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The Deloitte report is in. Watch this space.

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[quote user="blahblahblah"]Assuming you are still Joe - the Liverpool deal is not one to bring up if you want to win fans over.  Creating a credit facility for the fans to pay back is what fans of clubs want to avoid.  As I said before, give the choice of a philanthropist like Cullum and a capitalist, I''ll take the philanthropist any day of the week.
[/quote]

 

Ah, I see, you want dumb money that will be spent on a whim.  Fans think they need a new striker....sure, let''s spend several million quid.  After awhile, the money runs out.  Ask Mr. McCabe at Sheffield United who is seeking investment also.  This model doesn''t work even as generous as he has been with his wealth.  As much as you feel it is not, football is a business.

 

Joe

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[quote user="wirralcanary"]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]Assuming you are still Joe - the Liverpool deal is not one to bring up if you want to win fans over.  Creating a credit facility for the fans to pay back is what fans of clubs want to avoid.  As I said before, give the choice of a philanthropist like Cullum and a capitalist, I''ll take the philanthropist any day of the week.
[/quote]

 

Ah, I see, you want dumb money that will be spent on a whim.  Fans think they need a new striker....sure, let''s spend several million quid.  After awhile, the money runs out.  Ask Mr. McCabe at Sheffield United who is seeking investment also.  This model doesn''t work even as generous as he has been with his wealth.  As much as you feel it is not, football is a business.

 

Joe

[/quote]

 

Oh, one point I missed, the supporters don''t own Liverpool.  The supporters always have two options (i) don''t buy tickets and vote with your feet; or (ii) purchase the owners shares.  Otherwise, the fans don''t really have a say.

 

Best,

 

Joe

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[quote user="wirralcanary"]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]Assuming you are still Joe - the Liverpool deal is not one to bring up if you want to win fans over.  Creating a credit facility for the fans to pay back is what fans of clubs want to avoid.  As I said before, give the choice of a philanthropist like Cullum and a capitalist, I''ll take the philanthropist any day of the week.[/quote]

 

Ah, I see, you want dumb money that will be spent on a whim.  Fans think they need a new striker....sure, let''s spend several million quid.  After awhile, the money runs out.  Ask Mr. McCabe at Sheffield United who is seeking investment also.  This model doesn''t work even as generous as he has been with his wealth.  As much as you feel it is not, football is a business.

Joe

[/quote]Football is a business.  Premier League Portsmouth in administration.  Hull City with a debt they can''t service and 18 million owed to HMRC.  40+ football league clubs in administration in the last 18 years.  Man Utd with a 750 million debt - created by deals like the one you brokered for Liverpool.Why would any club, with the hindsight of the Glazers and Hicks / Gillette, use someone whose only talent is setting up a credit facility ?  If the fans have to pay for the club in the long run to enable an anonymous paper millionaire to gain an asset, such as the Glazers, why not just turn it over to the fans in the first place ?  Or failing that, a rich fan, such as the owner of Towergate...Norwich City does have land assets, I wonder if Wednesday also have vast tracts of land on their books.  Is this what interests your investors, or the club ?  I noticed that Man City are involved in the regeneration of land around their stadium, said to be worth 1 billion.  I do wonder if being part of this is the real reason for their Oil Sheiks'' interest...Also, I found this article suggesting that the Texas Rangers gained around 100 million in debt at the same time that Liverpool was bought by Hicks and Gillette.  The owner of the Rangers ?  Tom Hicks of course...

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="wirralcanary"]

Do you think I would actually give names to Deloitte after what McNally said about me on the BBC.  One would have to be in dreamland to believe something like that.



 

[/quote]

---
--

Well, this gets curioser and curioser, always assuming wirralcanary is anglophile is Joe Kosich!

I must say I had assumed that Kosich, having been told to do so by McNally, had already handed over these names to Deloitte’s before McNally spoke to the BBC, and so no damage had been done by his attack.

Now, if Kosich hadn’t passed the names on, but would have done so until he was slagged off by McNally, and now will keep them to himself, then it makes the McNally attack all the more stupid, even if what Kosich has produced in the way of possible investment interest turns out to amount to absolutely nothing.

---


[/quote]

Purple, part of what you respond with here is what I was getting at with you earlier. Your comment that "you had assumed" is, for me, you reacting in a different way than the superlative job you did ( in my opinion ) of summarizing the Peter Cullum saga, where you took great care to separate fact from fiction or assumptions. You will note that your earlier response to me did not address the factual point I made to you, namely: "Even if one conceeds the points you make viz "still a good thing" then I fail to see how you arrive at a summary that Deloitte would not not have had the names of possible investors without help from Kosich. None of us know that. do we? Indeed, I''m not sure we even know what Kosich handed over to Deloitte."

If Joe Kosich was referred to Deloitte then it is between those parties to deal with the matter. A lot of us engaging in speculation on here is fun, but not fact.

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[quote user="YankeeCanary"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="wirralcanary"]

Do you think I would actually give names to Deloitte after what McNally said about me on the BBC.  One would have to be in dreamland to believe something like that.



 

[/quote]

---
--

Well, this gets curioser and curioser, always assuming wirralcanary is anglophile is Joe Kosich!

I must say I had assumed that Kosich, having been told to do so by McNally, had already handed over these names to Deloitte’s before McNally spoke to the BBC, and so no damage had been done by his attack.

Now, if Kosich hadn’t passed the names on, but would have done so until he was slagged off by McNally, and now will keep them to himself, then it makes the McNally attack all the more stupid, even if what Kosich has produced in the way of possible investment interest turns out to amount to absolutely nothing.

---


[/quote]

Purple, part of what you respond with here is what I was getting at with you earlier. Your comment that "you had assumed" is, for me, you reacting in a different way than the superlative job you did ( in my opinion ) of summarizing the Peter Cullum saga, where you took great care to separate fact from fiction or assumptions. You will note that your earlier response to me did not address the factual point I made to you, namely: "Even if one conceeds the points you make viz "still a good thing" then I fail to see how you arrive at a summary that Deloitte would not not have had the names of possible investors without help from Kosich. None of us know that. do we? Indeed, I''m not sure we even know what Kosich handed over to Deloitte."

If Joe Kosich was referred to Deloitte then it is between those parties to deal with the matter. A lot of us engaging in speculation on here is fun, but not fact.

[/quote]

 

I was removed from the process after just prior to McNally''s immature rant on the BBC.

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HEY THERE, JOE, MAN!

Why didn''t you mosey along to the Supporters Forum tonight?

Couldn''t afford the 2 quid or avoiding eyeballing McNally and Delia? Or what?

Pity. Might have been fun.

OTBC

OTBC

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This is one of those really dry threads that you have to be an accountant or a corporate dullard to enjoy.

Posts from the usual suspects fighting over scraps with posts too long and wordy to interest anyone outside their ball achingly miserable clique. BIG YAWN.

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[quote user="YankeeCanary"]

Purple, part of what you respond with here is what I was getting at with you earlier. Your comment that "you had assumed" is, for me, you reacting in a different way than the superlative job you did ( in my opinion ) of summarizing the Peter Cullum saga, where you took great care to separate fact from fiction or assumptions. You will note that your earlier response to me did not address the factual point I made to you, namely: "Even if one conceeds the points you make viz "still a good thing" then I fail to see how you arrive at a summary that Deloitte would not not have had the names of possible investors without help from Kosich. None of us know that. do we? Indeed, I''m not sure we even know what Kosich handed over to Deloitte."

If Joe Kosich was referred to Deloitte then it is between those parties to deal with the matter. A lot of us engaging in speculation on here is fun, but not fact.

[/quote]------Not just your opinion, Yankee. I thought my

Cullumgate was pretty brilliant myself! That, for those who don’t get irony, is

self-mocking, by the way… Moving on
, of course you are right that Deloitte’s might have got whatever

names Kosich got, assuming Kosich got some names, which I strongly suspect he

did, given the market he was aiming at. But equally (precisely because of the

market Kosich was aiming at) his names may have been extra to those Deloitte’s

has found – assuming Deloitte’s has found any! If we can’t assume about Kosich

we can’t about Deloitte’s either…
[:D]I don''t actually think we are far apart on this, so I would be happy to leave it there, especially as if I carry on I''ll seque into another rant against McNally and his lamentable performance on this issue...`[:@]

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[quote user="wirralcanary"]I was removed from the process after just prior to McNally''s immature rant on the BBC.[/quote]Hey WC (I love your initials), how come you''re only showing two posts when there''s about six on this thread?

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Supporter forum news, there will be no Fernandes investment any time soon and Kosich was seen by McNally as just another leech trying to make a fast buck.

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[quote user="morty"]Supporter forum news, there will be no Fernandes investment any time soon and Kosich was seen by McNally as just another leech trying to make a fast buck.[/quote]

Morty,

I just want to repeat again, McNally thought he had a "bird in hand" with Fernandes and wanted to puff his chest out that he was earning his pay. Unfortunately, any investment is uncertain until the money changes hands. Fernandes only had an expression of possible interest. Nothing more than I had at the time with 2 investors here in the US.

McNally made the mistake of making me an enemy by flaming on me (for some unknown reason) on the BBC after I had posted a positive blog on the Canaries and given a very favorable interview with the Evening News. Unfortunately, I believe that McNally''s GIANT ego got in the way and felt he had to dismiss me.

No deals for a controlling interest in a club have happened outside of administration over the past year. Two clubs, Southampton and West Ham (Holdco in admin) sold controlling interests.

Here is the tally for the big name advisors in the last year:

Keith Harris - Zero

Inner Circle - Zero

Goldman - Zero

Merrill - Zero

Rothschilds - Zero

Deloitte - Zero - Not even a bank!!

Merrill and Goldman have had the LFC sell mandate for over a year and a half with ZERO results. Guess who will be the first advisor to raise equity for a club in over a year and a half?? You guessed it...Me

Inner Circle had the sell side mandate on Sheffield Wednesday but I nor my clients were on the list. I contacted THEM as I had a working relationship with Inner Circle. Good people (Rob Tillis and Philip Hall).

Before people start making libellous remarks about me and my firm, take a look at the facts. Mr. McNally was ill-behaved in his remarks on the BBC as I was not engaged by NCFC but had given the club great coverage. What he chose to do in this instance was act like a cretin on the BBC.

Finally, where is the money Mr. McNally??

Mr. Fernandes has left the building.

Respectfully this time,

Joe

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[quote user="morty"]Yeah, whatever.[/quote]

Morty,

Cat got your tongue?? Do you agree or disagree? I just want clarification from you so I can place all your minds at ease and make you understand that Chairman Mac acted like a boob on the BBC.

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[quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"]Yeah, whatever.[/quote]

Morty,

Cat got your tongue?? Do you agree or disagree? I just want clarification from you so I can place all your minds at ease and make you understand that Chairman Mac acted like a boob on the BBC.[/quote]He is our Chief Executive, and it would appear a very shrewd one.You are a middle man trying to make a fast buck and he told you to go talk to Deloitte.Then you made a complete arse of yourself on a fan''s forum, do you REALLY expect to be taken seriously?

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"]Yeah, whatever.[/quote]

Morty,

Cat got your tongue?? Do you agree or disagree? I just want clarification from you so I can place all your minds at ease and make you understand that Chairman Mac acted like a boob on the BBC.[/quote]He is our Chief Executive, and it would appear a very shrewd one.You are a middle man trying to make a fast buck and he told you to go talk to Deloitte.Then you made a complete arse of yourself on a fan''s forum, do you REALLY expect to be taken seriously?[/quote]

Morty,

I''m attempting to have an unemotional and logical debate with you but you seem unable to accomplish this. Your continued personal attacks on me using parroted phrases from Chairman Mac are not very grown up. I really don''t care what they call him...chairman, chief cook and bottle washer or travel agent for the club. Your ability to simply ignore chairman Macs behavior demonstrates that you are just a sheep not worthy of any grown up discourse.

Best,

Joe

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[quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"]Yeah, whatever.[/quote]

Morty,

Cat got your tongue?? Do you agree or disagree? I just want clarification from you so I can place all your minds at ease and make you understand that Chairman Mac acted like a boob on the BBC.[/quote]He is our Chief Executive, and it would appear a very shrewd one.You are a middle man trying to make a fast buck and he told you to go talk to Deloitte.Then you made a complete arse of yourself on a fan''s forum, do you REALLY expect to be taken seriously?[/quote]

Morty,

I''m attempting to have an unemotional and logical debate with you but you seem unable to accomplish this. Your continued personal attacks on me using parroted phrases from Chairman Mac are not very grown up. I really don''t care what they call him...chairman, chief cook and bottle washer or travel agent for the club. Your ability to simply ignore chairman Macs behavior demonstrates that you are just a sheep not worthy of any grown up discourse.

Best,

Joe[/quote]Your opinion. I''m fine with how he dealt with you.If I was in his position my opinion would be pretty much the same.I understand you''re trying to make money out of our club, we have already payed Deloitte a great deal of money, and you were trying to circumvent a process we had already put in place.And now you''re whining endlessly about it, when frankly, we couldn''t care less.

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"]Yeah, whatever.[/quote]

Morty,

Cat got your tongue?? Do you agree or disagree? I just want clarification from you so I can place all your minds at ease and make you understand that Chairman Mac acted like a boob on the BBC.[/quote]He is our Chief Executive, and it would appear a very shrewd one.You are a middle man trying to make a fast buck and he told you to go talk to Deloitte.Then you made a complete arse of yourself on a fan''s forum, do you REALLY expect to be taken seriously?[/quote]

Morty,

I''m attempting to have an unemotional and logical debate with you but you seem unable to accomplish this. Your continued personal attacks on me using parroted phrases from Chairman Mac are not very grown up. I really don''t care what they call him...chairman, chief cook and bottle washer or travel agent for the club. Your ability to simply ignore chairman Macs behavior demonstrates that you are just a sheep not worthy of any grown up discourse.

Best,

Joe[/quote]Your opinion. I''m fine with how he dealt with you.If I was in his position my opinion would be pretty much the same.I understand you''re trying to make money out of our club, we have already payed Deloitte a great deal of money, and you were trying to circumvent a process we had already put in place.And now you''re whining endlessly about it, when frankly, we couldn''t care less.[/quote]

I''ll take that as confirmation that you can''t have an adult discussion and that you have a large overarching brow and don''t walk upright. The club doesn''t pay me, my clients do. If you can''t understand this then it''s worthless responding to you.

Do you like your bananas green or ripe??

Joe

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[quote user="city till i die"]do you really think this is for real??why would he bother posting on here, its someone p!ssing about[/quote]I think he''s for real, Sports desk Pete confirmed.

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[quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"]Yeah, whatever.[/quote]

Morty,

Cat got your tongue?? Do you agree or disagree? I just want clarification from you so I can place all your minds at ease and make you understand that Chairman Mac acted like a boob on the BBC.[/quote]He is our Chief Executive, and it would appear a very shrewd one.You are a middle man trying to make a fast buck and he told you to go talk to Deloitte.Then you made a complete arse of yourself on a fan''s forum, do you REALLY expect to be taken seriously?[/quote]

Morty,

I''m attempting to have an unemotional and logical debate with you but you seem unable to accomplish this. Your continued personal attacks on me using parroted phrases from Chairman Mac are not very grown up. I really don''t care what they call him...chairman, chief cook and bottle washer or travel agent for the club. Your ability to simply ignore chairman Macs behavior demonstrates that you are just a sheep not worthy of any grown up discourse.

Best,

Joe[/quote]Your opinion. I''m fine with how he dealt with you.If I was in his position my opinion would be pretty much the same.I understand you''re trying to make money out of our club, we have already payed Deloitte a great deal of money, and you were trying to circumvent a process we had already put in place.And now you''re whining endlessly about it, when frankly, we couldn''t care less.[/quote]

I''ll take that as confirmation that you can''t have an adult discussion and that you have a large overarching brow and don''t walk upright. The club doesn''t pay me, my clients do. If you can''t understand this then it''s worthless responding to you.

Do you like your bananas green or ripe??

Joe[/quote]And so the insults again.You are an idiot and I want you nowhere near my football club.Go and take your face for a sh1t mate, seriously, you are a grade "A" dick.

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I keep trying to help you but it seems you are too interested in petty squabbling with the other posters. If you don''t want to lie and tell people it was Delia who sent you away with a flea in your ear try telling them it was Delia who instructed McNally to send you packing. You will then get lots of support on here. Maybe even the odd protest if you can convince my friends Smudger or City Angel [:O]

 

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="judderman"][quote user="PurpleCanary"]---

---

Interesting stuff about Club 9 in particular. But as far as Kosich and Norwich City are concerned the point is a rather different one.

Kosich may well be a loud-mouthed timewaster who has exaggerated his importance in doing deals. Totally irrelevant. What he did was pick Norwich out of 92 League clubs and sing its praises as an investment. So far, A GOOD THING.

This “buy Norwich” article gets read in America. America is the world’s largest economy. It has lots of rich people. Some of these rich people are sports fans. On the back of this Kosich (unless he is lying through his teeth, and such a lie would be easily found out) gets some polite very initial (note the “very initial”) inquiries about Norwich. Still so far A GOOD THING.

He contacts McNally and McNally tells him to pass the names on to Deloitte’s. This Kosich does, effectively cutting himself out of the action, since he certainly has no contract with NCFC or, presumably, with Deloitte’s.

So Kosich has got the names of some possible (note the “possible”) investors and instead of keeping them to himself does the selfless thing of handing them over to Deloitte’s to assess. And in doing so effectively excludes himself from the process. Still so far A GOOD THING, at least if he is a timewaster.

In summary, Deloitte’s has some names of possible investors it wouldn’t have had without Kosich’s help. The probability is that nothing will come of any of them. But there is a chance something will. The fact that Kosich may be a timewaster doesn’t mean the potential investors who read his article are also all timewasters.[/quote]thats the bit where you''re wrong, he would obviously ask for hefty agents fees. You think he''s interested in just hooking clubs up with potentil investers cos he''s just a nice guy?[/quote]Judderman, please read what I wrote. By passing the names on to Deloitte''s without any kind of contract with NCFC or Deloitte''s he has effectively cut himself out of the process. He can ask for fees from them until he is several shades of purple but without a contract he will get nowhere. Of course he might try to get money out of the investors, but that is another matter and nothing to do with NCFC.[/quote]Of course, so like I said, he wouldn''t pass the names on in the first place, until such a contract was set up (ie he would ask for agents fees). If no contract was set up, then there''s no way he''d pass the names on.

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"]Yeah, whatever.
[/quote] Morty, Cat got your tongue?? Do you agree or disagree? I just want clarification from you so I can place all your minds at ease and make you understand that Chairman Mac acted like a boob on the BBC.[/quote]

He is our Chief Executive, and it would appear a very shrewd one.

You are a middle man trying to make a fast buck and he told you to go talk to Deloitte.

Then you made a complete arse of yourself on a fan''s forum, do you REALLY expect to be taken seriously?
[/quote] Morty, I''m attempting to have an unemotional and logical debate with you but you seem unable to accomplish this. Your continued personal attacks on me using parroted phrases from Chairman Mac are not very grown up. I really don''t care what they call him...chairman, chief cook and bottle washer or travel agent for the club. Your ability to simply ignore chairman Macs behavior demonstrates that you are just a sheep not worthy of any grown up discourse. Best, Joe[/quote]

Your opinion. I''m fine with how he dealt with you.

If I was in his position my opinion would be pretty much the same.

I understand you''re trying to make money out of our club, we have already payed Deloitte a great deal of money, and you were trying to circumvent a process we had already put in place.

And now you''re whining endlessly about it, when frankly, we couldn''t care less.
[/quote] I''ll take that as confirmation that you can''t have an adult discussion and that you have a large overarching brow and don''t walk upright. The club doesn''t pay me, my clients do. If you can''t understand this then it''s worthless responding to you. Do you like your bananas green or ripe?? Joe[/quote]

And so the insults again.

You are an idiot and I want you nowhere near my football club.

Go and take your face for a sh1t mate, seriously, you are a grade "A" dick.
[/quote]

Ever figure you may have been suckered and clucked?

OTBC

 

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[quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"][quote user="wirralcanary"][quote user="morty"]Yeah, whatever.
[/quote] Morty, Cat got your tongue?? Do you agree or disagree? I just want clarification from you so I can place all your minds at ease and make you understand that Chairman Mac acted like a boob on the BBC.[/quote]

He is our Chief Executive, and it would appear a very shrewd one.

You are a middle man trying to make a fast buck and he told you to go talk to Deloitte.

Then you made a complete arse of yourself on a fan''s forum, do you REALLY expect to be taken seriously?
[/quote] Morty, I''m attempting to have an unemotional and logical debate with you but you seem unable to accomplish this. Your continued personal attacks on me using parroted phrases from Chairman Mac are not very grown up. I really don''t care what they call him...chairman, chief cook and bottle washer or travel agent for the club. Your ability to simply ignore chairman Macs behavior demonstrates that you are just a sheep not worthy of any grown up discourse. Best, Joe[/quote]

Your opinion. I''m fine with how he dealt with you.

If I was in his position my opinion would be pretty much the same.

I understand you''re trying to make money out of our club, we have already payed Deloitte a great deal of money, and you were trying to circumvent a process we had already put in place.

And now you''re whining endlessly about it, when frankly, we couldn''t care less.
[/quote] I''ll take that as confirmation that you can''t have an adult discussion and that you have a large overarching brow and don''t walk upright. The club doesn''t pay me, my clients do. If you can''t understand this then it''s worthless responding to you. Do you like your bananas green or ripe?? Joe[/quote]

As long as they''re Fairtrade, Joe my man, ...... any which way, man, any which way.

OTBC

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Joe

If you had a good understanding of English football then you would know that football is not a business like any other. It works on a philanthropic model, not on a profit-making model. Owners buy into football clubs for the status that it gives them, just in the same way that race horse ownership works - a few owners do make money from horse racing, the majority do not.

The past few years has seen a wave of money come into football from TV revenues and since capitalism always follow money it is not surprising that capitalist investors will try to leverage some of that cash their way. It''s the way the system works and it''s no surprise, therefore, that people like yourself will appear over the horizon looking to make a buck. I don''t blame you for that, it''s what you do.

However, you are quite mistaken if you think any investors that you might introduce to the club will see a return on their investment. Sorry, I will re-phrase that a little. An investor can come in and and raise funds from the club''s assets to finance his investment. This is what the Glaziers have done. In other words, the club has actually increased its debt to finance the purchase of the shares and the investors end up owning the club on the cheap.

Why do you think, to quote yourself, that no one is able to attract investment at the moment?

Keith Harris - Zero

Inner Circle - Zero

Goldman - Zero

Merrill - Zero

Rothschilds - Zero

Deloitte - Zero - Not even a bank!!

Football is now on the downside of the money-wave. Clubs are deeply in debt, the high-spending days are over and who in their right mind would invest in a money pit? You''re five years too late, my friend.

The last thing any club needs right now is an investor who is seeking to withdraw money from the club in the form of profits. What they need, and this is why they are encouraging people like Tony Fernadez, is to find investors who are in it for the fun, the kudos of owning a club.

You said McNally wants someone to pay-up, shut-up and buck-up. I couldn''t have put it better myself and I respect him the more for saying so. So unless you''ve got an investor whose great-grandmother originated from our fine city and pines for all things yellow and green, I suggest you quietly shut the door on the way out.

Don''t call us. We''ll call you.

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Your comment is naive to say the least.  Investors who place money in sports clubs are value investors looking for cash flow to REINVEST in the club, not withdraw it.  If your looking for a so called benevolent benefactor, you''ll be looking till hades freezes over.  Also, ask your bank which holds over 23 million quid on whether they believe football is a business.  I am VERY sure they would agree with me.

 

Finally, your xenophobic rants are not even worth commenting on.  I''ll let those just stand their for others to marvel at.

 

Joe

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Yellow Hammer - thanks for putting the point across with ten times more clarity than I have managed.  Football in its current state exists as a result of dumb money.

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[quote]Investors who place money in sports clubs are value investors looking

for cash flow to REINVEST in the club, not withdraw it.  If your looking

for a so called benevolent benefactor, you''ll be looking till hades

freezes over. [/quote]They do in the states.  Why do you think fans of Man Utd want the Glazers out ?  Because of a cultural difference, clubs are rich mens toys here, not cash cows for already rich men with no allegiances.The last Delloite report into the football economy stated that all championship clubs are run as a result of benevolent owners propping the club, and by extension, player wages, up.  The same is almost certainly true of the Premiership.If the FA / FIFA had any balls, they would impose wage caps as a percentage of turnover on all clubs - at the moment the club with the biggest overdraft wins.  Investment capitalists have a vested interest in keeping the debt / player wages bubble, while there are companies with large debts, and with very nice assets to purloin, there is something to leverage, and money to be made.As Yellow Hammer states, there is nothing to take out of clubs now.  Clubs face the choice of returning the game to sane player wage levels, or selling off the family silver to snake oil salesmen and "we''ll buy your gold" merchants.Let''s hope sanity prevails.

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Not really in agreement with investment capitalistswanting to see wage and salary bubble.  Investment capitalists want to see organic growth in turnover first, costs and margin control second and annual increases in cash flow thirdly.  Most investors I speak with today do not anticipate any increase in exit multiple (EBITDA) and understand that money is made through value creation, i.e. cash flow resources generated in the club.  Having a benevolent investor who own a small club and feels the pressure to invest heavily in players by the club''s supporters are doing a diservice to the game.  In my analyses, the only clubs that really have a chance to succeed long-term in the Premiership in the coming years are clubs that have large facilities, large catchment areas and solid support.  Given the circumstances that NCFC are in with facilities and catchment area, they probably best fit into the CCC.  Over-investing in players just to get a short stint in the EPL does not make sense.  Leeds will once again be a powerful long term player in the EPL due to the criteria above.  Not an insult to your club but resources vs. opportunities....that''s management in its purest form.  Wednesday is another club which will eventually be a long term player in the EPL along with Newcastle.  Big clubs...etc.

The benevolent investors need to get out of the way as their pockets are no longer deep enough and their screwing up the game trying to keep up.

 

Regardless, good points in your post as I agree that caps should be in place on wages/turnover to save the game.  Please see my posts on bigsoccer.com.  I have advocated this previously.

Regards,

 

Joe

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Your last post was a good one, thanks.  I''m glad we agree on some things.[quote]In my analyses, the only clubs that really have a chance to succeed

long-term in the Premiership in the coming years are clubs that have

large facilities, large catchment areas and solid support.  Given the

circumstances that NCFC are in with facilities and catchment area, they

probably best fit into the CCC. [/quote]That depends how you define catchment area.  Historically, NCFCs'' catchment area has been the whole of Norfolk, and North Suffolk.  Population of approx 1 million - with no competition from other sports teams, such as rugby union, rugby league, ice hockey, or other sporting events that you would find in London, Sheffield, Leeds or Birmingham.In the Premiership, NCFC could comfortably sell 35,000 tickets for every home league game, if the stadium could support it.  In league 1, we average 24630, which is 94% of capacity.  This makes us currently the 20th biggest average home attendance in the country I believe.This discussion is interesting ( to me at least ), but I doubt it will open doors at Carrow Road.

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