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shefcanary

Question to Tangy on the Club's property development portfolio

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Hi Tangy

Just seen this article on Arsenal and how they have turned around their property arm.  From hereon in it will provide substantials funds for the football business.  Yes there were scares along the way but they held their nerve.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11403202

Of course this is easy to do in Islington, London, but are you still of the view that NCFC should never have dabbled or is there a more long term view that perhaps investment in property will eventually make a return.  Given McNally''s comments in the paper today, couldn''t the property side of the business have been properly managed by someone like him earlier alongside the football business.  Isn''t the only issue in the past being to have appointted a professional corporate guy (Doomcaster) rather than a wheeling dealmaker like McNally? 

You will get from this I am still not fully convinced that going down the property route was wrong - it was just badly managed .  and yes I do recognise the chances of a big return in the next few years are slim.  However once the returns do flow, it will stand the club in good stead although some of us might not be here to see it!

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Hi Shefcanary,

I''ve been briefly looking at Arsenal''s accounts for a while now, so the move out of debt re the property side doesn''t surprise me. Moreover the last time I looked at their Balance Sheet they had about £90m - £100m of cash (the net debt figure is after offsetting any cash against the debt).

One thing to consider about Arsenal is that they have owned Highbury (the old ground) presumably for quite a while and may be the other bits of land too and it depends on whether the land values are in their Accounts at revalued values (unfortunately I haven''t got time to check) or at old (understated) values. Furthermore they already owned Highbury so when they moved to the Emirates they had to do something with that site. In addition (and I stand to be corrected on this) I would have thought that the demand for housing in London and especially in the better parts would help Arsenal''s property business.

Whereas NCFC bought land (under the Delia/MWJ regime) relatively recently and along way into an economic cycle giving little time for an uplift in values before reselling the land (People should note that this is about economic cycles and not the smokescreen of the credit crunch and Investment Bankers).  Somewhere in my old posts I stated that the club needed somebody on the NCFC board with experience in development  and finally we have Bowkett (who was Chairman of Redrow) and his contacts.

As for saying the property side at NCFC has been badly managed, I have to agree and I suspect that if Bowkett had been our Chairman at the time I really wonder if NCFC would have bought the ex LSE land and ex Norwich city Council land.  With respect to returns its going to take something to recover the cost of the land  purchased  and the interest paid to date...creeping up towards £7m.  However it wouldn''t surprise me if the club decided to move on the land if they got a reasonable offer by todays prices.

 

 

 

 

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I hope they release this thread as a comic book, I decided to go ahead and design a cover for it.[img]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_zEwW-8xVEsk/TBk8HScEudI/AAAAAAAAAc0/8PbRVas9BcM/s1600/boring_C.gif[/img]

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[quote user="Tangible Fixed Assets anyone"]

Hey Mr Chops,

I appreciate its an intellectual challenge for you to read such posts and comment in an intelligent way.......so move on.

Ta.

[/quote]I can read it and understand it, and that''s why I know it''s boring.[img]http://www.thisordinarylife.com/images/boring.jpg[/img]

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[quote user="Mr. Chops"][quote user="Tangible Fixed Assets anyone"]

Hey Mr Chops,

I appreciate its an intellectual challenge for you to read such posts and comment in an intelligent way.......so move on.

Ta.

[/quote]I can read it and understand it, and that''s why I know it''s boring.[img]http://www.thisordinarylife.com/images/boring.jpg[/img][/quote]So don''t f**king read it then you tit.

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[quote user="crafty canary"][quote user="Mr. Chops"][quote user="Tangible Fixed Assets anyone"]

Hey Mr Chops,

I appreciate its an intellectual challenge for you to read such posts and comment in an intelligent way.......so move on.

Ta.

[/quote]

I can read it and understand it, and that''s why I know it''s boring.

[img]http://www.thisordinarylife.com/images/boring.jpg[/img]

[/quote]

So don''t f**king read it then you tit.


[/quote]

 ...Phorr, there’s something funny round ‘ere. What is it?
Oh, it’s you... come ‘ere and sit down.
You’re gonna ‘ave the truth told about you and put on record.
‘Ere, please do not sit too close to me, I’ve just ‘ad my breakfast, thank you.

Who put salt in the sugar bowl? Who put fireworks in the coal?
Who put a real live toad-in-the-’ole? My brother!
Who put jam in mother’s shoe? Who made real caterpillar stew?
Who locked Grandad in the loo?... My brother!

My brother said it wasn’t he, who put shampoo in Grandma’s tea
My brother said that it was me – my brother’s rotten.
Who squeezed toothpaste round the hall? Who put soot in the baby’s ball?
Who drew things on the garden wall?... My brother!

You wanna see what he drew. Phorr, what a surprise.
Nobody knew what it was really, but everybody ‘ad a jolly good idea.
An’ ‘e wrote slogans. “Down with young mothers”, that was one.
‘Cos ‘e don’t think my mum knows ‘ow to brings us up right... I don’t think so either.
You know, every night when we’re wide awake, she makes us go to bed.
And then in the morning when we’re fast asleep, she makes us get up.

Whose pet mouse made Auntie shriek? Who ate glue and couldn’t speak?
What clever dick was sick for a week? My brother!
Who keeps maggots in a tin? Plays the twist on ‘is violin?
Who’s been gettin’ at the gin?... My brother!

He looks just like a chimney sweep, but dirt, they say, is just skin deep.
I know he’s good when he’s asleep. But you don’t know what he’s dreamin’ about do ya?
Who wouldn’t mind if I ride his bike? Who let’s me shoot his gun if I like?
Who says I’m best at - football, ludo, snakes & ladders, ‘ide & seek,
Chasin’ each other up an’ down the garden, pinching little girls up the ‘igh street.
Well, he’s gotta say I’m best, ‘cos I’m bigger than ‘e is An’ if ‘e don’t say I’m best at everything...
I’ll bash ‘im. Ha Ha. My lovely, lovely brother.

Come on, come on mate, let’s get you out of ‘ere before you fall down the ‘ole in the middle.
Come on, give us yer ‘and, we’re gonna walk …..
‘Ere, ‘ere, what ‘ave you ‘ad in yer ‘and?...
‘Ave yer? Phorr!!

 

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Well I''m no good at singing Tangie and we''d need to find a better name than The Luddite Brothers...

Maybe Captain Ludd & the Luddites.....

 

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[quote user="Turgid Financial Assumptions anyone"]

Another Luddite has arrived on the scene.

Only a matter of time before Capt Ludd arrives.

Nutty when are you starting your pop group,  the Luddite Brothers? Capt Ludd and Mr Chops could be your backing singers

[/quote]

"You never break a sweat any more when I check your accounts.....there''s no structural assets written off, not even small amounts...You''re trying hard not to show it - TangyBut Tangy - Tangy, I know itYou love that Luddite Feelin''whoa-whoa, that luddite feelin''You love that Luddite Feelin''Shame Doomy''s gone - gone - gone -Still you''ll carry onwhoa-whoa [|-)]"

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[quote user="crafty canary"][quote user="Mr. Chops"][quote user="Tangible Fixed Assets anyone"]

Hey Mr Chops,

I appreciate its an intellectual challenge for you to read such posts and comment in an intelligent way.......so move on.

Ta.

[/quote]I can read it and understand it, and that''s why I know it''s boring.[img]http://www.thisordinarylife.com/images/boring.jpg[/img][/quote]So don''t f**king read it then you tit.

[/quote]But I wouldn''t have found out how boring it was until I had read it.  Or would you rather I decided on the content of posts before reading them?Why is a raven like a writing desk?

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

 

[/quote]How strange that "the leader of the Luddites" is dressed in womens clothing as this was actually behaviour associated with the "Rebbecca" Rioters not the Luddites, but the engraving pictured is dated 1812 (on wiki) yet the Rebbecca Riots didn''t occur until nearly 30 years later. A veritable minefield of conflict these financial threads....

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Think the thing here is that the Thread is addressed to tangy, if it was an open post or (even better) sent by PM, it would not have got the repsonses it did.

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="Mr. Chops"]


Why is a raven like a writing desk?

[/quote]

I give it up..........

What''s the answer?

[/quote]

When Edgar Allan Poe wrote "The Raven" he wanted to focus on a creature that could not reason but yet was able to create words. Perhaps this is how Mr. Chops sees Crafty sitting at his desk. [:)]

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="Mr. Chops"]

Why is a raven like a writing desk?[/quote]

I give it up..........

What''s the answer?

 

[/quote]Nutty, if you really need the answer (I suspect you know it) then - to quote Grace Slick of Jefferson Airplane:"Go ask Alice when she''s ten feet tall."

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="Mr. Chops"]


Why is a raven like a writing desk?

[/quote]

I give it up..........

What''s the answer?


 

[/quote]

Nutty, if you really need the answer (I suspect you know it) then - to quote Grace Slick of Jefferson Airplane:

"Go ask Alice when she''s ten feet tall."


[/quote]

I think Mister might do something better with the time than wasting it in asking riddles that have no answers.

 

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