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LQ

Supporters groups meet the Board next week

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Couple questions abuot medium term secuirty of teh club

1. Has the chronic (and stupid in my opinion) over spend on staff, playing & non, been addressed? (If they would put a figure on this for the season''s total wage bill so we can see the reduction it''d be nice)

2. Will the clubs debt repayment plan be adjusted/renegotiated in light of relegation/Can we afford current payment plan ongoing in Div 3

thanks

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With all the changes at Carrow Rd (but still not enough in my opinion) why hasn''t the club met with the SCG sooner?

 

FOOTBALL MUST COME FIRST

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[quote user="yellow hammer"]Not criticizing you LQ but NCSIA can go into the board meeting and claim the representation of five hundred odd (sometimes very odd) members. So Tilly''s views carry some weight. Whereas the board can argue that your opinions are yours alone.[/quote]I see what you mean Yellow, but regardless of the 500 odd Mr Tilson represents, I have to date found  most things they have said to be reactionary rather than constructive and when it does make sense the communication is so amateurish and colloquial that I cringe. In addition some of the posters on here are NCISA reps and whilst it is only their view expressed, in most cases I don''t agree with them either and find them, too, as self satisfied but equally incapable of showing real charisma or power as leaders.  Therefore, whilst I do recognise LQ can be equally self satisfied at times and is probably the Delia lover of all Delia lovers, I would rather she took and delivered any question or message I proffered than the fleece covered, unreconstructed, testosterone fuelled egoist that is Tilson. Now I better think of a question.

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

It''s sort of half and half LQ. I am beginning to realise that where as some folk are genuine others live in a fantasy world. On the message board you can not renew a season ticket that you don''t actually have to renew. Or you can claim a rebate from a ticket that you never owned. You can make all kinds of claims that are from a complete fantasy world. So unless you know your questions are coming from "real life" people you could be taking points to the meeting that have no bearing on anything but virtual reality.

[/quote]

You can also scatter insinuations like confetti without actually naming names . . . [;)]

 

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LQ the one question that rears it''s head over and over again is this, are Michael and Delia looking to sell the club or just looking for investment? This question leads to the next, is the club up for sale or not?Secondly I personally do not trust Bryan Gunn with the squad he has put together, if our season is going badly wrong after around 15-20 games will they have the balls to appoint a real manager?As much as I would love Gunny to succeed I just can''t see it on the strength of his games in charge last season but I do wish him luck.

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Indeed does the club seek investment or do the majority shareholders seek to sell up completely? (option 2 is clearly preferred)

On appointment of Gunn, Crook & Butterworth the official site clearly gave the impression that it was on a trial short term type contract until the end of the season.  This trial period resulting in relegation was clearly failed.  It later emerged that Crook had an 18 month contract as I daresay Gunn & Butterworth probably also had.  Is it acceptable to be so economical with the truth with long suffering supporters??

If the club is not in an acceptable league position (top 6) at say Christmas will Gunn & Co be removed from post.

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[quote user="canary cherub "][quote user="nutty nigel"]

It''s sort of half and half LQ. I am beginning to realise that where as some folk are genuine others live in a fantasy world. On the message board you can not renew a season ticket that you don''t actually have to renew. Or you can claim a rebate from a ticket that you never owned. You can make all kinds of claims that are from a complete fantasy world. So unless you know your questions are coming from "real life" people you could be taking points to the meeting that have no bearing on anything but virtual reality.

[/quote]

You can also scatter insinuations like confetti without actually naming names . . . [;)]

 

[/quote]

Well.. I aint naming ''em.. you''re gonna have to work it out for yourself [:P]

 

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[quote user="IncH_HigH"]LQ the one question that rears it''s head over and over again is this, are Michael and Delia looking to sell the club or just looking for investment? This question leads to the next, is the club up for sale or not?[/quote]As far as this question is concerned it has actually been answered several times, but once more will do no harm.The club is up for sale, or at least it definitely was as recently as two months ago, as the statement of May 19th (with which you will all be familiar) made absolutely clear.However it is just possible that since then the new board of directors has privately decided to take the club off the market, and so it would certainly be useful for the current position to be clarified.

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[quote user="Soldier on"]

Indeed does the club seek investment or do the majority shareholders seek to sell up completely? (option 2 is clearly preferred)

On appointment of Gunn, Crook & Butterworth the official site clearly gave the impression that it was on a trial short term type contract until the end of the season.  This trial period resulting in relegation was clearly failed.  It later emerged that Crook had an 18 month contract as I daresay Gunn & Butterworth probably also had.  Is it acceptable to be so economical with the truth with long suffering supporters??

If the club is not in an acceptable league position (top 6) at say Christmas will Gunn & Co be removed from post.

[/quote]They''re good questions. I suppose in essence that all I would like, to echo what you have said, is that all Norwich supporters and not a small team of ''elite'' wannabes who meet with the board, are recognised as being vital to the club and that from now on, wherever possible we are not lied to or misled with regards to what the plans are for the club and, what are the KPIs by which Team Gunn will be measured?  

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Thanks all for keeping this reasonably sensible - I had no idea what I would wake up to this morning [;)]There are some good points that I''d love to know the answers to as well and I''ll do what I can to get them. Yes the other groups who are going should be there to represent the views of their members but I feel that any fans view is as valid as any others, whether they''ve paid their subs or not, so I was opening this up on here to give anyone an opportunity. I daresay others who will be attending will be asking similar Qs and don''t know what time I''ll get but you do what you can...A couple of things though, first up about the new Board not meeting earlier with the SCG. I imagine this lesson was learnt after the Cullum debacle last year when they did. The SCG isn''t perfect by any means and it''s hard for anyone other than the individual themselves to know if they are offering their own or a wider set of views. Meeting with various groups makes more sense to me and hopefully means that any reports about the goings on will hold more water, rather than an anodyne set of minutes which do little but make the whole set up look ineffective and pointless.Secondly, I''m no Delia lover.

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I don''t have a question for the board as such LQ because it won''t matter a jot what they answer. At the end of the day if we win football matches the ordinary fan will soon lose interest in the boardroom but if we have another disappointing season there will be calls for the boards heads. We''re a football club and that''s the way of it. No answers that the board could give would change that fact.

I do have a question for you though : I believe the forming of the SCG and other fans initiatives came through people who are no longer at the club. Do you believe these things will carry on under the new board?

 

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[quote user="LQ"]Thanks all for keeping this reasonably sensible - I had no idea what I would wake up to this morning [;)]

There are some good points that I''d love to know the answers to as well and I''ll do what I can to get them. Yes the other groups who are going should be there to represent the views of their members but I feel that any fans view is as valid as any others, whether they''ve paid their subs or not, so I was opening this up on here to give anyone an opportunity. I daresay others who will be attending will be asking similar Qs and don''t know what time I''ll get but you do what you can...

A couple of things though, first up about the new Board not meeting earlier with the SCG. I imagine this lesson was learnt after the Cullum debacle last year when they did. The SCG isn''t perfect by any means and it''s hard for anyone other than the individual themselves to know if they are offering their own or a wider set of views. Meeting with various groups makes more sense to me and hopefully means that any reports about the goings on will hold more water, rather than an anodyne set of minutes which do little but make the whole set up look ineffective and pointless.

Secondly, I''m no Delia lover.


[/quote]

Thank you for that, but do you like her?

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NN, there were changes to the SCG being discussed before Neil and Roger left. I have heard nothing further since then but I would imagine (hope) that either those changes which included opening the process up with more ''Meet the Board'' style evenings are put in place or the whole thing is shelved. The positive from the SCG is the work some of the Working Groups have done which have the benefit of years of experience but I expect this constructive function could be kept in some form.Yankee, I don''t know her so I don''t know if I like her or not?

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I have a question LQ and tbh it is a serious worry for me and possibly others.What on earth can we expect if we were to get promoted?It was made abundantly clear to us that we could not afford a Championship quality team of our own over the last couple of years and so the big earners were sold, the money spent and we were reliant upon a small core of our own players supplemented by a continual flux of short term loan players.What has changed or is expected to change in the next 12 months within the club to convince the fans that in the event of promotion we will be able to financially sustain a competitive Championship level squad and will not simply become a Champs/Div 1 yo-yo club as I fear?Cheers.

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That''s a great Q, Buckethead!Others have asked what contingency plans we have for if we don''t go up at the first time of asking but that question is hugely relevant if the Board share the same ambition McNally expressed when he arrived.Thanks for that.

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[quote user="LQ"]NN, there were changes to the SCG being discussed before Neil and Roger left. I have heard nothing further since then but I would imagine (hope) that either those changes which included opening the process up with more ''Meet the Board'' style evenings are put in place or the whole thing is shelved. The positive from the SCG is the work some of the Working Groups have done which have the benefit of years of experience but I expect this constructive function could be kept in some form.

Yankee, I don''t know her so I don''t know if I like her or not?


[/quote]

Those positives you mention from the SCG are of little interest to many on here. I do appreciate a lot of the improvements made. The "away fans charter" and ticketing arrangements are much fairer than they used to be. But to carry on from the other point I was making - fans only become interested in these things when the football team is succesfull. My fear would be if we lost the structure now it wouldn''t be there later when, hopefully, the good times return on the pitch.

 

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That''s an excellent question, Buckethead, for I have similar concerns.  I''m getting all excited ready for the new season, but it does niggle at the back of the mind that Delia and Michael would be more than happy for us to be a yo-yo club, but not between the Prem and Champs....Lisa, I''ll have a think for some serious questions of my own and let you know either on here or KIO... Oh, and welcome back to the funhouse, you seemed to be missing these last few weeks!

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[quote user="LQ"]NN, there were changes to the SCG being discussed before Neil and Roger left. I have heard nothing further since then but I would imagine (hope) that either those changes which included opening the process up with more ''Meet the Board'' style evenings are put in place or the whole thing is shelved. The positive from the SCG is the work some of the Working Groups have done which have the benefit of years of experience but I expect this constructive function could be kept in some form.

Yankee, I don''t know her so I don''t know if I like her or not?


[/quote]

LQ you would like to see more "Meet The Board" evenings, but has anything really come from them? Has the club changed anything it does from what''s been said by the supports who attended them? Or have they been "I''m on the board, I know best"?

 

FOOTBALL MUST COME FIRST

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I don''t know, BBFF. I think they took things on board, as it were, but whether what we as fans want is always what we as fans can get is the sticking point! I''ve only been to a couple of those kind of bashes a few years ago. It''s the same in any business though to an extent - what is actually physically and financially implementable and what is simply unrealistic.The feeling I get is that there is certainly a degree of humility around now.

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I''ve always felt the SCG was a way to avoid having a fans representative on the board, so my question is:

"What is the view of the current board about including a fans representive on the board of directors?"

 

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I don''t think it was anything to do with a fan on the Board but I''m sure the NCST will be asking your question.

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Well call me a cynic if you like. But you won''t get any board at any club up and down the land to do what the fans say. Some will listen but we shouldn''t confuse listening with agreeing. Any fans representation that is taken on board will always be on ticketing, refreshments, stewarding, away travel and other fans issues. I believe the main business decisions will always be made by those who have a stake in the club and the closest we get to that is being told as shareholders at the AGM.

 

 

 

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Well call me a cynic if you like. But you won''t get any board at any club up and down the land to do what the fans say. Some will listen but we shouldn''t confuse listening with agreeing. Any fans representation that is taken on board will always be on ticketing, refreshments, stewarding, away travel and other fans issues. I believe the main business decisions will always be made by those who have a stake in the club and the closest we get to that is being told as shareholders at the AGM.

[/quote]

I wasn''t suggesting that the fans should dictate the agenda.  Their role would be mainly to keep the board focused on football (and how badly has that been needed in recent years?) and in touch with the fanbase.

 

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[quote user="canary cherub "][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Well call me a cynic if you like. But you won''t get any board at any club up and down the land to do what the fans say. Some will listen but we shouldn''t confuse listening with agreeing. Any fans representation that is taken on board will always be on ticketing, refreshments, stewarding, away travel and other fans issues. I believe the main business decisions will always be made by those who have a stake in the club and the closest we get to that is being told as shareholders at the AGM.

[/quote]

I wasn''t suggesting that the fans should dictate the agenda.  Their role would be mainly to keep the board focused on football (and how badly has that been needed in recent years?) and in touch with the fanbase.

 

[/quote]

I do realise that Cherub, I was jst saying that he who pays the piper calls the tune. Even if we got a fan on the board and the rest of the board listened and even agreed whose to say the decisions would be better. Football decisions are the reason why we are in the Third Division. Decisions like football  managerial appointments. And when making these decisions the board consulted with some of the most respected football people in the country. Would a fan do better than that?

 

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

I don''t have a question for the board as such LQ because it won''t matter a jot what they answer. At the end of the day if we win football matches the ordinary fan will soon lose interest in the boardroom but if we have another disappointing season there will be calls for the boards heads. We''re a football club and that''s the way of it. No answers that the board could give would change that fact.

I do have a question for you though : I believe the forming of the SCG and other fans initiatives came through people who are no longer at the club. Do you believe these things will carry on under the new board?

 

[/quote]

Exactly, spot on Nutty... [Y]

As The Butler and Myself have suggested many times, those running our club need to be set some kind of targets throughout the season to match.

If come the end of September/start of October things are going as most fans are now expecting them to go and we are sat up there in the top 6 then I am sure the team will continue to receive most fans backing and what is going on within the boardroom will take much more of a back seat.  Anything short or that however and questions will obviously start be raised.

First and foremost, we as a group of fans need to decide what is an acceptable performance for this coming season.  For example, some say that just getting in to the play-offs without promotion would be acceptable, I would say that it is not and anything less than promotion at the first attempt without significant fresh investment being found will mean yet another year of our club moving in the wrong direction.

I get the feeling that some fans would even take a 7th or 8th place finish?

I think that anything short of a swift return to the Championship and the offer of a suitable budget given to Mr Gunn to keep us there is failing the club and the city once more.

To be fair, I think that we may have a squad capable of competing at this level.  I am still not sure though if we may find ourselves lacking in that extra bit of quality required to make the difference between success and failure.  I will not be happy if come the end of the season they are claiming poverty yet again for not having one or two real quality individuals who could of made the difference, as yet more cutbacks are made to balance the books.

I think that there should be further meetings throughout the season to assess whether we are on track to achieve the above goals or not.

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[quote user="Smudger"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

I don''t have a question for the board as such LQ because it won''t matter a jot what they answer. At the end of the day if we win football matches the ordinary fan will soon lose interest in the boardroom but if we have another disappointing season there will be calls for the boards heads. We''re a football club and that''s the way of it. No answers that the board could give would change that fact.

I do have a question for you though : I believe the forming of the SCG and other fans initiatives came through people who are no longer at the club. Do you believe these things will carry on under the new board?

 

[/quote]

Exactly, spot on Nutty... [Y]

As The Butler and Myself have suggested many times, those running our club need to be set some kind of targets throughout the season to match.

If come the end of September/start of October things are going as most fans are now expecting them to go and we are sat up there in the top 6 then I am sure the team will continue to receive most fans backing and what is going on within the boardroom will take much more of a back seat.  Anything short or that however and questions will obviously start be raised.

First and foremost, we as a group of fans need to decide what is an acceptable performance for this coming season.  For example, some say that just getting in to the play-offs without promotion would be acceptable, I would say that it is not and anything less than promotion at the first attempt without significant fresh investment being found will mean yet another year of our club moving in the wrong direction.

I get the feeling that some fans would even take a 7th or 8th place finish?

I think that anything short of a swift return to the Championship and the offer of a suitable budget given to Mr Gunn to keep us there is failing the club and the city once more.

To be fair, I think that we may have a squad capable of competing at this level.  I am still not sure though if we may find ourselves lacking in that extra bit of quality required to make the difference between success and failure.  I will not be happy if come the end of the season they are claiming poverty yet again for not having one or two real quality individuals who could of made the difference, as yet more cutbacks are made to balance the books.

I think that there should be further meetings throughout the season to assess whether we are on track to achieve the above goals or not.

[/quote]

Who kidnapped Smudger? It certainly wasn''t "moan city fc"

Seriously......... I actually disagree. I think based on the backing the board/fans has given Gunn compared to every team in LG1 and most in the champs..........8th place would be a huge failure.

I honestly think that if we are not top 6 by Xmas that the board will sack Gunn. The new chairman has already said its a "results based business"

With the amount spent we should demand results.

We should mark this day down in history................

Semi looks like a world beater and Smudger posts something almost positive...............

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smudger wrote.....

As The Butler and Myself have suggested many times, those running our club need to be set some kind of targets throughout the season to match.

 

I`m sorry "Smudger" but you, can want whatever you want, but theres nothing you can do except not go to matches, (wait............ you dont go anyways do you ?) Hmmmm ok so what you going to do if city dont live up to your expectations ? Stamp your foot ? call for everyone to protest ? ( Just like last time, when you had about 10 people there ? )

Its not you, not us, who set targets, try DS and WJ, as they got the most shares in city, so its up to them what GOES and what DONT.

But saying that, I believe the new CEO is not going to stand much. I expect him to not allow BG any slack. So if things are not going well, I think BG will be gone. But as things go in preseason, i`m full of hope.

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LQ - I have a few questions if you get the chance, not hopeful of answers but here goes -

To Delia - Is the club up for sale? If so, has the price been lowered since relegation? On the basis that if you are buying something then you need to know the price, then how much is NCFC to buy? If the club cannot find a buyer is there a reason why NCFC, despite it''s fan base, appears to be so unattractive, investors even preferring Notts County to Norwich?  Is the price of selling to the right buyer still £10 as quoted on (I think) the Simon Mayo radio show? Is so, can she define "the right buyer"? If the price is not £10, and she wants her full investment back, then fair enough but does she now regret making such a rash statement? Does she also regret the statement at the Norfolk Show regarding "lots of lovely investment"? Whilst she may have intended this to be ironic, is she aware of how many fans were misled by that statement?

Generally to the Board - What actions will it take to get NCFC back into the Premier League, how do they intend to complete those actions, how long do they anticipate it will take?Or have expectations been lowered and do the Board now regard the goal of NCFC to be able to compete in the Champioship rather than the Premier League?

Do the Board regard the team as stronger than last season, ie would the newly assembled team have kept us up? If so, on the basis that it has cost so little to assemble, why was this not done last season instead of the manager being allowed to waste money on loan signings?

Good Luck.  [Y]

 

 

 

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[quote user="USAcanary"][quote user="Smudger"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

I don''t have a question for the board as such LQ because it won''t matter a jot what they answer. At the end of the day if we win football matches the ordinary fan will soon lose interest in the boardroom but if we have another disappointing season there will be calls for the boards heads. We''re a football club and that''s the way of it. No answers that the board could give would change that fact.

I do have a question for you though : I believe the forming of the SCG and other fans initiatives came through people who are no longer at the club. Do you believe these things will carry on under the new board?

 

[/quote]

Exactly, spot on Nutty... [Y]

As The Butler and Myself have suggested many times, those running our club need to be set some kind of targets throughout the season to match.

If come the end of September/start of October things are going as most fans are now expecting them to go and we are sat up there in the top 6 then I am sure the team will continue to receive most fans backing and what is going on within the boardroom will take much more of a back seat.  Anything short or that however and questions will obviously start be raised.

First and foremost, we as a group of fans need to decide what is an acceptable performance for this coming season.  For example, some say that just getting in to the play-offs without promotion would be acceptable, I would say that it is not and anything less than promotion at the first attempt without significant fresh investment being found will mean yet another year of our club moving in the wrong direction.

I get the feeling that some fans would even take a 7th or 8th place finish?

I think that anything short of a swift return to the Championship and the offer of a suitable budget given to Mr Gunn to keep us there is failing the club and the city once more.

To be fair, I think that we may have a squad capable of competing at this level.  I am still not sure though if we may find ourselves lacking in that extra bit of quality required to make the difference between success and failure.  I will not be happy if come the end of the season they are claiming poverty yet again for not having one or two real quality individuals who could of made the difference, as yet more cutbacks are made to balance the books.

I think that there should be further meetings throughout the season to assess whether we are on track to achieve the above goals or not.

[/quote]

Who kidnapped Smudger? It certainly wasn''t "moan city fc"

Seriously......... I actually disagree. I think based on the backing the board/fans has given Gunn compared to every team in LG1 and most in the champs..........8th place would be a huge failure.

I honestly think that if we are not top 6 by Xmas that the board will sack Gunn. The new chairman has already said its a "results based business"

With the amount spent we should demand results.

We should mark this day down in history................

Semi looks like a world beater and Smudger posts something almost positive...............

[/quote]

Gunn''s budget in terms of the number of bodies that he has had to bring in has been nothing short of pitiful yet again.

Gunn has worked wonders in my opinion to put a squad together that is giving even the Smudgers of this world hope for the coming season.

Unless this new board of ours gets out here and finds serious investment in the next 9 months or so and Gunny & Co win promotion then we will be no better off than we were 12 months ago in my opinion.

I agree with you that it will be massive underachivement if we are not top 6 by Christmas and even by October.  But where exactly will sacking Gunn get us if we are not achieving those results?

We are skint and those new people in the boardroom plus the 3 old hands need to be getting out there and finding serious investment this season... there talk is going to achive nothing and it is about time that we saw something more from them.  Without serious investment in the next 9 months or so then even promotion by itself is llikely to achieve little in my opinion.

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