it as a revolution.

 

The main requirement for success is belief.    If you believe it is possible to get to the top - it is possible you can get to the top.   If you say it is only possible for us to get to 7th place - then you are  limiting your ambition.  Do we want to be limited in our ambition?  I don''t think so.  Playing the best we can do, improving the squad, keeping progressing - and the main thing is believing - and you never know what can happen.     The club is on a great financial footing, we have a great manager, a great squad - and great fans.   Why shouldn''t we believe we can carry on upwards?   Realism? Realism is another word for lack of ambition.   It''s football - not anything you can pin down.   All sorts of strange things can happen.  Who would have said three years ago we would be eyeing up  7th place in the premiership in three years time? 

 

Don''t limit what you think is possible.   The top is in sight.  Aim for it.

 

 

 

 

 

[/quote]I agree with what you are saying, but there are limitations.We are financially still vulnerable for a start, pick your favourite player, I dunno say Howson for example. Man Utd make a bid of 12 million pounds for him, what do you think happens next? It has always been about the "haves" and the have nots" and we are still firmly in the second category, for the minute anyway.I totally agree, we should always aim high, but I firmly believe that we are extremely unlikely to ever achieve top 6 status, without something in football dramatically changing.

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

Smashing post LDC, i completely agree.I said in an earlier post on this thread that money will hold us back. While that could be the case hard work and passion to do well can have it''s on rewards.If we constantly aim for ''comfortable mid table'' obscurity we could start to move backwards - by standing still as it were.7 years ago we watched those dreadful scenes as the Cottagers *snigger* battered us by 6 goals to nil to relegate us back to the championship. In 4 days about 2,000 of us will be heading back there to witness a redemption. Paul Lambert seems to do revenge well. Col Utd felt the full force of our boys after the infamous 7-1. After years of taunting from the Blue filth we came back from the third tier to teach them a lesson on two occasions. Fulham are next. The point I''m trying to make is that when the afore mentioned incidents occured nobody thought that we''d go back to the levels that we are now. I see absolutely no reason at all why we cant become East Anglia''s top dogs for many many years to come. Without the ''history'' of the scum... but I''d rather have a great team now. [;)]

[Bill 1,788]

" but I think it''s more likely that we will sink back to the second tier at some point in the not too distant future"Clearly you have not been watching what is going on at the club. When I stated at the beginning of the season ''Europe here we come'' wholle hordes of the whingers and whiners took to the forum in anquished outrage. The ''ever so umble had their run around the mid season point, as did the'' must have premiership experience'' halfwits before the season.And yet .... and yet.The same folk were warning of dire consequences if we went up last season. One such chap insisted that we should stay in the championship and consolodate for a few years, then go up when we were ready - as if it was like buying a pint.Well, we are up. Could even be 7th place come Saturday tea time. This is not simply due to Paul Lamberts skilful management. The whole club is being managed at a far high standard than ever before. That''s why we are where we are.For those who squeak that nothing will change, well it already has changed. The football league clubs are already being funnelled into the Financial Fair Play Rules and football in general is awaiting, with HMRC, for the High Court verdict on the Football Creditor’s Rule. A decision is expecting in the next few weeks. If it goes in HMRC (taxman)''s favour then expect a few changes as clubs seek to avoid being be caught up in any domino effect, whereby when one club collapses it takes other creditors with them. Something that has been avoided so far by the Football Creditor’s Rule.So we can only know how far we can go when we see where football is going. The bonus for us is that we will be free of debt and parasites (hinvestors) so as things stand we should be in a healthy position to meet what comes.

[lake district canary 0]

But its a win win scenario,  Morty.   If a top player at our club wants to go, then we will achieve a good price and move on.   I firmly believe that the balance is changing.    The top clubs don''t have the moral fibre of some of the smaller clubs.   They can have the best players from all around the world - but it does not mean they will be the best team.  Barcelona are just about the top club in the world in my book and they have both - the best players and a great team ethic.   In this country though, the money is bringing the types of players that supposedly we all want to see - but do they deliver? Teves? Suiraz?  There are too many flaky characters who despite their ability don''t fit in to the culture easily.  

 

Language is the  barrier - too many different nationalities and cultures.   It is very difficult to make teams gel as teams because of this.   Sure they can play great football - enough to win and be near the top - but can they be caught? I believe they can.

 

What''s the alternative?  Do we want to be Stoke and Everton who appear to be ''mid table established''?  Certainly don''t want to be Stoke.  Everton are stuck between a rock and a hard place.   Great manager, not enough money to be the big club they once were, can barely afford new players.

 

Norwich - financially good, wages - sensible, great manager - yes, can afford to buy new players (£2-3m) - yes. At the level we''re at we can afford to push on as we have.   Sure we might stumble and the team drop down, but at present it doesn''t look that way and to my mind we should push on and aim high.   I would rather be aiming for the top than mid-table respectability - thats for sure.    

 

Like I said before - its a question of belief, believing that we can go higher.  To get all philosophical, its like a mountain that''s there to be climbed. What''s the point in getting nearly to the summit and then saying - "Oh, we''re high enough, this will do."    No you push on until you get to the summit.  If the weather or something forces you back from the summit, at least you tried to get there.  

 

 

 

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

This is turning into a great debate.LDC your point about ''aiming for the top'' is a fascinating one.What do you consider the ''top'' to be?

[morty 0]

Again LDC, I agree with everything you''re saying here, but I just think that theres only so far ambition and spirit will take us.We''re not financially that good, not just yet. I would liken Fulham or Stoke as what we can achieve.There are probably 5 or 6 teams in this division that I can''t see us beating anytime soon, and until we have enough quality to do so then I think we have a ceiling of maybe 7th place. This isn''t to say its all about money, it doesn''t always buy quality, ask Chelsea!So we can go on about our plucky efforts against Man Utd and Chelski, but until we are taking points off those teams then we''re not really progressing.

[Mr Brownstone 0]

Complete disagree with the thought that a 35,000 seater stadium would be too big for us.

 

I had my first season ticket at the age of 16, the season after O''Neill left, but my Dad had been taking me on a casual basis since I was 8. I recall many a season under Rioch, Hamilton and Walkers 2nd spell where we regularly had crowds of 13-17k. To be fair, a cold Tuesday night in January against Grimsby watching that dross was hardly an attractive proposition.

 

However those figures could have been a lot lower if it had not been for some clever ''kids for a quid'' marketing by the Club. Many of those kids who got a taste of live football back then are probably todays season ticket holders. With current season ticket numbers unlikely to decline anytime in the near future and the low numbers of casual tickets available, especially grouped together, we are in danger of losing the next generation of fans to supporting United, Chelsea, City, Arsenal on TV rather than getting themselves down to FCR to experience the real thing.

 

That stand needs building, sooner rather than later.

 

[William Darby 0]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="The Pinkun Role Model"][quote user="morty"]A top ten club with the odd cup run. There is only so far Lambert''s magic can take us, the days when a club of our stature (By this I mean relative wealth) can finish anywhere near the top 4 have gone. You only have to look at the likes of Everton as an example, they have had Premiership money and great crowds for years, coupled with a manager I rate highly, and yet they still underachieve in the eyes of a lot of their fans.The cups will be our glory until the big money backers get bored of their Premier league toys and take their money elsewhere, and the playing field is slightly more level.[/quote]So how in front are Newcastle to us?  Seriously you really don''t think we can head the pack fighting for around 6th & 7th under Lambert.  Imo we can, if we invest a little more each year and improve.  Hell we''re not that far behind.[/quote]I think you only have to look at the kind of money they received for Carrol, and subsequent transfer fees they have paid out to answer that, and the fact they regularly pull in 40,000 plus fans. Yes, I think given enough time we could be on par with what they are achieving, and what their fans are expecting, but time isn''t on our side, I really don''t think we can grow quickly enough to continue to fulfil Lamberts ambition. We''re safe for now, as a real measure of his abilities will be how he manages the difficult second season, and if he can still progress at the rate he has been doing. If he has a good season next time then I really think the "bigger" clubs will be sniffing.

[/quote]I have, and facts are they''ve spent relatively next to nothing compared to other clubs now and what they have in the past.  IMO Newcastle have done so well due to rooting out the disruptive elements (you know who) and the result is, a happy settled squad.  The upshot is, we should stop wetting our pants worrying about if Lambert leaves and just watch us go next season.  We will spend a few million, and push on.

[William Darby 0]

[quote user="morty"]Again LDC, I agree with everything you''re saying here, but I just think that theres only so far ambition and spirit will take us.We''re not financially that good, not just yet. I would liken Fulham or Stoke as what we can achieve.There are probably 5 or 6 teams in this division that I can''t see us beating anytime soon, and until we have enough quality to do so then I think we have a ceiling of maybe 7th place. This isn''t to say its all about money, it doesn''t always buy quality, ask Chelsea!So we can go on about our plucky efforts against Man Utd and Chelski, but until we are taking points off those teams then we''re not really progressing.[/quote]I thought you just said top ten? You vacillate more than what you accuse others of.

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

To back up Mr Brownstone, Mr McNally said at aforementioned supporters forum that the clubs catchment area for supporters is massive.McNally claimed that getting 35,000 bums on seats would not be an issue:- we have an away end of (approx) 2,500 which leaves around 24,500 seats for the home support. Now going on the basis that a stadium of 35,000 would see the away end bump of slightly to 3,000 we would be looking at 32,000 seats for the home fans (minus about 1,000 for segregation).

Increase the season ticket holders to 25/26,000 would not be an issue and the greater capacity would give the non season ticket holder element of our support a better chance for tickets.Win/win all round.

[lake district canary 0]

[quote user="Shaker Maker"]This is turning into a great debate.

LDC your point about ''aiming for the top'' is a fascinating one.

What do you consider the ''top'' to be?


[/quote]

 

In the cold light of day, the top is top, 1st place, the Premiership Champions.  Its not as barmy as some people might think.  Its there as an ultimate goal.       The club should be - and I think they are - thinking of ways to carry on progressing  - and the only way of progressing is going up.   If you carry on this argument, you keep going up.   As far as you can.  The aim for me is top spot.   You may not achieve it but at least the you can say you  tried.     The alternative is to settle for less.  As soon as you settle for less you lose something - just look at Stoke and the way they play. 

 

As I said before this season, too many people have set apart the top six saying they can''t be touched - well Swansea have proved they can be - and others - and so have we - although we haven''t yet beaten one (apart from Newcastle, but they are a slightly different case).      The media and stats people say its impossible to compete with them - but this season says different.   Thanks to the likes of us and Swansea people are waking up to the fact that these clubs are only human - they are there to be beaten, just like any other team.  

 

Next season will be fascinating.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[morty 0]

[quote user="The Pinkun Role Model"][quote user="morty"]Again LDC, I agree with everything you''re saying here, but I just think that theres only so far ambition and spirit will take us.We''re not financially that good, not just yet. I would liken Fulham or Stoke as what we can achieve.There are probably 5 or 6 teams in this division that I can''t see us beating anytime soon, and until we have enough quality to do so then I think we have a ceiling of maybe 7th place. This isn''t to say its all about money, it doesn''t always buy quality, ask Chelsea!So we can go on about our plucky efforts against Man Utd and Chelski, but until we are taking points off those teams then we''re not really progressing.[/quote]I thought you just said top ten? You vacillate more than what you accuse others of. [/quote]Eh? I''m not accusing anyone of anything lol.I think that the best we can hope for is to be an established top ten team, the VERY best we can hope for without there being changes to current football rules regarding finances is 7th place.Hope this clarifies[Y]

[morty 0]

[quote user="Shaker Maker"]To back up Mr Brownstone, Mr McNally said at aforementioned supporters forum that the clubs catchment area for supporters is massive.McNally claimed that getting 35,000 bums on seats would not be an issue:- we have an away end of (approx) 2,500 which leaves around 24,500 seats for the home support. Now going on the basis that a stadium of 35,000 would see the away end bump of slightly to 3,000 we would be looking at 32,000 seats for the home fans (minus about 1,000 for segregation).

Increase the season ticket holders to 25/26,000 would not be an issue and the greater capacity would give the non season ticket holder element of our support a better chance for tickets.Win/win all round. [/quote]I don''t think the increase would be as obvious as you may think. If I thought I could turn up and Saturday with my lads and get 3 seats together then I would, currently I renew my season tickets because that is the only way I can ensure I can see games when I''m not working.Its all about supply and demand, at the minute demand outstrip supply, with a 35k stadium it no longer will.

[thenorthstand 0]

We have a big following. Expand the stadium to 35k and fill it out every week, MAYBE a push for Europe though not Champions league (perhaps one day though).

I think we would need investment to ever challenge for the Prem or even play in the Champions league, but I think we''re one of 10-15 clubs lucky enough to have a fanbase big enough.

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="Shaker Maker"]To back up Mr Brownstone, Mr McNally said at aforementioned supporters forum that the clubs catchment area for supporters is massive.McNally claimed that getting 35,000 bums on seats would not be an issue:- we have an away end of (approx) 2,500 which leaves around 24,500 seats for the home support. Now going on the basis that a stadium of 35,000 would see the away end bump of slightly to 3,000 we would be looking at 32,000 seats for the home fans (minus about 1,000 for segregation).

Increase the season ticket holders to 25/26,000 would not be an issue and the greater capacity would give the non season ticket holder element of our support a better chance for tickets.Win/win all round. [/quote]I don''t think the increase would be as obvious as you may think. If I thought I could turn up and Saturday with my lads and get 3 seats together then I would, currently I renew my season tickets because that is the only way I can ensure I can see games when I''m not working.Its all about supply and demand, at the minute demand outstrip supply, with a 35k stadium it no longer will.[/quote]I see what you''re saying and I agree to an extent. It does sometimes feel that people get season tickets to guarantee seats. A bigger stadium would mean that availabilty would increase. A good thing I''m sure we''ll all agree? My brother doesnt go to many home games (away games are different as we''re group 3ers) because he simply cannot get tickets.Someone like him would go to a lot more home games if he could get tickets more easily.We wont know whether we''ll be able to sell more tickets until the expanison.Exciting times.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Shaker Maker"][quote user="morty"][quote user="Shaker Maker"]To back up Mr Brownstone, Mr McNally said at aforementioned supporters forum that the clubs catchment area for supporters is massive.McNally claimed that getting 35,000 bums on seats would not be an issue:- we have an away end of (approx) 2,500 which leaves around 24,500 seats for the home support. Now going on the basis that a stadium of 35,000 would see the away end bump of slightly to 3,000 we would be looking at 32,000 seats for the home fans (minus about 1,000 for segregation).

Increase the season ticket holders to 25/26,000 would not be an issue and the greater capacity would give the non season ticket holder element of our support a better chance for tickets.Win/win all round. [/quote]I don''t think the increase would be as obvious as you may think. If I thought I could turn up and Saturday with my lads and get 3 seats together then I would, currently I renew my season tickets because that is the only way I can ensure I can see games when I''m not working.Its all about supply and demand, at the minute demand outstrip supply, with a 35k stadium it no longer will.[/quote]I see what you''re saying and I agree to an extent. It does sometimes feel that people get season tickets to guarantee seats. A bigger stadium would mean that availabilty would increase. A good thing I''m sure we''ll all agree? My brother doesnt go to many home games (away games are different as we''re group 3ers) because he simply cannot get tickets.Someone like him would go to a lot more home games if he could get tickets more easily.We wont know whether we''ll be able to sell more tickets until the expanison.Exciting times.[/quote]I think theres a waiting list of 2 or 3 thousand for season tickets, taking into account perhaps people like myself not renewing then I reckon the season ticket figure would likely be 23k at best, which in itself would be fantastic, but that leaves a lot of casual tickest to sell.And when you build a new stand every game a seat is empty is money lost.I''m not so sure its the no brainer that a lot of people think it is.

[ricardo 7,342]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="The Pinkun Role Model"][quote user="morty"]Again LDC, I agree with everything you''re saying here, but I just think that theres only so far ambition and spirit will take us.We''re not financially that good, not just yet. I would liken Fulham or Stoke as what we can achieve.There are probably 5 or 6 teams in this division that I can''t see us beating anytime soon, and until we have enough quality to do so then I think we have a ceiling of maybe 7th place. This isn''t to say its all about money, it doesn''t always buy quality, ask Chelsea!So we can go on about our plucky efforts against Man Utd and Chelski, but until we are taking points off those teams then we''re not really progressing.[/quote]I thought you just said top ten? You vacillate more than what you accuse others of. [/quote]Eh? I''m not accusing anyone of anything lol.I think that the best we can hope for is to be an established top ten team, the VERY best we can hope for without there being changes to current football rules regarding finances is 7th place.Hope this clarifies[Y][/quote]Realistic and far too sensible for all those with hambition Morty.Even if we could constantly fill a 35k stadium (which I very much doubt) we would still be way way below the Manure''s and Arsenals of this world.I''m all for dreaming dreams but lets not get too silly. Winning a cup and getting into the top 10 ought to be possible in extremely good years but the big boys will always come and nick your best players or manager, that''s the reality of it.

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

In very broadbrush terms there have been two phases in English football since the war. The economic phase, in which the success of clubs was tied to the local economy. And the financial phase, starting in the 1990s and still with us, in which the size of the owner''s wallet was the relevant factor. But in both it was money that talked. What the financial age has done, if anything, is to cement the position of big-name clubs and restore to prominence some that had fallen on - comparitively - hard times. It is no accident that Abramovich, who could have bought any club in the country, settled on Chelsea. Or that Abu Dhabi chose Man City. So English football is less meritocratic than it was in the 1970s and 1980s, towards the end of the economic era. As Bob Dylan says, and he might have had football in mind: "Money doesn''t talk; it swears."

 

While the financial age carries on there is a limit to what Norwich City, under anything like its current ownership, can achieve on a long-term basis. According to LDC: "The main requirement for success is belief." It would be nice it that were true. But the main requirement in any sport is talent. And talent costs money. And we have paupers for owners.

 

Even if we returned to an economic age we would still be hamstrung by a lack of support. There are simply not enough Norwich City fans to generate the income to enable us to compete with the mega-clubs. That even the most optimistic fans - and directors - are talking only about a 35,000-seat stadium tells its own story.

 

This is not to say we cannot cement a place in the Premier League and get cup success. We can. But the idea of becoming one of the elite half-dozen is fanciful. It flies in the face of the whole history of the game.

 

That said, we are in a happy position IF the financial bubble bursts. Unlike some other clubs, the essentials at Norwich City, thanks to Watling, South, Chase and Smith and Jones, are solid. We own the ground. We own the training ground. Neither is in need of any massive tarting up. We are in a position (luckily, since we have to) to pay off our debts. We have a solid core of suppprt, although one worry is that the new regime may be taking that too much for granted.

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

Bit of a reality check there Ricardo, this thread has long needed one! One thing I will say though, Delia will not be around forever. Such is life. A huge number of ''hinvestors'' could take us over. We could have billions, never mind millions pumped into the club.Coupled with the fact that they *could* be Norwich City supporters like us.

The truth is out there.

[lake district canary 0]

Ricardo wrote:  "Realistic and far too sensible for all those with hambition Morty.   Even if we could constantly fill a 35k stadium (which I very much doubt) we would still be way way below the Manure''s and Arsenals of this world.  I''m all for dreaming dreams but lets not get too silly. Winning a cup and getting into the top 10 ought to be possible in extremely good years but the big boys will always come and nick your best players or manager, that''s the reality of it."

 

 

Reality Reality.  What is reality?     The ''big boys'' are there to be beaten.    We really have to get this mentality right or no-one is ever going to compete properly against them.   Too many people put them on a pedastal.    Surely this season has proved a point in the way some of these ''big boys'' have been brought down a peg or two by various clubs - notably Swansea.   Get out there with your best players - great manager - great club set up and beat them.      The only people who say its impossible are the media and statisticians.   The media is not to be trusted and statistics can be manipulated in any way you want.    We have to believe we can go higher and keep going higher. The only alternative is settling for less. As soon as you settle for less you will start going down.   It''s inevitable.    Aim for the top.

 

 

 

[morty 0]

I don''t think we have put any of the "big" teams on a pedestal, the fact is that they are better than us.I admire your optimism though, I''m just slightly more of a pragmatist.

[Mr Brownstone 0]

Really, who''s to say we can''t finish in the top 6 in any given season. I appreciate that it''s an irrelevant stat, but had the season started on January 1st, Liverpool would be 18th whilst we would sit 8th, despite our ''blip''.

Take a look at La Liga this season, alright Barca and Real have disappeared as usual but Malaga sit joint 3rd with Valencia. More interestingly Zaragoza sit bottom with Betis and Villarreal sitting just above the drop zone.

I''m not saying we can do it next year, or sustain it year after year, but I completely disagree that we''ve hit our ceiling.

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"]Even if we returned to an economic age we would still be hamstrung by a lack of support. There are simply not enough Norwich City fans to generate the income to enable us to compete with the mega-clubs. That even the most optimistic fans - and directors - are talking only about a 35,000-seat stadium tells its own story.

 That said, we are in a happy position IF the financial bubble bursts. Unlike some other clubs, the essentials at Norwich City, thanks to Watling, South, Chase and Smith and Jones, are solid. We own the ground. We own the training ground. Neither is in need of any massive tarting up. We are in a position (luckily, since we have to) to pay off our debts. We have a solid core of suppprt, although one worry is that the new regime may be taking that too much for granted.

[/quote]Purple, I am delighted that you have graced this thread. I consider you to be one of the best posters on this board.However I feel that I have to take issue with one of your points. Our supporter base is huge- not on the 45k+ level but I would have absolutely no worries that we could sell out a 35,000 seater stadium. Maybe even a couple of thousand more?  

[ricardo 7,342]

[quote user="Shaker Maker"]Bit of a reality check there Ricardo, this thread has long needed one! One thing I will say though, Delia will not be around forever. Such is life. A huge number of ''hinvestors'' could take us over. We could have billions, never mind millions pumped into the club.Coupled with the fact that they *could* be Norwich City supporters like us.

The truth is out there. [/quote]Wouldn''t that be nice[:)]

[lake district canary 0]

[quote user="morty"]I don''t think we have put any of the "big" teams on a pedestal, the fact is that they are better than us.

I admire your optimism though, I''m just slightly more of a pragmatist.
[/quote]

 

I''m sorry Morty, but I spent alot of time earlier this season arguing that we could compete with these ''big'' clubs - and there are alot of people who said it wasn''t possible - that they were ''unreachable'' that we would be hammered every time we came up against one of them.       It hasn''t happened.   We competed, Swansea  competed.  We are there we''re with the'' big boys'' in the ''big league'' and if we are acclimatising to it then we will improve next season and push on. That means going higher in the league.  If we manage to finish 7th or 8th this season - quite a realistic possibility - that means  6th, 5th or even higher next.    The more credence or respect or whatever you call it you give to the big clubs  - the less chance you have of beating them.   They are there to be beaten.  It is up to the likes of our club to do it.  Lets stop talking down the possibilities and start talking them up.  Realism is only where you set the target.  

Hasn''t the last three years taught us anything??

 

 

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

We''ve given the big boys massive scares this year.I''ve come away from Old Trafford, Stamford Bridge this season feeling disappointed that we havent won the games!Maybe we''ve been let down by our ''lack of ability'' (in comparison to the top 5) in those games but they at least give us hope that with team building over a 2-3 period we can get a lot closer to them.I can guarantee that Paul Lambert has the ambition to drive this club on to new highs.Why would he want to leave?

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

[quote user="Shaker Maker"][quote user="PurpleCanary"]
Even if we returned to an economic age we would still be hamstrung by a lack of support. There are simply not enough Norwich City fans to generate the income to enable us to compete with the mega-clubs. That even the most optimistic fans - and directors - are talking only about a 35,000-seat stadium tells its own story.

 That said, we are in a happy position IF the financial bubble bursts. Unlike some other clubs, the essentials at Norwich City, thanks to Watling, South, Chase and Smith and Jones, are solid. We own the ground. We own the training ground. Neither is in need of any massive tarting up. We are in a position (luckily, since we have to) to pay off our debts. We have a solid core of suppprt, although one worry is that the new regime may be taking that too much for granted.

[/quote]

Purple, I am delighted that you have graced this thread. I consider you to be one of the best posters on this board.

However I feel that I have to take issue with one of your points. Our supporter base is huge- not on the 45k+ level but I would have absolutely no worries that we could sell out a 35,000 seater stadium. Maybe even a couple of thousand more?
 

[/quote]

 

You sweet-talking devil, you!!!

 

To be clear I wasn''t saying we couldn''t fill a 35,00-seat stadium. Although, along with David Cuffley, I am dubious about the club''s business plan, which is that we would fill it for every game. Ie, for Wigan or WBA at 3pm on a Saturday or for Southampton or Newcastle at 8pm on a Monday. The point I was making is that the mega-clubs have stadia of 60,000 or more, because they can fill them, and need to fill them, for financial reasons. We are simply nowhere near that, and I doubt we ever will be, unless the fish of the North Sea turn into people. In terms of generating income there is a limit beyond which we cannot rise, and it is way below the limit for the mega-clubs.

[morty 0]

[quote user="lake district canary"]

[quote user="morty"]I don''t think we have put any of the "big" teams on a pedestal, the fact is that they are better than us.I admire your optimism though, I''m just slightly more of a pragmatist.[/quote]

 

I''m sorry Morty, but I spent alot of time earlier this season arguing that we could compete with these ''big'' clubs - and there are alot of people who said it wasn''t possible - that they were ''unreachable'' that we would be hammered every time we came up against one of them.       It hasn''t happened.   We competed, Swansea  competed.  We are there we''re with the'' big boys'' in the ''big league'' and if we are acclimatising to it then we will improve next season and push on. That means going higher in the league.  If we manage to finish 7th or 8th this season - quite a realistic possibility - that means  6th, 5th or even higher next.    The more credence or respect or whatever you call it you give to the big clubs  - the less chance you have of beating them.   They are there to be beaten.  It is up to the likes of our club to do it.  Lets stop talking down the possibilities and start talking them up.  Realism is only where you set the target.  

Hasn''t the last three years taught us anything??

 

 

[/quote]Yes, we may have competed, but we didn''t actually take any points off them, did we? Other than a point at Liverpool, which is no big deal these days!

[Mr Brownstone 0]

We took a point off Chelsea too, who are about to start a Champions League tie.