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Penalty - did the ref really get it right

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Although I know that the Hools penalty did not really matter, I watched the replay and realised that almost certainly the ref got it wrong!A Colchester defender was almost two yards into the box when the penalty was taken and as far as I could see no one else had infringed the box. He then almost got to the ball as Hools tapped the rebound in clearly interfering with the game. I also noticed the assistant flagging which would be unusual for the simple infringement of touching the ball twice which the ref was clearly able to see himself. Maybe he saw the player come into the box as in better position than ref.What was even worse was the ref did not just go over to check why he was flagging!As always what annoys me is the lack of reliable standards on this , I remember the Southampton match where this became a massive issue with retaken penalties etc. What was annoying here was that the defender was clearly miles ahead of anyone else into the box so fairly blatant.As already said did not matter this time but would not be happy to see it happen again

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I remember POmpey having to re-take a pena gainst greeno taht was re-taken twice (taken three times)

and Greeno saved the first two and they scored the third... gutted

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"It was disallowed because no one else touched the ball before Hoolahan got his second touch."

I think the original post is suggesting it should''ve been re-taken...?

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[quote user="B-ru"]

I remember POmpey having to re-take a pena gainst greeno taht was re-taken twice (taken three times)

and Greeno saved the first two and they scored the third... gutted

[/quote]If you are talking about our game with them in the premiership, while it was taken three times Yakubu scored all of them.

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[quote user="Willmeister"][quote user="B-ru"]

I remember POmpey having to re-take a pena gainst greeno taht was re-taken twice (taken three times)

and Greeno saved the first two and they scored the third... gutted

[/quote]

If you are talking about our game with them in the premiership, while it was taken three times Yakubu scored all of them.
[/quote]

Really...? I am sure I remember being delighted then gutted numerous times in those 5 mins... My memory msu be getting nad [:(]

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[quote user="B-ru"][quote user="Willmeister"][quote user="B-ru"]

I remember POmpey having to re-take a pena gainst greeno taht was re-taken twice (taken three times)

and Greeno saved the first two and they scored the third... gutted

[/quote]

If you are talking about our game with them in the premiership, while it was taken three times Yakubu scored all of them.
[/quote]

Really...? I am sure I remember being delighted then gutted numerous times in those 5 mins... My memory msu be getting nad [:(]

[/quote]

*bad, lol, my writing too!

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[quote user="B-ru"]

I remember POmpey having to re-take a pena gainst greeno taht was re-taken twice (taken three times)

and Greeno saved the first two and they scored the third... gutted

[/quote]Wasn''t there a penalty against Southampton away, where Green saved one but it had to be retaken?

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[quote user="I.S."][quote user="B-ru"]

I remember POmpey having to re-take a pena gainst greeno taht was re-taken twice (taken three times)

and Greeno saved the first two and they scored the third... gutted

[/quote]

Wasn''t there a penalty against Southampton away, where Green saved one but it had to be retaken?
[/quote]

That rings a bell, Nigel Quashie wasn''t it?

I also recall Iwan missing and getting another attempt and sticking it away.

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[quote user="First Jedi"]"It was disallowed because no one else touched the ball before Hoolahan got his second touch." I think the original post is suggesting it should''ve been re-taken...?[/quote]

No its an indirect free kick to the opposing team as it is classed as Hoolahan touching the ball twice before an opponent touches it

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[quote user="Bruces Header"]It was disallowed because no one else touched the ball before Hoolahan got his second touch.[/quote]I don''t think you read the OP properly, actually I don''t think you read it at all judging from your response. Next time, make a bit of effort and read peoples'' posts properly.Anyway...As for whether it should be re-taken is clear, the player did (in my opinion) clearly enter the box way before the penalty was kicked. I checked the law out on the football league website, funnily enough the picture it that of Norwich taking a penalty. The law is quite clear though:Law 14 - The Penalty Kick[quote user="Law 14 - The Penalty Kick"]A team-mate of the goalkeeper enters the penalty area or moves in front of or within 9.15 m (10 yds) of the penalty mark:- the referee allows the kick to proceed- if the ball enters the goal, a goal is awarded- if the ball does not enter the goal, the kick is retaken[/quote]If in our example the player has entered the penalty area (or within 10yds), which in my opinion the player looks to clearly be inside the area before the ball is kicked, the referee should have awarded the penalty to be retaken. The only problem here though is that I had the benefit of watching a slow mo replay in a comfy chair and the issue is that obviously the ref did not notice the infraction, which is difficult to do in the moment. 

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[quote user="Norfolk Lutonian "]

[quote user="First Jedi"]"It was disallowed because no one else touched the ball before Hoolahan got his second touch." I think the original post is suggesting it should''ve been re-taken...?[/quote]

No its an indirect free kick to the opposing team as it is classed as Hoolahan touching the ball twice before an opponent touches it

[/quote]It looks like not many people are bothering to READ the original post

properly, the issue in question is NOT that Hoolahan touched the ball

twice but whether the penalty should be retaken because a Colchester

player had entered the box before the penalty kick was taken.

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[quote user="SimonOTBC"][quote user="I.S."][quote user="B-ru"]

I remember POmpey having to re-take a pena gainst greeno taht was re-taken twice (taken three times)

and Greeno saved the first two and they scored the third... gutted

[/quote]Wasn''t there a penalty against Southampton away, where Green saved one but it had to be retaken?[/quote]

That rings a bell, Nigel Quashie wasn''t it?

I also recall Iwan missing and getting another attempt and sticking it away.

[/quote]Yeh I remember it too [:)] Mainly because at the time I said to my friend that we have no hope as Green has never saved a penalty!http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2005/aug/22/match.sport3[quote]When Green pushed out Nigel Quashie''s first-half spot-kick, Craig

Fleming having been penalised for handball, the referee spotted some

encroachment and ordered a retake.[/quote]

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Problem is.... Refs try to watch both the keeper on his line and the pen taker as well as the other players... What the ref should be looking at is right across the line to make sure players dont infringe play and rely on the lino to watch the keeper. In this case it clearly should have been retaken. however the ref didn''t rely on his lino so was watching both the keeper and the players... make sense? probably not...!The atmosphere might have got to him also...

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="Notts Canary"][quote user="Bruces Header"]

Notts Canary, I do apologise for offending you so deeply, you rude c***!

[/quote]LOL! Hypocrisy at it''s best! You call me rude and then have the cheek to call me a highly offensive and rude insult! Anyway I shall not waste further typing with you, it will only end up as a flame war.[/quote]To be fair mate your telling off of people for not reading the first post correctly came across as pretty patronising.[/quote]Light hearted banter at worst, I take no issue of a retort, in fact I expected one but that response was completely unjustified and insulting/abusive behaviour (starred out or not) is also against the TOC of the forums.

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[quote user="Notts Canary"][quote user="morty"][quote user="Notts Canary"][quote user="Bruces Header"]

Notts Canary, I do apologise for offending you so deeply, you rude c***!

[/quote]LOL! Hypocrisy at it''s best! You call me rude and then have the cheek to call me a highly offensive and rude insult! Anyway I shall not waste further typing with you, it will only end up as a flame war.[/quote]To be fair mate your telling off of people for not reading the first post correctly came across as pretty patronising.[/quote]Light hearted banter at worst, I take no issue of a retort, in fact I expected one but that response was completely unjustified and insulting/abusive behaviour (starred out or not) is also against the TOC of the forums.[/quote]Your opinion, I thought it came across as very finger wagging, clearly the guy who replied to you thought so too.[:)]

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Obviously my reply was a little OTT but it reminded me of being told off by a victorian teacher armed with a wooden ruler! Anyway, apologies for the lashing response, which is not usually something I resort to on here.

I should have said patronising c***! [;)] Only joking!!! Apologies for the swearing, will not happen again [Y]

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[quote user="morty"]Your opinion, I thought it came across as very finger wagging, clearly the guy who replied to you thought so too.[:)][/quote]That''s a fair enough point, mainly because I was finger wagging [;)] I just thought his response could be a little more eloquent [:P]

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Aside from all of the arguing, the original post is suggesting, and is correct having watched the replay, that a Colchester defender is encrouching in the box BEFORE Wes kicks the ball , and as the pen is missed it should be retaken.

Recently Frank Lampard was made to take a penalty three times due to this, for Chelsea against West Ham. And guess who the referee was? A certain Mr Mike Dean.....

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[quote user="Bruces Header"]

Obviously my reply was a little OTT but it reminded me of being told off by a victorian teacher armed with a wooden ruler! Anyway, apologies for the lashing response, which is not usually something I resort to on here.

I should have said patronising c***! [;)] Only joking!!! Apologies for the swearing, will not happen again [Y]

[/quote]Ah yes the wink! Something that was possibly missing from my original post too, as it was not meant as such a strict telling off. My apologies too.Anyway I''ve now completely derailed the thread, the OP will not be pleased! [:P]

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[quote user="I.S."][quote user="B-ru"]

I remember POmpey having to re-take a pena gainst greeno taht was re-taken twice (taken three times)

and Greeno saved the first two and they scored the third... gutted

[/quote]

Wasn''t there a penalty against Southampton away, where Green saved one but it had to be retaken?
[/quote]

 

I don''t think Green ever officially saved a penalty while he was with us. He did however save one by accident in a testamonial (Berkamp maybe?). Then he left for West Ham and couldn''t stop saving them!

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[quote user="Notts Canary"][quote user="Norfolk Lutonian "]

[quote user="First Jedi"]"It was disallowed because no one else touched the ball before Hoolahan got his second touch." I think the original post is suggesting it should''ve been re-taken...?[/quote]

No its an indirect free kick to the opposing team as it is classed as Hoolahan touching the ball twice before an opponent touches it

[/quote]

It looks like not many people are bothering to READ the original post properly, the issue in question is NOT that Hoolahan touched the ball twice but whether the penalty should be retaken because a Colchester player had entered the box before the penalty kick was taken.
[/quote]

Notts I was actually talking to 1st Jedi and not the OP.

In answer to the OP if Norwich players were encroaching then this cancels out the Colchester players...again its down to discretion of the referee.

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all of this is irrelevent seeing as the player brought down (holt?) was offside anyway.  [;)]

have another look at it. i thought it at the time, and the replay hasnt convinced me otherwise.

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More to the point - why wasn''t the defender sent off? It was a clear goal scoring opportunity.

By the way, Kevin Keelan once saved the ''same'' penalty 3 times at Wolves.

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If Holt was offside, then yes it should not have been a pen.  The player should have been sent off.

In response to the OP and as the pen was given, as it was a Colchester player who encroached into the box before the kick was taken, then yes the penalty should have been re-taken.  Hoolahan could have touched the ball a million times before another player, it makes no difference it should still have been re-taken.

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[quote user="eddy melito"]

all of this is irrelevent seeing as the player brought down (holt?) was offside anyway.  [;)]

have another look at it. i thought it at the time, and the replay hasnt convinced me otherwise.

[/quote]

 

I believe that the rules state that you can''t be offside if an opposing player is inside your shirt[;)]

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Hasn''t anyone read my bit about the ref being MIKE DEAN? The same ref that made Frank Lampard retake the pen against West Ham WAS THE REF ON SATURDAY. Sorry but thought it was an interesting point. I should have talked about make-believe offside shouts ...would have got a bigger reaction . Or called the original poster a C***.

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[quote]

Hasn''t anyone read my bit about the ref being MIKE DEAN? The same ref that made Frank Lampard retake the pen against West Ham WAS THE REF ON SATURDAY. Sorry but thought it was an interesting point. I should have talked about make-believe offside shouts ...would have got a bigger reaction . Or called the original poster a C***. [/quote]

or perhaps you are making something out of very little. watch the replays, its not conclusive that he was onside. its nothing unexpected to have dodgy officials at this level.

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[quote user="eddy melito"][quote]

Hasn''t anyone read my bit about the ref being MIKE DEAN? The same ref that made Frank Lampard retake the pen against West Ham WAS THE REF ON SATURDAY. Sorry but thought it was an interesting point. I should have talked about make-believe offside shouts ...would have got a bigger reaction . Or called the original poster a C***. [/quote]

or perhaps you are making something out of very little. watch the replays, its not conclusive that he was onside. its nothing unexpected to have dodgy officials at this level.

[/quote]Yes, but the point is that this is a Premiership referee, who made Frank Lampard retake a penalty for a similar incident recently. Or are you saying that as soon as Mike Dean referees in League One he becomes dodgy?

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