Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Rudolph Hucker

A SLUMP OF OUR OWN MAKING?

Recommended Posts

[quote user="Mr. Magnolia"]Why is the Wigan match suddenly a "pressure game"?

[/quote]

 

 

Because people like to build things up out of all proportion and heap extra pressure on the team unnecessarily.

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We have lost four out of the last six but we have beaten the EPL teams below us.

 

We should beat Wigan, we need to beat Wigan. Stoke needed to beat Swansea because they lost four leading into that game and they needed to beat us because of tough fixtures coming up. Man Utd needed to beat us because they want to win the league. Leicester needed to beat us because they have little else to look forward too and we were a scalp.

 

But according to many on here; we didn''t need the Cup, it was a distraction. We played well against man Utd and they even said so (they wouldn''t have had we taken a point, you know) so that''s good enough. And we are just one of many teams who lose at Stoke because they are big, rough boys so that''s alright too. We didn''t need to win any of those games did we?

 

Well, we lost at Stoke because we couldn''t keep the ball. The striker to play up front on his own, because he likes being on his own - is Morison; it isn''t Grant Holt. We created nothing of note because we played a midfielder unfamiliar with his team-mates and Bradley Johnson in the same side.  I have to say though I thought  our defence did well, especially Ruddy on high balls.

 

Stoke had no pace that would worry us, we should have pushed right up and compressed them, we should have gone to win the game from the off rather than just try not to lose it.

 

And as for crap about playing too many games; Russell Martin and Simeon Jackson were both away on international duty in the week, so for me you just play your best side - something we failed to do against Leicester and deflated our own season as a result.

 

Our players showed character at Stoke, a shut out would have been highly creditable and we seldom looked in trouble. But not enough ambition was shown and that has been a characteristic of what is, in comparison to a consistent and resilient season, a slump perhaps?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="RUDOLPH HUCKER"]

Our players showed character at Stoke, a shut out would have been highly creditable and we seldom looked in trouble. But not enough ambition was shown and that has been a characteristic of what is, in comparison to a consistent and resilient season, a slump perhaps?

[/quote]

Was it in L1 or the Championship at about this time of year that you said we would not get promoted?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rudolph - Since winning in the cup builds momentum and keeps a winning mentality please could you explain why our excellent win in the Cup away at West Brom was followed by our worst League performance of the season away at Sunderland?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Really interesting OP - those who are thoughtlessly rejecting RH''s arguments need to reconsider why you spend time on an internet message board.

My thoughts:

I am still really disappointed that we didn''t pick our strongest team against Leicester. We had a real shot at a Wembley appearance in a season where we are all but safe. Not to go for that was very disappointing.

By not picking his strongest team (and you can argue round this any way you want, but he told Holt and Ruddy they didn''t even have to turn up to the ground), Lambert sent a message that he wasn''t really fussed whether we beat Leicester or not. And that ambivalence is always going to transmit to the players

The other message it sent was that he felt we were still in a relegation battle. All the positivity of the Swansea win dissipated at a stroke. And for what? Keeping the players fresh for two games that were always going to be very hard to win anyway?

I think Lambert made a mistake vs Leicester. For those who need it spelled out, that doesn''t mean I think he''s an idiot, or that he should resign. He''s our best manager of the last 25 years in my opinion. But I think he got it wrong vs Leicester, and the events of the last two weeks have not proved him right,

Oh, and the reason we lost at Sunderland after the West Brom win is clearly Lambert''s unresolved Oedipal relationship with Martin O''Neill. We will never beat a MO''N team under Lambert until Lambert stops calling MO''N ''Gaffer''.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It definitely is a slump. By the standards that we have set THIS season, it is below the points targets that we have come to expect.

I don''t care about last season, or even about what I would have liked at the start of the season - I like to take one game at a time, and the last few games we have taken fewer points from those one games at a time than I would have liked. So it is a slump.

HOWEVER, it is a lot easier to let the players and staff off for a slight slump at the moment than it would be had we not already been safe in the league. I''d luke to see Lambert shove a rocket up the backside of a few players wo we don''t just become happy with being safe and no slip down the league, as we''re better than that. But even if we fail miserably, we''re going to stay up.

I do thought think that the run in now until the end of the season is hard, but it may well predict our future. If we struggle, then I think it may suggest that possibly we are being sussed out and may need something different next year - and hve we got the money to get that something different to an effective level? Time will tell.

However, if we turn it round (as I personally expect we will), then we can be confident that we will continue in the same vein next season and at least finish comfortably mid table if not even higher.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It''s the predicted onset of our spiralling downwards ''Blackpool moment''.......I have already typed a drafted letter of complaint and disappointment, which is angrily addressed to NCFC, demanding a rebate of my ''renewed before the 1st deadline'' season ticket cost - for when we are playing Championship soccer next season.......

 

I only have to press ''send''.....and it will be winging its way to the club that''s let me and NCFC''s loyal support down.....

 

PS, I personally don''t think it''s a slump......but, it''s cetainly a blip.......that could possibly, turn into a slump.......''Ooh err''.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]Really interesting OP - those who are thoughtlessly rejecting RH''s arguments need to reconsider why you spend time on an internet message board. My thoughts: I am still really disappointed that we didn''t pick our strongest team against Leicester. We had a real shot at a Wembley appearance in a season where we are all but safe. Not to go for that was very disappointing. By not picking his strongest team (and you can argue round this any way you want, but he told Holt and Ruddy they didn''t even have to turn up to the ground), Lambert sent a message that he wasn''t really fussed whether we beat Leicester or not. And that ambivalence is always going to transmit to the players The other message it sent was that he felt we were still in a relegation battle. All the positivity of the Swansea win dissipated at a stroke. And for what? Keeping the players fresh for two games that were always going to be very hard to win anyway? I think Lambert made a mistake vs Leicester. For those who need it spelled out, that doesn''t mean I think he''s an idiot, or that he should resign. He''s our best manager of the last 25 years in my opinion. But I think he got it wrong vs Leicester, and the events of the last two weeks have not proved him right, Oh, and the reason we lost at Sunderland after the West Brom win is clearly Lambert''s unresolved Oedipal relationship with Martin O''Neill. We will never beat a MO''N team under Lambert until Lambert stops calling MO''N ''Gaffer''.[/quote]

Agreed, in fact the OP beat me to this sort of post.  This is not Lambert bashing he is clearly the best manager we have had for some time but that doesnt mean he doesnt make mistakes.  The logic of resting key players for the Man u game made no sense to me and clearly sent out the wrong message. Against Stoke we should of played to our strenghts rather than just trying to nulify them. We could and should still be in the cup with something to really look forward to but unfortunately we are not.  Hopefully we can turn it around against Wigan who like to play which means we can get back to us playing the Norwich way and no its not a must win game but as the original poster said I do believe we have lost some momentum since the Leicester game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote user="Making Plans"][quote user="RUDOLPH HUCKER"]There is a world of difference between intending to lose and intending to get a result![/quote]

Lambert picked a team he thought could win the game & the players tried to win the game - I call that intending to get a result.

I suppose every time we lose from now on you''ll try & make out it was all down to losing an FA Cup match.
So, what about the last 2 seasons then.
Sort of blows your theory out of the water, doesn''t it?
[/quote]

You could also put it in the( Selective Memory ) slot if you wanted, not to put to fina point on it but the Ref was crap, Oliver hates us and closes his eyes to any appeals we might make, (But we will over come and get the points on the board, don''t Panic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In the nicest way Wigan at home is the perfect game to have after our run of games.

 

We have had the odd game where we have struggled, but Stoke away is a game that many will think is vry tough to come away with any points. We played well against Man U but without the leadership to shake us up in the five minutes we allowed a winning goal. Yesterday we played an attack minded midfield and did show that we need combatative midfielders for some game likes this. Still think two big men were the key upfront to hold the ball up.

 

But as we have said we move on. Wigan felt hard done by yesterday. We know they will come to Carrow Road with a point to prove and a massive desire to get three points. We need to show desire for the second ball, yesterday we never showed any desire and we were always second best, hence you don''t create any luck.

 

We need to be up for the Wigan game, we know Moses gave Martin nightmares and we know many of their key players. We need to be up for this game and begin to pick up some points and just move forward again. Hence a perfect game, line up will be interesting as I am sure the formation and individuals from yesterday will be questioned. I do believe two wingers are key to attacking play, however it didn''t happen against Stoke we need to be ready to bring it next Saturday.

 

A slump? Well in some sorts, 3 straight losses is something that can build media attention and hence be in the minds of some. Therefore this is a key game and what better game to play than with a team in the bottom 3 who will be playing for the win, hopefully gaps will open.

 

For me a big game for Jackson can he create and start by a goal threat, will he even start? I think the result was as much to do with formation and tactics and Pulis showing other clubs how to rock our boat. The sooner next Saturday comes for our team now the better lets move on and be up for a vital game that could give us a massive three points and sink one team to the lower league.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whilst the OP used a bit of over-emotional language a,nd may be overstating the case a little, there is, however, more than a grain of truth in what he (and one or two others) say.

 

There has to be the concern that the season may begin to fizzle out and become something of a damp squib. Yesterday''s performance was poor by anyone''s standard. We barely contrived to fashion a single chance in the whole 90 minutes, and, excuses re throw ins aside, the defending for Etherington''s goal was shocking . We can and should do so much better.

 

So, yes, the Wigan match does have degree of pressure riding on it. Agreed, if we do lose, it does not mean we are embroiled in a relegation scrap, but 4 defeats on the bounce would be a slump, and with tough looking games against Newcastle and Wolves coming up, we could find ourselves in 15 or 16th place by the end of March.

 

As I say it''s not something to panic about, but I''m sure that PL is the sort of guy who will not take kindly to losing more than 3 consecutive games.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Ernie"]

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]Really interesting OP - those who are thoughtlessly rejecting RH''s arguments need to reconsider why you spend time on an internet message board. My thoughts: I am still really disappointed that we didn''t pick our strongest team against Leicester. We had a real shot at a Wembley appearance in a season where we are all but safe. Not to go for that was very disappointing. By not picking his strongest team (and you can argue round this any way you want, but he told Holt and Ruddy they didn''t even have to turn up to the ground), Lambert sent a message that he wasn''t really fussed whether we beat Leicester or not. And that ambivalence is always going to transmit to the players The other message it sent was that he felt we were still in a relegation battle. All the positivity of the Swansea win dissipated at a stroke. And for what? Keeping the players fresh for two games that were always going to be very hard to win anyway? I think Lambert made a mistake vs Leicester. For those who need it spelled out, that doesn''t mean I think he''s an idiot, or that he should resign. He''s our best manager of the last 25 years in my opinion. But I think he got it wrong vs Leicester, and the events of the last two weeks have not proved him right, Oh, and the reason we lost at Sunderland after the West Brom win is clearly Lambert''s unresolved Oedipal relationship with Martin O''Neill. We will never beat a MO''N team under Lambert until Lambert stops calling MO''N ''Gaffer''.[/quote]

Agreed, in fact the OP beat me to this sort of post.  This is not Lambert bashing he is clearly the best manager we have had for some time but that doesnt mean he doesnt make mistakes.  The logic of resting key players for the Man u game made no sense to me and clearly sent out the wrong message. Against Stoke we should of played to our strenghts rather than just trying to nulify them. We could and should still be in the cup with something to really look forward to but unfortunately we are not.  Hopefully we can turn it around against Wigan who like to play which means we can get back to us playing the Norwich way and no its not a must win game but as the original poster said I do believe we have lost some momentum since the Leicester game.

[/quote]

It`s very reassuring to know that we have an expert panel at hand to advise Lambert on where he has been going wrong. The we "know it all after the event" posters who clearly know what our best team is and the best formation to beat any given team. These are the same guys that would have jumped on the band wagon after the team selection for say QPR away or WBA away, had we lost of course, been biding your time eh lads, enjoy your moment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whilst I was firmly in the "let''s have a real go in the FA Cup" camp I think we are letting what happened cloud our judgement about the following two league games. Single goal defeats at home to Utd and away to Stoke aren''t unexpected. Just disappointing like any defeat would be. We could have drawn either or both. The players were up for both games. The next game will be a big test not just for for Lambert and his team but also for some of our fans. It''s a game we are expected to win but it''s a game that will be difficult. Wigan will be targetting mid-table teams to get the points they need to survive.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Struggling to understand why we''ve all become a bit over-sensitive to a largely factual op with a bit of plain english.

Personally I do not think that RH has overstated the case.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
why are we still harping on about the cup game? Forget it and let it go!! Lets just rejoice in the fact we are going to be in this division next season, and before people say thats a doomy approach its not, its realistic!!! Too many people on here think overnight we should be challenging for honours, who is to say that we won''t be in the near future but one step at a time people!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lambert picked the wrong team vs Leicester, boo hoo! How dare he! Maybe we should go back to the Roeder era where he picked the wrong team every bloody week! For the record I don''t even think it was a bad team Lambert picked v Leicester, its just that some player didn''t pull their weight!

We outplayed ManU for the most part and were unlucky to lose and Stoke won by a dodgy goal! We should have got 2 draws and this thread wouldn''t even exist!

Hardly a slump! Some people just enjoy moaning for the hell of it!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Phyxius"]Stoke closed us down often forcing us to play long to a single striker who found it hard against two physical centrebacks. We rarely used the width of our first half formation to get behind the Stoke defense and on the rare occasions we did (Bennett''s run down the right first half) we had broken too quickly for anyone to be in a dangerous position. After Fox came on we passed well but rarely into a threatening position. Playing Stoke was always going to be a tough physical game and 0-0 was probably a fair result. Ward should not have been beaten so easily for the goal.[/quote]............he wasn''t so much beaten as pulled out of the tackle. terrible effort, looked as if he was afraid of getting injured. gifted them a goal which was very well taken by stokes stand out creative player.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
"Hardly a slump! Some people just enjoy moaning for the hell of it!"   Too right Josh, nag nag nag nag, moan moan moan moan, grumble grumble grumble grumble, old git old git old git![:P]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Firstly, the Club already has my £790 for next season, so I feel entitled to make whatever observations I like.

 

Taken in isolation the two EPL results look acceptible although we benefitted from Man U not knowing whether to stick or twist at 1 - 0 up and being unable to keep a clean sheet away from home we nullified ourselves trying to nullify Stoke.

 

But that Cup game makes it three games and it was managed poorly on all sorts of levels and not only do we as NCFC fans ever get a sniff of Wembley how does a player like Holt feel at 31 years of age seeing perhaps his best last chance slip away as he sits in the stands?

 

That game gave out all the wrong messages.  I think PL was trying to motivate players to go for the league by saying we are not safe, but the psychology failed for once.

 

Fortunately a win against Wigan would set things right but lets not turn up at that one expecting to win and showing too much respect and crowd discontent when it doesn''t seem to be going to plan - that''s what we did against Leicester and Wigan are an established EPL side who know how to beat the drop.

 

I have to say I find Swansea a real enigma. Are they one trick ponies who lack the versatility which has stood Norwich in such good stead or should we take note of how they tinker less and play to their strengths?  Perhaps because we tinker and change I titled this thread ''of our own making'' rather than ''we couldn''t avoid?''

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would add that I don''t want Wigan to be the fourth team in a row to feel they need the result more than we do; this is the nub of the problem for me. At 800k a place and with a tougher second season to come we need every point and place we can get.

 

Wigan are a win away from exiting the bottom three; a huge incentive for them, how incentivised will we be to beat them? I would say that a bit of self-criticism, an acceptance of dropped standards and a sense of pride would be a good starting place and beyond that status and prize money which buys players.

 

A few of you apologists need to reflect and maintain your expectations. It''s not beach weather yet!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Smokebomb"][quote user="Ernie"]

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]Really interesting OP - those who are thoughtlessly rejecting RH''s arguments need to reconsider why you spend time on an internet message board. My thoughts: I am still really disappointed that we didn''t pick our strongest team against Leicester. We had a real shot at a Wembley appearance in a season where we are all but safe. Not to go for that was very disappointing. By not picking his strongest team (and you can argue round this any way you want, but he told Holt and Ruddy they didn''t even have to turn up to the ground), Lambert sent a message that he wasn''t really fussed whether we beat Leicester or not. And that ambivalence is always going to transmit to the players The other message it sent was that he felt we were still in a relegation battle. All the positivity of the Swansea win dissipated at a stroke. And for what? Keeping the players fresh for two games that were always going to be very hard to win anyway? I think Lambert made a mistake vs Leicester. For those who need it spelled out, that doesn''t mean I think he''s an idiot, or that he should resign. He''s our best manager of the last 25 years in my opinion. But I think he got it wrong vs Leicester, and the events of the last two weeks have not proved him right, Oh, and the reason we lost at Sunderland after the West Brom win is clearly Lambert''s unresolved Oedipal relationship with Martin O''Neill. We will never beat a MO''N team under Lambert until Lambert stops calling MO''N ''Gaffer''.[/quote]

Agreed, in fact the OP beat me to this sort of post.  This is not Lambert bashing he is clearly the best manager we have had for some time but that doesnt mean he doesnt make mistakes.  The logic of resting key players for the Man u game made no sense to me and clearly sent out the wrong message. Against Stoke we should of played to our strenghts rather than just trying to nulify them. We could and should still be in the cup with something to really look forward to but unfortunately we are not.  Hopefully we can turn it around against Wigan who like to play which means we can get back to us playing the Norwich way and no its not a must win game but as the original poster said I do believe we have lost some momentum since the Leicester game.

[/quote]














It`s very reassuring to know that we have an expert panel at hand to advise Lambert on where he has been going wrong. The we "know it all after the event" posters who clearly know what our best team is and the best formation to beat any given team. These are the same guys that would have jumped on the band wagon after the team selection for say QPR away or WBA away, had we lost of course, been biding your time eh lads, enjoy your moment.
[/quote]

I think your post is very unfair. Lambert has got far more right than wrong and yes hindsight is a wonderful thing, but you will find that any fan that has played or watched footbal will have an opinion.  I didnt what us to try and play Stoke at there own game, of course I wanted us to win, but playing our way and if we had then lost so be it. As with the Leicester Lambert sent out the completely wrong message by his team selection resting players in my opinion needlessly and again if we sent out our strongest team and really went for it with conviction but still lost then at least than I would have no compliants.  You will notice that I have not moaned about our defeat against Man U, not because it was Man U but we played well, to our strenghts but in the end lost to the better side (taking the yellow and green classes off after we scored they had at least 2/3 clear cut chances).  I stand by all that I have said, no knee jerk reaction as the Leicester game still bugs me. Rant over.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="Ernie"][quote user="Smokebomb"][quote user="Ernie"]

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]Really interesting OP - those who are thoughtlessly rejecting RH''s arguments need to reconsider why you spend time on an internet message board. My thoughts: I am still really disappointed that we didn''t pick our strongest team against Leicester. We had a real shot at a Wembley appearance in a season where we are all but safe. Not to go for that was very disappointing. By not picking his strongest team (and you can argue round this any way you want, but he told Holt and Ruddy they didn''t even have to turn up to the ground), Lambert sent a message that he wasn''t really fussed whether we beat Leicester or not. And that ambivalence is always going to transmit to the players The other message it sent was that he felt we were still in a relegation battle. All the positivity of the Swansea win dissipated at a stroke. And for what? Keeping the players fresh for two games that were always going to be very hard to win anyway? I think Lambert made a mistake vs Leicester. For those who need it spelled out, that doesn''t mean I think he''s an idiot, or that he should resign. He''s our best manager of the last 25 years in my opinion. But I think he got it wrong vs Leicester, and the events of the last two weeks have not proved him right, Oh, and the reason we lost at Sunderland after the West Brom win is clearly Lambert''s unresolved Oedipal relationship with Martin O''Neill. We will never beat a MO''N team under Lambert until Lambert stops calling MO''N ''Gaffer''.[/quote]

Agreed, in fact the OP beat me to this sort of post.  This is not Lambert bashing he is clearly the best manager we have had for some time but that doesnt mean he doesnt make mistakes.  The logic of resting key players for the Man u game made no sense to me and clearly sent out the wrong message. Against Stoke we should of played to our strenghts rather than just trying to nulify them. We could and should still be in the cup with something to really look forward to but unfortunately we are not.  Hopefully we can turn it around against Wigan who like to play which means we can get back to us playing the Norwich way and no its not a must win game but as the original poster said I do believe we have lost some momentum since the Leicester game.

[/quote]














It`s very reassuring to know that we have an expert panel at hand to advise Lambert on where he has been going wrong. The we "know it all after the event" posters who clearly know what our best team is and the best formation to beat any given team. These are the same guys that would have jumped on the band wagon after the team selection for say QPR away or WBA away, had we lost of course, been biding your time eh lads, enjoy your moment.
[/quote]

I think your post is very unfair. Lambert has got far more right than wrong and yes hindsight is a wonderful thing, but you will find that any fan that has played or watched footbal will have an opinion.  I didnt what us to try and play Stoke at there own game, of course I wanted us to win, but playing our way and if we had then lost so be it. As with the Leicester Lambert sent out the completely wrong message by his team selection resting players in my opinion needlessly and again if we sent out our strongest team and really went for it with conviction but still lost then at least than I would have no compliants.  You will notice that I have not moaned about our defeat against Man U, not because it was Man U but we played well, to our strenghts but in the end lost to the better side (taking the yellow and green classes off after we scored they had at least 2/3 clear cut chances).  I stand by all that I have said, no knee jerk reaction as the Leicester game still bugs me. Rant over.

[/quote]

Once again I''ll agree wholeheartedly with Rudie''s viewpoint, Lim was right on the mark, and Ernie also seems to have given it a nice balance.  Even Shyster elsewhere has obviously thuoght deeply about it and has not given a reactioanry view.  The Leicester match really has gotten under my skin - the messages sent out were all wrong. 

 

But, and it is a big but, Lambert has always said he is still learning and is not worthy of Messiah status (yet!).  He will look back at this run of three games (I''m assuming, perhaps rather recklessly, that we will bounce back and beat Wigan next week) and will not make the same mistake next year.   

 

Next week we should start with Fox and I hope to see Howson in as well (at the expense of Johnson).   But we certainly must not take the game lightly.  Whelan is quoted today as saying he is having a meeting with Martinez on Monday - surely a precursor to another managerial casualty depsite Whelan saying Martinez is safe.  Can see that Wigan will really go for it next week so would expect us must not to take it too likely.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]Thanks Ernie, your post saved me typing a reply.[/quote]

My pleasure

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Although I hardly think you could call this a ''slump'', It does make me wonder if it''s revealing Lambert''s Achilles Heel.

We always worry whenever a half-decent managerial post comes up, terrified that one of the Big Boys might come in for him, & he''d be off like a shot. I think the opposite is true; he''s often stated that fear of failure is what motivates him, & he''s incredibly lucky to be where he is.The latest round of managerial sackings will not have served to persuade him otherwise. A manager''s position (apart from a very few, e.g. Fergie) is tenuous in the extreme.

Just watch this MB if we lose the next 2 or 3 games.

He is very conscious that he & his team are new to the Premiership. He knows teams like Stoke are survivors, & that they will fight for their lives as the season draws to a close. I think that inhibits him, & he starts worrying about what the opposition might do to us, instead of vice-versa. The game that really stood out for me was the Sunderland one. He seemed totally subdued, as if in awe of O''Neil.

So, I think his genuine humility is a two-edged sword. It makes him work furiously to devise ways of overcoming the opposition, but can translate to negative tactics, nervousness & inhibition on the pitch, altogether too much respect for the adversary. It also means cup runs & the like are seen as a complete luxury.

I think he''s much more concerned about survival than any of us. Let''s hope it doesn''t paralyse him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote user="RUDOLPH HUCKER"]

I would add that I don''t want Wigan to be the fourth team in a row to feel they need the result more than we do; this is the nub of the problem for me. At 800k a place and with a tougher second season to come we need every point and place we can get.

 

Wigan are a win away from exiting the bottom three; a huge incentive for them, how incentivised will we be to beat them? I would say that a bit of self-criticism, an acceptance of dropped standards and a sense of pride would be a good starting place and beyond that status and prize money which buys players.

 

A few of you apologists need to reflect and maintain your expectations. It''s not beach weather yet!

[/quote]I can understand your frustration RH but we''re certainly not in a slump. Three narrow defeats : one against the League''s awkward squad, one against the current champions and another not so easily explained against underdogs in the Cup. Out of those Man Utd certainly needed the win as do next week''s opponents Wigan. We probably will beat the Lactics but will hardly be doomed if we don''t.At £800,000 a place it would be nice to finish as high up the table as we can but a Premier League place next term guarantees at least £42 million so we''ll hardly be skint.Regarding apologists reflecting and maintaining expectations surely expectations were, at best, that we''d survive ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote user="ron obvious"]. I think he''s much more concerned about survival than any of us. Let''s hope it doesn''t paralyse him.[/quote]

 

That''s an interesting take on this Ron. I must confess I''d not really looked at it as a possibility, but it''s certainly there. I suppose , as a club and fans , we are entering a period that''s not been experienced for the past few years, ie one of , apart from  the small matter of the cash for league position situation, there may not be much left to play for . The last 2 years we''ve had a promotion push, and the year before we were fighting relegation . But this is what I mean about the danger of the season fizzling out, and why, in hindsight, perhaps a better fist of keeping it going via a Cup run would have been a good idea. As you say, Stoke have become past masters of this aspect . For them,a relegation scrap is unlikely, as is qualifying for Europe via the league, so, if all goes according to plan, PL too is going to have to explore new motivational tools, to avoid the sort of paralysis you allude to above.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whilst the team selection and result against Leicester was dissapointing, for me it was nothing more than that. There is tendency to over analyse these things, to give you an example of what I mean by that, I took up running less than a year ago as a way of keeping fit, I can go for a run, feel great and really enjoy it, a week later i could go for the same run, having prepared in exactly the same way and "it just does not happen", I find myself struggling to run the distance I have run many times before and I come back from my run not really enjoying it, to me it is totally inexplicable.

Whilst we have been hovering around 8th, 9th, 10th place for most of the season I have always felt that over the course of the full season we would finish lower than that, the main reason being that by the last third of the season everybody would have played us and therefore we are less of an "unknown quantity"

I personally believe that we would have got no more than 1 point from the games against Man Utd, even if we had beaten Leicester in the cup, so for me I am not that concerned.

I will start to be concerned if we do not get anything out of the games at home to Wigan and Wolves, again I would not be upset if we got a draw in both of those games, that said there is every possibilty 35 points will be enough to keep us up.

I can understand the point being made by Rude Old, but as far as I am concerned all managers make mistakes, regardless of their stature/experince, for example SAF made the mistake of underestimating us for the game at CR the last time we were in the Prem, he did not make the same mistake in our recent encounter....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...