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Re: The Doc is on his bike......

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[quote user="Glenn Foy"]Your a moron. Did you watch the Man U away game? Stop making such glib, ignorant comments and think before you post. He IS a Norwich legend. [/quote]Sorry to be a pedant, but if you call someone a moron you need to get your facts right. Doc didn''t play at Old Trafford… he hadn''t signed at that point. I think you''ll find it was against Newcastle.Ok, interlude over… carry on with the mud-slinging!

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I cant believe that a couple of people are angry with Lambert for this decision, would they rather keep Doc, (who admittedly has had a good season) possibly against the wishes of Lambert.

It may not have been totally Down to Lambert, perhaps an offer was made that Doc refused or his agent has something on the table? Will anyone ever know, but to be doubting the man who otherwise is god seems a bit hypocritical to me. I could nearly understand if Grant Holt had been released[:P]

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[quote user="norfolkbroadslim"]

So we get rid of the Doc and are left with Askou, Nelson and Spillane.[/quote]

And Whitbread.  Now, I was expecting the CBs to be Doc + Whitbread as first choice, but apparently not - so I''m confused too.Whitbread plus one, I guess.

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[quote user="Mister Chops"][quote user="wrathsajoke"]2 WORDS- LEAGUE ONE[/quote]There are 24 football teams in League One.  Each has (usually) two centre backs, which makes 48 players to select from.Doherty was one of the two best centre backs in that league last season, if he made Team of the Year.Don''t you think on that basis he deserved a shot in the Championship?[/quote]

Exactly - this PROVES The Doc is HIGHLY thought of by many others doesn''t it?

It''s an incredible decision - PL must have a gem of a player on lower money lined up methinks?

There can''t be too many about in that category - mind you, based on past performance PL will know who to get in...

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Doc, loyal player, not Championship standard imo, but legend, how easy is it to be put in that bracket now? Think were in danger of devaluing legend status if this sort of thing carries on.[:O]

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rather than everyone arguing whether it was right or wrong lets put it all into perspective. I''ll be honest i used to shout from the stands everytime he made a mistake but knowing he always gave 100% i warmed to him like most of us did. Yes, the doc has been a norwich legend and had his best season by far by a country mile. But come on, the only decent teams in league 1 were basically in the top 6-8, the rest of them pretty much dire so has he really been tested?

I believe Lambert has made the decision probably not on performance alone, perhaps cutting the wage bill so he can bring in experienced and competitive championship players. I was watching the champ play off games this week and you look at their defence, both teams had strong, quick players. Although i love ''Ginger Pele'' he hasn''t really got the speed for that league for us to be challenging.

Alot of people doubted lambert when he came in but he proved everyone wrong and im sure he will make the best decisions for the team. The only thing i disagree with is similar to the roeder-hucks decision. We wasnt told beforehand and never got a chance to give the doc a proper send-off. Good luck to him and im sure many teams will be after him and hopefully if he gets the chance to come back to fortress carrow road we will all give him a huge standing ovation.

As for the other victims, cureton is ****, mcveigh though i love him he''s too old and wasnt even good enough for league one and the other two i cant even remember their names do that says it all.

I believe Rose, Russell Martin, Hughes and maybe even Lappin will also struggle next season because they are all too slow on the ball and at champ level you get found out.

IN LAMBERT WE TRUST!!!!

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[quote user="Mister Chops"][quote user="norfolkbroadslim"]

So we get rid of the Doc and are left with Askou, Nelson and Spillane.[/quote]

And Whitbread.  Now, I was expecting the CBs to be Doc + Whitbread as first choice, but apparently not - so I''m confused too.

Whitbread plus one, I guess.

[/quote]

Oh yes, I forgot about Whitbread.  Hardly surprising I forgot about him though is it, which proves my point perfectly

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[quote user="Olski_yellows"] Although i love ''Ginger Pele'' he hasn''t really got the speed for that

league for us to be challenging.

[/quote]This is another common myth about Doherty, that he is slow.Ask Jermaine Beckford if the Doc is slow.

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Never been one to barrack players but privately I have always been critical of Doherty''s performances in recent seasons. However this season he has been magnificent and our best centre half by a distance. Based on current performances will Askou and Nelson step up? They have only performed in league one and not as well as the Doc by my reckoning so surely that makes them even less suitable to step up. What about Whitbread who has been ropey at best so far? This is a big decision by Lambert. I hope he has something interesting planned. But I guess the writing was on the wall when he tried to sign Seaborne in January.

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[quote user="Big Bad John"]At the best of times the Doc was a heroic figure. I could never think of associating him with the word ''solid'', like i could Adam Drury, but he had the passion and detrmination within him to go that extra mile in his efforts to keep the opposition at bay, and protect our goal from any threats that beared upon it.Personally, with regret i feel this is a good move by Lambert. Doherty had played a key part in two successive relegations, overseen our darkest times in football, his lack of assurance, more explicitly evident on his worst days, created a wave of anxiety amongst many fans that could never quite accustom themselves with his style of defending, and as captain i feel he is best forgotten, with him having presided over

the worst half of last season that led to our eventual relegation, and

our worst form under Paul Lambert. Whether you like it or not, the Doc is a very symbolic part of our past, and should be accounted for such as we look to the future under a new regime. The past is an elemental part of our hopes for progress, and Lambert will naturally look to release any potential baggage in that respect so as to maximise the potential of our club to head full steam into the higher echelons of English football. In this case Doherty is that baggage.As good a player he could be, he could never quite provide the bedrock someone of his experience would be expected, and to peril of previous regimes, was asked, to do. Doherty is very much his own man, and plays his own game. Some made more of what he was, whilst others made much less, but what is for certain is that he was a man made of the very simple ingredients of ''courage'' and ''passion'', and what those characteristics manifested into in his game made him into the player we all know him to be... A rather ''ambigous'' one.Whatever is to be said about him though, he undisputedly served this club well in many respects, and for that i will thank him as he finally departs from a long stay at Carrow Road.[/quote]QFT

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I have been saying since Dec/Jan that Doc should be released and got shot down for it. He has had a good season in this league but ain''t good enough for the money in the championship with Nelson + Askou/Whitbread partnership. I think as they have been signing the praises of Whitbread he may be first choice with either Askou or Nelson.

Cheers Marmite Doc for your efforts this season.

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When I first heard the news I was very shocked, if not saddened at the departure of Doc. However, now thinking about it-it is not the end of the world. I appreciate everything he has done for us greatly, but no-one can deny sometimes he WAS a bit of a liability at Championship level. He was a great servant to the club, and always gave 110%, but does no-one else think Lambo has a better addition up his sleeve? For him too release the Doc, was very bold and one I just think wouldn''t have happened was he not planning an immediate replacement. I for one know, that Doc was a one of our highest earners along with JC, and too get his wages off our books is surely a good thing. It shouldn''t be to hard too find someone with lesser wages, young hungry, and decent/good championship material. The likes of Mark Beavers (Sheff Wed POTS), Elliot Ward, Jay McCevely & Martin Taylor all seem a good shout to me. However, Doc will never be forgotten, and [8] There''s only one Ginger Pele [8]In Lambert I Trust!

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[quote user="grantroederdisaster"]If Whitbread was that good then why didn''t he play more last season?[/quote]Injuries.

[quote]The Docs release has shocked me cause he was a major part of this seasons success and has been one of best players ever since the 1st season after relegation from the Premiership. Those who attribute our 2 relegations largely to the Doc are being very blinkered. The great urban myths about the Doc being slow and generally cr*p were so far wide of the mark that it was painful listening to ignorant fans making these claims.[/quote]

Of course it was a team failure and not just Doherty who let us down, but he was a big part of that failure and was regularly criticised on here, and openly mocked by fans of other clubs. People don''t start making comments about ''bear hugging'' and being slow from nowhere. He received the criticism because he was due it in a lot of cases. He did also get some unfair stick in the process.

[quote]I was saying on this forum all season to all the Doc knockers, tell me a better CB in this Division - Obviously after the Ginger Peles inclusion in the League 1 team of the season voted for by other League 1 players, my sentiments are shared by those who better than any of us![/quote]

I don''t think virtually anyone is looking to dispute this point, it''s the concern about his ability in the CCC that''s the issue. If a supposed Prem standard player cannot get into the L1 team of the season, then there''s something badly wrong

I do also want to point out that on each of the previous occasions Doc has been free to leave or even told he can leave, there hasn''t been a single solid offer made (to anyone''s knowledge, and we do manage to find out most things). Why is it that a player of such ''quality'' hasn''t been snapped up on a free on these occasions? You''d think there would have been CCC clubs lining up in droves to get a player of that standard on a free - but nothing...alarm bells are ringing here...

[quote]I know one thing, it would probably cost a lot of money to replace the Doc with a better player![/quote]FFS he''s not Vidic or Terry, replacing a low CCC/top L1 defender isn''t going to cost the earth, and chances are that their wages would be lower as well. 

[quote]And a message to the Doc - Thanks for your full hearted performances for the club[/quote]

This I can totally agree with, ability may have been lacking on occasions, but you couldn''t fault his commitment on the pitch.

[quote]I hope Lambert knows what hes doing cause releasing one of our best players is a massive call and I hope that the Doc doesn''t come back to haunt us![/quote]

Releasing the likes of Hoolahan, Holt or Martin would have been a massive call, releasing Doc isn''t that big a deal, and I can''t ever see myself thinking "God, I wish we had Doherty back"...

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Always divided opinion but gave 100% I will be sorry to see him go but i guess that Lambert does not want to keep Nelson and Docherty together and not much to pick between the pair other than one is out of contract

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I am mystified as to why there is no mention of the Doc leaving on the main Norwich City news page on the Pink Un. I would like to know the full story. He was out of contract so maybe he had indicated he wanted to leave. Really sad to see him go.

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[quote user="norfolkbroadslim"]

Can somebody please explain the logic in that to me because I am struggling to see it.

[/quote]it seems Lambert, like many, doesnt think he''ll cut in the champ. All this rubbish about being proven in the champ is ridiculous. He certainly wasnt the only reason we went down, or maybe even the main reason, but to be equally at fault for the failures of last season when he is supposedly a leader makes me really doubt he can create and lead a strong  back line next season.Hes quite often been described as a confidence player and that has certainly showed this season so what happens when we inevitably have a bad run of games next season? Forgive him, its Doc and hes a legend? Better to leave on a great seasons performance and build a better and stronger team for the champ

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I don''t understand why archant aren''t picking this up. I didn''t even know about it until seeing it on the BBC site as i haven''t been on here for a while.

Pretty shocked. I don''t think there''s any question of Nelson and Doc being better or worse than one another. It''s a tough call if you want to let someone go and i guess in the end it has come down to money, plain and simple. Nelson is under contract, a McNally negotiated contract at that so likely to be affordable for the club.

I just wonder if he intends replacing him or if he''s happy to go with Nelson, Whitbread, Askou, Spillane.

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[quote user="Mister Chops"]I hope he''ll find a club where supporters realise he does not give away penalties and free kicks around the box in every game.  [/quote]!!! Before this season it was virtually every game! Remember the hands all round attackers? Jumping over and on top of them? Then looking perplexed when a free kick is given? Yes 100% effort, anything to win the ball, but keep your hands to yourself and just head the ball!Seems Lambert really took that weakness out of his game

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[quote user="Indy_Bones"][quote user="Big Bad John"]At the best of times the Doc was a heroic figure. I could never think of associating him with the word ''solid'', like i could Adam Drury, but he had the passion and detrmination within him to go that extra mile in his efforts to keep the opposition at bay, and protect our goal from any threats that beared upon it.Personally, with regret i feel this is a good move by Lambert. Doherty had played a key part in two successive relegations, overseen our darkest times in football, his lack of assurance, more explicitly evident on his worst days, created a wave of anxiety amongst many fans that could never quite accustom themselves with his style of defending, and as captain i feel he is best forgotten, with him having presided over

the worst half of last season that led to our eventual relegation, and

our worst form under Paul Lambert. Whether you like it or not, the Doc is a very symbolic part of our past, and should be accounted for such as we look to the future under a new regime. The past is an elemental part of our hopes for progress, and Lambert will naturally look to release any potential baggage in that respect so as to maximise the potential of our club to head full steam into the higher echelons of English football. In this case Doherty is that baggage.As good a player he could be, he could never quite provide the bedrock someone of his experience would be expected, and to peril of previous regimes, was asked, to do. Doherty is very much his own man, and plays his own game. Some made more of what he was, whilst others made much less, but what is for certain is that he was a man made of the very simple ingredients of ''courage'' and ''passion'', and what those characteristics manifested into in his game made him into the player we all know him to be... A rather ''ambigous'' one.Whatever is to be said about him though, he undisputedly served this club well in many respects, and for that i will thank him as he finally departs from a long stay at Carrow Road.[/quote]QFT[/quote]I couldn''t have put it better myself Big Bad John.  This is exactly how I feel over the whole subject, I was shocked that he was released, but at the end of the day we all know the restrictions he has.  I was one of his biggest critics over the last few years, and whilst he did win me over this season with his sheer determination to succeed, I do believe that Lambert has made the right call here.

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I have not read the 10 pages of this thread so forgive me if someone else has already said this.

 

I would imagine that Lambert also told the doc that he will be looking to bring in other CB''s to strengthen the team and therefore the Doc would not necessarily be in the starting line up every week and therefore the Doc may well have decided not to accept any contract (if there was one offered) due to this reason. 

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To me this news augurs well for the future. There is no doubt that Doc could have done a job for us next term ,IF  our ambition was solely to just survive in the Championship. But the message this gives out is that is not the board''s or Lambert''s intention. If we are to challeng at the right end of this Div,then we need players of much higher quality/ability than Doc in the squad.

 

The fact is that there is no room for sentimentality in Football these days,and I''m sure Doc will soon find a club,where he''ll be able to make a more positive contribution than he would here. Best of luck,Gary.

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[quote user="Andy Larkin"]Sorry to be a pedant, but if you call someone a moron you need to get your facts right. Doc didn''t play at Old Trafford… he hadn''t signed at that point. I think you''ll find it was against Newcastle.[/quote]Whereas presumably, if you don''t call someone a moron you don''t need to worry about facts [;)][url]http://www.soccerbase.com/results3.sd?gameid=428802[/url]

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Yes, another Doc thread. Sorry!What sort of club does everyone think he will go to and in what league?Also, is there anyone who wouldn''t give Doc a good reception if he ever lined up against us? He''s been a great servant for the club and one of our top performers this season, always gave %100 even when he was heavily targeted for criticism by our fans. I admire that about the Doc and think EVERYONE should give him a good reception, no questions. Saying that, there''s always a few who disagree and decide to boo ex-players regardless...

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[quote user="Persnickety"][quote user="Mister Chops"]I hope he''ll find a club where supporters realise he does not give away penalties and free kicks around the box in every game.  [/quote]!!! Before this season it was virtually every game![/quote]No, it wasn''t.  It''s never been like that!  227 appearances, four penalties given away.  Averages just over one foul per game.  Shocking.

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[quote user="mickfoot"]110%er, hope you find a good club that will appreciate you as much as you were appreciated at Norwich.[/quote]Did you get the [img]http://www.pinkun.com/cs_pinkun/cs/Themes/default/images/newtopic.gif[/img] button mixed up with the [img]http://www.pinkun.com/cs_pinkun/cs/Themes/default/images/newpost.gif[/img] button? Or did you think the forum needed a 17th individual Doherty topic?

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[quote user="First Wizard"]Thank God, one of the worse defenders I''ve ever seen play for City, a happy day.[Y][/quote]No he''s not, don''t be silly.

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agree with wiz on this one .

he is a good first division player ,

we need to raise our game this season , and parting with a few who did not cut it last time is not a bad thing.

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="First Wizard"]Thank God, one of the worse defenders I''ve ever seen play for City, a happy day.[Y][/quote]

No he''s not, don''t be silly.
[/quote]No its not Morty, this is based on me being in the Barclay actually watching him, he was a damn liability at times.

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