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Bryangunnshairline

our club is driving the working class fans away

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[quote user="Andy Larkin"][quote user="morty"][quote user="Andy Larkin"]Mr C… you have forgotten to mention a very different workplace from a year ago… to some people that are living on the breadline a shift in terms of a few pounds really does make a difference as to going or not… the threat of impending redundancy or pay-freeze or pay-reductions. Football may be the be-all-and-end-all to some, but to others it doesn''t replace food on the table, bills paid or school uniforms.

Also, I just can''t buy into this "casual ticket and you''re not a supporter" bol lox… from when I was 10 until I bought my first season ticket in the Play Off year I only missed a handful of games in what was 25/26 years. The fact that I was always a "casual" supporter made me no less a "supporter" nor any more a "spectator"… I was there when we struggled to get 15 - 16,000 when we were top of the Prem.

Are the missing 10,000 that have subsequently turned up from those days any more a supporter cos I have once again reverted to my casual ticket buying existence?
[/quote]

Sorry, but who mentioned that they thought casual ticket buyers were less of a supporter? I have not seen it mentioned in this thread.
[/quote]

See the parenthesis on Mr Carrow''s "supporters" above my last post… along with previous references from others on the £31 per ticket posting from a few days back
[/quote]

I wouldn`t question whether casual supporters are real supporters because i am one myself- due to not being able to do evening games (work) and usually spending a large part of the season travelling.  If someone has gone from working to unemployed then obviously i feel for them, but it is unlikely they would do games if they were a few quid cheaper isn`t it? 

The point i am trying to make (probably badly) is that most casual supporters go to several games per season and that the only way they are being "priced out" is that they may have to go to a few less than normal to make up for the increases.  The club is banking on still selling those spare seats as there has generally been extra demand in recent years- for example, i had to go in the away end v. Swindon last season as there was literally NO ticket to be had in home areas ten minutes before kick-off.

As for the "breadline" argument, i work part-time with other part-timers and i know nobody on the breadline.  Most people drive when they could walk/cycle, buy junk food and expensive coffee, go for a few pints a few times a week, smoke etc.,etc.  I`m sure people exist who went to 5-10 games last season but can now afford none, but i would think the number would be tiny and i`m not quite sure why a club at last showing some drive and ambition to give us a decent team on the pitch should be worried about the misfortune of a small number of people.

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[quote user="Mello Yello"]

[quote user="First Wizard"][quote user="ron obvious"]Blimey, Wiz spent 8% + of his earnings on chocolate? What would that be today? He must have been made of the stuff.A chocolate brain would explain a lot ........

[/quote]Err, I was still at middle school![/quote]

Was it approved? Borstal Comprehensive or something similar.....maybe?

[/quote]

Bogwarts perchance?

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[quote user="morty"]Its not about what has happened in the last 25 years. Its about what we have to spend on players, right now.And someone committing to go to every single game of the season is contributing more cash to the coffers, thats the plain fact of it. No one is calling anyone disloyal, and I think you are over reacting a

little. And if you have become so disillusioned with the football today,

you can always choose not to go.[/quote]If I went to every remaining home game this season on a casual basis I''ll end up paying more than a season ticket holder! Therefore I would be more loyal and contributing more to the coffers of the club than you judging by your calculation!And besides, its not over-reacting, its simply getting pee''d off with having my loyalty (or lesser brand of loyalty) called into question!How far would you go in financially supporting the club to reach the top? How much of an increase would it take for you to say "That''s it, I''ve had enough"? I think that point has been reached by a number of people this season… which I believe was the original poster''s point.

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[quote user="......and Smith must score."][quote user="morty"][quote user="Bryangunnshairline"]not at all just pointing out the fact that it always goes back to the fans.

I tel you what im doing. Im going to eat and drink else where before a game from now on where I get value for money and get someone in norwich to collect my away tickets so I dont have to pay the booking fee.

I would happily pay abit more for my season ticket next season but not on beer because its not value for money. Its a crap pint when the pumps are working and you can get a nicer pint for less 5 mins away.

My point here is if others think sod it I will eat and drink elsewhere then surely the club will lose out?[/quote]Its all about choice. I very rarely have a beer at the ground, I buy my kids sweets and drinks from Morrissons. People will still pay the prices, just look at the queues at half time at the refreshment kiosks.Yes it is all about the fans, always has been. Norwich city is a big football shop where we all go to buy footy. But the difference is that, unlike other shops, if we find a cheaper one elsewhere we are unlikely to go and shop there.We may moan and groan, but we''ll still pay the prices.[/quote]I''m not sure they will Morty.It was very noticeable on the concourse in the Jarrold Stand at half time that the queues were less normal. Whether this was as a result of Mr McNally''s ingenious assertion that '' rounding up '' prices would speed things along or that people felt they were getting ripped off is anybody''s guess.My own guess is that people didn''t want to pay the prices. Having arrived at Carrow Road on Friday I discovered that the price of a cup of coffee has increased by 25% to £2.00. This immediately put me off and the Club lost out on what would have been an easy sale at the old price.On the occasions when I arrive after a few beers the new prices will of course seem very reasonable and I won''t even look at the price, but, as the vast majority of fans attend games stone cold sober I think the Club has to be very careful it doesn''t kill the golden goose by pushing supporters just that bit too far.......[/quote]I think they will still pay, and that a lot of what is going on right now is just the usual mumbling and grumbling. I agree the coffee is a blatant rip off though, and if I want one I go to Costa before the game.Only time will tell if it is a marketing masterstroke by the lad McNally or a step too far.

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Whatever way you put it, a game of football is not worth £31.  In a million years.  I have a season ticket, and I almost blindly accept the monthly direct debit without really thinking about it.  However, had I have parted with £60 odd on Friday night for me and my wife, then I would have been fuming.  Or to put it another way, I wouldn''t have gone in the first place.  I love NCFC, have been a season ticket holder for 30 years (since the age of 4) but I would not pay that kind of money to watch them. If that makes me less of a fan, then fine. A game of footbal should cost £10-£15.  

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[quote user="Andy Larkin"][quote user="morty"]Its not about what has happened in the last 25 years. Its about what we have to spend on players, right now.And someone committing to go to every single game of the season is contributing more cash to the coffers, thats the plain fact of it. No one is calling anyone disloyal, and I think you are over reacting a

little. And if you have become so disillusioned with the football today,

you can always choose not to go.[/quote]If I went to every remaining home game this season on a casual basis I''ll end up paying more than a season ticket holder! Therefore I would be more loyal and contributing more to the coffers of the club than you judging by your calculation!And besides, its not over-reacting, its simply getting pee''d off with having my loyalty (or lesser brand of loyalty) called into question!How far would you go in financially supporting the club to reach the top? How much of an increase would it take for you to say "That''s it, I''ve had enough"? I think that point has been reached by a number of people this season… which I believe was the original poster''s point.[/quote]But they already have my money, guaranteed, whether I decide to go or not. More fool you if you choose to go to every game on a casual basis lol. I decide, on a season to season basis on whether or not I consider it value for money, and if I can afford it, its as simple as that, football is an entertainment, and therefore a luxury, its more important to be able to afford to live.I think a lot of this is knee jerk reaction, coupled with the fact that people are watching the pennies a little more right now, there is a recession on, after all.

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[quote user="No Quarter"]Whatever way you put it, a game of football is not worth £31.  In a million years.  I have a season ticket, and I almost blindly accept the monthly direct debit without really thinking about it.  However, had I have parted with £60 odd on Friday night for me and my wife, then I would have been fuming.  Or to put it another way, I wouldn''t have gone in the first place.  I love NCFC, have been a season ticket holder for 30 years (since the age of 4) but I would not pay that kind of money to watch them. If that makes me less of a fan, then fine. A game of footbal should cost £10-£15.  [/quote]Lol, but it doesn''t cost that, and a bag of chips is no longer 2 shillings either.No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.[:)]

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="No Quarter"]Whatever way you put it, a game of football is not worth £31.  In a million years.  I have a season ticket, and I almost blindly accept the monthly direct debit without really thinking about it.  However, had I have parted with £60 odd on Friday night for me and my wife, then I would have been fuming.  Or to put it another way, I wouldn''t have gone in the first place.  I love NCFC, have been a season ticket holder for 30 years (since the age of 4) but I would not pay that kind of money to watch them. If that makes me less of a fan, then fine. A game of footbal should cost £10-£15.  [/quote]

Lol, but it doesn''t cost that, and a bag of chips is no longer 2 shillings either.

No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.

[:)]
[/quote]

I''m 35....not 95.  I even recognise your Cube signature, although Death Certificate kicks the arse off the Predator........

 

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="No Quarter"]Whatever way you put it, a game of football is not worth £31.  In a million years.  I have a season ticket, and I almost blindly accept the monthly direct debit without really thinking about it.  However, had I have parted with £60 odd on Friday night for me and my wife, then I would have been fuming.  Or to put it another way, I wouldn''t have gone in the first place.  I love NCFC, have been a season ticket holder for 30 years (since the age of 4) but I would not pay that kind of money to watch them. If that makes me less of a fan, then fine. A game of footbal should cost £10-£15.  [/quote]

Lol, but it doesn''t cost that, and a bag of chips is no longer 2 shillings either.

No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.

[:)]
[/quote]Totally agree morty, but, you get crucified on here if you dare admit it!

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[quote user="First Wizard"][quote user="morty"][quote user="No Quarter"]Whatever way you put it, a game of football is not worth £31.  In a million years.  I have a season ticket, and I almost blindly accept the monthly direct debit without really thinking about it.  However, had I have parted with £60 odd on Friday night for me and my wife, then I would have been fuming.  Or to put it another way, I wouldn''t have gone in the first place.  I love NCFC, have been a season ticket holder for 30 years (since the age of 4) but I would not pay that kind of money to watch them. If that makes me less of a fan, then fine. A game of footbal should cost £10-£15.  [/quote]Lol, but it doesn''t cost that, and a bag of chips is no longer 2 shillings either.No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.[:)][/quote]Totally agree morty, but, you get crucified on here if you dare admit it![/quote]The football club is a business, and thankfully they are now running it like one. It doesn''t owe the community anything, it need show no loyalty to people who used to pay a groat to go and stand in the Barclay and piss down the backs of peoples legs.The prices have to go up so we can compete, and unfortunately if you don''t have the required sheckels, then its dodgy internet streams and Radio Snorefolk all the way for you.Sorry, thats the facts.[:)]

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="First Wizard"][quote user="morty"][quote user="No Quarter"]Whatever way you put it, a game of football is not worth £31.  In a million years.  I have a season ticket, and I almost blindly accept the monthly direct debit without really thinking about it.  However, had I have parted with £60 odd on Friday night for me and my wife, then I would have been fuming.  Or to put it another way, I wouldn''t have gone in the first place.  I love NCFC, have been a season ticket holder for 30 years (since the age of 4) but I would not pay that kind of money to watch them. If that makes me less of a fan, then fine. A game of footbal should cost £10-£15.  [/quote]

Lol, but it doesn''t cost that, and a bag of chips is no longer 2 shillings either.

No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.

[:)]
[/quote]Totally agree morty, but, you get crucified on here if you dare admit it![/quote]

The football club is a business, and thankfully they are now running it like one. It doesn''t owe the community anything, it need show no loyalty to people who used to pay a groat to go and stand in the Barclay and piss down the backs of peoples legs.

The prices have to go up so we can compete, and unfortunately if you don''t have the required sheckels, then its dodgy internet streams and Radio Snorefolk all the way for you.

Sorry, thats the facts.

[:)]
[/quote]But we can''t even compete financially now, footy''s gone bonkers as Delia said in todays EDP.

League 1 imo, has more honest to goodness equal status about it then where we are now.

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It shocks me to see morty has gotten something right for once. Regardless what is paid for single game tickets, the season ticket holder shows more loyalty by committing his money well BEFORE knowing how good the end product is. Others can jump on and off the bandwagon at will. Big props to the season ticket holders. Even morty.

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[quote user="First Wizard"]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="First Wizard"][quote user="morty"][quote user="No Quarter"]Whatever way you put it, a game of football is not worth £31.  In a million years.  I have a season ticket, and I almost blindly accept the monthly direct debit without really thinking about it.  However, had I have parted with £60 odd on Friday night for me and my wife, then I would have been fuming.  Or to put it another way, I wouldn''t have gone in the first place.  I love NCFC, have been a season ticket holder for 30 years (since the age of 4) but I would not pay that kind of money to watch them. If that makes me less of a fan, then fine. A game of footbal should cost £10-£15.  [/quote]Lol, but it doesn''t cost that, and a bag of chips is no longer 2 shillings either.No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.[:)][/quote]Totally agree morty, but, you get crucified on here if you dare admit it![/quote]The football club is a business, and thankfully they are now running it like one. It doesn''t owe the community anything, it need show no loyalty to people who used to pay a groat to go and stand in the Barclay and piss down the backs of peoples legs.The prices have to go up so we can compete, and unfortunately if you don''t have the required sheckels, then its dodgy internet streams and Radio Snorefolk all the way for you.Sorry, thats the facts.[:)][/quote]But we can''t even compete financially now, footy''s gone bonkers as Delia said in todays EDP.

League 1 imo, has more honest to goodness equal status about it then where we are now.

[/quote]Football has always been about the "haves" and the "have nots", its just that the "haves" have a lot more now. League 1 didn''t have equal status, its just that we were the bigger fish in the pond, which gave us "have" status temporarily.

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[quote user="Houston Canary"]It shocks me to see morty has gotten something right for once. Regardless what is paid for single game tickets, the season ticket holder shows more loyalty by committing his money well BEFORE knowing how good the end product is. Others can jump on and off the bandwagon at will. Big props to the season ticket holders. Even morty.[/quote]No he''s wrong imo Houston, all it proves is that some fans have more money than others or less call on their income than others............and its going to get worse, not better.

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[quote user="First Wizard"][quote user="Houston Canary"]It shocks me to see morty has gotten something right for once. Regardless what is paid for single game tickets, the season ticket holder shows more loyalty by committing his money well BEFORE knowing how good the end product is. Others can jump on and off the bandwagon at will. Big props to the season ticket holders. Even morty.[/quote]No he''s wrong imo Houston, all it proves is that some fans have more money than others or less call on their income than others............and its going to get worse, not better.[/quote]Wiz, thats life, some people have more than others.Some eat beans, others eat steak.Norwich City is a business, not a charity.

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Why on earth are posters on here  harping on about season tickets the OP was talking about the casual ticket prices. We all know a season ticket is good value and £31 is not ,and it is a price i will never pay so that rules me out of   CAT A  games.

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Well, that''s it then....The club isn''t driving the working class fans away....The club hasn''t introduced a dress-code yet.

But, I''ve certainly made my savings elsewhere....I don''t purchase a programme - as they only end up as placebo loft insulation.  I rarely buy club merchandise - unless I really, really, have to.....and I don''t buy any munchies or drinks in the stadium....and haven''t done so - for as long as I can remember.

I drink before and after the game where it''s cost-effective, and eat where it''s good value.... and sometimes where my season ticket gets me 20% off.

Is the football value for money? Well, I pay £500+ and to me, that''s more than ample for the present product...

I also claimed my rebate - and we still got promoted....RESULT!

 

 

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Interesting discussions on this thread, with good points made by both ''sides''.

I just find it amusing/sad that anyone would have watched the game at home on Sky in protest at the high entry prices and anti-social timing...

Yes, it''s BECAUSE of the masses, paying Murdoch''s people a monthly retainer to ruin the game they love, that the wages spiral started & continues.

"O rose, thou art sick. The invisible worm that flies by night in the howling storm has found out thy bed of crimson joy, and his dark secret love does thy life destroy."

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No it shows the level of commitment, FW. morty has paid for what may turn out to be a shower of shix. He will be at the next game. 1000s of others who were thinking of going held onto their money after the Friday debacle. That is not loyalty.

The whole ''what about the poor'' arguement is a straw dog. It was pointed out prices are consistent with wages. Maybe wanting to go to games might inspire the few destitute supporters to improve their lot in life. As such, raising prices could be seen as community aid.

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[quote user="morty"]

Wiz, thats life, some people have more than others.Some eat beans, others eat steak.Norwich City is a business, not a charity.[/quote]Morty, no-one is arguing against any of that. The point you seem unable or unwilling to understand ("No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.") is indeed a very simple one.If, as seems likely, the new guard is intent on a general policy of raising prices (casual tickets, food and drink etc) then it will need to be very careful to get the balance right, particularly when it comes to season tickets, in what is going to be an increasingly difficult economic climate. If it gets the balance wrong (and it will be easier to get it wrong than to get it right) then it will end up being counter-productive.In short, get it wrong and the planned extra income will not materialise (indeed, income will fall) because fewer people (enough fewer to tip the balance) will be paying the higher prices.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="morty"]


Wiz, thats life, some people have more than others.

Some eat beans, others eat steak.

Norwich City is a business, not a charity.
[/quote]

Morty, no-one is arguing against any of that. The point you seem unable or unwilling to understand ("No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.") is indeed a very simple one.

If, as seems likely, the new guard is intent on a general policy of raising prices (casual tickets, food and drink etc) then it will need to be very careful to get the balance right, particularly when it comes to season tickets, in what is going to be an increasingly difficult economic climate. If it gets the balance wrong (and it will be easier to get it wrong than to get it right) then it will end up being counter-productive.

In short, get it wrong and the planned extra income will not materialise (indeed, income will fall) because fewer people (enough fewer to tip the balance) will be paying the higher prices.
[/quote]

And It all will be affected, on how our season pans out....

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="morty"]

Wiz, thats life, some people have more than others.Some eat beans, others eat steak.Norwich City is a business, not a charity.[/quote]Morty, no-one is arguing against any of that. The point you seem unable or unwilling to understand ("No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.") is indeed a very simple one.If, as seems likely, the new guard is intent on a general policy of raising prices (casual tickets, food and drink etc) then it will need to be very careful to get the balance right, particularly when it comes to season tickets, in what is going to be an increasingly difficult economic climate. If it gets the balance wrong (and it will be easier to get it wrong than to get it right) then it will end up being counter-productive.In short, get it wrong and the planned extra income will not materialise (indeed, income will fall) because fewer people (enough fewer to tip the balance) will be paying the higher prices.[/quote]Yes, that point is obvious. But weren''t we all lauding our sleek, professional board and management team, and shouldn''t we be trusting them to get this right? There is obviously a tipping point, and I would hope that before we ever reach it, corrective action is taken.

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="morty"]

Wiz, thats life, some people have more than others.Some eat beans, others eat steak.Norwich City is a business, not a charity.[/quote]Morty, no-one is arguing against any of that. The point you seem unable or unwilling to understand ("No one is forcing anyone into Carrow road, if you can''t afford the price, you can''t go, it really couldn''t be simpler.") is indeed a very simple one.If, as seems likely, the new guard is intent on a general policy of raising prices (casual tickets, food and drink etc) then it will need to be very careful to get the balance right, particularly when it comes to season tickets, in what is going to be an increasingly difficult economic climate. If it gets the balance wrong (and it will be easier to get it wrong than to get it right) then it will end up being counter-productive.In short, get it wrong and the planned extra income will not materialise (indeed, income will fall) because fewer people (enough fewer to tip the balance) will be paying the higher prices.[/quote]Yes, that point is obvious. But weren''t we all lauding our sleek, professional board and management team, and shouldn''t we be trusting them to get this right?[/quote]Er, no. Not if "we all" is meant to include me. No and no. No to the lauding bit. And certainly no to the trusting bit.

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The prices in the ground are too expensive, I  thought that there had been a mistake  when I bought a drink at the Newcastle game, a lot of people will use the catering oppertunities outside the ground rather than enjoy something to eat and drink inside cos they cant afford it.

You can  debate the issue all you like but if you cant afford the prices you will go elsewhere, reluctantly I think this is what I will have to do with my family. 

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Also, there is a world of difference between whether you can physically afford something, or whether you actually think its worth the price it''s being sold for. I am lucky enough to be able to afford £31 for a football match, but is it worth it?? Not in a million years!

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[quote user="thefutureisyellow"]

The prices in the ground are too expensive, I  thought that there had been a mistake  when I bought a drink at the Newcastle game, a lot of people will use the catering oppertunities outside the ground rather than enjoy something to eat and drink inside cos they cant afford it.

You can  debate the issue all you like but if you cant afford the prices you will go elsewhere, reluctantly I think this is what I will have to do with my family. 

[/quote]

Agree with you entirely.Read my article on www.ncisa.co.uk

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I''m surprised people have stuck with buying stuff within the ground for so long, its been overpriced for years now! I may have the odd beer at half time very occasionally, but anything my kids eat or drink usually comes from Morrissons.

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[quote user="thefutureisyellow"]

The prices in the ground are too expensive, I  thought that there had been a mistake  when I bought a drink at the Newcastle game, a lot of people will use the catering oppertunities outside the ground rather than enjoy something to eat and drink inside cos they cant afford it.

You can  debate the issue all you like but if you cant afford the prices you will go elsewhere, reluctantly I think this is what I will have to do with my family. 

[/quote]Yep. Im home for the Swansea game, and just found out its Category A, £31 (For Swansea?? Hardly the most glamourous of games). As much as I want to go, im not sure I can justify it. If those are the prices then so be it, im sure the club will find the best price to fit the supply and demand; But it is a shame that football has gone this way.Having said that I go to watch London Irish play every now and again, and they cost over £20 to watch. Test match cricket costs over £50, in grounds that arent sold out, so its not just football.

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Christ almighty... we just get over the ''Saviour Delia'' crap and now we''re crowning the new boardroom bunch as god-like.Head out of arse time Mort and realisation that the club are just after our money and basically couldn''t give a toss about the fan in the stands. We are a necessary evil required to fund Delia''s toy-box.... whoever the front man may now appear to be.Nothing has changed at NCFC and it won''t do until Smith is gone.

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[quote user="Cluck"]Christ almighty... we just get over the ''Saviour Delia'' crap and now we''re crowning the new boardroom bunch as god-like.Head out of arse time Mort and realisation that the club are just after our money and basically couldn''t give a toss about the fan in the stands. We are a necessary evil required to fund Delia''s toy-box.... whoever the front man may now appear to be.Nothing has changed at NCFC and it won''t do until Smith is gone.[/quote]My heads not in my arse, of course I know they only want our money.Your Delia fixation is tiresome lol.

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