1.9p in the pound!

[The Walking Man 13]

1.9p in every pound.

That''s how little Crystal Palace have to pay back to creditors under terms of their CVA, all so we can have the privilege of playing them in their dump of a ground on boxing day which I see has been moved to an earlier kick off time ensureing a earlier start from Norfolk. Absolute joke. When will going into administration come with a real punishment? Barry Hearn was spot on when he said clubs should be demoted two divisions instantly instead of wiping their debts ready for an assault on the premiership.

http://www.thelondondailynews.com/from-near-extinction-signing-players-crystal-palace-agree-jordan-backs-down-p-4278.html

[grantroederdisaster 0]

Sickening really!

I know what its like to be owed money from a bankrupt and its not a nice feeling!

In the case of many bankrupt clubs, if they were not football clubs and a normal business they''d be made to fold!

Crystal Palace have now had money problems for years and years and with previous owners. With their lowish support levels, stuck in a s hit hole ground that is unlikely to be improved very soon and in the capital City where there is better attractions particularly football clubs, I think Palace are destined to always lurch from problem to problem unless a genuine mega rich sugardaddy bankrolls them.

I bet many people outside of East Anglia would consider Palace to be a bigger club than us! Great urban myths!

[Skippy 0]

Without checking i''m sure even our six fingered friends managed to pay out more than that - I do agree with everyone that calls for automatic relegation though - might encourage people to be a bit more Prudent.

[William Darby 0]

[quote user="The Walking Man "]

1.9p in every pound.

That''s how little Crystal Palace have to pay back to creditors under terms of their CVA, all so we can have the privilege of playing them in their dump of a ground on boxing day which I see has been moved to an earlier kick off time ensureing a earlier start from Norfolk. Absolute joke. When will going into administration come with a real punishment? Barry Hearn was spot on when he said clubs should be demoted two divisions instantly instead of wiping their debts ready for an assault on the premiership.

http://www.thelondondailynews.com/from-near-extinction-signing-players-crystal-palace-agree-jordan-backs-down-p-4278.html

[/quote]The problem with that is, the innocent fans get punished.  How would we all feel if for the sake of argument, we didn''t get promoted?  And we then slipped into administration and subsequently relegated to the Conference?  I''d have been ****ing furious while Smith n'' Jones would''ve buggered off never to be seen again.

[Webbo118 0]

[quote user="grantroederdisaster"]Sickening really! I know what its like to be owed money from a bankrupt and its not a nice feeling! In the case of many bankrupt clubs, if they were not football clubs and a normal business they''d be made to fold! Crystal Palace have now had money problems for years and years and with previous owners. With their lowish support levels, stuck in a s hit hole ground that is unlikely to be improved very soon and in the capital City where there is better attractions particularly football clubs, I think Palace are destined to always lurch from problem to problem unless a genuine mega rich sugardaddy bankrolls them. I bet many people outside of East Anglia would consider Palace to be a bigger club than us! Great urban myths![/quote]

This is not the case. Recent times have seen big increases in the number of "pre-pack" administrations where businesses are sold to existing directors, leaving creditors with very little or, in most cases, nothing. Apparently, the new Government is planning to do something about these. In my view, not before time. It was an absolute disgrace that they were allowed in the first place.

[I am a Banana 0]

What a joke!!

[The Walking Man 13]

[quote user="ſilly ſauſage"][quote user="The Walking Man "]

1.9p in every pound.

That''s how little Crystal Palace have to pay back to creditors under terms of their CVA, all so we can have the privilege of playing them in their dump of a ground on boxing day which I see has been moved to an earlier kick off time ensureing a earlier start from Norfolk. Absolute joke. When will going into administration come with a real punishment? Barry Hearn was spot on when he said clubs should be demoted two divisions instantly instead of wiping their debts ready for an assault on the premiership.

http://www.thelondondailynews.com/from-near-extinction-signing-players-crystal-palace-agree-jordan-backs-down-p-4278.html

[/quote]

The problem with that is, the innocent fans get punished.  How would we all feel if for the sake of argument, we didn''t get promoted?  And we then slipped into administration and subsequently relegated to the Conference?  I''d have been ****ing furious while Smith n'' Jones would''ve buggered off never to be seen again.
[/quote]

I agree i''d be furious but not as furious as if I were a small creditor owed money and whose livlihood depended on a debt being settled.Yes it''s tough on the fans but the chances are the club will survive in one guise or another but if the club has irresponsible owners then what incentive do they have to stop being irrisponsible?

I gurantee if automatic demotion was introduced (perhaps only one division) then there would sure as hell be alot less clubs entering administration.

[king canary 7,580]

[quote user="ſilly ſauſage"][quote user="The Walking Man "]

1.9p in every pound.

That''s how little Crystal Palace have to pay back to creditors under terms of their CVA, all so we can have the privilege of playing them in their dump of a ground on boxing day which I see has been moved to an earlier kick off time ensureing a earlier start from Norfolk. Absolute joke. When will going into administration come with a real punishment? Barry Hearn was spot on when he said clubs should be demoted two divisions instantly instead of wiping their debts ready for an assault on the premiership.

http://www.thelondondailynews.com/from-near-extinction-signing-players-crystal-palace-agree-jordan-backs-down-p-4278.html

[/quote]The problem with that is, the innocent fans get punished.  How would we all feel if for the sake of argument, we didn''t get promoted?  And we then slipped into administration and subsequently relegated to the Conference?  I''d have been ****ing furious while Smith n'' Jones would''ve buggered off never to be seen again. [/quote]I know its not popular but it is the only punishment that would actually work. You cant fine a club in administration the only penalties that have any affect are on field penalties.

[whoareyou? 0]

[quote user="ſilly ſauſage"][quote user="The Walking Man "]

1.9p in every pound.

That''s how little Crystal Palace have to pay back to creditors under terms of their CVA, all so we can have the privilege of playing them in their dump of a ground on boxing day which I see has been moved to an earlier kick off time ensureing a earlier start from Norfolk. Absolute joke. When will going into administration come with a real punishment? Barry Hearn was spot on when he said clubs should be demoted two divisions instantly instead of wiping their debts ready for an assault on the premiership.

http://www.thelondondailynews.com/from-near-extinction-signing-players-crystal-palace-agree-jordan-backs-down-p-4278.html

[/quote]

The problem with that is, the innocent fans get punished.  How would we all feel if for the sake of argument, we didn''t get promoted?  And we then slipped into administration and subsequently relegated to the Conference?  I''d have been ****ing furious while Smith n'' Jones would''ve buggered off never to be seen again.
[/quote]

 

Yes but in future no owner would want to get a club in financial difficulties in the first place as the anger from supporters would be even worse than the sh*t they would have to face from unpaid creditors.

[William Darby 0]

[quote user="The Walking Man "][quote user="ſilly ſauſage"][quote user="The Walking Man "]

1.9p in every pound.

That''s how little Crystal Palace have to pay back to creditors under terms of their CVA, all so we can have the privilege of playing them in their dump of a ground on boxing day which I see has been moved to an earlier kick off time ensureing a earlier start from Norfolk. Absolute joke. When will going into administration come with a real punishment? Barry Hearn was spot on when he said clubs should be demoted two divisions instantly instead of wiping their debts ready for an assault on the premiership.

http://www.thelondondailynews.com/from-near-extinction-signing-players-crystal-palace-agree-jordan-backs-down-p-4278.html

[/quote]The problem with that is, the innocent fans get punished.  How would we all feel if for the sake of argument, we didn''t get promoted?  And we then slipped into administration and subsequently relegated to the Conference?  I''d have been ****ing furious while Smith n'' Jones would''ve buggered off never to be seen again. [/quote]

I agree i''d be furious but not as furious as if I were a small creditor owed money and whose livlihood depended on a debt being settled.Yes it''s tough on the fans but the chances are the club will survive in one guise or another but if the club has irresponsible owners then what incentive do they have to stop being irrisponsible?

I gurantee if automatic demotion was introduced (perhaps only one division) then there would sure as hell be alot less clubs entering administration.

[/quote]Various creditors get shafted every day of the week in ordinary bankruptcies.  Having said that I''m not defending gun ho owners who seem to gamble with their clubs like it''s a £1 lucky dip on the lottery.  Punishments must be given but it always seems to be innocent fans getting the brunt.  A instant relegation would seem less harsh,  but a punishment to the actual culprits would be better.Take Mr Jordon, you can argue he''s responsible for the majority of Palarse''s troubles.  He was away on his toes weeks ago at the first whiff of trouble.  Unless there''s some kind of indefinite ''black list'' where these people can never be involved in football clubs again other than selling programs or something?

[The Walking Man 13]

[quote user="ſilly ſauſage"][quote user="The Walking Man "][quote user="ſilly ſauſage"][quote user="The Walking Man "]

1.9p in every pound.

That''s how little Crystal Palace have to pay back to creditors under terms of their CVA, all so we can have the privilege of playing them in their dump of a ground on boxing day which I see has been moved to an earlier kick off time ensureing a earlier start from Norfolk. Absolute joke. When will going into administration come with a real punishment? Barry Hearn was spot on when he said clubs should be demoted two divisions instantly instead of wiping their debts ready for an assault on the premiership.

http://www.thelondondailynews.com/from-near-extinction-signing-players-crystal-palace-agree-jordan-backs-down-p-4278.html

[/quote]

The problem with that is, the innocent fans get punished.  How would we all feel if for the sake of argument, we didn''t get promoted?  And we then slipped into administration and subsequently relegated to the Conference?  I''d have been ****ing furious while Smith n'' Jones would''ve buggered off never to be seen again.
[/quote]

I agree i''d be furious but not as furious as if I were a small creditor owed money and whose livlihood depended on a debt being settled.Yes it''s tough on the fans but the chances are the club will survive in one guise or another but if the club has irresponsible owners then what incentive do they have to stop being irrisponsible?

I gurantee if automatic demotion was introduced (perhaps only one division) then there would sure as hell be alot less clubs entering administration.

[/quote]

Various creditors get shafted every day of the week in ordinary bankruptcies.  Having said that I''m not defending gun ho owners who seem to gamble with their clubs like it''s a £1 lucky dip on the lottery.  Punishments must be given but it always seems to be innocent fans getting the brunt.  A instant relegation would seem less harsh,  but a punishment to the actual culprits would be better.
Take Mr Jordon, you can argue he''s responsible for the majority of Palarse''s troubles.  He was away on his toes weeks ago at the first whiff of trouble.  Unless there''s some kind of indefinite ''black list'' where these people can never be involved in football clubs again other than selling programs or something?
[/quote]

There is some sort of black list so to speak I believe, as part of the fit and proper person''s test I think (not 100% sure) that a prospective new owner cannot have owned more than two companies that have entered administartion.

[SwindonCanary 455]

What''s the betting that very soon after they come out off administratoin,they sign a player for tens of thousands of pounds.

[Hairy Canary 668]

One of the main problems is that all football related costs have to be settled first. Once that has been done there is often virtually no cash left for other creditors.

Does anyone know why football players are not considered as an asset in these circumstances? For instance why can''t Palace sell all their players at knock down prices and use that money to pay off the creditors? They would be forced to play trainees or amatures and almost certainly go down but that would be the price of getting so deeply into debt.

[Bill 1,788]

'' Fit and proper '' eh ?

"A World Cup insider said: ‘It’s extraordinary with Evans’s reputation

as a pirate seller of sports tickets around the globe and the legal

actions against him in a number of countries that the Football League

still regard him as a fit and proper person to own a club.''

The article had previously stated -" South African police have been handed affidavits from seven companies

outlining huge losses. They include petrochemical giants Sasol, who

have singled out the Marcus Evans Group after buying tickets and

hospitality packages that were later cancelled, as MEG were not FIFA

accredited agents.

Sasol have been pursuing the company for the return of their big

six-figure deposit for World Cup orders since the Confederations Cup in

South Africa last year, when they discovered the Ipswich owner, who has

been called the biggest ticket tout in the world, was an unlicensed

trader for the World Cup. "

As far as I am concerned he is a ''fit and proper'' owner for that grubby little, debt dodging outfit down the A140. They suit each other, well. And when he finally extracts as much as he can and the paupers are left washed up like Bradford, Oxford and Luton nobody should be too surprised.

[The Walking Man 13]

[quote user="Hairy Canary"]

One of the main problems is that all football related costs have to be settled first. Once that has been done there is often virtually no cash left for other creditors.

Does anyone know why football players are not considered as an asset in these circumstances? For instance why can''t Palace sell all their players at knock down prices and use that money to pay off the creditors? They would be forced to play trainees or amatures and almost certainly go down but that would be the price of getting so deeply into debt.

[/quote]

I think they are (not 100% sure mind), but the reason why Palace didn''t sell any of their star players is because the consortium who have now taken control said that if any players where sold they would withdraw and because they were the only party in town the administrator had to relent to their demands. However if they had of gotten closer to ging under the players would have been sold, remember all that who-ha with those Palace fans outside the bank, that was the day when the administrator said he was going to start selling players...

[The Walking Man 13]

[quote user="swindoncanary"]What''s the betting that very soon after they come out off administratoin,they sign a player for tens of thousands of pounds.[/quote]

You cynic!

[Hairy Canary 668]

[quote user="The Walking Man "][quote user="Hairy Canary"]

One of the main problems is that all football related costs have to be settled first. Once that has been done there is often virtually no cash left for other creditors.

Does anyone know why football players are not considered as an asset in these circumstances? For instance why can''t Palace sell all their players at knock down prices and use that money to pay off the creditors? They would be forced to play trainees or amatures and almost certainly go down but that would be the price of getting so deeply into debt.

[/quote]

I think they are (not 100% sure mind), but the reason why Palace didn''t sell any of their star players is because the consortium who have now taken control said that if any players where sold they would withdraw and because they were the only party in town the administrator had to relent to their demands. However if they had of gotten closer to ging under the players would have been sold, remember all that who-ha with those Palace fans outside the bank, that was the day when the administrator said he was going to start selling players...

[/quote]

Thanks WM, I think I see. [:P] Still dont understand why selling players is not forced on clubs before they enter administartion though. Its a bit like having loads of valuable paintings but no cash and then saying to the people you owe money to that you cant pay.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Hairy Canary"][quote user="The Walking Man "][quote user="Hairy Canary"]

One of the main problems is that all football related costs have to be settled first. Once that has been done there is often virtually no cash left for other creditors.

Does anyone know why football players are not considered as an asset in these circumstances? For instance why can''t Palace sell all their players at knock down prices and use that money to pay off the creditors? They would be forced to play trainees or amatures and almost certainly go down but that would be the price of getting so deeply into debt.

[/quote]

I think they are (not 100% sure mind), but the reason why Palace didn''t sell any of their star players is because the consortium who have now taken control said that if any players where sold they would withdraw and because they were the only party in town the administrator had to relent to their demands. However if they had of gotten closer to ging under the players would have been sold, remember all that who-ha with those Palace fans outside the bank, that was the day when the administrator said he was going to start selling players...

[/quote]

Thanks WM, I think I see. [:P] Still dont understand why selling players is not forced on clubs before they enter administartion though. Its a bit like having loads of valuable paintings but no cash and then saying to the people you owe money to that you cant pay.

[/quote]I think its more to do with the fact that the players ARE the business, and if they are sold then the business becomes worthless as a going concern.Like having a business that operates a swimming pool, getting in trouble and selling your swimming pool to keep the business going.

[7rew 0]

I''m not sure about the auto-relegation. The points penalty at least means that the team plays its remaining fixtures competitively, which has as small an impact on the league as possible.

What I would like to see is the points deduction being 15 points this season, 10 next and 5 the one after, with the same delayed start rules. Also with a automatic loss of playoff places as well.

That would stop the "administration will ruin this year, but fix next year" scenario - It would make promotion very hard for a while after administration a very difficult scenario, but not actually impossible. Clubs still have stuff to play for, but will suffer for a few years and find it more difficult to attract players.