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Canary Boy

I'm worried for Gary Holt!

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I thought it would be only appropriate to start a thread on this great midfielder.

Gary has given a lot to Norwich City and is not nick-named ''3 lungs'' for nothing. He always gives his all for club and country. This season he has struggled a little bit to life in the Premiership but so have many of our other players...in fact, as can be seen by our league position, the whole team has struggled.

The reason I am writing this is because I was disappointed by the fans reaction to Gary Holt''s substitution against Charlton last Saturday. No player deserves this treatment, especially someone who has given so much. Gary is not a creative midfielder but a ball winner...and a very good one at that! He works well with Damien Francis and has derserved to have been picked so far this season.

I do feel that it is time to change the midfiled around a little now and maybe a run on the bench may do Gary the world of good...it keeps you sharp and helps you to see that no one is guaranteed a place. It also helps to watch how the team play sometimes from our position rather than being in the team.

I''m sick of hearing about some kind of love affair between Gary and Nigel Worthington. Nigel puts Gary in the team because he is a professional international midfielder and works his socks off!

I''m not against change, and I believe after our performances recently we should give some others the chance to show what they can do. However, football is a CONFIDENCE game and no player can play at his best while he knows the crowd (his own fans) are on his back. Let''s get behind Gary and give him the confidence he needs otherwise we could loose him altogether.

Keep the faith Gary.

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I don''t think the crowd are on Holty''s back, I just feel that because of his poor form this year people are frustrated with Worthy for not seeing it and for persisting with someone who has played below par all season. I think its a frustration with the manager rather than with the player.

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I think Holt has had reasonable suppport and there have been many other players who have received fierce abuse for performing better than holt.

I think the reason he has not been harshly treated by the fans is that he continues to work his socks off - bless him - and that he IS playing to the best of his ability - its just that is not quite up to the standard we want.

OTBC

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[quote]I thought it would be only appropriate to start a thread on this great midfielder. Gary has given a lot to Norwich City and is not nick-named ''3 lungs'' for nothing. He always gives his all for club a...[/quote]

Hmm, Canary Boy, I am bemused.  Ole 3 Lungs looks a bit more like one and a half so far to me, and if predictions for tomorrow''s starting line up are right, then Worthy may be up for a change too, with Mullers coming in.

More bemusing still, is that not only have you come up with this Gary Holt thread, but you have elsewhere posted a panic about Crouch scoring against us tomorrow.  Mate, he probably won''t even play.  And if he did he highly likely wouldn''t even score.  I''ll put a tenner on it.

And I''ll put a tenner on no more than 3 posters out of the whole lot of us agreeing with you that Holty "deserves to have been picked so far this season"

 

 

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Well you can count me as one. At least he''s always "there" in the games (which is probably why everyone slates him) whereas Francis seems to bugger of for a cup of tea and a sit down for at least 30 mins of every game.

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Thanks Banaman for backing me up there.

That''s two of us, we only need two more posters and Flicky Fleck owes me a tenner...which I''ll gladly put towards the family of Geoffery Watling.

And if Crouch scores, I''ll send the other tenner from Flicky Fleck in the same direction.

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Uh-oh I sense trouble on this one.  Not only does it look like I''m going to lose me tenner on the Holty issue, but I''ve acquired a derogatory ''y'' on me name too...

 

...Steady on Canary Boy.  And re-read my post - you need you and 3 more to get the tenner to the Watling fund.  That''s you, bananman, and you still need 2 more.  No lying now!

 

At least I''ll draw even on the Crouch bet...

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...erm, yup, spotted the mistake - you did indeed say you needed two more on the Holty bet.  Sorry bout that, me heart always skips a beat when there''s money on it...

...But are they really out there?  Are there really 2 more people who think that Holt deserves to be picked?  Come on, show yer colours...

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Hey hey hey, hang on a cotton pickin'' minute here!! I''m not saying Holt is a great player and has done brilliantly.My point was that Holt "deserves" his place no less than anyone else in the team, but the eye disorders suffered my the collective Carrow Rd faithful allows them only to see Gary Holt.They just can''t take their eyes off him!If we dropped Holt then IMO Edworthy, Drury, Francis, Bentley, Jonson, McKenzie, Huckerby, Drury and Green would all have to be dropped too.He has not played consistently well, and yes, it''s time for a change, but by no means is it just Gary Holt''s fault.

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I''m getting rather tired of this Holt episode. I would certainly never jeer or boo any City player but I will admit to having a go at him if he fouls up.

I have never been a real fan of Holt, so Canary Boy, I think you''re blind to a real objective assessment of the player.

1. Why did he win Player of the Year in 2002? One reason only and that was the famous lung bursting runs up and down the pitch. A number of those runs would be seen every game. Now, if you see one, you really sit up and take notice because they''re so rare! IN SHORT, HE HAS LOST THAT EXTRA PHYSICAL ENERGY HE HAD THEN. Without that Holt is an also ran.

2. Holt fans say ....''he works his socks off'' SO WHAT!! Every player should do that as a minimum requirement surely?  

3. Other than his workrate, what else does Holt give as a central midfielder?  ''A ball winner'' I hear you say. Watch him. Count the number of times he really goes in HARD for 50:50 balls. Again, once or twice a match, if that.

4. Creativity. With Holt there is none! He does NOT take free kicks, he does NOT take corners, he does NOT play defence splitting passes and create goals.

5. Goalscoring! At any level of football, a central midfilder MUST chip in with 7 or 8 goals a season. Holt has scored just 3 goals in over 160 games!! THAT SIMPLE FACT ALONE IS WHY HE IS NEVER WORTH HIS PLACE IN THE TEAM.  

END OF STORY!! 

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Holt has been, and still is, a magnificent servant to this club. He came in and did spectactularly well immidiately.  His battling qualities were fantastic in the first Div. 

However, I don''t think it would be unfair for me to say that he hasn''t been up to his usually standard this season.  I know it''s a tough step up to the Prem but I don''t think there is anything wrong with giving someone else the oppertunity in the middle, just to see how they do. 

It wouldn''t do any harm

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I think the only way to stop some of you lot moaning about Holt is to drop him and play someone like Mulryne and then for him to look as ineffective. I don''t want to say I told you so but maybe that will be what is takes for people to understand his contribution to the side. The simple truth is that most premiership clubs have better midfielders than ours, we kind of know that really don''t we? therefore if we continue to stay down the bottom of the table we could play numerous midfielders and eventually they will get loads of grief from people posting here because they will at one stage or another look inferior to the opponents. Gary Holt isn''t a worse player than last year, it''s just he''s up against better teams / players. This argument can be used for the lack of form from many of our players, that includes Huckerby too. Let''s stop whinging and back whoever plays.

 

 

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Ok, Green was harsh.

But just watch Francis tomorrow. Not the bits when he has the ball, but the bits where he is letting GARY HOLT chase the flow of the possession all the way across, up and down the pitch.

Think of the last time you saw Francis with the ball, or wanting the ball.

If you''re listening to radio Norfolk, ask yourself when was the last time Roy mentioned "Fraaances".

A great player in the making, but he just disappears too often from games, and for too long. Hopefully he will start to impose himself from start to finish soon.

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Ok Mr Fleck

Looks like I still need some extra Holt suppporters on here.

Anyone who thinks Gary Holt has deserved his place so far in the starting line this season please put your name down here....

So far (as far as I can tell...)

bananaman - Was a yes but backed out

yellow rider - No

if i had the wings of a sparrow - YES

worthy nigelton - No direct comment

dumbledelia is magic - Sat on the fence

Marty - Sat on the fence

bananaman - Sat on the fence again

Just 2 of us at the moment...more needed please.

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Canary Boy, put me down as a yes based on what i''ve seen and what we have in reserve I''d have him playing.

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I think Marty sums up my position. You know what you are going to get with Holt and that cannot be said of the alternatives - Mullers & Safri.

Neither has the consitency or the legs to do what Holt does and I suspect his contribution will be missed tomorrow. However he is not up to premier class.

However as we have not looked like winning a game a shake up is needed so why not have a change.

Holt to play once fit again.

OTBC

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I''m going to say he deserved to start the season as first choice and deserved a run in the team to see how he coped but now is the time to drop him as he hasn''t performed.

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No, i didn''t back out. I just said that although he hasn''t played well, neither has anyone else in the team.

Gary does deserve to start, and if he lines up tomorrow I shan''t be upset. But the creative players need to up their "creativity" because it''s not Holty''s job.

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i''m with marty on this one. i think its swings and roundabouts for the centre midfield partner for Francis.
safri looked good against arsenal because they''d already won it and were just strolling around killing time and leaving safri with more time and freedom than he would have had in the first half.
mulryne looked good when he came on from charlton - in similar circumstances - and is good for the dead-ball but can you really see him putting himself about like Holt. mulryne wasn''t really good enough for a regular place in div 1 so what makes everyone think he''s the answer in the premiership.

having said that i think its time to give holt a rest before the crowd get any worse than they did last week and let them see the difference when he''s not there.

p.s. if mulryne does look good tomorrow please take into account the quality of the opposition before hailing the messiah(s)


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Have been away from the PC all afternoon otherwise you would have had my vote for Holt much earlier.

I''m not against making changes but we should be starting with the defence that much has been obvious for weeks.

I also think, well hope at least, that after a few weeks of watching Mulryne do nothing that people will be a little bit more aware that Holt still does a pretty effective if unglamorous job.

I also think that people will start to question Francis a lot more. As Bananaman says, he frequently disappears for lengthy periods and leaves the hard work to Holt, dont think that Mullers is going to take up the slack somehow.

I think we''ll lose tomorrow because the defence will be unchanged and Beattie and Phillips will think its Christmas.

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Ok Flick Fleck...time is up. The vote for Gary Holt as to whether he has deserved his place in the starting line up until now is finally over. A few of us sat on the fence but here are the results..

ZippersLeftFoot - Yes
Marty - Yes
Canary Boy (me) - Yes
If I had the wings of a sparrow - Yes
Worthy Nigelton - Yes
Bananaman - Yes
FilletTheFishWife - Yes
Creative Midfielder - Yes

£10.00 goes to the Geoffrey Watling family fund. Thank you all so much.

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Well, Canary Boy, I can but hold up my hands and then put em in my pocket and pass the tenner on.  A fair bet, won fairly, but I must admit that for a minute there I was thinking that your votes would fade away onto the Fence.  A good late rally secured the tie.

Now, er, any bright ideas how I can send 10 quid to the Geoffrey Watling Fund (does it exist?) from my office in south-central Tanzania?

I rest my hopes on the Crouch living up to reputation and failing to muster up a shot on target, let alone a goal!

And as for Holty, well I''m a Scot and I love the man, but I loved him more in Div 1.  Someone said earlier in this thread that time will tell whether Holty/Mullers/Safri et al should deserve their place.  So let it tell.  I hope Holty doesn''t play today so that at least we all have something to compare him to...

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Tazmania...I never knew you were so far away.

If Crouch doesn''t score today, we''ll wipe the slate clean. If he does score, it''s £20 to the Geoffery Watling fund.

Postal address to follow...he he he!

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Just wanted to bring this thread back the forefront as so many posters were moaning about Francis disappearing and Mullers not being any better than Holt, Francis scores our only goals, oh doesn''t that make him joint top goal scorer?   Mullers was way better than Holt.  Okay you can argue that So''ton are poor opposition, so a run of games please Mr. Worthington.  Agree with the start at the back comment too, our defence is not good enough for this league and better teams would have scored a hat full yesterday.  Need some height and pace sharpish - hi Shacks!!  

Now Mullers is in, my campaign for Helveg and Shacks will continue

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Gary Holt is a great Championship/old div1 player, but he does not have enough skill to play in the premiership. Yes he can run but in the premiership you need the qualities to hold a ball, pass a ball, create something from nothing and also shoot. He is simply not good enough. If we want a runner in the side we should sign Maurice Green!!!!! He probably has more skill level than Holty. Don''t get me wrong, the work he has done for City has been fantastic but we are playing in the best league in the world, there is no room for sentiment. Sorry Gary!!!!!! OTBC

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claiming Maurice Green has more skill than Gary Holt is just offensive really, seems like we win 1 game without Gary playing and there will be a glut of posters jumping on the "look we win when Gary Holt doesn''t play" bandwagon. Don''t get me wrong, I am delighted we have finally won but there was only one significant change in the starting line up and i doubt that had much to do with the result to be honest. Let''s face it this wasn''t even our best performance of the season was it? I can''t believe the player who has played out of his skin year in year out gets so much criticism.

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