Will they ever get off Robert Chase's back

[Delia Out! 0]

[quote user="The Trumpington Riot"]"Robert Chase kept us in the top teir (sic)" Except that he didn''t. "by appointing good managers" The EDP assessed our 31 managers in our first 100 years. Megson ranked 31st. Deehan 29th. The problem with NCFC has in fact been that in terms of the policies pursued Smith & Jones were in many ways a continuation of Chase - notably in the prioritising of property development.[/quote]

Hahahaha - & the EDP are never wrong!!!

[Delia Out! 0]

[quote user="Old Shuck"]This "Chase: Was He Good Or Bad?" debate has rumbled on for a few years now-hindsight is now looking to portray him as a knight in shining armour. Whether hindsight, again, in 20 years time or so portrays DS and MWJ et al in the same forgiving light, well, we''ll have to wait and see... Its interesting that, despite the antipathy towards the current regime, especially in the season prior to, and the relegation season, there was nothing like the scale of protest and antagonistic fervour against them, compared to that directed at the Robert Chase regime when its halo was perceived as slipping, sending us, then, as previously, down a slippery slope. Small scale dissent and protest of course, and heated debate on these and other NCFC boards, debate that verged on hate-opinions differed, but what was constant, was that everyone seemed to have an opinion. Perhaps, in those days of Chase, when there was no internet and anonymous means to spout anger and frustration, that very same was more spontaneous in nature, and actual, visible, physical protest came about more readily and easily? Because there were protests. Whatever else his time at the club brought us, it ended with anger, anger and discontent from fans, players, managers, plus stark headlines in the local press magnifying that. However, to repeat a point, that anger has been nowhere near the same wide scale with regard to that regime and those god-awful, in particular, 2007/08 and 2008/09 seasons. Can Chase be held accountable for the loss of Martin O''Neill as a Manager, ditto Mike Walker, plus the wholesale exodus of players at that time? Well, if he is the man at the top, was the man at the top, then yes, he can''t be blameless. But, by that same logic, then he must be regarded with a more positive view with regard to the prem success, the FA Cup semi-finals, the initial upgrade of the ground and beginnings of Colney. I have previously posted that football caught up with, and overtook Robert Chase, and I will stand by that opinion. Where the game was, mid to late 80''s and into the 90''s, a man his financial standing, ambition, capability, could and did do things well at a football club, and he did. As the game grew out of all proportion, our resources, his resources and planning couldn''t keep up, we were to be left behind, no-one wanted that, and I don''t think for one moment he wanted that either-but Jack Walker, a multi-national multi-millionaire of international standing and his ilk were coming into the game, and Robert Chase, a well off bloke from Norfolk couldn''t keep up. He wasn''t the only club chairman at that time to suffer for it, neither were we the only club-Middlesbrough nearly went out of existence, Maidstone, then a football league club did. And Wimbledon, FA Cup winners in 1988, started their steady demise which peaked when footballs new breed decided that there was more money to be made in ''fashionable'' Milton Keynes. Football has now caught up with and speedily overtaken the resources of DS and MWJ. Like Robert Chase before them, they are trying to stem the tide, but it is difficult, and now, even more so, to make money out of football and be profitable. FFS, Liverpool and Manchester United, massive debts, clubs that we used to be on a level playing field with-like West Ham-going pretty much the same way, what relegation might do to them this season-frightening... When Robert Chase left the club, there was a good chance that someone would take over, debts included. Not quite so many suitors out there in 2010 willing to do it now. Each regime has had its positives, each its negatives, and we can list them ad-infinitum, to support those who we favour, as easily as we can offer the negatives of the other. However, any and all failings of either are, and were, I believe, down to circumstances in the game, not their avowed intent, as it sometimes seems to be portrayed on here, to deliberately, wilfully, and intentionally run the club into the ground.[/quote]

Excellent post.

[Delia Out! 0]

[quote user="Old Shuck"]This "Chase: Was He Good Or Bad?" debate has rumbled on for a few years now-hindsight is now looking to portray him as a knight in shining armour. Whether hindsight, again, in 20 years time or so portrays DS and MWJ et al in the same forgiving light, well, we''ll have to wait and see... Its interesting that, despite the antipathy towards the current regime, especially in the season prior to, and the relegation season, there was nothing like the scale of protest and antagonistic fervour against them, compared to that directed at the Robert Chase regime when its halo was perceived as slipping, sending us, then, as previously, down a slippery slope. Small scale dissent and protest of course, and heated debate on these and other NCFC boards, debate that verged on hate-opinions differed, but what was constant, was that everyone seemed to have an opinion. Perhaps, in those days of Chase, when there was no internet and anonymous means to spout anger and frustration, that very same was more spontaneous in nature, and actual, visible, physical protest came about more readily and easily? Because there were protests. Whatever else his time at the club brought us, it ended with anger, anger and discontent from fans, players, managers, plus stark headlines in the local press magnifying that. However, to repeat a point, that anger has been nowhere near the same wide scale with regard to that regime and those god-awful, in particular, 2007/08 and 2008/09 seasons. Can Chase be held accountable for the loss of Martin O''Neill as a Manager, ditto Mike Walker, plus the wholesale exodus of players at that time? Well, if he is the man at the top, was the man at the top, then yes, he can''t be blameless. But, by that same logic, then he must be regarded with a more positive view with regard to the prem success, the FA Cup semi-finals, the initial upgrade of the ground and beginnings of Colney. I have previously posted that football caught up with, and overtook Robert Chase, and I will stand by that opinion. Where the game was, mid to late 80''s and into the 90''s, a man his financial standing, ambition, capability, could and did do things well at a football club, and he did. As the game grew out of all proportion, our resources, his resources and planning couldn''t keep up, we were to be left behind, no-one wanted that, and I don''t think for one moment he wanted that either-but Jack Walker, a multi-national multi-millionaire of international standing and his ilk were coming into the game, and Robert Chase, a well off bloke from Norfolk couldn''t keep up. He wasn''t the only club chairman at that time to suffer for it, neither were we the only club-Middlesbrough nearly went out of existence, Maidstone, then a football league club did. And Wimbledon, FA Cup winners in 1988, started their steady demise which peaked when footballs new breed decided that there was more money to be made in ''fashionable'' Milton Keynes. Football has now caught up with and speedily overtaken the resources of DS and MWJ. Like Robert Chase before them, they are trying to stem the tide, but it is difficult, and now, even more so, to make money out of football and be profitable. FFS, Liverpool and Manchester United, massive debts, clubs that we used to be on a level playing field with-like West Ham-going pretty much the same way, what relegation might do to them this season-frightening... When Robert Chase left the club, there was a good chance that someone would take over, debts included. Not quite so many suitors out there in 2010 willing to do it now. Each regime has had its positives, each its negatives, and we can list them ad-infinitum, to support those who we favour, as easily as we can offer the negatives of the other. However, any and all failings of either are, and were, I believe, down to circumstances in the game, not their avowed intent, as it sometimes seems to be portrayed on here, to deliberately, wilfully, and intentionally run the club into the ground.[/quote]

Excellent post.

[vos 155]

Well,well, well. Mention Robert Chase, don''t they get excited.

What I was referring to is that seems to be some kind of cult at the EDP whereby given the slightest chance they will have a go at Robert Chase. I am sure there are many issues he could say in his defence but he has maintained a dignified silence.

Of course my comments re Delia and company were tonque in cheek. There is too much at stake for her and the EDP to have a little scrimmage.

[. 0]

[quote user="vos"]Well,well, well. Mention Robert Chase, don''t they get excited.

What I was referring to is that seems to be some kind of cult at the EDP whereby given the slightest chance they will have a go at Robert Chase. I am sure there are many issues he could say in his defence but he has maintained a dignified silence.

Of course my comments re Delia and company were tonque in cheek. There is too much at stake for her and the EDP to have a little scrimmage.[/quote]I just hope Robert Chase is aware that some of us still appreciate what he did for the club and City beyond.... plus a little bit of loyalty to the great man is no bad thing.  [Y]

[corbs 0]

Very proud to have played a small part in ridding the Club of that man, ''he''s fat, he''s round, bounce him on the ground...........ROBERT CHASE.

[. 0]

[quote user="corbs"]Very proud to have played a small part in ridding the Club of that man, ''he''s fat, he''s round, bounce him on the ground...........ROBERT CHASE.[/quote]Does your mum know you''re still up?Oh I forgot.... been out trick or treating have you?

[chicken 0]

Cluck said: ''There were still plenty of assets left when Smith took over.... What will be left when Smith finally clears off back to Suffolk? Debt.... and nothing to cover it other than someone else''s ''investment'' in her abysmal failure.''

Firstly Chase made ''investments'' in ''assets'' that did not make any money for the club for over ten years in the land he bought near to the club.

Where did Chase actually invest money that saw the club at that time reap any sort of reward? No where, that''s where. And because the land wasn''t worth anything in selling terms for years, the debt incurred to buy it has mounted up and in the end cost the club more.

As I already mentioned he also left the club with negative assets - for example the old south stand which consistantly needed upgrading due to regulations and the fact that it was really a shed. How much did that new stand cost?

Delia through all of her faults, and yes she has had them, has at least put her own money into the club and created money making assets in her resteraunt and yellows.

Chase also left a club with average attendances of around 15/16k at the most - even when our ground could hold more. In recent years we have seen a huge increase in gates which actually goes against the norm of other clubs around the country at this level and above.

Not only that but the accademy now seems to be churning out players on a steady basis and each year they seem to be getting better. This year our under 18''s are doing really well - that''s to do with the progress in our accademy over the last 10-15 years, nothing to do with prior to that.

So while Chase may leave a legacy ballanced by the success we had under him and the negative way in which he took the club to the ''wall'', so too will Delia and like I said before at least she has admitted her portion of fault where Chase to this day still says he did nothing wrong - how much of his own money did he put into the club?

[. 0]

[quote user="chicken"]Cluck said: ''There were still plenty of assets left when Smith took over.... What will be left when Smith finally clears off back to Suffolk? Debt.... and nothing to cover it other than someone else''s ''investment'' in her abysmal failure.''

Firstly Chase made ''investments'' in ''assets'' that did not make any money for the club for over ten years in the land he bought near to the club.

Where did Chase actually invest money that saw the club at that time reap any sort of reward? No where, that''s where. And because the land wasn''t worth anything in selling terms for years, the debt incurred to buy it has mounted up and in the end cost the club more.

As I already mentioned he also left the club with negative assets - for example the old south stand which consistantly needed upgrading due to regulations and the fact that it was really a shed. How much did that new stand cost?

Delia through all of her faults, and yes she has had them, has at least put her own money into the club and created money making assets in her resteraunt and yellows.

Chase also left a club with average attendances of around 15/16k at the most - even when our ground could hold more. In recent years we have seen a huge increase in gates which actually goes against the norm of other clubs around the country at this level and above.

Not only that but the accademy now seems to be churning out players on a steady basis and each year they seem to be getting better. This year our under 18''s are doing really well - that''s to do with the progress in our accademy over the last 10-15 years, nothing to do with prior to that.

So while Chase may leave a legacy ballanced by the success we had under him and the negative way in which he took the club to the ''wall'', so too will Delia and like I said before at least she has admitted her portion of fault where Chase to this day still says he did nothing wrong - how much of his own money did he put into the club?[/quote]I don''t see any point in us going off on another Harry Hill type ''who''s best'' session.... as it is clear that we have an entirely different view of life.While you prefer the ''safe pair of hands'' road.... I will allows go for edge. Robert Chase gave us the glory years.... Delia Smith decline and ridicule. To my mind there will only ever be one winner.... and that is RC. He may have come off the rails a bit towards the end but it was one hell of a ride.

[Budgie 0]

[quote user="Cluckbert Chase"]Couldn''t agree more.I''ll never stop being grateful for what Robert Chase gave me as a fan over many years.... but sadly many have short memories.... or memories based on what they''ve either read or heard about it from the Carrow Road/Delia Smith spin machine.It''s sad.... but life really is that shallow these days.[/quote]

What is really tragic is your arrogance in suggesting that anyone with a differing opinion to yours has either memory problems or has based their opinions on third party sources.

It could just be that people saw, and experienced that Chase era and its aftermath and came to a logical conclusion that just happens to be vastly different to yours - But that would be to difficult for you to argue against and dismiss I take it.

Better to brand everyone else stupid as it makes you seem superior lol

[Shaun Tilly Lace 0]

In answer to the OP''s rhetorical question: hopefully not.

[. 0]

[quote user="Budgie"][quote user="Cluckbert Chase"]Couldn''t agree more.I''ll never stop being grateful for what Robert Chase gave me as a fan over many years.... but sadly many have short memories.... or memories based on what they''ve either read or heard about it from the Carrow Road/Delia Smith spin machine.It''s sad.... but life really is that shallow these days.[/quote]

What is really tragic is your arrogance in suggesting that anyone with a differing opinion to yours has either memory problems or has based their opinions on third party sources.

It could just be that people saw, and experienced that Chase era and its aftermath and came to a logical conclusion that just happens to be vastly different to yours - But that would be to difficult for you to argue against and dismiss I take it.

Better to brand everyone else stupid as it makes you seem superior lol[/quote]Because... quite frankly I''m right.......End of.

[Alf Stewart 0]

[quote user="Cluckbert Chase"]

To my mind there will only ever be one winner.... and that is RC. He may have come off the rails a bit towards the end but it was one hell of a ride.
[/quote]

 

Too true my friend. You''ve got to be judged on your results - and my last 18 months were very difficult. But I think the 8½ years before that were very successful.

When you look back over our ten years at Carrow Road as a whole I think we were very successful.

I hope that my colleagues there now will be more successful over the next decade. But going back, and the club is over 100 years old you know, I would think that my decade was the best and most successful the club has ever had. OK, the last 18 months was tough - but you''ve got to take a broad view.

 

That''s why it hurt so much when the Chase Out Brigade were so insulting to me in such a personal way. Taking my unprecedented ten years as a whole I don''t believe I deserved that. Apart from the year they spent treating Nigel Worthington the same way, they''ve never protested like that again. Even Neil Doncaster, who took this club into the Third Division, never had to contend with a fraction of the abuse I received in those last 18 painful months.

 

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,023]

Going off at a tangent, I am interested by the comparisons over the scale of the Chase protests and those half hearted Delia Smith "protests". If you think about logically what has happened to NCFC under Delia Smith and Co was (I say was as I believe she is now just a figurehead and McNasty is the driving force of the club) is every bit as bad as what happened under Chase, yet hardly a whimper from the fans....why? Personally I think there are three main reasons - 1) Legislation (In terms of organising a protest and the powers available to the authorities 2) Technology (No mass access to the internet and 3) Apathy (Linked to 2) in that there are so many keyboard warriors these days, these days its all Facebook campaigns....  

[lappinitup 629]

[quote user="Bob The Builder"]That''s why it hurt so much when the Chase Out Brigade were so insulting to me in such a personal way. Taking my unprecedented ten years as a whole I don''t believe I deserved that. Apart from the year they spent treating Nigel Worthington the same way, they''ve never protested like that again. Even Neil Doncaster, who took this club into the Third Division, never had to contend with a fraction of the abuse I received in those last 18 painful months.

 

[/quote]10,000 people couldn''t have all been wrong Bob...........

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/chase-facing-fans-revolt-1317288.html

The only thing I don''t get is who they wanted IN.

[Budgie 0]

[quote user="Cluckbert Chase"][quote user="Budgie"][quote user="Cluckbert Chase"]Couldn''t agree more.I''ll never stop being grateful for what Robert Chase gave me as a fan over many years.... but sadly many have short memories.... or memories based on what they''ve either read or heard about it from the Carrow Road/Delia Smith spin machine.It''s sad.... but life really is that shallow these days.[/quote]

What is really tragic is your arrogance in suggesting that anyone with a differing opinion to yours has either memory problems or has based their opinions on third party sources.

It could just be that people saw, and experienced that Chase era and its aftermath and came to a logical conclusion that just happens to be vastly different to yours - But that would be to difficult for you to argue against and dismiss I take it.

Better to brand everyone else stupid as it makes you seem superior lol[/quote]Because... quite frankly I''m right.......End of.[/quote]

Oh I see - You''re one of those!

[Alf Stewart 0]

[quote user="Sons of Boadicea"]Going off at a tangent, I am interested by the comparisons over the scale of the Chase protests and those half hearted Delia Smith "protests". If you think about logically what has happened to NCFC under Delia Smith and Co was (I say was as I believe she is now just a figurehead and McNasty is the driving force of the club) is every bit as bad as what happened under Chase, yet hardly a whimper from the fans....why? Personally I think there are three main reasons - 1) Legislation (In terms of organising a protest and the powers available to the authorities 2) Technology (No mass access to the internet and 3) Apathy (Linked to 2) in that there are so many keyboard warriors these days, these days its all Facebook campaigns....  [/quote]

Interesting post sir. Although I do feel you miss the point slightly. In my day I controlled the show. I didn''t employ Executive Management - I was Executive Management. I think the dear lady once referred to me as the "all singing, all dancing leader". Consequently the 8 good years were down to me alone. As was the following struggle. As you say, there were half-hearted Delia protests but no protests whatsoever towards the Executive Management of the club. I shall never understand why that was.

 

Perhaps you can answer your own question - Did you protest against me? Did you protest against them?

 

 

[Budgie 0]

Bob the builder - Is it actually legal to impersonate (or pass your self off as someone) without their permission?

[PurpleCanary 5,557]

[quote user="Budgie"]Bob the builder - Is it actually legal to impersonate (or pass your self off as someone) without their permission?[/quote]

 

---

 

You mean it''s not the real Robert Chase? The Robert Chase who handed me a ticket outside the Olympic Stadium in Munich?!?!?![:O]

 

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,023]

Bob the Builder - Yes I protested against Chase and yes I protested against Delia and Co.....

[The Butler 0]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"]

[quote user="Budgie"]Bob the builder - Is it actually legal to impersonate (or pass your self off as someone) without their permission?[/quote]

 

---

 

You mean it''s not the real Robert Chase? The Robert Chase who handed me a ticket outside the Olympic Stadium in Munich?!?!?![:O]

 

[/quote]

Another nutty problem for you to puzzle over PC[;)]

[. 0]

[quote user="lappinitup"][quote user="Bob The Builder"]That''s why it hurt so much when the Chase Out Brigade were so insulting to me in such a personal way. Taking my unprecedented ten years as a whole I don''t believe I deserved that. Apart from the year they spent treating Nigel Worthington the same way, they''ve never protested like that again. Even Neil Doncaster, who took this club into the Third Division, never had to contend with a fraction of the abuse I received in those last 18 painful months.

 

[/quote]10,000 people couldn''t have all been wrong Bob...........

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/chase-facing-fans-revolt-1317288.html

The only thing I don''t get is who they wanted IN.

[/quote]Incorrect... several millions thought Adolph Hitler was a God.  If the masses are fed any story they''d personally like to believe.... it soon becomes historic fact.I prefer to rely on a memory based on personal experience.... backed up by statistics which cannot be questioned.

[The Butler 0]

[quote user="Cluckbert Chase"][quote user="lappinitup"][quote user="Bob The Builder"]That''s why it hurt so much when the Chase Out Brigade were so insulting to me in such a personal way. Taking my unprecedented ten years as a whole I don''t believe I deserved that. Apart from the year they spent treating Nigel Worthington the same way, they''ve never protested like that again. Even Neil Doncaster, who took this club into the Third Division, never had to contend with a fraction of the abuse I received in those last 18 painful months.

 

[/quote]10,000 people couldn''t have all been wrong Bob...........

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/chase-facing-fans-revolt-1317288.html

The only thing I don''t get is who they wanted IN.

[/quote]

Incorrect... several millions thought Adolph Hitler was a God.  If the masses are fed any story they''d personally like to believe.... it soon becomes historic fact.

I prefer to rely on a memory based on personal experience.... backed up by statistics which cannot be questioned.


[/quote]

Taking the view of some posters on this forum Cluck there was nothing wrong personaly with Adolph.It was just his running of Germany that was the problem.

Please don''t mix up the two will you[;)]

[Budgie 0]

"backed up by statistics which cannot be questioned."

Wow - I have to hand it to you. That is brilliant. Not just for saying it, but for genuinely believing it with a passion.

I applaud you sir

[. 0]

[quote user="Sons of Boadicea"]Going off at a tangent, I am interested by the comparisons over the scale of the Chase protests and those half hearted Delia Smith "protests". If you think about logically what has happened to NCFC under Delia Smith and Co was (I say was as I believe she is now just a figurehead and McNasty is the driving force of the club) is every bit as bad as what happened under Chase, yet hardly a whimper from the fans....why? Personally I think there are three main reasons - 1) Legislation (In terms of organising a protest and the powers available to the authorities 2) Technology (No mass access to the internet and 3) Apathy (Linked to 2) in that there are so many keyboard warriors these days, these days its all Facebook campaigns....  [/quote]In the case of Robert Chase we simply had a wildly deluded fan base who grew way too big for their boots ... drunk on unprecidented success. The fact that RC had (and his selected employees) created these great teams on a shoestring budget was little more than miraculous. Sheer ignorance caused the Chase backlash at the time.... and it''s sheer ignorance that is perpetuating the myth.As for the lack of any Delia Smith protests? Given that her tenure has been abysmal throughout, and the teams put out on the field secondary to the tablecloths and cutlery.... the apathy which allowed her to so cynically control her rustic flock simply continued. Any dissent (even on here) was ridiculed... and the CR spin machine manipulated the media to put the blame elsewhere.... primarily at the feet of the hapless Worthington. The ''Worthington Out'' farce should have been the ''Smith Out'' campaign.... but again the fanbase was cynically sidetracked..The club has become a transvestite, unsure of what it is.... and the engineered ''family audience'' simply going to a show to keep ''little Johnny'' entertained.

[Budgie 0]

That is one of the most ridicual things I have read on here recently.

You can''t applaud a major shareholder for success on a shoe string budget. You can only applaud the managers under him.

It is like applauding banks for not lending to small businesses for the success of those small businesses. Your logic is very scewed.

[. 0]

[quote user="Budgie"]That is one of the most ridicual things I have read on here recently.

You can''t applaud a major shareholder for success on a shoe string budget. You can only applaud the managers under him.

It is like applauding banks for not lending to small businesses for the success of those small businesses. Your logic is very scewed.[/quote]Bollox..... Would you like a list of the ''budget'' signings made by Robert Chase.... many of whom were later sold on for very large sums? It''s not how much you spend..... it''s how you choose to spend it. Time to get your books out and see just who the great man brought to Carrow Road during his reign.

[Budgie 0]

So Chase was buying the players was he?

Silly me. There was me thinking the likes of Stringer and Walker were the brains behind our giant killing squad of the 90s. How silly of me.

Of course you are right about Chase dismantling that squad by selling off our best players for a tasty profit only to never be reinvested back into the team.

[lappinitup 629]

[quote user="The Butler"]Taking the view of some posters on this forum Cluck there was nothing wrong personaly with Adolph.It was just his running of Germany that was the problem.

[/quote]Adolph was just lucky there was no NCISA around at the time to get him out......

 

[;)]

[. 0]

[quote user="lappinitup"]

[quote user="The Butler"]Taking the view of some posters on this forum Cluck there was nothing wrong personaly with Adolph.It was just his running of Germany that was the problem.

[/quote]Adolph was just lucky there was no NCISA around at the time to get him out......

 

[;)]

[/quote]We at the ''all-new'' NCISA wouldn''t have given him the Chancellorship in the first place....A simple case of tanks..... but no tanks.