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Lurd

Drop Gary Holt.. midfield rant

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Will this ever happen? What does Gary Holt really bring to our team these days? Worthy must hold him in the same regard as gerrard or henry because no matter how bad the bloke plays, and he has had some awful performances this season; he seems to never get subbed or dropped? Why is this?

I know 3 lungs has been class for us in div 1 over the last few years but he''s really not up to premiership standard, especially playing in the diamond where he''s gonna have to use a bit of skill instead of his headless chicken running.. i really hope mullers gets himself fit and proves he is the premiership player he believed he was in 2002 when he didn''t sign that big contract till no big club came in for him,

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Holt does do a lot of the unglamorous work. If he plays on Saturday keep an eye for who''s making up the defensive positions when Drury is attacking.

That said, I''ve been pretty impressed with Safri so far... although he has been prone to a few too many misplaced passes.

It''s a big game this weekend - hopefully Hucks will show Primus what he''s missing out on in training.

3 points for City!

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Holt gets through a tremendous amount of work but has looked off the pace this season and his passing has been abysmal.Safri instead of Holty should mean we do retain possession a little better, but we would lose an awful amount of energy. Safri does not have that energy to cover back nor the pace (god did I really just say that Holt had pace??) that Holt has. It would then mean he HAS to remain deeper to give the defensive cover we need, but would release Francis to get forward more often. On balance I would drop holt and revert to a 4-4-2 but my jury is out on Youssef.Its all academic really coz Holt the Undroppable will be in the starting 11 come 3pm sat.

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I hope Gary Holt doesn''t read this message board, because it would make pretty miserable reading for someone who gives his maximum all the time. True, his passing isn''t great, never has been, but that applies to a lot of our players (such as Francis) and it''s the main reason we''re suffering this year. But he does have great defensive qualities, he does have pretty good pace, and he never gives up.

I''m just a bit concerned that the focus is so much on him as the root of the problem. Francis catnaps during games too much for my liking, and when he does it leaves a dangerous hole in midfield: Holt doesn''t do that.

I''m not saying that Holt shouldn''t be rested for some games, but it''s not that big a deal. The real problem is that we''re not well endowed with players who are comfortable on the ball and can pass accurately over distance.

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I also hope Gary Holt doesn''t read this message board - I don''t think any of our midfielders have performed consistently this season, yet week-in, week-out Holt gets singled out for criticism... unfairly in my book.

Whilst he''s not had the greatest of starts, Holt has been a victim of the dreaded diamond formation this season... And whilst I agree he looked poor on right-mid at Anfield on Saturday, he looked pretty composed in the 2nd half when playing in his preferred central position...

Perhaps GH should be rested and other options considered, but I do wish people would take a more even-handed view when appraising our midfield!



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Yes.

Francis played well against Newcastle and Manchester United, but other than that has been off-the-pace and looked sluggish and let''s face it - he''s hardly Ian Crook when it comes to passing. It seems that two good, high profile performances have made him untouchable but if you compare him and Holt in most of our games this season I would put them on a level par.

Two bad games is not enough to judge a player - Helveg, Jonson and Svensson.

Two good games is not enough either, Damien, so get back to your best because we need you!

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I agree with the sentiment  about our passing, it is the main reason for our struggles to date. The fact is when you have the ball, it is a crime to give it away cheaply to quality opposition, as we frequently do.

Watching the Liverpool game on Saturday,  every player  lacked poise on the ball, a couple of times resulting in charged down clearances flying back into our penalty area... we have to play a percentage game, keeping the ball longer willl limit the amount of time the opposition have the ball and therefore limit the   chances they have to hurt us. playing 3 or 4 players who lack elementary passing skills in this league is a recipe for disaster. the only answer is to pick the best passers available, guile and stealth win over running and work rate every time in the prem.

It really is time for the scandinavians to deliver, we are totally reliant on them recreating their international form in a Norwich City shirt. Hopefully this saturday V Pompeii, will see them selected and at last perform to their undoubted abilities. No-one is knocking players working at 100% in the yellow shirt.. sometimes you need more.  

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Keeping possession is so key in this league and to be fair all of the midfield have failed to pass consistently well - Safri at times has looked worse than Holt but on other occassions has looked far better. So far this season I put Safri ahead of Holt as he has kept the ball better. However one thing you can never knock Holty for is his effort - its just that at some levels (like Malky, Iwan) effort simply isnt enough.

I agree that Francis does have his dozzy moments but when he snaps out of them he CAN be out best midfielder. I think the diamond has encouraged him in looking worse as he is unclear/unfamiliar with his role in the diamond. I do feel though that is should continue to be our first choice central midfielder - he looks the player most likely to have a consistent impact - he just has to want it more often!

If Mullers can get to match fitness and ball retention remains an issue he becomes a real live candidate/option to partner Damo in my 4-4-2 central midfield partnership.

As far as Holt not reading these boards I think the criticism has not been personal, everyone recognises the contribution he has and will continue to make and a fully functioning Holt would be a key part of our success. However the comments against Holts performance have discusses justifiable and understandable concerns about his performances that are nothing new to him and are, I am sure, being worked on by Worthy and co on the training ground. If you are reading Holty we are behind you 100% and would love you to prove us all wrong.

OTBC


OTBC

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[quote]Keeping possession is so key in this league and to be fair all of the midfield have failed to pass consistently well - Safri at times has looked worse than Holt but on other occassions has looked far ...[/quote]

Drop him?, boot him out altogether, would be a far better option!.

Yes, he has a great heart, but so do the 23.000, who turn up to support the lads every week, trouble is, most of us are no bloody good at playing at the required level!.

I included ''three lungs'' in my thread, ''4 maybe 5 can''t cut the mustard'', along with Malky, some weeks ago and got ''creamed'' on here for it.             

It seems the chickens are coming home to roost now, so save on his wages and go for someone more befitting the Premiership in January.

He''s still a good ''Micky Mouse'' Championship player, so some club is bound to come in for him.

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Very unfair IMO 1st Wizard. Yes Holt has struggled so far and if we are now going to revert back to 4-4-2 he should (and i believe will) be the midfielder dropped to the bench.

HOWEVER, if our seemingly more attacking intentions come off on Saturday and we are leading well into the second half,as legs tire,i cant think of a better player to come on and get stuck in to ensure 3 points.

Obviously in an ideal world we would continue attacking and steam-roller teams by 2 or 3 goals but i think we have seen enough of the Prem to realise this just isnt going to happen.

Holt may not be worthy of a starting place but he will still play a major role this season. Try to see the bigger picture!

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I think what worries me most (and what was brought up in the first post and forgotten about) is that in the managers mind it seems that Holt can do no wrong - as far as I remember he''s yet to even be substituted this season. I remember a few years back when Iwan would never be substituted - there were even rumours that he had such a clause in his contract - and it seemed to be to the detriment of both his own performances and the team''s.

Worthington has tried any number of midfield combinations - this season and last - but every single one of them so far has involved Gary Holt. I''d just say - especially if he''s going through a bad patch, which he IS - that the next one should be without him.

My personal view (even before the start of the season) was that Holt simply isn''t good enough for this league, but which ever way you look at it, it''s time he was rested.

As for the rest, yes, none have consistently performed, but Worthington has already shown that he is willing to leave them out of the side if necessary - even wonder-boy Bentley, yet still not Holt.

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"My personal view (even before the start of the season) was that Holt simply isn''t good enough for this league".

You may be right, but the Premiership-standard players in our squad can be counted on the fingers of one hand. As they say, you have to p*** with the d*** you''ve got.

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What I don''t like about this debate is it feels a bit "knee-jerk".

If anyone watched Rooney Utd the other night, they will realise that even with a crap player (Bellion) and totally ineffective central midfielders they still played well. This is because they have good awareness, and move well into space. Our players do not find space - they usually wait patiently by their marker and get tackled before they''ve received the ball.

All I am saying is this - dropping Holt, or Doc, or Edworthy, or Francis or WHOEVER, and playing a 1-6-4 formation with wingbacks and a sweeper will have very little effect unless we have the confidence to use the space and use the ball.

It''s like most things in football - you can chop and change whoever you like but keeping things nicely constant has many advantages, and a balance takes a long time to find.

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Sure, tactics, formations, confidence have a huge part to play... But if you have players in the team that simply can''t cope with the pace of the game or pass the ball effectively, they''re going to struggle whatever the state of the other factors.

Yes, Francis and Safri haven''t yet shown consistency, but at least they''ve shown skill, and potential - meanwhile Holt has consistently struggled to keep up with the game. btw I personally think that Mulryne is also likely to struggle as I''m not sure he really has the presence on (and off) the ball for this league, but at least he CAN pass.

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