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Leedscanary

Rangers & Celtic

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So, they''re discussing breaking away from the SPL again, with the Celtic CEO saying "Premier League is the goal, no matter what".

How will this be acheived though? And more importantly how will this affect our club?

I can''t foresee straight forward entry in the Prem for these two, the current league managers mince on about fixture congestion so the league won''t want to expand to 22. But the league will also want to carry on the tradion of promotion and relegation, and surely will be unwilling to "fast track" the Old Firm into the Prem over the rightful Championship winners and runners up and playoff winners.

The Old Firm must be elected into the League, as everyone else was in the past. And I can only see that election into League 2, with subsequent promotions should be the only way these guys will get to the Premiership. However, money talks - it will be an interesting 5-10 years if they insist on the SPL breakaway.

I hope that any controversay(sic) regarding this avoids City  - it would be scandalous to win the Championship in the year that promotion is suspended, wouldn''t it?

What do the rest of you think?

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[quote user="leedscanary"]

So, they''re discussing breaking away from the SPL again, with the Celtic CEO saying "Premier League is the goal, no matter what".

How will this be acheived though? And more importantly how will this affect our club?

I can''t foresee straight forward entry in the Prem for these two, the current league managers mince on about fixture congestion so the league won''t want to expand to 22. But the league will also want to carry on the tradion of promotion and relegation, and surely will be unwilling to "fast track" the Old Firm into the Prem over the rightful Championship winners and runners up and playoff winners.

The Old Firm must be elected into the League, as everyone else was in the past. And I can only see that election into League 2, with subsequent promotions should be the only way these guys will get to the Premiership. However, money talks - it will be an interesting 5-10 years if they insist on the SPL breakaway.

I hope that any controversay(sic) regarding this avoids City  - it would be scandalous to win the Championship in the year that promotion is suspended, wouldn''t it?

What do the rest of you think?

[/quote]

 

My personal belief is that, ultimately, the current Premier League will break away - whether with Rangers and Celtic is a moot point but with or without them my belief is that it will become a closed competition with no relegation and clubs only admitted by invitation.  It will then play a percentage of games in this country but then have periods when games are played in places like Asia, the Middle East, China, etc, almost a sort of touring league to maximise the revenue - different shirt sponsorships in different countries, for example.  They will do their own deals for TV rights across the world and sponsorship as well.

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Agree with that leeds, I would not want them to get any special treatment.  The only problem here is that the Premier League is not affiliated to the Football League.  Therefore I guess if the FA wanted to they could just let Celtic and Rangers in, and while it would be up to the Football League to appeal and don''t know what they''d be able to do about it.I don''t want them to come into the league at all to be honest, yes they are better than all the other teams in Scotland, but I am not sure whether they''d be able to compete to begin with in the way they would want to.  They would not be able to get into the Champions League places straight away, that is for sure.  I don''t want them anywhere near the English leagues, it''s not our fault that they play in a rubbish league, and we should not be pressured to let them play in the English leagues at all.  If they do want entry then they should be forced to enter in at the lowest point, League 2, but I would prefer them to have to enter lower than that.  AFC Wimbledon didn''t get an easy ride after they emerged from the wreckage of Wimbledon did they?

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Well there ain''t many teams in the Scottish premiere so rather than leave it, Rangers & Celtic should be joined by Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool, Man Utd, oh.....and Man City. That should give some of us others a chance ! [:D]

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[quote user="Camuldonum"]

My personal belief is that, ultimately, the current Premier League will break away - whether with Rangers and Celtic is a moot point but with or without them my belief is that it will become a closed competition with no relegation and clubs only admitted by invitation.  It will then play a percentage of games in this country but then have periods when games are played in places like Asia, the Middle East, China, etc, almost a sort of touring league to maximise the revenue - different shirt sponsorships in different countries, for example.  They will do their own deals for TV rights across the world and sponsorship as well.

[/quote]

In a world where money means more than tradition or morals this has to be the most likely scenario.  I would imagine the Old Firm would be part of that breakaway though as they would be worth more to a new league than the likes of Burnley, Fulham and Stoke.

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This subject does come round again and again, I can''t really see what Rangers or Celtic would bring to the table apart from guaranteed huge numbers of away fans. Initially they would only be as good as the likes of Bolton or Blackburn. Hopefully they can feck off and become part of some sort of European league with the so called English big clubs and let the normal clubs return to some sort of reality.

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[quote user="I am a Banana"]

[quote user="missing in action?"]start at very bottom.[/quote

 

 

they wouldn''t though as they would not get any champions league

[/quote]then stay in spl. if they are to join, they should begin at bottom.

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[quote user="Pboro_Canary"][quote user="Camuldonum"]

My personal belief is that, ultimately, the current Premier League will break away - whether with Rangers and Celtic is a moot point but with or without them my belief is that it will become a closed competition with no relegation and clubs only admitted by invitation.  It will then play a percentage of games in this country but then have periods when games are played in places like Asia, the Middle East, China, etc, almost a sort of touring league to maximise the revenue - different shirt sponsorships in different countries, for example.  They will do their own deals for TV rights across the world and sponsorship as well.

[/quote]

In a world where money means more than tradition or morals this has to be the most likely scenario.  I would imagine the Old Firm would be part of that breakaway though as they would be worth more to a new league than the likes of Burnley, Fulham and Stoke.

[/quote]

I hope I am wrong but I have a nasty feeling I am not - hence the recent suggestion that there should be a 39th game played abroad.  The seeds are there I believe.  And if I am right yes, as you say, the Old Firm would be worth a lot more than Burnley, Fulham, Stoke (or Hull).

 

 

 

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This subject seems to raise its head every year or so and nothing ever happens. Because it''s ridiculous. That''s not to say I think it''s never ever going to happen at any point. But they have as much right to play in England as teams like Barcelona do so why don''t we invite them as well?

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[quote user="Camuldonum"][quote user="Pboro_Canary"][quote user="Camuldonum"]

My personal belief is that, ultimately, the current Premier League will break away - whether with Rangers and Celtic is a moot point but with or without them my belief is that it will become a closed competition with no relegation and clubs only admitted by invitation.  It will then play a percentage of games in this country but then have periods when games are played in places like Asia, the Middle East, China, etc, almost a sort of touring league to maximise the revenue - different shirt sponsorships in different countries, for example.  They will do their own deals for TV rights across the world and sponsorship as well.

[/quote]

In a world where money means more than tradition or morals this has to be the most likely scenario.  I would imagine the Old Firm would be part of that breakaway though as they would be worth more to a new league than the likes of Burnley, Fulham and Stoke.

[/quote]

I hope I am wrong but I have a nasty feeling I am not - hence the recent suggestion that there should be a 39th game played abroad.  The seeds are there I believe.  And if I am right yes, as you say, the Old Firm would be worth a lot more than Burnley, Fulham, Stoke (or Hull).

 

 

 

[/quote]

Or Norwich [:^)]

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I think you''ll find that Celtic and Rangers will become ever more desperate to join the English Premier League over the coming seasons. Look at the players that they have signed this year, I reckon they will have been out spent by most Championship sides. Scottish football is dying.

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The sooner the premier league implodes the better! It now exists for nothing other than money - they will do anything if it will bring in more revenue...

My hope is that they invite teams like Rangers / Celtic (hell you may aswell invite Real Madrid as well), fast track them straight into the top flight and bring the whole thing crashing down! There has to be a point where people realise that they have nothing in common anymore with the overpaid prima-donna''s in there - who despite all their badge kissing (sic), care more about their diamond earings and which girl they are seen out with than winning games for the fans. After the novelty wears off, are Celtic fans really going to be travelling down to Fulham, Portsmouth etc. anyway and vice-verse?

I remember watching a silly film a while back called ''Basketball'' - where it depicted an end to professional baseball + grid iron in the US; as teams began moving around the country to where the largest fan bases were, and players started spending more time on goal celebrations than on playing the game... It was kinda silly, but not really all that out there looking at things now...

Money does seem to ruin most sports unfortunately and I''m not sure that there is ever a way back :(

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[quote user="Camuldonum"][quote user="leedscanary"]

So, they''re discussing breaking away from the SPL again, with the Celtic CEO saying "Premier League is the goal, no matter what".

How will this be acheived though? And more importantly how will this affect our club?

I can''t foresee straight forward entry in the Prem for these two, the current league managers mince on about fixture congestion so the league won''t want to expand to 22. But the league will also want to carry on the tradion of promotion and relegation, and surely will be unwilling to "fast track" the Old Firm into the Prem over the rightful Championship winners and runners up and playoff winners.

The Old Firm must be elected into the League, as everyone else was in the past. And I can only see that election into League 2, with subsequent promotions should be the only way these guys will get to the Premiership. However, money talks - it will be an interesting 5-10 years if they insist on the SPL breakaway.

I hope that any controversay(sic) regarding this avoids City  - it would be scandalous to win the Championship in the year that promotion is suspended, wouldn''t it?

What do the rest of you think?

[/quote]

 

My personal belief is that, ultimately, the current Premier League will break away - whether with Rangers and Celtic is a moot point but with or without them my belief is that it will become a closed competition with no relegation and clubs only admitted by invitation.  It will then play a percentage of games in this country but then have periods when games are played in places like Asia, the Middle East, China, etc, almost a sort of touring league to maximise the revenue - different shirt sponsorships in different countries, for example.  They will do their own deals for TV rights across the world and sponsorship as well.

[/quote]

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[quote user="Graham Humphrey"]This subject seems to raise its head every year or so and nothing ever happens. Because it''s ridiculous. That''s not to say I think it''s never ever going to happen at any point. But they have as much right to play in England as teams like Barcelona do so why don''t we invite them as well?[/quote]...because Barcelona, like Cardiff and Swansea are in the United Kingdom..................let me just check that.

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In my murky crystal ball I see the top clubs from all over Europe in a kind of fulltime Champions League fuelled by massive TV rights and with matches played all over the world to maximise merchandise and sponsorship. Similar to Cams post.

I doubt there''s a place at that table for Celtic and Rangers though. I reckon they''re like Theo and missed the bus. I don''t see them ever playing in our League because their own FA are always mindful not to do anything that may encourage FIFA into reviewing their independence as a football nation.

 

 

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yup.  Have to say i have a lot of time for Celtic and their fans (generally a very passionate, well mannered bunch) but would never want to see them playing in English leagues.  Cardiff and Swansea have been in them for a long time and its not as if there are enough sides in Wales to merit a decent league eh? If i was a hibs, hearts or aberdeen fan i would be massively peeved if the old firm sold out.....As for a European Super League the sooner the better. Get games back to 3pm on saturdays only, bring back terracing just as they have in Germany right now and give football back to the fans. Salary caps, reasonably priced tickets, passion (not the P.A induced crap of moxdern stadia), the works.......One only has to look at the make up of the top division in England pre premiership to see how Sky has ruined the game.Let them have their circus in Beijing, Hong Kong, Bangkok, Tokyo, Dubai, Riyadh and anywhere else they wish, the tide is slowly turning against this crap.......I shall leave this one example.....my Godfather has had a season ticket at Old Trafford since 1957 and two years ago he gave it up....now spends his saturday afternoons watching either Accrington Stanley or non-league and says he has never enjoyed football more......says a lot i feel.ah yes and before any upstart wants to call me an old fart im 28. So God only knows how middle aged fans feel about the modern game :(

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[quote user="Scottlarock"]...because Barcelona, like Cardiff and Swansea are in the United Kingdom..................let me just check that.[/quote]Except, of course, that''s irrelevant. Wales is a principality and are allowed to have their clubs played in the English League system (much in the same way that Monaco play in the French League, and teams from Liechtenstein play in Switzerland). And historically Welsh clubs have always played in England; they didn''t even have their own league until relatively recently.Scottish teams have as much right to play in England as Spanish teams do, i.e. none. Maybe they would like to get in touch with the German or French FAs to see if they have any places going spare...? If they are "too big" for their own League then that''s something they just have to deal with. Perhaps Barcelona feel they are too big for the Spanish League and would like a move here too?

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This truly is a perennial discussion and for that reason I think something will happen to the organisation of the UK leagues. It really only depends on the money. The integration is going to be a huge headache. There might be some mileage in a UK Super League, taking the Old firm and say, the top 8 in the Premiership. The same year all top 6 in the Championship would be promoted to the Premiership, with no relegations and so on down the English leagues. SPL and leagues would do likewise.

The UK Super League would probably generate additional revenue and brand profile by entering new Euro mini competitions or world wide exhibition matches. The alternative would be to have a SPL format of playing each other twice home and away.

It''ll all end in tears!

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[quote user="Gibbo"]The sooner the premier league implodes the better! It now exists for nothing other than money - they will do anything if it will bring in more revenue...

My hope is that they invite teams like Rangers / Celtic (hell you may aswell invite Real Madrid as well), fast track them straight into the top flight and bring the whole thing crashing down! There has to be a point where people realise that they have nothing in common anymore with the overpaid prima-donna''s in there - who despite all their badge kissing (sic), care more about their diamond earings and which girl they are seen out with than winning games for the fans. After the novelty wears off, are Celtic fans really going to be travelling down to Fulham, Portsmouth etc. anyway and vice-verse?

I remember watching a silly film a while back called ''Basketball'' - where it depicted an end to professional baseball + grid iron in the US; as teams began moving around the country to where the largest fan bases were, and players started spending more time on goal celebrations than on playing the game... It was kinda silly, but not really all that out there looking at things now...

Money does seem to ruin most sports unfortunately and I''m not sure that there is ever a way back :([/quote]just checking do you mean Baseketball

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[quote user="Camuldonum"]

My personal belief is that, ultimately, the current Premier League will break away - whether with Rangers and Celtic is a moot point but with or without them my belief is that it will become a closed competition with no relegation and clubs only admitted by invitation.  It will then play a percentage of games in this country but then have periods when games are played in places like Asia, the Middle East, China, etc, almost a sort of touring league to maximise the revenue - different shirt sponsorships in different countries, for example.  They will do their own deals for TV rights across the world and sponsorship as well.

[/quote]A few years ago I would have said that this idea is close to impossible, but now though it doesn''t sound all that far fetched. I hope your completely wrong though as if anything like this were to happen, my passion for football would completely disappear as i''m it would for many other people in this country.

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Yes great points from 6088m canary. I too will welcome the day the circus moves away. All divisions of English football can then come back under the Football League and any wealth can be distributed more evenly through the game. Who cares if either Celtic or Rangers get to join that circus! But I doubt they will ever join our league for the reasons I gave earlier.

Yes Welsh clubs still play in our league and it probably has gone on too long. I guess it just means that the Welsh want to be an independent football nation but on their terms[*-)] As a kid it always used to amaze me that Cardiff, Swansea and Wrexham could enter our FA Cup and then get knocked out but then win the Welsh FA Cup like some sort of consolation. They then used to get to play in Europe! I used to think we could easy win that Welsh Cup!!!!

 

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Now am I right in thinking that our dear departed Chief  Exec is now CEO of the SPL?

They were talking about Rangers/Celtic on Radio 5 last night, and I swear to God the Rangers chairman said "If we stay in Scotland we can''t compete"!!!

He did, honestly [:D]

 

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I completely disagree with those of you who like the idea of a "super league" where by our biggest clubs left the English league to compete in a European league, it would all but kill English football, I am a great believer in English football tradition and despite whatever you may think about Man U, Liverpool, Arsenal etc we all dream about our club one day competing against the big boys, if the now Championship would to one day become the top league in English football, that passion and drive to compete against the best would be all but gone.

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Put like that Wembley I agree with you. But unfortunately it''s not like that anymore. That traditional League where we competed with the "big boys" has already gone.

 

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