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The head steward always has a go at me becuase I use my digital camera and he tells me to put it away. i am getting fed up with this and the steward. he has now started having a go at people for using camera phones. Can anyone help me with the rules on this issue?

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It is something to do with image rights - I believe Sky or someone have technically bought pretty much all the rights, so they decide who can take pictures. I suppose then the club is liable for allowing fans to breach this. I took digital pics of some of the matches I went to last season before, during and afterwards, some of which turned out very well.

However, the moment we get into the Premiership, the stewards were on me pretty quickly telling me to stop. The strangest thing was that I went to a reserve game and I hadn''t even turned the camera on before a steward was onto me...I think that was a bit over-zealous considering reserve nights are peaceful affairs.

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As a freelance photographer the world of image rights I can assure you is a complex one.

Basically any person or owner of a property has rights associated with any imagery of them/their property if it is going to be sold or used to sell or market anything else. Even if you go to lets say a National Trust Property you can''t simply take picyures and sell them. I don''t know for sure on football as I''ve never looked to cover it professionally (boy that would be hard) but I would imagine that there are all sorts of rights that the club (no doubt through The Premier League) will have sold on to Sky, BBC and the various newspapers/agencies working for the papers etc. The players too will no doubt have some clause intheir contracts covering this too.

That said there are generally different rules in the "for personal use" category, and unless the club has notices up and/or publishes a no-photograsphy policy in the programme for instance (not seen one, but not looked either) an individual should be able to take personal photographs.

Maybe the web-team as part of the local paper set-up could clarify the situation on this one?

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Afternoon all . .  . I was hoping to duck out if this one!

Ther local papers (and nationals)  have a multi-page agreement, in extremely legal terms (hereby, heretofore, hereof, thereof, in respect of, pursuant to . . .) with the Premier League. (Similar to the one we had in the past for other leagues.)

eg "The FAPL hereby grants for the Term to the Licencee a licence ("Licence") for Authorised Photographers to enter the Stadium of each Club for the purpose of taking photographs only on the occasions of Matches subject to the conditions hereof and to the Licensee making arrangements with the Home Club in respect of such Match prior to the day of the Match for the issue to any Authorised Photographer of Acccreditation."

Got that? They can also ONLY take photos:

 "Authorised photographers are permitted to take photographs only and shall not whilst present at the stadium or using any materials captured or created whilst at the stadium publish or communicate any commercial messages, live match reports, statistics, data of whatever nature save only the photographs in accordance with this agreement."

We also have to agree not to allow the pix to be published on any website other than our own (fanzine sites take note - that''s why we get touchy about you pinching them!)

Think this adds up to the fact that if you are not an accredited photographer, they can probably stop you taking pix.

I''m going to lie down.

 

 

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[quote]Thanks for that Celia. All sounds a bit hardcore! I''ll remember that when I next get my phone out. Bloody stewards![/quote]

Welcome to the photographers world!!

Now if it''s hardcore you want....!

(Only joking!!)

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I still really can''t see the problem with a 15 year old boy taking some pictures to remember Norwichs season in the Premiership to remember it. OK then, I can see that, what is up with the reserve matches though, it isnot as if they are as serious as the actual premeirship matches. And why can''t you use camera phones? it''s rudiculous. Does anyone know how I can get a license then, and how much it is? Web team, can you help?

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The licence is free - but it''s a deal only for newspapers.

I don''t know what the situation is for the ordinary fan - I agree photos should be allowed.

I''ve mentioned this thread to the Evening News newsdesk, and they may investigate with the club to see what their view is.

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take a photo and tell the steward where to put it!!!your rights are your rights. like leaving early is your rights, OOPS i forgot you do do that as well. never mind, u can get a photo of the away team bus as you often take pleasure from this. why do u take photos of the game, what are u gaining? gurantee your camera wont be there next year!!

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[quote]take a photo and tell the steward where to put it!!!your rights are your rights. like leaving early is your rights, OOPS i forgot you do do that as well. never mind, u can get a photo of the away tea...[/quote]

You''re in danger of becoming a one-trick pony Donaldson.

Time to move on.

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[quote]take a photo and tell the steward where to put it!!!your rights are your rights. like leaving early is your rights, OOPS i forgot you do do that as well. never mind, u can get a photo of the away tea...[/quote]

What''s your beef dude? Stop being so confrontational.

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Will be pretty academic soon given the technology.Can''t see it being too difficuilt to carry a small camera on your person and transmit the pictures back via a mobile phone.Will give a fans eye view of the game.Not sure if it would help the binners though, as anyone seeing anything from poorman rd would think the sound had packed up.

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I just want to take pictures of matches to remember this season. And NO, I WILL NOT BE GONE NEXT SEASON. It is not up to you or anyone else to decide about my rights. I decide when I want to leave and this topic discussion is on the use of cameras. I just want photos to remember this season by. I took them last season also and i will take them next season.

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i hate this kind of thing - it happens at events and things too and if you go to Ibiza, most of the clubs confiscate your cameras at the door!! As if they have some kind of ownership over your own experiences and memories. The creeping commercialisation of, well,  everything and anything - hate it!!

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[quote]I had a similar experience when I tried to take my dishwasher and microwave in with me. The stewards are bullies and it''s time we made a stand.[/quote]

There''s a thought, if we make our own stand out of dishwashers and microwaves, could we take photos from it?


Seriously though, I agree that we should be able to take snapshots. It''s not as though any major news agencies pay reproduction rights for shots from the stands, is it? It''s one thing to clamp down on people using SLRs with long lenses but it''s a bit daft to rule out people with compacts and mobiles!

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[quote]I had a similar experience when I tried to take my dishwasher and microwave in with me. The stewards are bullies and it''s time we made a stand.[/quote]

Ha ha! Very funny!

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"The FAPL hereby grants for the Term to the Licencee a licence ("Licence") for Authorised Photographers to enter the Stadium of each Club for the purpose of taking photographs only on the occasions of Matches subject to the conditions hereof and to the Licensee making arrangements with the Home Club in respect of such Match prior to the day of the Match for the issue to any Authorised Photographer of Acccreditation."

I''m a law student, and as such I''m supposed to be able to interpret such clauses with some degree of regularity - but this goes waaaay above my head! They certinatly mean business, don''t they? Is this quite a strictly enforced clause?

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the club are only a small, though no doubt, unwanted, part of the big copyright fiasco, let''s face it, for years we, the people, have not been "allowed" to copy music off the radio, take photos at gigs, etc, just in case someone ordinary was able to make some money selling it on

the day a newspaper pays for and uses anyone''s private photo phone or digi photo is the day we will all make it rich, ie never

as someone said, if you went in with a professional camera and kit, okay, but the average fan is not going to

all a fuss about nothing as usual, i have taken loads of photos with my phone and digi camera and no steward or anyone else has ever stopped me - and loads of fans like me

and i will be taking my microwave to the next home game   lol

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I sit in the block closest to the new corner infill in the river end lower tier and the head steward is so hell bent on stopping me taking pictures with my digital camera (nothing likle what the professionals use), he hides behind the post, and he watches me through the hole in the middle. How sad is that and it really annoys me. He is obsessed with stopping me use it now and it is really annoying me. Yet, there was someone right in front of his nose using a digital cameras, with a flash I might add, a couple of rows up in the jarrold stand closest to the corner infill and he didn''t stop them and it had a massive flash. This issue is really annoying me.

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I am sure that it is a standard condition on most ''performance/entertainment'' (sports events, pop concerts etc) tickets that cameras are not to be used in the venue to support these very image rights issues. 

Its several years since I had a regular ticket and I have checked the conditions for my season ticket but I would be amazed if these are not attached to the clubs conditions of sale in small print on the tickets - can any one confirm.

However it does not explain why for example Old Trafford exploded with flashes when the team came on the the pitch at the start of the game last night though does it!  I guess it depends how the clubs interpret/prioritise the issue for them.

Come on city - give us a little leeway but enforce it mid game - sudden flashes as a chance comes along would give leon an excuse for his miss!

 

OTBC 

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This you won''t believe. My next door neighbour is a man u fan and when he went, he had a person sitting next to him using a camcorder in full view of a club steward. Now what I don''t understand is at old trafford you can use camcorders and at carrow road, you can''t even use camera phones. it ridiculous. Whats the difference? If anything, it should be the other way round because more united games are televised (cup, league and champ league and tournaments).

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[quote]This you won''t believe. My next door neighbour is a man u fan and when he went, he had a person sitting next to him using a camcorder in full view of a club steward. Now what I don''t understand is at ...[/quote]

Don''t know whether you saw this but it looks like you made the Eastern Evening News.

 

http://www.eveningnews24.co.uk/content/News/story.aspx?brand=ENOnline&category=News&tBrand=enonline&tCategory=news&itemid=NOED29%20Jan%202005%2010%3A58%3A50%3A257

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I know

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