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The Dog

Hoolihan

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Anyone think that perhaps it is time he was given a little kick up the backside and is put on the bench for a game or two? The last few weeks he has reminded me of the Wes of last season very very frustrating, running up blind alleys, overplaying when on the ball and then very quick to throw his hands up in the air and blame others when things don''t go right. Wes was simply fantastic after he came back from his intial exile that Lambert placed upon him when he first came in. I just wonder whether a short sharp reminder in the form of a game or two on the bench may just bring the Wes of earlier this season flying back. Also I think it would get the opposition guessing again and unsettle them as I have no doubt a large part of their pre match discussions are about how to stop Wes.

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Dunno if we can have Wes, macca, Holt and c Martin in the team away and against Leeds... however think macca has got to stay in the side...

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Please dont take this personally op but have we really now resorted to blameing Wes ( probably the best player in league 1 ) for our shambles of a 442 last night. He was the Wes of last year simply because he is not a left winger and never will be. As soon as he was put into his normal position for the last 15 minutes he was once again the best player on the pitch. Dropping Wes will have every club we play rubbing their hands with glee. Unless someone can come up with another option it is Wes or McNamee.

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I read the first sentence and didn''t bother reading any further. Wes was out of position last night but he still made the most of everything he got. And I lost count of the amount of times I saw him deflated from not receiving a pass.

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The problem with Wes is you just can''t play him in a 4 4 2. Last night Holt was playing in midfield half the time to cover the gaps in midfield left by Wes. Last night had compromise written all over it to kep the holy trinity all in the side in a 4 4 2

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Please don''t think I am resulting to blaming Wes, he has been fantastic this season however having gone to all of the last 6 games he has been back to the Wes of old in all of them. Fail to agree with you that he was the best player on the park for the last 15 mins last night but then football is a game of opinions. I just feel Wes has slightly gone off the boil, we have become very predicatable, and teams are paying very special attention to Wes and thus nulifying him. I agree completaly that he is one of the best players in the league and that he can win games on his own but if he is not producing he can become a luxary as he leaves us very exposed when he is playing in the middle of the park and he makes us very unbalanced if we are playing 442 and he is on the left wing. By putting him on the bench for a couple of games it does not mean he can''t influence games look how Oli changed the game last night when he came on!

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Would Man U drop Wayne Rooney??? Or did they drop Ronaldo during his 2 or 3 below par games?? Of course not.

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I can remember ronaldo being dropped on several occasions!

Anyway I''m not talking about dropping him altogether anyway i merely saying suggesting putting him on the bench , this does not mean he could not come on!

Lambert banishing him to the reserves at the start of his tenure was a pivotal moment in this season as Wes took the hint, pulled his finger out and came back to prove his quality which I''m not disputing.

Rest assured Lambert will do what is best for the team which maybe what I am thinking or may be what you are thinking however let''s hope we see the Irish wizard back to his flying best in the very near future.

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[quote user="Northern Canary"]Was there not a period at the start of Lamberts tenure where he didnt use hoolahan? Was that before the diamond?[/quote]

Despite yesterday''s win I am sceptical that we have a convincing alternative to the diamond. We got very lucky on Tuesday and we will need to be more solid in midfield in the next away game at Oldham.

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[quote user="Yarmyed"]

[quote user="Northern Canary"]Was there not a period at the start of Lamberts tenure where he didnt use hoolahan? Was that before the diamond?[/quote]

Despite yesterday''s win I am sceptical that we have a convincing alternative to the diamond. We got very lucky on Tuesday and we will need to be more solid in midfield in the next away game at Oldham.

[/quote]

Agreed. Im not entirely sure the diamond is the problem. If the players all perform, i dont see there being much that the opposition can do. I credit our "dip in form" more to under performing players rather than the diamond being sussed. Its been pretty obvious how our team plays for a long time now.

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Thats exactly what I think. We''ve played the diamond since beating Leyton Orient in 4-0 in about September. Frankly if people have only just figured out that they should mark Hoolahan in the last month then the standard of management in league 1 truly is awful.

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Don''t think Wes is at his best at the moment, but the idea that he needs to ''pull his finger out'' is absurd. He worked really hard in the last two games. I think people assume that because he is small and tricky that he can''t put himself about or do any defensive work. I thought he was man of the match against Southampton - he never stopped running, never stopped looking for the ball. Against Southend the problem was the system, not  Wes.

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Since when does ''dropping'' a player have a positive outcome anyways? I think that''s a really daft process... I know he wasn''t dropped but Holt has been half the player since he was suspended..

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Nope, he''s much too good a player to leave out. We have to admit that we always put the weight of our expectations on his shoulders as well on those of our topscorer. I don''t think you can solve things by leaving him out!

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[quote user="The Dog"]Please don''t think I am resulting to blaming Wes, he has been fantastic this season however having gone to all of the last 6 games he has been back to the Wes of old in all of them. Fail to agree with you that he was the best player on the park for the last 15 mins last night but then football is a game of opinions.

I just feel Wes has slightly gone off the boil, we have become very predicatable, and teams are paying very special attention to Wes and thus nulifying him.

I agree completaly that he is one of the best players in the league and that he can win games on his own but if he is not producing he can become a luxary as he leaves us very exposed when he is playing in the middle of the park and he makes us very unbalanced if we are playing 442 and he is on the left wing. By putting him on the bench for a couple of games it does not mean he can''t influence games look how Oli changed the game last night when he came on!

[/quote]

Given that most of us have been disappointed by Holt and Martin''s form over the last few games.  Rose is no Drury and lappin has been below his previous standards.

Does that not give you a clue as why Wes has been less effective?  The runs are not being made and the channels are not presenting as they did a few games ago.  If Wes is guilty of anything, it is trying too hard and doing too much to compensate for the lack of form in his teamamtes.

Wes is not the problem but his ineffectiveness is symtomatic of a loss of form amongst the team

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I don''t know why people get rounded on for ever suggesting we consider a team without Wes in it. Someone says "would Man U drop Ronaldo or Rooney?" That is completely different and a bit absurd. Rooney is always threatening wherever he plays in an attacking role. Ditto Ronaldo who can play virtually anywhere and still be brilliant.

We don''t have the luxury of options with Wes. He is brilliant in ONE role. In other roles we have alternatives who are as good or better than him. I''d still like to see Hughes and Russell paired together at CM, with Macca and Smith on the wings. Or a midfield 3 in a 433 of Hughes Russell and Smith with CMart, Oli and Holt up top, similar to the 433 we used in our champ title winning season. Steal in midfield, flair in attack. We have the quality to win games in this league without starting Wes IF he is tiring or off form. And being able to bring him on as a sub can be just as effective as starting him. It is completely normal at this time of year for some players to start to tire, especially when they have been running out in every game since August. Players like Hughes and Oli and Macca are fresh as daisies however and we should be trying to accommodate them if we can.

I was really interested to hear how Millwall had trained all week before the game with us with someone playing in the Hoolahan role so they could practice sitting on him! Imagine if they walked out to find Macca and Oli tearing their defence up instead. Wes is not our only source of goals now, we have options if he is being sat on or having an off day.

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I think another issue is that opposition teams have worked out he only has a left foot, so if you make him check back so he turns back onto his left then his undoubted skill can be thwarted at times. What I didn''t get though is having Lappin in the centre, surely him on the left with Macca on the right both whipping crosses onto Holt''s head would be devastating?!Then Wes can still marshall the middle of the park and push forward.

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I think that having him being man-marked and targeted by other teams can only help us if we have quality in the team elsewhere, as these players will be left exposed. What''s our plan B then? pump them long to Holt? Accommodate Mcnamee and Hoolahan in the same side? Lappin crossing from deep? Smith dominating the middle and our strikers picking up on this?

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[quote user="jbghost"]The problem with Wes is you just can''t play him in a 4 4 2. Last night Holt was playing in midfield half the time to cover the gaps in midfield left by Wes. Last night had compromise written all over it to kep the holy trinity all in the side in a 4 4 2[/quote]]I would like to see McNamee on the left, Martin on the right and Wes playing in just behind Holt to pick up the knock downs and be more central to help create things. Martin has played wide before and shown he can be a handful there.

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[quote user="CambridgeCanary"]

[quote user="The Dog"]Please don''t think I am resulting to blaming Wes, he has been fantastic this season however having gone to all of the last 6 games he has been back to the Wes of old in all of them. Fail to agree with you that he was the best player on the park for the last 15 mins last night but then football is a game of opinions.

I just feel Wes has slightly gone off the boil, we have become very predicatable, and teams are paying very special attention to Wes and thus nulifying him.

I agree completaly that he is one of the best players in the league and that he can win games on his own but if he is not producing he can become a luxary as he leaves us very exposed when he is playing in the middle of the park and he makes us very unbalanced if we are playing 442 and he is on the left wing. By putting him on the bench for a couple of games it does not mean he can''t influence games look how Oli changed the game last night when he came on!

[/quote]

Given that most of us have been disappointed by Holt and Martin''s form over the last few games.  Rose is no Drury and lappin has been below his previous standards.

Does that not give you a clue as why Wes has been less effective?  The runs are not being made and the channels are not presenting as they did a few games ago.  If Wes is guilty of anything, it is trying too hard and doing too much to compensate for the lack of form in his teamamtes.

Wes is not the problem but his ineffectiveness is symtomatic of a loss of form amongst the team

[/quote]

Excellent points Cambridge man.

Holt and Chris Martin need to be instructed and encouraged to get back to their true roles of goalscoring and that means spending a hell of a lot more time in the box getting on the end of crosses (from McNamee / Wes) and balls playes in on blind side of defenders (from Wes).Recently they seem to be playinmg anywhere BUT where they should be! Sometimes Holt plays so deep he''s almost starting play off like Rusty whilst Chris is working the flanks and, similarly, is AWOL when we eventually do play the ball in.   

In truth, all three front men realise things aren''t clicking like earlier in the season and seem to be working far too hard doing other things to try and get the momentum back. Dave Stringer put this point forward tonight on Radio Norfolk.

If it was just Wes struggling then I would agree with resting him but that ain''t the case.

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