Smith & Jone's strangle hold is slipping!

[First Wizard 0]

[quote user="Shack Attack"][quote user="First Wizard"]

Likewise with this John from Brighton malarky, I have no opinion on this as it doesn''t merit a responce from me, as I can see where Blah (a canny poster btw) wants to take it.

[/quote]

 

Which roughly translated means ''I couldn''t give a stuff about the overall quality of threads on this forum as long as people are still mug enough to reply to my blatant trolling.''*. Although the two threads you started yesterday are only at two pages each so far Wiz. Back in your prime they would have been at least five or six pages long by now. Your powers are weak old man [;)]

 

* Having said that I haven''t got a problem with Wiz''s threads. It''s just a shame that posters are reluctant to voice their opinions on more thoughful threads and instead gravitate towards the longer threads and the constant bickering and insults therein. If we cut down on the abuse (and I can be as guilty as anyone) then maybe posters would have the confidence to share their thoughts on a wider range of topics and these threads could flourish. As things stand at the moment the best way to get noticed on here is to wade into a twelve page thread started by Wiz, Bly etc. and start calling everyone a c*nt. That is not a healthy way for a forum to operate as the more thoughtful and reasoned commenters get pushed to one side in favour of the louder and more ''controversial'' posters. This is evidenced by the decreasing frequency of posts by a number of interesting and well informed commenters from a few years back.

[/quote]

 

Or maybe, just maybe Shack, the standard of posters are rubbish these days!

 

A few are just serial wiz haters and some are still stuck in puberty, many are in their teens still or ''Wrath'' exciles with chav habbits.

[First Wizard 0]

[quote user="norfolkchance1"]Why do I feel this thread is like this one from a few weeks ago but just recycled with slightly different words. http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun/cs/forums/2394664/ShowPost.aspx Stirring for a few pages then watch as the thread disappears off the page( after a point that can''t be argued against) then bring back the same topic in a new thread or two a few weeks later and try to catch new people with the same old patter.[/quote]

 

Slightly different words?.............you''re having a laugh fella.

[. 0]

The marginalisation of Smith and Jones MATTERS to some of us.Not so long ago the star struck Deliarite luvvies threw stones at anyone who dare criticise their saviour. What happens? We slump to our lowest level for 50 years and become a national laughing stock.Then (to preserve her celebrity persona and protect her investment).... Smith is forced to step back and bring in people who know what they are doing, who in turn bring in a proper manager rather the one of her laughable puppets. What happens? We gradually begin to get our club back.It may not bother many of you... but for some of us the ultimate removal of Smith will equal the return of NCFC to it''s roots. Smith at NCFC equals decline and the minute Paul Lambert moves on her luck will run out.... and then watch the club die a death.Wiz is exactly right to express this view....quite simply because his opinion is spot on. Sad that the luvvies have been mugged (yet again) into thinking that what we have now is anything to do with her.... it is entirely in spite of her.Just pray PL stays long enough to dig us out of the hole his employer dug over 13 disastrous years. If he doesn''t we''re done for.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Paul Cluckbert "]The marginalisation of Smith and Jones MATTERS to some of us.Not so long ago the star struck Deliarite luvvies threw stones at anyone who dare criticise their saviour. What happens? We slump to our lowest level for 50 years and become a national laughing stock.Then (to preserve her celebrity persona and protect her investment).... Smith is forced to step back and bring in people who know what they are doing, who in turn bring in a proper manager rather the one of her laughable puppets. What happens? We gradually begin to get our club back.It may not bother many of you... but for some of us the ultimate removal of Smith will equal the return of NCFC to it''s roots. Smith at NCFC equals decline and the minute Paul Lambert moves on her luck will run out.... and then watch the club die a death.Wiz is exactly right to express this view....quite simply because his opinion is spot on. Sad that the luvvies have been mugged (yet again) into thinking that what we have now is anything to do with her.... it is entirely in spite of her.Just pray PL stays long enough to dig us out of the hole his employer dug over 13 disastrous years. If he doesn''t we''re done for.[/quote]You forgot to add "As long as she leaves without wanting all the money back she has invested"[;)]

[O.T.B.C 1]

But Cluck, wasn''t Foulger part of the problem too? He has been on the board the same amount of time.

[. 0]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="Paul Cluckbert "]The marginalisation of Smith and Jones MATTERS to some of us.Not so long ago the star struck Deliarite luvvies threw stones at anyone who dare criticise their saviour. What happens? We slump to our lowest level for 50 years and become a national laughing stock.Then (to preserve her celebrity persona and protect her investment).... Smith is forced to step back and bring in people who know what they are doing, who in turn bring in a proper manager rather the one of her laughable puppets. What happens? We gradually begin to get our club back.It may not bother many of you... but for some of us the ultimate removal of Smith will equal the return of NCFC to it''s roots. Smith at NCFC equals decline and the minute Paul Lambert moves on her luck will run out.... and then watch the club die a death.Wiz is exactly right to express this view....quite simply because his opinion is spot on. Sad that the luvvies have been mugged (yet again) into thinking that what we have now is anything to do with her.... it is entirely in spite of her.Just pray PL stays long enough to dig us out of the hole his employer dug over 13 disastrous years. If he doesn''t we''re done for.[/quote]You forgot to add "As long as she leaves without wanting all the money back she has invested"[;)][/quote]Invested my arse. Milking the NCFC brand for so long for such a small investment has to be the most cynical rip off possible. Clearly you don''t get it.There''s nothing like riding a horse into the ground and then getting your money back in full when it''s on it''s last legs. Nice work if you can get it.You''ve all been mugged.... big time.

[blahblahblah 2]

Lovely rhetoric Cluck, but was does any of that have to do with football ?

[morty 0]

[quote user="Paul Cluckbert "][quote user="morty"][quote user="Paul Cluckbert "]The marginalisation of Smith and Jones MATTERS to some of us.Not so long ago the star struck Deliarite luvvies threw stones at anyone who dare criticise their saviour. What happens? We slump to our lowest level for 50 years and become a national laughing stock.Then (to preserve her celebrity persona and protect her investment).... Smith is forced to step back and bring in people who know what they are doing, who in turn bring in a proper manager rather the one of her laughable puppets. What happens? We gradually begin to get our club back.It may not bother many of you... but for some of us the ultimate removal of Smith will equal the return of NCFC to it''s roots. Smith at NCFC equals decline and the minute Paul Lambert moves on her luck will run out.... and then watch the club die a death.Wiz is exactly right to express this view....quite simply because his opinion is spot on. Sad that the luvvies have been mugged (yet again) into thinking that what we have now is anything to do with her.... it is entirely in spite of her.Just pray PL stays long enough to dig us out of the hole his employer dug over 13 disastrous years. If he doesn''t we''re done for.[/quote]You forgot to add "As long as she leaves without wanting all the money back she has invested"[;)][/quote]Invested my arse. Milking the NCFC brand for so long for such a small investment has to be the most cynical rip off possible. Clearly you don''t get it.There''s nothing like riding a horse into the ground and then getting your money back in full when it''s on it''s last legs. Nice work if you can get it.You''ve all been mugged.... big time.[/quote]If you could put aside your obvious dislike for Smith and Jones for one minute then figures don''t lie. I don''t know the exact amount that has been invested by them, but its a considerable amount, and if they hadn''t bothered would there even be a Norwich city right now? Of course we don''t know that for sure.Sorry, but when have they snatched their money back exactly?I do get it, whilst I think that mistakes have been made we would have been proper buggerred without their money.I agree with you on a lot of points, but surely you are just posting this for some sort of reaction?

[. 0]

[quote user="Bebop and Rocksteady"]But Cluck, wasn''t Foulger part of the problem too? He has been on the board the same amount of time.[/quote]Foulger is a lightweight and his investment is piffling.Accrington Stanley might make a song and dance about £2 million... but at this level it''s peanuts. It''s just another indication that NCFC remains ''little old Norwich'' under Smith.... and of course he fits Delia Smith''s investment requirements perfectly.He is a ''yes man'' puppet and poses no threat ...... and that is why he has lasted the length of time he has. Also maybe question the timing of this tyrivial purse full of money? Too late to spend on a player isn''t it? Think about it.

[. 0]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="Paul Cluckbert "][quote user="morty"][quote user="Paul Cluckbert "]The marginalisation of Smith and Jones MATTERS to some of us.Not so long ago the star struck Deliarite luvvies threw stones at anyone who dare criticise their saviour. What happens? We slump to our lowest level for 50 years and become a national laughing stock.Then (to preserve her celebrity persona and protect her investment).... Smith is forced to step back and bring in people who know what they are doing, who in turn bring in a proper manager rather the one of her laughable puppets. What happens? We gradually begin to get our club back.It may not bother many of you... but for some of us the ultimate removal of Smith will equal the return of NCFC to it''s roots. Smith at NCFC equals decline and the minute Paul Lambert moves on her luck will run out.... and then watch the club die a death.Wiz is exactly right to express this view....quite simply because his opinion is spot on. Sad that the luvvies have been mugged (yet again) into thinking that what we have now is anything to do with her.... it is entirely in spite of her.Just pray PL stays long enough to dig us out of the hole his employer dug over 13 disastrous years. If he doesn''t we''re done for.[/quote]You forgot to add "As long as she leaves without wanting all the money back she has invested"[;)][/quote]Invested my arse. Milking the NCFC brand for so long for such a small investment has to be the most cynical rip off possible. Clearly you don''t get it.There''s nothing like riding a horse into the ground and then getting your money back in full when it''s on it''s last legs. Nice work if you can get it.You''ve all been mugged.... big time.[/quote]If you could put aside your obvious dislike for Smith and Jones for one minute then figures don''t lie. I don''t know the exact amount that has been invested by them, but its a considerable amount, and if they hadn''t bothered would there even be a Norwich city right now? Of course we don''t know that for sure.Sorry, but when have they snatched their money back exactly?I do get it, whilst I think that mistakes have been made we would have been proper buggerred without their money.I agree with you on a lot of points, but surely you are just posting this for some sort of reaction?[/quote]FFS Morty. You really are a plank aren''t you? Hook line and sinker and proof that the ''Saviour'' myth is alive and well.I won''t waste my electricity taking this discussion any further.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Paul Cluckbert "][quote user="morty"][quote user="Paul Cluckbert "][quote user="morty"][quote user="Paul Cluckbert "]The marginalisation of Smith and Jones MATTERS to some of us.Not so long ago the star struck Deliarite luvvies threw stones at anyone who dare criticise their saviour. What happens? We slump to our lowest level for 50 years and become a national laughing stock.Then (to preserve her celebrity persona and protect her investment).... Smith is forced to step back and bring in people who know what they are doing, who in turn bring in a proper manager rather the one of her laughable puppets. What happens? We gradually begin to get our club back.It may not bother many of you... but for some of us the ultimate removal of Smith will equal the return of NCFC to it''s roots. Smith at NCFC equals decline and the minute Paul Lambert moves on her luck will run out.... and then watch the club die a death.Wiz is exactly right to express this view....quite simply because his opinion is spot on. Sad that the luvvies have been mugged (yet again) into thinking that what we have now is anything to do with her.... it is entirely in spite of her.Just pray PL stays long enough to dig us out of the hole his employer dug over 13 disastrous years. If he doesn''t we''re done for.[/quote]You forgot to add "As long as she leaves without wanting all the money back she has invested"[;)][/quote]Invested my arse. Milking the NCFC brand for so long for such a small investment has to be the most cynical rip off possible. Clearly you don''t get it.There''s nothing like riding a horse into the ground and then getting your money back in full when it''s on it''s last legs. Nice work if you can get it.You''ve all been mugged.... big time.[/quote]If you could put aside your obvious dislike for Smith and Jones for one minute then figures don''t lie. I don''t know the exact amount that has been invested by them, but its a considerable amount, and if they hadn''t bothered would there even be a Norwich city right now? Of course we don''t know that for sure.Sorry, but when have they snatched their money back exactly?I do get it, whilst I think that mistakes have been made we would have been proper buggerred without their money.I agree with you on a lot of points, but surely you are just posting this for some sort of reaction?[/quote]FFS Morty. You really are a plank aren''t you? Hook line and sinker and proof that the ''Saviour'' myth is alive and well.I won''t waste my electricity taking this discussion any further.[/quote]More like you can''t actually argue with facts, so choose to not bother.The club was on its arse when Bob the Builder left, I know this for a fact.Have a nice day.[:D]

[. 0]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]Lovely rhetoric Cluck, but was does any of that have to do with football ?[/quote]That''s the very question you should ask Smith after you''ve studied her laughable tenure.

[O.T.B.C 1]

I wouldn''t waste your breath Morty.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Bebop and Rocksteady"]I wouldn''t waste your breath Morty.[/quote]Its cool, I know he''s a wind up merchant and doesn''t truly believe all the crap he''s spouting.[;)]

[Joanna Grey 0]

[quote user="Paul Cluckbert "]  Too late to spend on a player isn''t it?

Think about it.
[/quote]

On what date exactly did Lambert first have access to this little pot? Seems some strongly believe that he had it during the transfer window. Perhaps you could tell us exactly?

Think about it....

[norfolkchance1 0]

Just got odds off skybet, that in three weeks when this thread has dropped to page five that Wiz will write another thread just like this one.

1/1000

Just bet my house on it - A sure fire certainty

[Coelho 0]

[quote user="Paul Cluckbert "][quote user="blahblahblah"]Lovely rhetoric Cluck, but was does any of that have to do with football ?[/quote]That''s the very question you should ask Smith after you''ve studied her laughable tenure.

[/quote]If S&J were that desperate to ''milk'' the club, why would they have appointed someone like McNally? They knew they were out of their depth running a football club and needed someone with more business acumen and first-hand experience of successfully running a club. Surely you can see that, despite their errors, the club is on the up at the moment? If S&J had walked out after relegation to League One, there might not even be a Norwich City now. At least the club is moving back towards more stable foundations, on and off the pitch, which will make it infinitely more marketable to potential investors.Just out of interest, who would you prefer to be in charge of NCFC now? S&J and McNally/Bowkett, or Evans and Clegg?

[morty 0]

Hehehe, good old Cluckster.Drop a few bombshells and then quickly leave the thread to observe the chaos from afar.[:D]

[JKUIL 0]

[quote user="First Wizard"]

Now down to 53%

 

Thank Gawd imo..............only 4% to go![Y]

[/quote]

That means they still have the controlling interest. We are where we are today because of decisions made by them.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Al Catraz"][quote user="First Wizard"]

Now down to 53%

 

Thank Gawd imo..............only 4% to go![Y]

[/quote]

That means they still have the controlling interest. We are where we are today because of decisions made by them.[/quote]This is indeed correct, but they have openly admitted that they made mistakes, and have now handed more control to people who know what they are doing.The fact still remains that we would have been screwed without their money.

[blahblahblah 2]

So Cluck, you start with"The marginalisation of Smith and Jones MATTERS to some of us."And yet, on the man building his share-holding"He is a ''yes man'' puppet and poses no threat .."Is this not an admission of defeat cluck ?

[Ruddygore 0]

Could anyone suggest a ball park figure of what Smith & Jones have put in to the club and also if they can see how they might have milked the club and in what way that represents good value for their input?

From what I assume they have both purchased shares and made available further amounts as "directors loans" which are either seen as "gifts" (not expected to be recalled) or debt.

Not a trolling post, genuine interest and also I would like to put the matter to bed satisfactorily in my own mind please.

[JKUIL 0]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="Al Catraz"][quote user="First Wizard"]

Now down to 53%

 

Thank Gawd imo..............only 4% to go![Y]

[/quote]

That means they still have the controlling interest. We are where we are today because of decisions made by them.[/quote]This is indeed correct, but they have openly admitted that they made mistakes, and have now handed more control to people who know what they are doing.The fact still remains that we would have been screwed without their money.[/quote]

That''s the point I''m making. We all make mistakes but the trick is to learn from them. S&J realised that they needed to bring in more experience and expertise. They made that decision, which is why we are here today - not to mention the fact that they saved the club from administration. They are alo intelligent enough to retain controlling interest which I am very comfortable with.

[morty 0]

[quote user="itstheruddyfuture"]Could anyone suggest a ball park figure of what Smith & Jones have put in to the club and also if they can see how they might have milked the club and in what way that represents good value for their input?

From what I assume they have both purchased shares and made available further amounts as "directors loans" which are either seen as "gifts" (not expected to be recalled) or debt.

Not a trolling post, genuine interest and also I would like to put the matter to bed satisfactorily in my own mind please.[/quote]I seem to remember Delia herself saying that they had put something in the region of 10 or 12 million into the club that they are unlikely to see back.*This is only a vague memory and I am  perfectly prepared to be proved wrong by the fag packet accountants.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Al Catraz"][quote user="morty"][quote user="Al Catraz"][quote user="First Wizard"]

Now down to 53%

 

Thank Gawd imo..............only 4% to go![Y]

[/quote]

That means they still have the controlling interest. We are where we are today because of decisions made by them.[/quote]This is indeed correct, but they have openly admitted that they made mistakes, and have now handed more control to people who know what they are doing.The fact still remains that we would have been screwed without their money.[/quote]

That''s the point I''m making. We all make mistakes but the trick is to learn from them. S&J realised that they needed to bring in more experience and expertise. They made that decision, which is why we are here today - not to mention the fact that they saved the club from administration. They are alo intelligent enough to retain controlling interest which I am very comfortable with.[/quote]Ah right, I read your post as negative to begin with.[Y]

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,234]

I think it is important to note that had Delia and MWJ not invested in the club at the time then somebody else would have done. Some posters were suggesting a while ago that Southampton would go out of business, it did not happen. The true saviour of the club is Geoffrey Watling and the fans, had he/they not intervened when he/they did then there would be no NCFC for anybody to invest in......

[morty 0]

[quote user="Sons of Boadicea"]I think it is important to note that had Delia and MWJ not invested in the club at the time then somebody else would have done. Some posters were suggesting a while ago that Southampton would go out of business, it did not happen. The true saviour of the club is Geoffrey Watling and the fans, had he/they not intervened when he/they did then there would be no NCFC for anybody to invest in......[/quote]I agree totally with your point about Geoffrey Watling.But no one knows if other investors would have stepped in or not. One fact we do know is that we were in a dire financial state and probably not a very attractive prospect.And also when it all happened, the world, and football especially was a very different animal.

[Ruddygore 0]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="itstheruddyfuture"]Could anyone suggest a ball park figure of what Smith & Jones have put in to the club and also if they can see how they might have milked the club and in what way that represents good value for their input?

From what I assume they have both purchased shares and made available further amounts as "directors loans" which are either seen as "gifts" (not expected to be recalled) or debt.

Not a trolling post, genuine interest and also I would like to put the matter to bed satisfactorily in my own mind please.[/quote]I seem to remember Delia herself saying that they had put something in the region of 10 or 12 million into the club that they are unlikely to see back.*This is only a vague memory and I am  perfectly prepared to be proved wrong by the fag packet accountants.[/quote]

Thank you morty, for some reason I had it at £15m but I expect it would take someone with accurate knowledge to pin it down. I don''t know how you ever see a return on that during your "tenure" since the club is loss making (aren''t all clubs?) and dividends must be few and far between. Maybe you could make it back if you ever sold your shares and clawed back your loans but only if you''ve added value meanwhile.

I take the later point about Geoffrey Watling as well made too but all I know is that every time I walk into Carrow Road and take my seat in the Jarrold I am immensely proud of the club, stadium, fans and the people who run the whole thing. I suppose people make mistakes like putting Roeder in charge of the team but the fact that they are still here means that they are in for the long haul. I don''t feel that Delia is more famous or has more cachet from being associated with the club (faintly infamous for the Rant but sincere) but I do feel if anything it is slightly the other way around.

[JKUIL 0]

[quote user="Sons of Boadicea"]I think it is important to note that had Delia and MWJ not invested in the club at the time then somebody else would have done. Some posters were suggesting a while ago that Southampton would go out of business, it did not happen. The true saviour of the club is Geoffrey Watling and the fans, had he/they not intervened when he/they did then there would be no NCFC for anybody to invest in......[/quote]

Yes, well of course we have been indundated with interest from potential buyers/investors for years haven''t we ?! Fact is that when we were on the verge of bankruptcy it was Delia and MWJ who stepped upto the plate and put their money where their mouths were. Being an ardent Norwich fan I was keenly interested at the time and I don''t recall even a wisp of interest from any other "saviour", do you ? Watling is of course a legend and there is no one out there who hasn''t got a good word for him, marvellous man and a great ally and friend of the Club and its fans.

[morty 0]

[quote user="itstheruddyfuture"][quote user="morty"][quote user="itstheruddyfuture"]Could anyone suggest a ball park figure of what Smith & Jones have put in to the club and also if they can see how they might have milked the club and in what way that represents good value for their input?

From what I assume they have both purchased shares and made available further amounts as "directors loans" which are either seen as "gifts" (not expected to be recalled) or debt.

Not a trolling post, genuine interest and also I would like to put the matter to bed satisfactorily in my own mind please.[/quote]I seem to remember Delia herself saying that they had put something in the region of 10 or 12 million into the club that they are unlikely to see back.*This is only a vague memory and I am  perfectly prepared to be proved wrong by the fag packet accountants.[/quote]

Thank you morty, for some reason I had it at £15m but I expect it would take someone with accurate knowledge to pin it down. I don''t know how you ever see a return on that during your "tenure" since the club is loss making (aren''t all clubs?) and dividends must be few and far between. Maybe you could make it back if you ever sold your shares and clawed back your loans but only if you''ve added value meanwhile.

I take the later point about Geoffrey Watling as well made too but all I know is that every time I walk into Carrow Road and take my seat in the Jarrold I am immensely proud of the club, stadium, fans and the people who run the whole thing. I suppose people make mistakes like putting Roeder in charge of the team but the fact that they are still here means that they are in for the long haul. I don''t feel that Delia is more famous or has more cachet from being associated with the club (faintly infamous for the Rant but sincere) but I do feel if anything it is slightly the other way around.[/quote]It very well could be 15 million, it was only a throwaway line in an interview. Which ever it is, its certainly not small change! Yeah, thats the way I see Delia too, I certainly don''t hold with theories that she bought into the club to help her media image, she was already way more of a household name than Norwich City was!We could get into a whole other debate here, but a lot of people forget that Roeder kept us up before his dramatic fall from popularity, things are always much easier to rationalise with hindsight though.