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With how physical the game was at times, I couldn''t help but think it would have been nice to get the ball on the ground and play it through them like we did in the last half hour. Playing Howson today instead of Fox or Hoolahan seemed like a logical decision, but sadly the game didn''t turn out as planned.

I agree we need to play Fox, he brings the best out of our squad and playing style the majority of the time.

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We need Fox in the starting line up. Week in week out. If there is one complaint about Lambert this season, it would be the fact that he doesn''t seem to have clicked on that Fox is the key. Without him we simply don''t look the same team.

I''m not a fan of Johnson, he seems a yard off the pace. He may "put himself around" but does he actually? You want someone who can impact the game positively, not just kick people and give away freekicks, I''ve yet to see much positive from Johnson I''m afraid. Today I would have possibly have dropped him, put Fox in the side, and gone with a 4-1-4-1 formation.

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A very integral part of our midfield is Foxy......."In hindsight" he should have started against Stoke ahead of young Howson. I''m sure Mr Lambert and Mr Culverhouse were certainly well aware of our ''improvement'' when Foxy came onto the field, late on in the game.

I do hope Foxy starts against Wigan next week......Oh, and Hoolyhoop also needs to be on from the onset next week.

But, then again, I don''t attend Colney training sessions - and I''m not the manager of a Premiership team that lies 10th in the table after three successive promotions on the bounce.....

Oh, and Stoke''s Ryan Shawcross, is a grade ''A'' dirty twunt with the face of porky pig....

 

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[quote user="Mello Yello"]

A very integral part of our midfield is Foxy......."In hindsight" he should have started against Stoke ahead of young Howson. I''m sure Mr Lambert and Mr Culverhouse were certainly well aware of our ''improvement'' when Foxy came onto the field, late on in the game.

I do hope Foxy starts against Wigan next week......Oh, and Hoolyhoop also needs to be on from the onset next week.

But, then again, I don''t attend Colney training sessions - and I''m not the manager of a Premiership team that lies 10th in the table after three successive promotions on the bounce.....

Oh, and Stoke''s Ryan Shawcross, is a grade ''A'' dirty twunt with the face of porky pig....

 

[/quote]

amendment......TWO successive promotions......

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[quote user="AJ"]With how physical the game was at times, I couldn''t help but think it would have been nice to get the ball on the ground and play it through them like we did in the last half hour. Playing Howson today instead of Fox or Hoolahan seemed like a logical decision, but sadly the game didn''t turn out as planned. I agree we need to play Fox, he brings the best out of our squad and playing style the majority of the time.[/quote]

Agreed, thats the thing with hind sight, its seems so obvious after the event.  However I still would like us to play our game rather than trying to combat the opposition all the time.  Attack is the greatest form of defence we need to play to our strenghts and let the opposition worry about us more.  Yes we do need to be tactically aware re: Swansea game but we still played the Norwich way, when we just set up to nullify the opposition we tend to lose our way a bit and more offen than not come unstuck.

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Fox for Johnson not Howson,  although neither of the of the ex leeds pair had good games

 

Basically we were second best,  we were hopeless with the ball,  poor movement up front and created nothing and the ploy of playing a robust midfield to cope with their physicality was woeful,   with us not even winning theball back let alone disrupting their play!!  It did not work in augist either 

 

Ruddy was the busier keeper and their tactic of defending from the front worked wonders,  with none of our 11 able to pass to another green shirt.   PL was out tacticked by Pulis.   Nothing to do with long ball game - their game plan was better than our, they wanted it more than us and delivered what was asked.

 

Yes the goal came from a dodgy throw decision - but that is 40 yards from goal,  we fell asleep and defended half heartedly.  But excluding that decision did we do enough in the other 89 mins to deserve a point? And we should not become a team that bemoans one poor linesman decision to mask a poor performance.

Fair play to Stoke - they earnt their 3 points

 

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and after this if I was another prem manager facing fox I would assume he is not up to a physical game and target him accordingly.  I do think Fox is better than that.

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I think today just confirmed what I thought after the Sunderland game. That whenever David Fox isn''t in the side I am worried about the game. He is happy to receive the ball off the back 4 under pressure and pick out a pass, which sets us moving on the attack. I would like to our record this season when Fox hasn''t started games because I reckon it can''t be particularly clever.

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It definitely should have been Fox starting for Johnson. As soon as Fox came on we stopped lumping it up the field, which of course was not going to work given their size in defense. We did once Fox came on get it into some better positions. Fox and Howson would have worked well together in that midfield 2.

If Lambert wants to play the 4-2-3-1 in future game we should play with Fox and Howson in midfield. Pilkington or Bennett on the right of the 3, Surman on the left and Wes through the middle. Given Howson''s tracking back today it has shown me with he and Fox in Midfield we won''t be a liability.

Howson is the future.

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Another thing that Fox does, once he passes the ball, he follows it. In theory it sounds like a bad idea, but if you watch, when he gets the ball back it''s always in a slightly more advanced position. He continues to do this until a good pass is open wide or further up the field for a full attack to start.

Given his passing ability, this type of play is very Scholes.

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Fox starting

P Points L GF GA points%

17 25/51 4 24 26 49%

Fox Sub

P Points L GF GA points%

5 6/15 3 7 11 40%

For not play

P Points L GF GA points%

5 4/15 3 4 9 26

So starting with Fox we have only lost to manure, spurs & arsenal (4 games) while we have lost 6 when he does not start, 33% of points one without him (a point a game) while its nearly 50% of points with him on the pitch from the begining, just under 1.5 per game, 50% more

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Very interesting stuff Zipper. I wonder based on those statistics whether we did actually attempt to sign Liam Bridcutt from Brighton during the window. From what Brighton have said on their forums he seems like a very similar player to Fox, who is able to get the ball in deep positions and get the team ticking over. I think in the summer that area is definitely a priority because I am not certainty whether Crofty or Johnson are good enough to play in that role in the Premiership.

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David Fox is a crucial element of our mid field and we do find it much harder to play without him. It was good for Howson to get a run out yesterday and I am sure he will have learned a lot from the experience, more importantly Lambert would have learned a lot about him and will now be in a position to help him develop his game in the way we want him to play.

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[quote user="zak123"]Another thing that Fox does, once he passes the ball, he follows it. In theory it sounds like a bad idea, but if you watch, when he gets the ball back it''s always in a slightly more advanced position. He continues to do this until a good pass is open wide or further up the field for a full attack to start. Given his passing ability, this type of play is very Scholes.[/quote]

 

Spot on - never tries to do anything OTT immediately.   Gets the ball, plays a quick couple of passes, follows the ball as mentioned earlier in this thread, before trying to spot the killer pass.  Wes does similar but by dribbling with the ball, gets caught more often.  I think Fox is the person we need to build the team around.  He is also a key dead ball player as well - invariably causes mayhem when he takes our corners, before he came on yesterday our corners were p1ss poor.

 

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[quote user="ZippersLeftFoot"]Fox starting

P Points L GF GA points%

17 25/51 4 24 26 49%

Fox Sub

P Points L GF GA points%

5 6/15 3 7 11 40%

For not play

P Points L GF GA points%

5 4/15 3 4 9 26

So starting with Fox we have only lost to manure, spurs & arsenal (4 games) while we have lost 6 when he does not start, 33% of points one without him (a point a game) while its nearly 50% of points with him on the pitch from the begining, just under 1.5 per game, 50% more[/quote]It is also worth noting that in the four league games in which David Fox has come on as a sub, the team has played better after his introduction, with the possible exception of the more recent game against West Brom, but that was partly because the game plan by that point was the close the game out.For me, David Fox would be the first name on the teamsheet, even before Holt. It''s not to say that he''s necessarily the best player; it''s just that nobody else in the squad really plays the way he plays. Russell Martin is probably my favourite player, but he is replaceable with players with similar qualities (not a criticism, more praise of our strength in depth). Even Holt is replaceable as a first choice starter (though should not be left out of the final 18 ever in my opinion).

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[quote user="shefcanary"]

[quote user="zak123"]Another thing that Fox does, once he passes the ball, he follows it. In theory it sounds like a bad idea, but if you watch, when he gets the ball back it''s always in a slightly more advanced position. He continues to do this until a good pass is open wide or further up the field for a full attack to start. Given his passing ability, this type of play is very Scholes.[/quote]

 

Spot on - never tries to do anything OTT immediately.   Gets the ball, plays a quick couple of passes, follows the ball as mentioned earlier in this thread, before trying to spot the killer pass.  Wes does similar but by dribbling with the ball, gets caught more often.  I think Fox is the person we need to build the team around.  He is also a key dead ball player as well - invariably causes mayhem when he takes our corners, before he came on yesterday our corners were p1ss poor.

 

[/quote]

We definately need players like Fox in the side who have an eye for a pass, can put their foot on the ball when needed and link up play from the back to the front.  Without a Fox type player in the side to often we run out of ideas and just lump it forward. Ian Crook was brilliant at it, never the fastest but didnt need to be he could destroy teams with a single killer pass and seemed to have so much time on the ball as did Martin Peters, the sign of a quality player.

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