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Game Changers

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Or lack of..... Looking at the squad of players we have it is clear to me that we do not have any sort of quality to bring on from the bench when the inevitable situation arises, where we are losing and need someone to bring on to change the match.

Particularly in the midfield area, where the likes of Lappin, Smith and Johnson will do not much more than provide cover for injury, or to maintain a lead. Pilkington offers one option, but one is clearly not enough.

Lansbury and for a few games Pacheco, provided this last season and in my opinion must be signed prior to the end of THIS window to avoid the Dean Ashton type of situation we were faced with last time round when it was too little too late.

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Pilkington, Bennett, Vaughan, Jackson and Hoolahan are all game changers. Not all of them will start.

I agree though, i''d personally go and pick Lansbury up to get him here.

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Vaughan will be injured most of the season i expect, and if you expect Jackson to make an impact in the premier league you need to think again.

Hoolahan is clearly a game changer, but he will start when available and there has to be options when he is not at his best or the game doesn''t suit him.

There is clearly not enough quality attacking midfield players in our squad to have a range of options for PL when needed. Both must be signed.

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I have to completely disagree with the OP on this one,  in Hoolahan, Pilkington, Bennet and Surman we have the players that are creative and skillfull enough to come on a change a game... and in all honesty I dont think Lansbury is miles ahead of those players in a game changing sense. Furthermore in the difference between Morrison, Vaughan, Wilbraham, Jackson and Holt we have enough to be able to adjust and change our front line and its style of play within a match.Lets give the new boys a chance to become games changers before we write them off of not being up to the job!personally I think the one to watch is Pilkington!

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[quote user="row"] if you expect Jackson to make an impact in the premier league you need to think again.  [/quote]

Why don''t you wait and see what happens before you write-off players?

 

Since Paul Lambert has been here we''ve seen a few players written-off who have since gone on to prove themselves more than capable.

 

Infact, Jackson was written-off by many just a few months into his time with the club but came good when it mattered to shut up his critics.

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OK, i''ll put it a different way, Hoolahan, Bennet and Surman start at Wigan, and we are 1-0 down with 30minutes left. Chances aren''t being created so Pilkington comes on for Surman, 10 minutes later and nothing has changed, what other options are there in midfield to make a creative impact. The answer is nobody.

Your argument for Wilbraham is bonkers, I wouldn''t want him up front back in league 1, and as stated Jackson will have minimal impact as premier league defenders are much faster and stronger than before. The Parma chances he missed prove he can''t be relied on.

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Bit harsh on Vaughan, i think he''ll be fine this season.

Jackson i suppose we''ll wait and see, i had my doubts until his terrific end to last season. See if he can bulk up without losing his pace and instinct.

Wilbrahimovic has to convince me, underrated in my book, but still not really what we need, only reason he''s here over cody is money, we can get half a mill for Cody and none for Wilbraham.

You''re right in that we could do with a bit more, although we have plenty of option with C Martin, K Smith, Crofts, Lappin, B Johnson etc... Usually a bench consists of a ''keeper, a full back, a CB, a defensive minded centre mid, an attack minded centre mid, a winger and a striker. We can cover all them.

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All of the names above mentioned bar Crofts and B Johnson, do not possess the quality needed to compete in the premier league. With the exceptions being defensive players, which brings me back around to the point of quality in-depth for attacking midfielders, with further emphasises the need for Lansbury and Pacheco to be signed up.

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Unless you are a premier league manager (and preferably Paul Lambert, as he is the one in charge of the NCFC players), could you please shut up?

Why do you think you can decided which players are good enough, and act as if its a fact. You can say, i don''t think they will be up to much. But to go out and just say those players are not good enough, without them even playing a premiership game yet is very silly in my opinion.

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You have not understood the point being made, clearly. The players we have that could be considered to be attacking or creative midfielders are as follows: Pilkington, Bennet, Hoolahan and Surman. 3 out of 4 would be likely to be playing at any one time, therefore if one sustains injury, we then have not one substitute available who would be capable of replacing such a player from the bench, whilst still giving the same quality. I am not saying Lappin or Smith could not fill in as cover, but they are not players who could come on in the premier league and make considerable impact on the game, when inevitably it will be needed.

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[quote user="row"]OK, i''ll put it a different way, Hoolahan, Bennet and Surman start at Wigan, and we are 1-0 down with 30minutes left. Chances aren''t being created so Pilkington comes on for Surman, 10 minutes later and nothing has changed, what other options are there in midfield to make a creative impact. The answer is nobody.

Your argument for Wilbraham is bonkers, I wouldn''t want him up front back in league 1, and as stated Jackson will have minimal impact as premier league defenders are much faster and stronger than before. The Parma chances he missed prove he can''t be relied on.[/quote]You could say that about any team in the premire league and any position in our squad... what if Barrnet and De laet have a mare and bringing on Whitbread does nothing? What if Ruddy has a shocker and then we bring on Rudd who then does even worse? This is all complete guess work and not backed up by an actual performances. This is how football works, there are always questions for every team in the league and you can never give an answer.. you cant garantee that Torres, Fabragas, Giggs or even flipping Messi is going to be a game changer, players have good days and bad days.Quiet frankly you strike me as one of those cynical moaners you get, never happy any oppitunity to jump down a players throat? Writing off jackson because he missed in a pre-season game and deciding to ignore the goals he got for us that sent us up at the end of the last season goes to show how deluded you are and frankly its abit embarrasing.Slating Wilbraham and saying hes not good enough for league 1... perhaps we should hire you instead Lambert as you have so easily picked apart his promotion winning squad. The fact that Wilbraham IS a game changer in his hold up play and the relief he can provide for the defence show a fundemental lack of understanding of how players can change games. Wilbraham in fact was involved in several goals after coming off the bench last season.Personally  I think if we have for instance Fox, Bennet, Surman and hoolahan starting and they are failing bringing on  Pilkington, Crofts, Smith or even lappin can potentially change a games as a result of their individual atributes. No doubt your now going to come back at me saying they arnt good enough without actually telling me what it is they will do wrong.. enlighten me? Or better yet tell me who would be more of a game change for a similar price... and no Lansbury and Pacheco are not of the same price bracket and arnt for sale at the moment so put them out of your mind.

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You are clearly passionate Row and also worried about the season ahead just like everyone else, but please please please just give the lads a chance an d i mean all of them that include willbraham because they can all do a job when you look at the footballing tactics more deeply. If we are in this situation in january and what you say has turned out to be correct then we can discuss it all then but just give the lads a chance, after all, they ALL deserve a fair crack don''t they?

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Defenders are very unlikely to change the game in the attacking sense that I am talking about. If Barrnet was having a poor game, I would likely mean we would be a goal down; Even if Whitbread were to come on and play out of his skin, the outcome is likely to still remain negative, as he is unlikely to change the result in an attacking sense. It is quality attacking players, like Lansbury and Pacheco that change games and we do not have enough players like them in our squad at the moment.

Wilbraham will not make any sort of an impact in the premier league and quite frankly you''re deluded if you believe he will.

Neither Lansbury nor Pacheco are likely to feature in their managers plans so it would be reasonable to say they would be available to purchase. We need to put more money into enhancing the quality of the squad, rather than quantity at this moment in time.

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[quote user="birchfest"][quote user="row"]OK, i''ll put it a different way, Hoolahan, Bennet and Surman start at Wigan, and we are 1-0 down with 30minutes left. Chances aren''t being created so Pilkington comes on for Surman, 10 minutes later and nothing has changed, what other options are there in midfield to make a creative impact. The answer is nobody.

Your argument for Wilbraham is bonkers, I wouldn''t want him up front back in league 1, and as stated Jackson will have minimal impact as premier league defenders are much faster and stronger than before. The Parma chances he missed prove he can''t be relied on.[/quote]You could say that about any team in the premire league and any position in our squad... what if Barrnet and De laet have a mare and bringing on Whitbread does nothing? What if Ruddy has a shocker and then we bring on Rudd who then does even worse? This is all complete guess work and not backed up by an actual performances. This is how football works, there are always questions for every team in the league and you can never give an answer.. you cant garantee that Torres, Fabragas, Giggs or even flipping Messi is going to be a game changer, players have good days and bad days.Quiet frankly you strike me as one of those cynical moaners you get, never happy any oppitunity to jump down a players throat? Writing off jackson because he missed in a pre-season game and deciding to ignore the goals he got for us that sent us up at the end of the last season goes to show how deluded you are and frankly its abit embarrasing.Slating Wilbraham and saying hes not good enough for league 1... perhaps we should hire you instead Lambert as you have so easily picked apart his promotion winning squad. The fact that Wilbraham IS a game changer in his hold up play and the relief he can provide for the defence show a fundemental lack of understanding of how players can change games. Wilbraham in fact was involved in several goals after coming off the bench last season.Personally  I think if we have for instance Fox, Bennet, Surman and hoolahan starting and they are failing bringing on  Pilkington, Crofts, Smith or even lappin can potentially change a games as a result of their individual atributes. No doubt your now going to come back at me saying they arnt good enough without actually telling me what it is they will do wrong.. enlighten me? Or better yet tell me who would be more of a game change for a similar price... and no Lansbury and Pacheco are not of the same price bracket and arnt for sale at the moment so put them out of your mind.[/quote]

Good post.

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As mentioned by myself in the Cody thread....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_div_1/9415413.stm

Please take some time to listen to the Paul Lambert interview regarding Aaron Willbraham.

1:17 - 1:55 of the interview shows your football knowledge is somewhat limited. It comes straight from the horses mouth.

So just cos he doesnt bang in 30 goals a season doesnt make him sh*t.

Centre forward play is not all about goals as others have touched on in this thread.

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Let''s just see how they do. Put your trust in Lambert and stop slagging them off before they have kicked a ball.

I think they will be OK but who knows. They are all desperate to play their part and do their best, so give them a chance.

If Fox, Surman, Hoolahan and Crofts play, we have Johnson, Pilkington, Bennett, C Martin or Smith to bring on if we need to change things round. Naughton could even play left wing, so it seems we have enough options in midfield, but if we''re struggling in January I''m sure PL will bring someone in to make a difference.

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We need goals to keep us up in the premier league and Wilbraham will not score more than 1 or 2 even if he started every game, he can''t hit a barn door, even in training.

Lansbury and Pacheco need to be signed without a doubt.

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row, i can''t help but imagine you as somebody who sits front row behind the goal in the river end and moans everytime the ball is passed around the back 5. You just seem so critical and seem to have no faith in our team. Oh and here is a link to a video which involves a very good strike in a pre-season game in Germany by your main man Wilbrahimovic, yes him, who couldn''t hit a barn door, even in training....

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=10150748040740621&oid=133065016766815&comments

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against no more than a ''pub team'' in the words of infamous Barry on canary call. Actually I have a home and away season ticket thank you very much.

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Naughton has played not only RB but also right midfield for previous teams.

 

Based on accounts from Leicester fans (by far their best loan player last season), and on the evidence of the Zaragoza & Parma games, he is an extremely good player.

 

He is far more likely to play RM than Korey, whom you quote as one of the "limited" substitutes available.

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[quote user="row"]against no more than a ''pub team'' in the words of infamous Barry on canary call. Actually I have a home and away season ticket thank you very much.[/quote]

God f*cking help us then! Jesus what a fool.

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I was sat yesterday thinking of starting a thread stating how good our creative options are going to be this season!! lol

I am absolutely buzzing for next season. We have more creative midfielders this season than any other that I can think of, certainly for a long long time anyway,

With so many I feel there will be real healthy competition and that can only benifit us.

I can''t wait to see the assists and goals table for our players at the end of the season

OTBC!!!!

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[quote user="Butterbean_Canary"]

I was sat yesterday thinking of starting a thread stating how good our creative options are going to be this season!! lol

I am absolutely buzzing for next season. We have more creative midfielders this season than any other that I can think of, certainly for a long long time anyway,

With so many I feel there will be real healthy competition and that can only benifit us.

I can''t wait to see the assists and goals table for our players at the end of the season

OTBC!!!!

[/quote]See thats my opinion too and what we were lacking last season; strength on the bench especially in going forward. This guys appears to be clueless.... having a season ticket doesnt make you a good judge, and frankly the level of naivety is amazing. Once again Wilbraham ISNT meant to be brought on as prolific striker but instead to create an outlet for the defence, batter the opposition and win headers for people like Jackson and Vaughan to play off and get the goals. It amazes me that you appear to go to every match and yet appear to know nothing about football.First game tomorrow, maybe time to just put these opinions behind us and get behind the team!

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[quote user="row"]You have not understood the point being made, clearly. The players we have that could be considered to be attacking or creative midfielders are as follows: Pilkington, Bennet, Hoolahan and Surman. 3 out of 4 would be likely to be playing at any one time, therefore if one sustains injury, we then have not one substitute available who would be capable of replacing such a player from the bench, whilst still giving the same quality. I am not saying Lappin or Smith could not fill in as cover, but they are not players who could come on in the premier league and make considerable impact on the game, when inevitably it will be needed.[/quote]

''Game changers'' don''t necessarily have to be creative anyway. Changing a forward partnership from Holt/Jackson to Holt/Morison for example could cause a defence huge problems with a few minutes left in the game.

I think you may be on your own with this one thank god. We don''t need moaning ''fans'' who are never satisfied.  We need fans who will back the team.

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