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Re: The Doc is on his bike......

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I think it is time that the club and him parted company. As much as he seems to polarise opinions, he played a lot of games for the club and never shirked responsibility on the pitch. And whilst I see him merits, I don''t think they shine through as clearly as some on this message board would preach. In reality Doc has resided over 5 of our worst seasons in living memory, and whilst no single player is solely responsible for the on-pitch results, he was and always will be part of that. So while I''m disappointed a player who has played well over this past season has not been giving a contract, the past has caught up with him. His refusal to sign on for a new contract two years ago before becoming a bosman, and for being one of the higher paid players at the club undermine, for me, what he has achieved on the pitch. I personally feel it is time we signed a leader and inspirational centre back at the club, something we have avoided since letting Malkay go, and Flem departing from the starting XI. Still, I have my doubts, but I trust Lamberts'' judgement above all, he has managed to pleasantly surprise me throughout the whole season, and hopefully we can all look back on this decision and unanimously agree that it was the right decision for the club that let us move forward to better and brighter things. So thank you Doc and all the best at your next club, you deserve it.Just one more thing, I''d like to thank McVeigh as well. I know he''s not done much this past season, only playing in about 10 games, but I can''t help but feel his career maybe coming to a premature end. Probably my favourite Norwich player when I was younger, it was a pleasure to watch him play when he was at his best, a player that few defences in Division One could handle, so best of luck WLY as I fear you may need it.

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hahaha I always wondered how we got such strange player of the season voting... now I know!

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[quote user="RichT - The Biscuit"]Never really been a massive Doc fan, but will admit that he has been better this year after being left out when Lambert arrived. However, lets put a little bit of reality around this, Doc is out of contract, the last time he was out of contract he demanded a wage in excess of what he was worth, he was still given a bladey good contract, how do I know this, well unlike some who claim to have inside knowledge, I did have connections within the coaching staff pre-Lambert. So, with him being on a lot of money, out of contract and no doubt wanting something similar, I think that there are players out there who we could get who will do a better job for less money. We have to trust Lambert and don''t be suprised if he already has someone lined up. I posted the other day that Whitbread and Askou could well be our starting pair, people have very short memories when it comes to players, before getting injured Askou was consistent and looked solid and comfortable on the ball, yes he was poor against Carlisle but to be fair to him he hadn''t played much and if you watch the replay you will see that he got majorly exposed by a certain player being too far up the field who''s man then scored, that player was Doc. Lets not also forget that last year Doc was awful, yes a lot of players were but this guy was an international and played in the Prem blah, blah, blah. I ask all those that think that this is a stupid decision, when has Doc ever looked like an international or Prem league player since he has been here?? Now I''m not Doc bashing, but I am trying to look at this for what it is, someone whom Lambert is sure cannot cut it in the Championship or the Doc has asked for a big contract that he is not worth, we will never know the answer, but lets move on and trust Lambert as I can''t think of much that he has got wrong since he has been here![/quote]

 

You think that Askous better than the Doc?

 

PLLease!

 

Yes looking at the season just gone, Askou really stood out as being better than the Doc. The Doc is faster than Askou and is much more comfortable on the ball than Askou!

 

You thought the Doc was awful in the relegation last year?

 

Wrong - The Doc and Clingan and maybe to a lesser extent David Marshall were head and shoulders above the rest of the squad and could hold their heads high!

 

One I do agree with you on is that we have to trust Lambert cause his previous decisions have turned out to be good ones!

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[quote user="Lord Flashheart"][quote user="TheGoogler"]Agree with Black Panther. It''s a decision that''ll either be vindicated or proven wrong only this time next year. It''s bold.[/quote]

How come releasing Hucks wasn''t regarded as "bold"? Was it because we all thought Roeder was a dicksplash? [*-)]
[/quote]

Probably, we all have confidence in Lambert which is why I for one am backing him in this decision. Roeder didn''t know what he was doing, hence all those loan signings which cost us in the long run. The season after we realsed Hucks we went down and were lacking in the wide areas so I think it is clear that the decision to released Huckerby wasn''t valid. But that doesn''t mean lightning will strike twice, neither will it not, but we will only see in time to come.

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Yes I do think that Askou is a better player than Doc, if Lambert honestly thought that Doc was better than Askou or Nelson or Whitbread he would have kept him would he not??? Unless of course there is some sort of suggestion that Lambert doesn''t know what he is doing or he made the decision last night whilst he was drunk!?!? Doc has the same ball week in week out, the diagonal ball out to the left wing, if we can recognise it week in week out then every football manager will do!

As for Doc last year, I used to be a Doc basher, not because I disliked him as a person but because he would give needless freekicks away on the edge of our area because he spent more time with him arms round defenders when he should have been doing what a centre half should do and that''s get his head on it. I''m actually quite suprised he has been released as this year he has done that less and less, maybe the influence of Culverhouse, who knows and I actually think that had he not been at the end of his contract would he have been released!

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I still don''t really know what to think, I''m a big fan of the Doc but I''m going to save my final judgement until I see next season'' team sheet.

 

What does really get me however is all these people saying ‘he was poor at championship level it’ a good thing we released him because he wouldn’t have made it’. I really don’t understand comments like this, I mean what about Whitbread, Nelson and Askou- none of them are even proven at championship level and Doherty made it onto the team sheet above all of them- what does that say? Players don’t just magically become 100 times better than other players when they enter new leagues etc.

 It is possible for a player’s skill to completely change under new management and that’s what I believe has happened with Doherty with him finally finding the confidence/security in the team this year which in turn has helped him develop. I’m still not really convinced by all this wage talk either. If his wages were so high why did the club renew his contract two years ago when we were struggling to afford players etc? And why did we not just come to an agreement at the start of this season when he found himself in the reserves if his wages were so tough? It just seems slightly sceptical that we were able to afford his wages two years ago when there were still many other players on similar wages but not now when I’d expect to have seen the squad’s overall wage fall massively from what it was and when we have just been promoted.

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Doc gone = first good decision by Paul Lambert for the 2010/2011 season!

Now lets get one thing straight, Doherty is 110% proven at being completely useless in the Championship!  He is not a legend and if you think he is a legend then it just proves how bad the last few seasons (before this one) have been! 

Onwards and Upwards!

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[quote user="Boyo"]Now lets get one thing straight, Doherty is 110% proven at being completely useless in the Championship![/quote]Let''s get another thing straight.  You''re talking garbage.

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Well said Fellas... I agree with everything you have to say, especially about Paul McVeigh who delighted the crowd for 3 or 4 years before it all went wrong under Worthy despite being played out of position for most of that time for me. I will never forget the momentum that carried us in to the play-offs with McVeigh and Nelson upfront in 2002. I think in the few games McVeigh did get this season he never really let us down.

You do wonder if this could be the end of Paul and Jamie Cureton''s careers? I wish both of them the best of luck in whatever the future beyond their playing days might hold for them. We will forever have memories of WLY pulling the strings at the Millennium Stadium and Jamie C patting his bald green head after netting at Portaloo Rd... Best of luck lads!

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[quote user="Graham Humphrey"][quote user="Boyo"]Now lets get one thing straight, Doherty is 110% proven at being completely useless in the Championship![/quote]
Let''s get another thing straight.  You''re talking garbage.
[/quote]

So he is a good, solid, Championship quality defender then is he? Now who is talking garbage?

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[quote user="Graham Humphrey"][quote user="Boyo"]Now lets get one thing straight, Doherty is 110% proven at being completely useless in the Championship![/quote]
Let''s get another thing straight.  You''re talking garbage.
[/quote]

yeah agreed [Y]

All these people saying ‘Whitbreads going to be great when fit, he was brilliant two seasons ago’ it’s ridiculous! Doherty was brilliant this season and yet by so many peoples reasoning he’s going to be rubbish in the championship so surely that reasoning would point to Whitbread being rubbish in the championship too!!

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[quote user="freddyf105"]

[quote user="Graham Humphrey"][quote user="Boyo"]Now lets get one thing straight, Doherty is 110% proven at being completely useless in the Championship![/quote]
Let''s get another thing straight.  You''re talking garbage.
[/quote]

yeah agreed [Y]

All these people saying ‘Whitbreads going to be great when fit, he was brilliant two seasons ago’ it’s ridiculous! Doherty was brilliant this season and yet by so many peoples reasoning he’s going to be rubbish in the championship so surely that reasoning would point to Whitbread being rubbish in the championship too!!

[/quote]

Why are you asking the question why can''t Doherty make it in the Championship?  Before we got relegated he was hopeless in the Championship and people on here would have jumped at te chance to get him released but, because he had a good season in that really, really, really good league called league 1 people are now saying he can definately cut it in the Championship! 

Hello, everytime he has played in the Championship he has been hopeless, he is still the same Doherty, nothings changed!

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It''s funny how everyone has different opinions about what happens, guess thats what makes life so much fun eh!

Yes Doc was better this year, but he only got back into the team due to injuries and lets be honest, none of the other central defenders have really been fully fit since, Askou had his problems, Whitbread has been injured and so has Spillane, so he''s hardly kept players out of the team has he, none of the potential replacements were fit.

Now I''m not saying that he was only in because of this but who''s to know whether he would have ever got back in had the others not been injured for long periods.

But I will reiterate, he had a better year than last year and looked comfortable in League 1. But what we don''t see is what Lambert sees in training day in day out and he obviously doesn''t feel that the Doc is up to the standard that he wants in the Championship

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Thanks Doc, you''ve been a good player for us, and have some blinders this season and lets not forget we have paid you well for 6 years so its worked well for all of us. Sometimes its just time to move on, this shows we are ambitious and want to be challenging at the top next year.

Good luck Doc where ever you go.

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[quote user="Graham Humphrey"]You.  Sorry.
[/quote]

Can I just ask how unearth do you think he is a good defender?  Anyone who has watched Norwich over the past few seasons in the Championship with half a footballing brain cell would see that he is complete and utter rubbish!

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Bit strong Boyo, he''s not complete and utter rubbish as he did a job this year in League 1, but I do agree with you that he wasn''t very good in the Championship when we were there last year and that is the point of all of this.

I will still come back to the point made before and that is that if Lambert thought he was good enough, he would still be here, end of really!

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"Why are you asking the question why can''t Doherty make it in the Championship?  Before we got relegated he was hopeless in the Championship and people on here would have jumped at te chance to get him released but, because he had a good season in that really, really, really good league called league 1 people are now saying he can definately cut it in the Championship! 

Hello, everytime he has played in the Championship he has been hopeless, he is still the same Doherty, nothings changed!"

Well he clearly isn''t the ''same Doherty'' after the performances he''s put in this season against some of the league''s best strikers. It''s a shame you have to act with such arrogance to mock the standard of players in league 1, especially those who were recognised by their peers as being excellent. Either way it is possible for a player to change under different management, if that wasn''t the case then we wouldn''t still have a player like askou who was deemed unfit by a lower league Turkish club...

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Absolutely true Freddy, Diego Forlan is a classic example of different players and managers, pants at Manure but consistently one of the top scorers in Spanish football.

Just look at Chris Martin, Roeder thought he was a troublemaker (not suggesting he''s an angel) but boy can that boy score goals and Lambert has seen that or has he just got the best from him.

The thing with Doc, he wasn''t in favour, got back in due to injury, stayed in due to injuries and an improvement in form or simply impressing in training and ended up having a good season but contrary to what some believe, he was poor last year and cost us a lot of silly goals, Marshall looked crap last year because he had no confidence of what was in front of him, purely my opnion of course!!

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Someone has said on another forum it was Docs decision,  he''ll be moving

to a league 2 club to start earning his coaching badges, and the

management knew of this weeks ago.

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[quote user="RichT - The Biscuit"]Bit strong Boyo, he''s not complete and utter rubbish as he did a job this year in League 1, but I do agree with you that he wasn''t very good in the Championship when we were there last year and that is the point of all of this. I will still come back to the point made before and that is that if Lambert thought he was good enough, he would still be here, end of really![/quote]

I meant complete and utter rubbish in the championship, which is what he is.  This year, he has done well, but Lambert has done the right thing in getting rid of him because he would be a waste of time next season.

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[quote user="freddyf105"]

 

"Why are you asking the question why can''t Doherty make it in the Championship?  Before we got relegated he was hopeless in the Championship and people on here would have jumped at te chance to get him released but, because he had a good season in that really, really, really good league called league 1 people are now saying he can definately cut it in the Championship! 

Hello, everytime he has played in the Championship he has been hopeless, he is still the same Doherty, nothings changed!"

Well he clearly isn''t the ''same Doherty'' after the performances he''s put in this season against some of the league''s best strikers. It''s a shame you have to act with such arrogance to mock the standard of players in league 1, especially those who were recognised by their peers as being excellent. Either way it is possible for a player to change under different management, if that wasn''t the case then we wouldn''t still have a player like askou who was deemed unfit by a lower league Turkish club...

[/quote]

Lambert has brought the best out of him but he has still got older and at the end of the day at times in this league he has still looked very shakey.  He has found his level, well done Paul Lambert for noticing that.

And as for the standard of players, if an ex premier league player can''t defend agaisn''t them then I would be worried.

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Everyone saying "Why should Nelson stay?" etc, he''s still under contract. For all we know, Lambert might try and sell him as well.

How many defensive partners has Doc had over the past six years? How many of those has he actually formed a solid partnership that you had faith in with? None in my opinion. So are all his partners the problem or is it the Doc?

I think it''s a very bold move by Lambert as I think defence is going to be our weakest area next season.

I don''t feel that The Doc was going to be worth the wages he would have asked for and I think we will be able to get someone younger in that can perform to a higher level for the money we paid him.

I wonder if he already knew because when we were singing "One Ginger Pele" at him on the bus he seemed really struck by it like it had a bit of extra poignancy.

I''m pleased he has had such a good season and I wish him all the best for the future.

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Hope to see us building a team that will be of Championship standard. Decisive management and a good  decision. Well done Lambert.

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I''m also pleased he had a good season, he has been here a while and although I''ve never been a fan he''s been a servant to the club and has helped us gain promotion back to the Championship

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[quote user="TheNewBoy"][quote user="GJP"][quote user="Good Touch For A Big Man"][quote user="morty"][quote user="Good Touch For A Big Man"]

[quote user="morty"]Meh.

[:(]
[/quote]

Will you keep the picture in honour of the Doc, Morty?

[/quote]

I shall indeed.

[:)]
[/quote]

In all seriousness really surprised by this. Really big call by Lambert. But if he isn''t convinced by him in the championship then fair play.  But best of luck to the Doc. Been a bloody star this season when he could have easily sacked the season off in about August and just taken the money.

[/quote]

To be honest I''d very much doubt it''s got anything to do with the Championship because looking at it Lambert will know what Doherty has done in the game. Afterall nobody in our squad has done as well in football as he has.

My guess would be the money side of it or perhaps the Doc himself would like to leave on a high and have a fresh start at a new club while he''s still got a few years on his side.

[/quote]

"Nobody in our squad has done as well in football as he has"

Really? Because I was under the impression that this was his first winners medal, and he has no individual honours that I can speak of. He played a handful of games at Spurs and got ridiculed as a result, he played in a very poor Ireland defence in an international team which never qualified for a major tournament whilst he played. In fact, this is his first ever promotion. In fact, he is probably one of the LEAST successful senior players in our squad. Please for the bloke to have won something, but now is the time for him to take that trip to the USA.

Adam Drury, on the other hand, has a Championship winners medal and a League One winners medal.

Paul McVeigh now has a Championship winners medal, a League One winners medal, and an FA Vase winners medal.

Chris Martin now has a League One winners medal, and an FA Vase Winners Medal.

Michael Spillane now has a League One winners medal, and an FA Vase Winners Medal.

Gary Holt now has two League One winners medals, and the League Two top scorer award.

Jamie Cureton has won several League One and League Two top scorer awards.

Matt Gill captained Exeter City to two consecutive promotions.

Stephen Hughes, I believe, possesses more than one Scottish Premier League winners medal.

Russell Martin now has two League One winners medals.

Wes Hoolohan has now won promotion from League One for the second time.

Now, you tell me what Gary Dohery has "achieved" other than being comically labelled the ''Ginger Pele'' after a handful of games for a, frankly, crap Spurs team. You sound just like those journalists who give bias coverage towards famous clubs. Oh thats Doherty, the former Spurs player, the only player... he once played in the premiership.... Norwich aint so rubbish afterall :/

Whitbread is better, period.

[/quote]

Well just look at the level of football he''s played at in comparison to the others.

Isn''t it obvious?

The majority of those players have done things in the lower leagues.

Gary Doc has clocked up several seasons of football in the top two tiers, not to mention playing for his country.

That''s not to say some of the others couldn''t go a bit further but quite simply the Doc has done it. And that''s what counts.

So yeah, without doubt, the Doc has had the best career in football out of them all, as it stands at the moment.

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