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Duncan

Great Support But ...

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Free speech. Isn''t that the starting point? Everyone is allowed to voice their own opinion or view, and if it reveals them to be an idiot or bigot then so be it. Argue if you wish, ignore them if you can, walk away if you must, but nobody has the right to restrict others views - no matter how much you may disagree.

IMO under no circumstances should crowd banter cause a game to be called off. Violence, danger, safety concerns all merit action and it is up to the Police to interpret the problem and act accordingly. Un-PC words shouted by morons isn''t a sufficient or necessary condition to call off a match and it isn''t for the players themselves, or the manager, to judge. The gamemanship opportunities, not to mention potential for disruption overwhelm any positive benefit.

And finally, at what point will we begin to see support, or a case for the defence, for racists. Aren''t the educated majority infringing their rights by denying them the opportunity to voice their opinions?

"Down with this sort of thing.."

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Vlad, free speech is ok if it is a reasoned arguement IMO. You can''t call racist abuse free speech. Nor homophobic abuse, or any other kind of hurtful rantings.  There is a campaign on at the moment to stamp out bullying in schools, a lot of which is the verbal type, does some poor kid who suffers this have to put up with it in the name of free speech? No, didn''t think so.

I took my son to Coventry away a couple of years ago, he didn''t want to go again because of 2 drunken idiots hurling  racist abuse at I think Richard Shaw.  I couldn''t really tell him it was ok due to free speech now could I? 

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Gazza, I think you will find that Le Saux is singled out because he reads the Guardian. Not sure if it is because of his choice of periodical, or because he can read..............?

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Vlad, what utter rubbish.

There is an unwritten code of conduct for all walks of life. It stops us living in constant disharmony and helps us get through every day.

When the opposition have an injury and kick the ball out, do we take the throw in and try and score?

No.

And the reason is, although we have a "freedom" to do such a thing, it is an inherently wrong action. Although you have the freedom to call anyone whatever the hell you like, that doesn''t mean you should.

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Pyro Pete:

I''d just like to say that although we''ve had our differences before, I have a whole new respect for you (and many others here) after reading your post(s) on this thread... I just thought you were a idiot before Pete  but I can see now I''ve been well mistaken...

There are no easy answers, but it all comes down to "respect and understanding". Respect of peoples rights to freedom of speech, but at the sametime, respect of peoples rights to go to a game and not hear or be abused because of their race or sexual preference etc. Understanding the need to consider the feelings of those around us, that what makes us human, and we should have the ability to show compassion and respect for the rights of all, on and off the field... and thats what this "PC brigade" as some like to call it is about!! If this makes me an emotional fool, then so be it, there needs to balance in this world right??

As someone on here thats been put into the PC catagory, I can assure you that I wont be jumping on the "Not allowed to say binners" wagon, or any other kind of wagon travelling in that direction. With anything in life, PC as far as I am concerned has it''s limits aswell. But for me those limits certainly don''t fall short of homophobic, sexual or racist abuse as already discussed previously... and as if I would want, people to be sitting at the games twiddling there thumbs and looking at their feet in fear of saying something not PC approved! That''s Ridiculous... and it''s not going to come to that, so stop being paranoid that your losing your freedoms...

People have the right to say whatever they want still! Only now, they may have to pay the consequences for doing that, and rightly so in many cases. Perhaps this will make people "think" twice before saying something, and perhaps "think" about whether or not it''s abusive! I mean, people aren''t too scared to "think" these days are they?? ANd obviously if something has become "not freely" available to be "chanted", there must be a valid reason??And if you are the type of person that feels that losing the right to freely sing homophobic songs is going to ruin your day at the football, then may i ask a question, did you feel the same way when people lost the right to freely sing racist songs at the football?? Like bananaman said, it''s not just the people who the chants are aimed at that are the only one''s affected, it''s all those that person represents (or is said to represent). And westoncanary is perfectly correct in saying (in other ways) that "freedom of speech" shouldn''t mean "freedom of disrespect" or "freedom to let others suffer", well said all... And all those that don''t tolerarte racism and homophobia at the games and tell people off, well done, it''s actions like these that form the basis for change...

Sometimes it''s good to remember that the world we live in today, is a complicated place, and that all of "our" social values filter through into all walks of "our" lives, including sport and the football ground. If we all continue to discuss and voice our opinions, eventually suitable and mutual outcomes can be achieved...  

It

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oh yeah one more thing

thebarclaykid:

thanks for your response on a post a while back!! I would''ve have thanked you on that one, but I kinda wanted that topic to slide into the "bog of eternal posts"... thanks again mate...

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only come in here a few times, but although I agree with most of your points Norman? You do babble on! You should run for priminister or somethin, go up against blair! Man, there essays! Get to the point! Quickly! and take a bit of your "own" advice, get out more.

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Good lord, what a debate!

Norman Canary, great stuff. You are lost on here my friend, you need a regular column in the paper. Seriously, you should think about it.

Just thought I would add that, and also send respect to the last poster for a great poster icon.

Biggie Smalls, RIP. Hip Hop Legend.

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[quote]TYPICAL response from the PC BRIGADE getting carried away with there emotions , why do these guys take life so seriously when was the last time you heard a racist chant at Norwich because i cant remem...[/quote]

OK dude, I was never calling you a racist by the way, & I hope that wasn''t taken like that.  I do have relatively strong opinions on the matter, as you also do about my opinions.  It all makes for good discussion.  But as for lighten up and be less serious; you can imagine from the tone of most of my posts, that''s not something I''m often advised to do! 

Let''s kiss and make up... 

NCFC PC OK!

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[quote]This is a difficult debate really because if you ban all sorts of "predjudice" from football grounds then you would destroy the whole atmosphere. We wouldn''t be able to single out Ipswich fans for abu...[/quote]

Good point Mr Nigelton.  So given that gays have also suffered widespread oppression, violence and even execution (e.g. 19th century Britain, 20th century Germany) for even more millennia right down to today in some parts of the world, for me that''s why it makes it a comparable cause.

That''s me last one, promise! 

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Super Shaun!

Why thank you my friend, at times I think I''m a bit outspoken and boisterous, but thanks for your encouragment! I post these "essays" (thanks mr biggie smalls) and get worried about getting slandered, but doesn''t seem to have happened this time, luckily!

And yes, I do get emotional... as people can read

I hope we can kiss and make up too barclayendboy, or would that just be me getting carried away with my emotions, and gettin too in ya face

ONWARD CITY SOLDIERS!!

triple pointer this weekend at the brummy carnival!!

and don''t forget... VOTE 1, Normann for Priminister of the U.K

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Fair- do guys thats why this country is great free speech and all that jazz , anyway i think we have all aired our views on the subject and i for one don''t want to fall out with my fellow canary fans after all we are all in for a roller coast ride as it is from now on in :sick. cya around the forum for more heated discussions .

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No worries at all barclayendboy... that''s what the boards for, getting your opinions out there and getting feed back... but at the end of the day, we''re still one big happy family (sorry gettin emotional again)

so till we next do battle

cheers

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I have to resurrect this one. I''m not as sensitive as some other souls but having to sit an entire 90 mins very near to a group of neanderthals at stamford bridge I''m considering a rethink.

Listening to one guy greeting virtually every Chelsea pass with :- Tiago...you''re a C*nt, Lampard you''re a c*nt, Robben you''re a c1Nt...every Norwich challenge with "MAIM HIM" and then they starting on Robben along similar lines to the Le Saux incident, does change your perspective. Apart from player''s names I think the only words their vocabulary were expletives (and I bet they couldn''t spell them!).

 

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