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William Darby

Has the club learnt anything today?

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As a couple of people have asked me to respond to this thread I would like to confirm that I was NEVER on the pricing/season ticket working group.Somewhere in my old files I have a list of the last people who were on it but I NEVER was.I was on ''Image & Identity'' (always made me laugh!) and ''Communications'' (equally and ironically hilarious!). Both these groups met very infrequently and trying desperately to recall such incidental matters from over 3 years ago I think I attended 3 or 4 meetings across both those groups in the time I was on the SCG.I hope this clears up any confusion or misapprehensions anyone may have.

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[quote user="LQ"]As a couple of people have asked me to respond to this thread I would like to confirm that I was NEVER on the pricing/season ticket working group.Somewhere in my old files I have a list of the last people who were on it but I NEVER was.I was on ''Image & Identity'' (always made me laugh!) and ''Communications'' (equally and ironically hilarious!). Both these groups met very infrequently and trying desperately to recall such incidental matters from over 3 years ago I think I attended 3 or 4 meetings across both those groups in the time I was on the SCG.I hope this clears up any confusion or misapprehensions anyone may have.[/quote]Why was I never told there was a communications group?

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[quote user="Davo"]Butler said: "I hate stating what seems the obvious but is it not even more essential that the fans have a strong voice through NCISA or some other fans organisation. If not the CLUB will just do as it wishes when it wishes to and an individual voice will not even register." Butler while I agree with you it depends on what type of organisation NCISA actually is. Is it the type of organisation that stands back from the club and then tuts and shakes it''s head when the club does something it like? Or is it the type of organisation that goes to the club and says "Look our members have a problem with this thing your doing here, why don''t we sit down and try to come up with a more suitable solution for club and fans?" I get the feeling that NCISA is more along the lines of the former when I would prefer the latter. With the dissolution of the SCG there''s an opening for something like this. Maybe you''ve tried to do this but the club have refused you, I don''t know and I can''t remember reading anything about a topic like this. Davo[/quote]

We ALL support the club and no way do we seek confrontation.

In my view if we can sit down with the powers that be, with a large group of supporters behind us,put forward those supporters views and discuss an amicable solution, then that must be the way forward to resolve percieved and real problems.

Whilst there are so many small groups  and individuals then it is easier for the club to ignore those views.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="GMF"]John, thanks for the clarification. In the absence of any further clarifiaction from the Club, I''m still not sure if this was a straight "lift and shift" for the members of the old SCG working groups into the new regime? Nevertheless, the Club certainly seems wanting in implementing the new changes! Not sure if your contact with Joe was in a personal or NCISA capacity but perhaps this is something NCISA should be picking up the batton on in due course?[/quote]

GMF, in reply to this, and your earlier post, I have already asked for clarification from the club as to what the position is, and specifically whether or not these groups have ever met.
[/quote]

There is no question that these groups have met but they have not met for many many months.These meeting were called by the Club as they were chaired by a member of Club staff who arranged the dates.

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GMF - I was under the impression that the club still had five supporter working groups as outlined on the website. I have no idea when these groups last met but wonder if there has been any reason for them to meet. What concerns have we had that they needed to discuss? One thing I noticed in the customer charter was the possibility of having a category for supporters with five ticket stubs when there are limited tickets available for away games. Is this new or has that always been in there? If it''s new how did it get there without consultation with fans or fans representatives?

 

My problem with supporters pressure groups is that they only ever have a large group of supporters urging them into battle when the football team are disappointing them. There would certainly not be a large group of supporters behind them over ticketing, refreshment prices or any of the other things that the SCG may have got to grips with. That''s why these supporters working groups are much better for these issues.

 

I wonder what the ratio is between the numbers of fans who contacted nCIsA over issues like sacking the manager and the numbers of fans who contacted them over issues like the allocation of away tickets. I reckon the former is hundreds of times more!

 

I can''t see Bowkett and McNally being so eager to be told how to run the club by all and sundry in the same way that Roger Munby would.

 

 

 

 

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[quote user="LQ"]As a couple of people have asked me to respond to this thread I would like to confirm that I was NEVER on the pricing/season ticket working group.

Somewhere in my old files I have a list of the last people who were on it but I NEVER was.

I was on ''Image & Identity'' (always made me laugh!) and ''Communications'' (equally and ironically hilarious!). Both these groups met very infrequently and trying desperately to recall such incidental matters from over 3 years ago I think I attended 3 or 4 meetings across both those groups in the time I was on the SCG.

I hope this clears up any confusion or misapprehensions anyone may have.


[/quote]

Lisa i am not going to enter into a war of words with you over this but i think your word NEVER refers to them not meeting since you were invited via an e-mail to take part as the SCG was disbanded shortly afterwards.I assumed that these groups had been meeting but now realise they had not so apologies for that.How good to see that the two other groups made you laugh and were hilarious.Just a pity you did not share your view at the time then maybe you could have been replaced by someone who took them more seriously.

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I''m not interested in debating something with you, John, that you constantly change the goalposts on.First you said you were at the meeting when I was asked and agreed to join the Pricing Working Group - then suddenly I was invited by email which you obviously have access to. That email conversation actually contained my serious reservations about joining and I only agreed after I had been assured it would not be anything like the old SCG pricing group and would, in fact, encompass wider issues and supporter relations with a far greater degree of transparency.I think everyone is pretty clear on how that plan eventually worked out.Additionally making sad jibes about my attitude to the working groups I was on is, even for you, rather childish. The whole point of putting the titles of the working groups in inverted commas and following them with my comments was to indicate that the titles themselves were funny - or I found them so anyway, especially given how things worked out.I never go into anything, work or play, without the intention of giving of my all.You have clearly demonstrated why I find it impossible to post on here or any other forum anymore. Petty digs and misinterpretation along with weird suppositions, fairy stories and "FACTS!!!!!!" dished out consistently really do make it impossible for me to offer any opinion or even be a little light-hearted.

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---As I raised the question of these working groups, some points:

1. Good to see LQ back, if only for a comet-like appearance, swooshing

across the cyber heavens. This is entirely a guess, but I strongly

suspect that what she found hilarious (as would anyone with a brain and a

sense of humour) about those groups she mentioned were the

managementspeak titles - not the work of the groups.

2. The point is not whether these groups have ever met, but whether -

which is yet to be established - they''ve met SINCE the SCG was

disbanded. When that happened the club was keen to stress that these

groups would be a key part of the way in which fans were consulted. IF

they haven''t been meeting, then that might well be an indication that

the new regime is less interested in the views of fans than was the old

guard. If that is the case, fine, but best not to pretend. Better to be

bluntly honest.

3. There is the broader argument that the club  doesn''t need its

activities monitored, by focus groups or an independent pressure group.

Roughly, the Nutty Nigel argument:

"Calls for nCIsA to act as a kind of trade union to represent the fans

with the club suggests we are on different sides. It suggests the club

do things that are against the interests of the fans who are it''s

lifeblood. I don''t believe that is the case. I believe the club, team

and supporters are all on the same side."

With respect, that confuses being on the same side with always taking

the right decisions. And that isn''t the case, with NCFC or pretty much

any organisation. It certainly never applied to any company I worked

for, even though we were in a broad sense on the same side. That is not

to say these focus groups are/were the best way to keep a check on the

club, or that there is a supporters'' group out there with the brains and

energy to fulfil the task. But it is a necessary task.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"]---

As I raised the question of these working groups, some points:

1. Good to see LQ back, if only for a comet-like appearance, swooshing across the cyber heavens. This is entirely a guess, but I strongly suspect that what she found hilarious (as would anyone with a brain and a sense of humour) about those groups she mentioned were the managementspeak titles - not the work of the groups.

2. The point is not whether these groups have ever met, but whether - which is yet to be established - they''ve met SINCE the SCG was disbanded. When that happened the club was keen to stress that these groups would be a key part of the way in which fans were consulted. IF they haven''t been meeting, then that might well be an indication that the new regime is less interested in the views of fans than was the old guard. If that is the case, fine, but best not to pretend. Better to be bluntly honest.

3. There is the broader argument that the club  doesn''t need its activities monitored, by focus groups or an independent pressure group. Roughly, the Nutty Nigel argument:

"Calls for nCIsA to act as a kind of trade union to represent the fans with the club suggests we are on different sides. It suggests the club do things that are against the interests of the fans who are it''s lifeblood. I don''t believe that is the case. I believe the club, team and supporters are all on the same side."

With respect, that confuses being on the same side with always taking the right decisions. And that isn''t the case, with NCFC or pretty much any organisation. It certainly never applied to any company I worked for, even though we were in a broad sense on the same side. That is not to say these focus groups are/were the best way to keep a check on the club, or that there is a supporters'' group out there with the brains and energy to fulfil the task. But it is a necessary task.
[/quote]

Up to the thinly veiled side swipe I was in total agreement with you. That must be a first.

IF NCISA can gather enough members to make that voice heard, it is the largest group BUT not large enough in my view,then, if the right approach is taken they could be the ACAS between the club and fans in general.

Not to have a fans voice with the club could be very detremental for the fan base in the future.

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[quote user="The Butler"]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"]---As I raised the question of these working groups, some points:1. Good to see LQ back, if only for a comet-like appearance, swooshing across the cyber heavens. This is entirely a guess, but I strongly suspect that what she found hilarious (as would anyone with a brain and a sense of humour) about those groups she mentioned were the managementspeak titles - not the work of the groups.2. The point is not whether these groups have ever met, but whether - which is yet to be established - they''ve met SINCE the SCG was disbanded. When that happened the club was keen to stress that these groups would be a key part of the way in which fans were consulted. IF they haven''t been meeting, then that might well be an indication that the new regime is less interested in the views of fans than was the old guard. If that is the case, fine, but best not to pretend. Better to be bluntly honest.3. There is the broader argument that the club  doesn''t need its activities monitored, by focus groups or an independent pressure group. Roughly, the Nutty Nigel argument:"Calls for nCIsA to act as a kind of trade union to represent the fans with the club suggests we are on different sides. It suggests the club do things that are against the interests of the fans who are it''s lifeblood. I don''t believe that is the case. I believe the club, team and supporters are all on the same side."With respect, that confuses being on the same side with always taking the right decisions. And that isn''t the case, with NCFC or pretty much any organisation. It certainly never applied to any company I worked for, even though we were in a broad sense on the same side. That is not to say these focus groups are/were the best way to keep a check on the club, or that there is a supporters'' group out there with the brains and energy to fulfil the task. But it is a necessary task.[/quote]

Up to the thinly veiled side swipe I was in total agreement with you. That must be a first.

IF NCISA can gather enough members to make that voice heard, it is the largest group BUT not large enough in my view,then, if the right approach is taken they could be the ACAS between the club and fans in general.

Not to have a fans voice with the club could be very detremental for the fan base in the future.

[/quote]And then problems will arise with a really big groups,  really big disagreements and arguments on which way to go.  Say you had a group of 3000  and of those 300 thought the chairman was talking bollox?

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At last, a breath of fresh air and common sense for Purple Canary.

Leaving aside personal differences on opinion as to what may, or may not of happened in the past, are NCISA going to pick up the batton on this one?

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The Butler

Surely it doesn''t matter how many members you currently have, or what you preceive to be a critical number in order to be taken seriously by the Club, the question has to be, "are NCISA going to be proactive and pick up the batton on this one?"

There seems to be several key issues and concerns raised here on this thread, several moans as to what people think is wrong, yet no clear action plan to take these forwards.

As an organisation, you will be judged on your actions / inactions on the key concerns of the fans. Your call, which is it to be?

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Just let the club get on with it.  If they go wrong the Chief Exec gets more emails than a spam detector.  So there''s no doubting he''ll know how fans think.  Other than that, periodically the club sends out a ''how do you think we''re doing'' questionnaire''And leave the committees for the WI they just don''t work in the long run.

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[quote user="ſilly ſauſage"]Just let the club get on with it.  If they go wrong the Chief Exec gets more emails than a spam detector.  So there''s no doubting he''ll know how fans think. 

Other than that, periodically the club sends out a ''how do you think we''re doing'' questionnaire''

And leave the committees for the WI they just don''t work in the long run.
[/quote]

So you are in favour of dictatoships are you?

They have at times sent out questionairs, have you had one lately?

If the CEO has a good spam detector then the  chances of your message getting through, ...

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[quote user="The Butler"]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"]---As I raised the question of these working groups, some points:1. Good to see LQ back, if only for a comet-like appearance, swooshing across the cyber heavens. This is entirely a guess, but I strongly suspect that what she found hilarious (as would anyone with a brain and a sense of humour) about those groups she mentioned were the managementspeak titles - not the work of the groups.2. The point is not whether these groups have ever met, but whether - which is yet to be established - they''ve met SINCE the SCG was disbanded. When that happened the club was keen to stress that these groups would be a key part of the way in which fans were consulted. IF they haven''t been meeting, then that might well be an indication that the new regime is less interested in the views of fans than was the old guard. If that is the case, fine, but best not to pretend. Better to be bluntly honest.3. There is the broader argument that the club  doesn''t need its activities monitored, by focus groups or an independent pressure group. Roughly, the Nutty Nigel argument:"Calls for nCIsA to act as a kind of trade union to represent the fans with the club suggests we are on different sides. It suggests the club do things that are against the interests of the fans who are it''s lifeblood. I don''t believe that is the case. I believe the club, team and supporters are all on the same side."With respect, that confuses being on the same side with always taking the right decisions. And that isn''t the case, with NCFC or pretty much any organisation. It certainly never applied to any company I worked for, even though we were in a broad sense on the same side. That is not to say these focus groups are/were the best way to keep a check on the club, or that there is a supporters'' group out there with the brains and energy to fulfil the task. But it is a necessary task.[/quote]

Up to the thinly veiled side swipe I was in total agreement with you. That must be a first.

IF NCISA can gather enough members to make that voice heard, it is the largest group BUT not large enough in my view,then, if the right approach is taken they could be the ACAS between the club and fans in general.

Not to have a fans voice with the club could be very detremental for the fan base in the future.

[/quote]

---TB, it wasn''t really veiled at all! Seriously, it is an honest

assessment. Getting on for two years ago now I wrote an open letter to

NCISA, saying it needed to decide whether it was content to stay as

(mainly) a social club or could turn itself into a pressure group. The

two can, of course, are not mutually exclusive. But at the time NCISA

was very much the former and not much or the latter. I still don''t see

anything like enough of the latter, but perhaps that will change.

While I''m on, I will repeat what I said more recently, that NCISA needs

to get on board someone who has even half a clue about journalism and PR. I know

the website is still in a state of flux but so far it is displaying the

faults of the old one. According to your chairman he played a part

recently in clarifying the club''s position over the £50 reprint charge

for season tickets. Is there a mention of that on your website? No.

There is something about vuvuzelas, and two football-related blogs. Of

NCISA''s activities as a pressure group there is zilch.

Finally this is NCISA''s mission statement:

To encourage the

overall success of Norwich City Football Club so that football of the

highest standard can be provided for the supporters.

To help ensure that those supporters can enjoy good value in the matchday experience and in the ongoing support of our club.

WHAT??? I have seen some crimes against the English language and

against logic, often in "mission statements", but that is up there with

the most heinous. I just about get the first sentence, but the second

sentence defeats me, I''m afraid, and the whole is just garbage.

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[quote user="GMF"]The Butler Surely it doesn''t matter how many members you currently have, or what you preceive to be a critical number in order to be taken seriously by the Club, the question has to be, "are NCISA going to be proactive and pick up the batton on this one?" There seems to be several key issues and concerns raised here on this thread, several moans as to what people think is wrong, yet no clear action plan to take these forwards. As an organisation, you will be judged on your actions / inactions on the key concerns of the fans. Your call, which is it to be?[/quote]

The numbers ,up to a level ,do matter if you are to be percieved as speaking "for the fans" If not you could do it on your own!!

Many key issues have been raised and need taking up with representatives of the club.(as far as this web site is concerned)

Are you a member of NCISA GMF? Have you raised it directly with any committee member?

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WHAT??? I have seen some crimes against the English language and against logic, often in "mission statements", but that is up there with the most heinous. I just about get the first sentence, but the second sentence defeats me, I''m afraid, and the whole is just garbage.

Thanks PC as usual that is your opinion and as always you are welcome to it.

Such a major critic as your good self no doubt, could do so much better, it''s a pity that your main achievment is to critisise rather than take action or offer constructive help.

The web site has changed and will continue to evolve. It is getting members into the mind set that at last we have a site that can be kept upto date rather than rely on messages on the pinkun board to get points across.

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[quote user="The Butler"]

[quote user="ſilly ſauſage"]Just let the club get on with it.  If they go wrong the Chief Exec gets more emails than a spam detector.  So there''s no doubting he''ll know how fans think.  Other than that, periodically the club sends out a ''how do you think we''re doing'' questionnaire''And leave the committees for the WI they just don''t work in the long run. [/quote]

So you are in favour of dictatoships are you?

They have at times sent out questionairs, have you had one lately?

If the CEO has a good spam detector then the  chances of your message getting through, ...

[/quote]The point is most committees end up either like a dictatorship anyway.  As soon as some bullish loudmouth gets his/her arse in the chair it''s their way all the way.  Or they just become stagnant because others view then as some jolly clique.Anyhow imo most fans who attend just view supporting and watching football as purely entertainment.  And don''t see the need to get involved.  It''s like you don''t get involved in other entertainment like filmaking/DVDs etc.  You don''t form a committee to tell the theatre director what they should or shouldn''t be doing.  You either buy into the product or you don''t.  And if the product is successful everybody is happy.  Just like 20 odd 1000 ST holders are.  McNally probably assumes everyone is happy up to now.  He probably knows there''s very few still moaning about how their committee want to be involved and speak for everybody.  But in all honest opinion, he probably doesn''t want to indulge them just for the sake of it because while the club has managed to get bums on seats and everything is still positive it just ain''t worth the hassle.If that''s a dictatorship so be it.As someone said already, you have the charter.  You have customer services for daft things.  And you have the CE''s e-mail.

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[quote user="The Butler"]

WHAT??? I have seen some crimes against the English language and against logic, often in "mission statements", but that is up there with the most heinous. I just about get the first sentence, but the second sentence defeats me, I''m afraid, and the whole is just garbage.

Thanks PC as usual that is your opinion and as always you are welcome to it.

Such a major critic as your good self no doubt, could do so much better, it''s a pity that your main achievment is to critisise rather than take action or offer constructive help.

The web site has changed and will continue to evolve. It is getting members into the mind set that at last we have a site that can be kept upto date rather than rely on messages on the pinkun board to get points across.

[/quote]I thought suggesting you get on board someone with some journalistic/PR expertise WAS being constructive, but no matter. As to producing a mission statement that is better than::"To encourage the

overall success of Norwich City Football Club so that football of the

highest standard can be provided for the supporters.To help ensure that those supporters can enjoy good value in the matchday experience and in the ongoing support of our club."Hmmm..."NCISA exists to bring Norwich City fans together and to stand up for their interests."It is in plain English. And it makes sense. It covers the social side of NCISA (the bringing fans together bit) and the pressure group side (the standing up for tbeir interests bit). And it takes only 15 words as opposed to 45 words.

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That there nutty nigel musta gorn doollally!! He reckon that the club allus make the right decisions and wass more allus will!!!

 

Howabout No!

 

That''s not at all what I said. But over issues that directly affect the fans and where the fans can have an input I would suggest that over the last 15 or so years they have indeed got it right. Tilly will correct me if I''m wrong but I''m sure it was the club that instigated the working groups that formed the SCG. These were then made up of people selected to  represent the fans on the various committees. These folk were not selected because they were club toadies or anything like. I believe they were selected because they were the best who made themselves available for each category. I have absolutely no complaints about any of the people who represented my interests on these committees. In fact the opposite is the case because I believe they have made things a lot better for us fans in so many ways. These people in the main have quietly got on with the job with minimal fuss in order to make club policy more fan friendly and certainly more fair.

 

Now as I understand it the new regime, although having abandoned the SCG, have kept certain important groups as stated on the Web Site. Now if I''m wrong then I agree questions need to be asked about what''s going to replace them and yes nutty nigel would be concerned!

 

But we have to accept there have been changes in personnel at boardroom level and the new people do things differently. Where as dear old Roger would stand for hours listening to all and sundry telling him what he was doing wrong I suspect Bowkett is a completely different kettle of fish. Same with Doncaster and McNally. These new board members probably believe that an hour spent listening to a few of us oiks ranting about how we could run the club far better or manage the team far better as an hour wasted. Much better to let us have our say on a web chat! Far less time consuming but the end result is the same in both cases, whatever we say they will run the club as they see fit.

 

 

 

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The Butler

Your point on numbers is noted but NCISA really can''t have it both ways, claiming, on the one hand, to be the largest fans group, whichI believe you still are and then, in the next breath implying that you have insufficent numbers for the Club to take you seriously!

As an organisation generally, it is for you to decide what you want to be and then seek to influence an agenda for change on any key issues. If you''re seen to be proactive, then you''re far more likely to get new members on board.

It may well be that NCISA has taken up certain issues already with the Club but, save for your message, there is nothing to indicate on your website that this is the case.

I''m not suggesting for one moment that every single issue has to be noted thereon, but there''s no reason why you can''t have a high level summary of the issues you''re seeking to address with the Club which is updated regulalry.

I''m not a member of NCISA, although I wasn''t aware that I had to be in order for any issues anc concerns I may have to be taken seriously.

I have in the past emailed both Kathy and John generally with mixed results. I haven''t obviously emailed them recently.

Frankly, my willingness to join, or otherwise, is influenced by the way NCISA interfaces both with fans both in an offical capacity and on the likes of this board. Generally, I''m afraid I''m unimpressed with the behaviour of certain members.

I''m not saying I''ll never join, but it strikes me that much progress has to be made, both in terms of it''s overall leadership, its objectives and the way it conducts itself before I would consider joining.

The new website is a positive step in the right direction, but, IMHO, it needs to provide a means for non members to interface with the group both to air concerns and ideas. I don''t think that just emailing is a viable option here.

Hope that helps and I''m happy to PM if this is getting too off topic for this thread..

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Purple Canary said

"NCISA exists to bring Norwich City fans together and to stand up for their interests."

Now that is praise!![;)]

Only kidding PC, many thanks for your thoughts and input.

Noted and will be discussed

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[quote user="LQ"]I''m not interested in debating something with you, John, that you constantly change the goalposts on.

First you said you were at the meeting when I was asked and agreed to join the Pricing Working Group - then suddenly I was invited by email which you obviously have access to. That email conversation actually contained my serious reservations about joining and I only agreed after I had been assured it would not be anything like the old SCG pricing group and would, in fact, encompass wider issues and supporter relations with a far greater degree of transparency.

I think everyone is pretty clear on how that plan eventually worked out.

Additionally making sad jibes about my attitude to the working groups I was on is, even for you, rather childish. The whole point of putting the titles of the working groups in inverted commas and following them with my comments was to indicate that the titles themselves were funny - or I found them so anyway, especially given how things worked out.

I never go into anything, work or play, without the intention of giving of my all.

You have clearly demonstrated why I find it impossible to post on here or any other forum anymore. Petty digs and misinterpretation along with weird suppositions, fairy stories and "FACTS!!!!!!" dished out consistently really do make it impossible for me to offer any opinion or even be a little light-hearted.



[/quote]

Interesting Lisa that you said twice in your original post that you and i quote "NEVER" were on the working group yet here you are saying you agreed to join it.Must be me and my goalposts moving again hey?

 

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"]---

2. The point is not whether these groups have ever met, but whether - which is yet to be established - they''ve met SINCE the SCG was disbanded. When that happened the club was keen to stress that these groups would be a key part of the way in which fans were consulted. IF they haven''t been meeting, then that might well be an indication that the new regime is less interested in the views of fans than was the old guard. If that is the case, fine, but best not to pretend. Better to be bluntly honest.

[/quote]

Which takes us back to Communications.

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Yes the club has learned a valueble lesson.

The only thing we really have to whinge about at the moment is the price of the pies.

If we are still moaning about this in May then things on the pitch will have been going very nicely thank you

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[quote user="LQ"]As a couple of people have asked me to respond to this thread I would like to confirm that I was NEVER on the pricing/season ticket working group.

[/quote]

Could you please advise as to who the members are of the pricing / season ticket working group according to the list you have. Thanks.

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[quote user="Tangible Fixed Assets anyone"]

[quote user="LQ"]As a couple of people have asked me to respond to this thread I would like to confirm that I was NEVER on the pricing/season ticket working group.[/quote]

Could you please advise as to who the members are of the pricing / season ticket working group according to the list you have. Thanks.

[/quote]Nevermind who was on the list.  Home come LQ was given the list if she claims she wasn''t involved?

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Wrong again, John.Read my lips (or actually I''d rather you read my post) and you''ll find that what I actually agreed to was the group that "...would not be anything like the old SCG pricing

group and would, in fact, encompass wider issues and supporter relations

with a far greater degree of transparency".Get it?That''s your lot, mate. I''d rather just be a fan than continually argue with the likes of you.For the others, everyone on the SCG had full lists of who was on which group and that includes Mr Tilson. Ask him to tell you what the make up of these (now over 2 season old) groups was cos the way I see it he''s always been very quiet about his participation - and participation it was. For my part I would prefer to leave it to the individuals involved to "out" themselves. I''ve always told you where I stood and always told you where I sat in case anyone wanted me to raise anything on their behalf. That''s far more than most did, but it''s never enough for some. Geez!Always remember that John Tilson, the Chairman of NCISA, was on the SCG. Was it him who asked Neil Doncaster to look him in the eye and tell him that he was doing the best for this Club? Or (during the meetings) questioned the secrecy surrounding parts of how the SCG operated? No. But he missed those meetings...Maybe a look in the mirror is the order of the day for NCISA. Why and how, I ask, is it that after so many years of turmoil and with such a nominal joining fee NCISA has a couple of hundred members out of a fanbase including 20,550 season ticket holders and many times that in terms of fans? Seriously guys and gals, look at the image you project. How you interact with anyone outside your group of luvvies. How you kowtow to get someone/anyone to appear at the AGM and then proffer the snidey comments online when you know they won''t lower themselves to answer. How any proposal to make serious changes to the NCISA board are met - or brushed aside as was, I believe, the case last Autumn. Look at yourselves and ask - are we a pressure group fighting for fans or are we a&re-lickers when the time is right and we want to phone Joe Ferrari/Mr McNally for a little chat?I know what I think.And I think you''ve been seen through by many, many fans.And many more are just happy that this Club, our Club, is moving forwards.

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