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Camuldonum

Premier League clubs alone owe over three billion pounds

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The saddest thing for me is reading that list and wondering what hope clubs like Norwich, Plymouth among others have of surviving for any time against that sort of uncontrolled funding even if they are fortunate enough to make it.  Total madness, indeed.

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I wish we were Hull!What a well run club!

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Another interesting article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8078533.stmChampionship clubs'' total wage costs increased by £32m to £291mAlso, Another worrying factor (not linked to us, but) Newcastle Utd were 5th on the highest wage bill in the Premierleague in the 07/08 season at £74.6m! Good luck in the Championship fella''s!

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God I hate the ''Premier League''. I would honestly rather us be a top Championship side than a rubbish top tier one. I can''t stand it. Everything wrong with modern football.

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[quote user="city-till-i-die"]football = money....sad.....not entertainment just money...it will go BANG sooner rather then l8tr[/quote]Even sadder is that the majority on here dont want entertainment, they want results, at any cost

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[quote user="jbghost"]And that sums up just where football has gone wrong. No other business would be allowed to exist with such uncontrolled debt.[/quote]

Actually there are loads of companies with this amount of debt individually. Considering their revenues are a couple of billion it doesn''t look disasterous. And when you consider that a few clubs account for most of this, i don''t think it''s that bad. It may be at some point that particularly wealthy owners just write some of it off.

Whether football should be about money full stop is a different thing.

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[quote user="coro"]God I hate the ''Premier League''.

I would honestly rather us be a top Championship side than a rubbish top tier one. I can''t stand it. Everything wrong with modern football.
[/quote]

Interestingly Delia, when I spoke to her, blamed it for all the woes of NCFC too and yet everyone is striving to get there. I do wish a group of people/clubs would take up an earlier suggestion of mine and set about forming an alternative to the Premier League. It would be a league of twenty clubs which had neither promotion or relegation but would concentrate on football excellence. At the end of the season there could be a match between the champions of both leagues for the Chamionship of Britain.The system works well enough in the USA with American Football (not soccer) and could work in England but for the conservative F.A. There is enough interest and money for two "Premier" Leagues.

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Again football and the fans are the losers, unless you support one of the few. Unless there is change football will will suffer too greatly to recover. What is the point of the FA introducing a massive pyramid system when in reality there is a super league at the top of the Premiership that other teams nowadays have no chance of getting anywhere near.

Drastic action is needed now to save football.

Ban the loaning of players immediately. This system is highly abused by the top clubs who have 50, 60 or 70 professionals on their books many of whom will never play as regular first team players but who are continually denied to other clubs. Gone are the days when lower clubs can pick up players in their early twenties, develop them, build them into their teams and/or sell them them off at a profit later to keep the club going. The top clubs will not sell the players now, they only allow them to be loaned out. Other clubs give them exposure, develop them, pay their wages and increase their value. In fact they often increase their value so much that they then cannot afford them if, and only if, they are sold! If no-one loaned players what would the top clubs do with their surplus players who would then be getting no football? They would no longer be an investment so they would have to be released.

Squad limitation must be introduced. Too many of the top clubs have too many players to be realistic. Limit the players over the age of 21 at a club. Then on a players 21st birthday his club would have to make up their mind ... sign him or release him ..... if they sign him they would then have to sell/release another player to keep their squad limit. This would allow many more players to become available to lower teams and as a consequence make the players accept far more realistic wage demands than at the moment as it is the wages now that are killing clubs.

Change must be made and made soon, before it is too late.

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Also interesting from a financial perspective is the fact that Setanta failed to meet its payment obligations to the SPL on Monday - an installment of £3 million has failed to show up in the SPL bank account. Setanta have asked for an advance from Sky of around £50 million for a deal that would allow Sky to sell Setanta packages to its customers - Sky have declined.It''s ITV Digital all over again and some of the clubs in the SPL are seriously worried about the implications on their cashflow and overall financial stability because of this missed payment and the fact that Setanta are trying to negotiate downwards the new deal due to run to 2014 that they signed off on recently.The Sky monopoly marches on but there could be some cheap deals on players from north of the border as clubs try to balance their books if Setanta can''t fulfil their contract.

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More bad news on the big money front as Liverpool''s parent company reports losses of over £42 million and their auditors report was less than congratulatory! They have a £350 million loan deal to refinance by the end of July (which they already refinanced for 6 months in January) meaning Hicks and Gillett need to get selling to stabilise in the States.Why are they losing so much? Because of interest payments on the debt that H&G took out to buy the club in the first place.Sounds like Rafa will be scrabbling around for his kitty?

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One frequent call from posters is for Smith and Jones to dilute their stake to the point where they do not have a majority of the shares.What that Guardian analysis confirms is that the trend is very much the other way. Of the 20 Premier League clubs 18 have solid majority control. Moreover the writer makes the point that at Arsenal (one of the two exceptions) the lack of clear majority control has damaged the club in recent years.Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"]One frequent call from posters is for Smith and Jones to dilute their stake to the point where they do not have a majority of the shares.What that Guardian analysis confirms is that the trend is very much the other way. Of the 20 Premier League clubs 18 have solid majority control. Moreover the writer makes the point that at Arsenal (one of the two exceptions) the lack of clear majority control has damaged the club in recent years.Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.[/quote]Best we all get down the Newmarket Races then and find a rich Arab ?

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[quote user="blahblahblah"][quote user="PurpleCanary"]One frequent call from posters is for Smith and Jones to dilute their stake to the point where they do not have a majority of the shares.

What that Guardian analysis confirms is that the trend is very much the other way. Of the 20 Premier League clubs 18 have solid majority control. Moreover the writer makes the point that at Arsenal (one of the two exceptions) the lack of clear majority control has damaged the club in recent years.

Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.[/quote]

Best we all get down the Newmarket Races then and find a rich Arab ?
[/quote]

Speak for youself sweetie!!

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[quote user="blahblahblah"][quote user="PurpleCanary"]One frequent call from posters is for Smith and Jones to dilute their stake to the point where they do not have a majority of the shares.What that Guardian analysis confirms is that the trend is very much the other way. Of the 20 Premier League clubs 18 have solid majority control. Moreover the writer makes the point that at Arsenal (one of the two exceptions) the lack of clear majority control has damaged the club in recent years.Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.[/quote]Best we all get down the Newmarket Races then and find a rich Arab ?[/quote]Oil money is SO this week, Blah! Metals and minerals magnates from a bit further east are the way to go. If I was Michael Foulger I''d have booked my place at this month''s Central Asian Mining Congress in Kazakhstan and the International Metallurgy Conference in Beijing in August.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"]One frequent call from posters is for Smith and Jones to dilute their stake to the point where they do not have a majority of the shares.

What that Guardian analysis confirms is that the trend is very much the other way. Of the 20 Premier League clubs 18 have solid majority control. Moreover the writer makes the point that at Arsenal (one of the two exceptions) the lack of clear majority control has damaged the club in recent years.

Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.[/quote]

And as the controlling Notts County Supporters Trust are about to discover: "Hand over your 61.6 per cent or you don''t get the money."[:|]

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Yes, that does seem to be the downside to this deal.

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Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.

Why don''t you ask them to stop it then![:D]

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[quote user="The Butler"]

Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.

Why don''t you ask them to stop it then![:D]

[/quote]I was waiting for that!

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="The Butler"]

Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.

Why don''t you ask them to stop it then![:D]

[/quote]

I was waiting for that!
[/quote]

Thanks for the feed "Little Ern"

Get out of that you cant can you!!

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[quote user="The Butler"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="The Butler"]

Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.

Why don''t you ask them to stop it then![:D]

[/quote]I was waiting for that! [/quote]

Thanks for the feed "Little Ern"

Get out of that you cant can you!!

[/quote]Butler, or should I say "Big Eric", I can argue my way out of anything! But in this case I don''t need to resort to sophistry. What Smudger charmingly calls "billy bull".What we have now may be incompetence, but there is at least an agreement in the boardroom on what the "plan" is. Create a situation where the directors are permanently at loggerheads (which seems to be the case at Arsenal) and there would be no "plan", competently or incompetently carried out.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="The Butler"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="The Butler"]

Whatever the arguments against Smith and Jones, creating corporate chaos is not a good idea.

Why don''t you ask them to stop it then![:D]

[/quote]

I was waiting for that!
[/quote]

Thanks for the feed "Little Ern"

Get out of that you cant can you!!

[/quote]

Butler, or should I say "Big Eric", I can argue my way out of anything! But in this case I don''t need to resort to sophistry. What Smudger charmingly calls "billy bull".

What we have now may be incompetence, but there is at least an agreement in the boardroom on what the "plan" is. Create a situation where the directors are permanently at loggerheads (which seems to be the case at Arsenal) and there would be no "plan", competently or incompetently carried out.[/quote]

True oh short fat hairy legged.

Loggerheads in our boardroom would end in divorce!  Or a very stiff session in the confessional!

Mind you I would swap Arsenals football (and Manager) for ours any day.

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[quote user="Bobert"]

[quote user="coro"]God I hate the ''Premier League''.

I would honestly rather us be a top Championship side than a rubbish top tier one. I can''t stand it. Everything wrong with modern football.
[/quote]

Interestingly Delia, when I spoke to her, blamed it for all the woes of NCFC too and yet everyone is striving to get there. I do wish a group of people/clubs would take up an earlier suggestion of mine and set about forming an alternative to the Premier League. It would be a league of twenty clubs which had neither promotion or relegation but would concentrate on football excellence. At the end of the season there could be a match between the champions of both leagues for the Chamionship of Britain.The system works well enough in the USA with American Football (not soccer) and could work in England but for the conservative F.A. There is enough interest and money for two "Premier" Leagues.

[/quote]


If you''d heard her comments at Charlton after we went down you''d have known that already.  She says it to anyone who will listen.  Blame anyone or anything instead of taking responsibility for the mess we''re in. 

fwiw I believe a two tier Prem, probably with 36 clubs and with no relegation from the second tier is just around the corner.  That''s why wealthy people are investing in Championship clubs at the moment.  They know they can''t all get into the Prem and stay there but they''re jockeying for position in the top half of the Champ so that they make the cut when the new league is formed.  If there are enough of them they''ll vote for a two tier system and that will be that.

Norwich City undoubtedly has the potential to be part of it, but we need a miracle now to get anywhere near.  If we miss out it will spell the end of full time professional football at Carrow Road by 2015 if not sooner.

 

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