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Muddy funster

Another Rugby post but still not OT!

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I got tickets to watch the England v Wales match last night and I went in an England shirt and a Norwich scarf down to Cardiff for the evening. Wonderful match, atmosphere and result. Great banter and fantastic night all round. My point has, I''m sure, been made many times before.

Why can Rugby supporters be non-segregated and walk out with arms around each other, sharing banter about their teams, have a drink together and there be no trouble, but not football fans. I don''t mean for local derbys and the like, but more for Reading v Forest or something. It''s such a shame. It''s a cliche but sport was the winner last night. Met some great people and myself and Mrs Muddy had a brilliant night.

I don''t suspect things will be the same down in Swansea on Sunday, but then again, I wouldn''t go there on Sunday if you paid me!

I did get a few comments about my Norwich scarf, but they all said we were one of the best teams they''ve played this season and they hope we go up.

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Likewise I''m up in North Wales and was in a packed pub last night, there was a small English group in the corner of which I was part of. The banter was flying and plenty of stick was being given out both ways. Everything was taken in good humour and a great time was had until long after the match with the beer freely flowing. It never once looked like turning nasty, I don''t think we''ll have the same freedom going there for the football in March

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[quote user="haisbrohacker"]Football is tribal with its roots in the working classes, rugby is a game from the middle classes and elite.

Discuss![/quote]

Rugby Union has it`s roots in the middle classes is in England but not in Wales, in Wales it is rooted in the working class.

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At the older, more traditional grounds, fans still swap ends at half time, to stand behind the end their team is attacking!

This obviously means 3-5000 people crossing eachothers path around the ground.

Never saw any trouble - apart from against the Hull teams, but they are horrible people from a horrible city!

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The majority of football fans would behave as you say the rugby fans did. It is just the fringe elements that give football the trouble it has.

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[quote user="NorfolkChance"]Football is a simple game, followed by simple people.Rugby Union is a complex game, followed by wan*ers.[/quote]Really?.. Love to see you say that to the faces of everyone on here who is a rugby fan.As an earlier person pointed out, the vast majority of football fans could happily act in this way. There is just a small minority who could not handle it (The type who regularly gesture to away fans from the safety of a seperate stand)

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[quote user="Trent Canary"][quote user="NorfolkChance"]Football is a simple game, followed by simple people.Rugby Union is a complex game, followed by wan*ers.[/quote]Really?.. Love to see you say that to the faces of everyone on here who is a rugby fan.As an earlier person pointed out, the vast majority of football fans could happily act in this way. There is just a small minority who could not handle it (The type who regularly gesture to away fans from the safety of a seperate stand)[/quote]Yet, football fans are OK with being called simple??! Bit precious aren''t you? I will, and have told that little bit to anyone who wants to listen.I''m actually a rugby fan more than a football fan (so, I''m a simple wanker if you like). However if you go to a rugby game (and I''ve been to games in the UK, and Aus), half the people are there not to follow the game, but more to be seen with their middle-class friends. The whistle will go, and people will turn around and ask "what was that for?"Both games and crowds have their pro''s & con''s. They''re different, and always will be. Non-segregation at football would never work, and I believe generally, the atmosphere at football games are all the better for it.

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People turn around and ask "what was that for" because it is sometimes unclear sitting 50 metres away from the action and 200 stone of man in a big heap on the floor.

This is why you can now buy ref radios at all the international matches for £5. You have no doubt what the infringement was then.

People still ask what was that for in football matches, however usually due to incredulity as to why the decision was given.

I saw an immense amount of passion and love for the game on Friday night, not anyone going "to sit with their middle class mates". I''m sure some of that goes on, but rugby is very much indoctrinated into the working class here in Wales, as someone else put it so well. I realise it''s not the same in England, but there were a lot of West Country accents from decidedly "salt of the earth" people, and I only saw one or two "rugger w@nkers". They usually annoy me as an Englishman as much as they annoy the other home nations.

I also saw an England fan in a wheelchair with a red mohican (who hit on Mrs Muddy, the cheeky little rapscallion!) get a hug and a handshake from a random Welsh fan walking past him at the end. "Well done But! Good game, you deserved it." That was a real moment of warmth and I am sure it was a common theme that night. The Welsh fan was obviously gutted, but still had time to do that.

I think 95% of Football fans would love it to be like that. I think its a real shame that (I love all sports but) the sport I love the most can''t be like that.

Rant over.

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