Has nobody noticed this? Well done NCISA!

[nutty nigel 7,509]

[quote user="TIL 1010"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

I hope that Badger and Smudgers ridiculous reponses to Jims fair post don''t set the tone for the meeting.

 

[/quote]

Will you be attending Nutty? Somehow i think i may already know the answer!

[/quote]

You seem to think you know a lot of things about others Tilly! Don''t make too many assumptions and lets hope whatever gets aired at your meeting helps move the club further forward than last time.

 

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Badger"][quote user="Smudger"]

THere we go you see... the first to give out the abuse yet again.... [:$]

[/quote]

Sorry Smudger but in all honesty, I do find your arguments rather aggressive.
[/quote]

Not even half as aggressive as what was handed out to me when there was only a few of us in the minority campaigning for change and trying to make the rest aware of what was going on at our club.

Are we still in the minority?

I really don''t know, but again judging by some of what was handed out at the Open Day on Monday then I would say that those with the ''Gunn Out'' view most certainly were.

Judging by the numbers that turned up I would suggest that even those who are prepared to push through changes no matter what are also in the minority.

I would suggest the majority seem to want to give a failure of a manager in Gunn another chance just because he is a Norwich Legend and the they also have no wish to push through change as they believe that without Delia Smith there would be no Norwich City FC.

I think that the majority are wrong on both counts and that we still have a battle on our hands trying to prove that.

Even the local press do not want to take up a story where possible investment has been turned away, because it will once and all nail the myth that Delia Smith has the best interests of NCFC at heart!

[Badger 0]

[quote user="Jim Smith"]

It will be as representative as you will get and at the end of the day the people there will be the ones who care enough about the club to make the effort to attend. i know not everyone who wants to go will be able to and i''m not saying if you don''t attend you are not a fan but i suspect there will be several hundred people there all of whom are passionate norwich fans. Many of our season ticket holders and members are not what i would describe as passionate Norwich fans and to be honest any ballot that included them would also not be truly representative if you ask me!

[/quote]Why would it be more representative than a ballot of season ticket holders and members?It all comes down to the point that I have been challenging on another thread about the contempt some on here have for Norwich fans - too old/ middle class/ female etc. therefore presumably not worth a vote?I really don''t think you can say with justification that a ballot of season tickets holders and members can be seen as unrepresentative of the fans.

[Badger 0]

[quote user="Kathy"]

[quote user="Jim Smith"]If people are going to attend this and its going to be any use nobody should be given abuse for expressing their opinion. It will only be worthwhile if people are able to say what they think. At the end of the day if I sit there and a majority of the fans in the room put their hands up and support Gunn getting the job or Delia, Doncaster et all carrying on regardless then we have to accept that is the majority view. I would be amazed if that is the case (not least because those more likley to attend are going to be those that want change) but thats how i see it.[/quote]

Abuse will not be tolerated at the meeting, irrespective of the views expressed. If we want the club to listen to our opinions then people must behave like grown ups.

[/quote]What''s wrong with a ballot of season ticket holders and members Kathy?

[Jonny O - disgrace in yellow 0]

Hi all, new member here, long time reader, first time poster.

There has been lots of animated discussion these last few days with people expressing their views on a variety of different discussions. People have an opinion. It is neither right nor wrong, but it is their opinion. If you have a different opinion it does not mean you are right.

I personally do not want Gunn to keep the job and would prefer someone else. It is my opinion based on results and performances. Some have the same opinion as me, and others not but it is my opinion and I have the right to it. If people disagree with me fine that is their right. None of us know what the future holds, we just have an opinion. Only what happens in the future will tell us if we were right or wrong.

We should respect peoples different opinions.

As bad as last season was I will continue to support my team. Norwich are my team and I enjoy going to the games. I hope we have a new manager next season, a new team of permanent signings that put in effort and want to play for the club (especially a new right back please), and a few quality loans. Whatever the team next season, both on the pitch and in the dugout they will have my support.

[TIL 1010 4,722]

[quote user="Badger"][quote user="Kathy"]

[quote user="Jim Smith"]If people are going to attend this and its going to be any use nobody should be given abuse for expressing their opinion. It will only be worthwhile if people are able to say what they think. At the end of the day if I sit there and a majority of the fans in the room put their hands up and support Gunn getting the job or Delia, Doncaster et all carrying on regardless then we have to accept that is the majority view. I would be amazed if that is the case (not least because those more likley to attend are going to be those that want change) but thats how i see it.[/quote]

Abuse will not be tolerated at the meeting, irrespective of the views expressed. If we want the club to listen to our opinions then people must behave like grown ups.

[/quote]

What''s wrong with a ballot of season ticket holders and members Kathy?
[/quote]

Such a ballot would have to be carried out by the club itself.NCISA does not have access to its database with contact details of season ticket holders and members.That comes under the Data Protection Act.

Do you think the club would be prepared to conduct such a ballot?The chances of that happening ar nil unfortunately.

[Ex-greenoschin 0]

Congratulations Tilly and Kathy for getting this meeting in place so promptly I look forward to coming along.

A friendly bit of advice to Smudger, having been present at the last two meetings at Carra'' when you have been in "action" you would help the cause you belieie in no end if you took your turn to speak and came back with a response as everyone else does - speak forcibly by all means but cut the snidey comments throughout the evening.

Reading you on this forum shows you in a crap light but I do believe you are passionate about getting the best for the club - perhaps you can review your past performances and see how you can help the cause rather than alienate people.

[Badger 0]

[quote user="TIL 1010"]

Such a ballot would have to be carried out by the club itself.NCISA does not have access to its database with contact details of season ticket holders and members.That comes under the Data Protection Act.

Do you think the club would be prepared to conduct such a ballot?The chances of that happening ar nil unfortunately.

[/quote]I appreciate that the constraints of the Data Protection Act but given way in which majority opinions are distorted on this board, I would have thought that it could well be in their interests. It would certainly be fairer and more representative.I''m not up with all the politics of NCISA although I read references to them but I do appreciate that it is a labour of love for most of you and you do your best. However, in all honesty, I don''t think that it will be representative of most peoples opinions. It is likely to bring the angriest of fans out - it is the nature of these things (like phone in polls) and that in itself will put off a lot of people - myself included. I don''t think that it makes me any less of a fan - perhaps just a bigger coward!

[newcastle uni canary 0]

[quote user="Smudger"][quote user="Badger"][quote user="The Butler"]

[quote user="Jim Smith"]http://new.pinkun.com/[/quote]

I have now surprised you haven''t[;)]

Urge everyone who can to attend

[/quote]I have know problem with the meeting but doubt very much that it will be a representitive sample of fans opinions. Having seen the abuse meeted out to any that dare voice a contrary view on this message board it would take a far braver person than me to speak out in favour of Gunn etc.Wouldn''t a better way be a ballot of season ticket holders and members?[/quote]

No it wouldn''t Bodger.

It has been this spineless behaviour by our fans that has had a huge part to play in seeing us in to this fine mess.

Back your convictions for once.

How much abuse have people like myself or Tilly, or many others taken on attempting to get things this far?

If you are not prepared to get out from behind your keyboard then you do not deserve a say.

[/quote]Oh i see its the fans fault for Norwich City not being able to play well enough to remain in the championship and it the fans fault we brought rubbish players in on loan. Because if we just chanted "win" during game instead of singing "on the ball city" then we would have won more and if when it got near transfer window time we chanted " sign someone good" we''d had bought good players in not the dross we actually got. Thankyou smudger you''ve opened my eyes. 

[nutty nigel 7,509]

[quote user="Jim Smith"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

oops.. I''ll take it back. Who are you to decide which fans are should be included to make a vote representative of Norwich fans[:|]

 

[/quote]

 

I''m not saying its for me to decide. i''m just saying that (leaving aside the logistics of organising it) a ballot of all season ticket holders and members would not IMHO be much more representative than a sample of say 1,000 who attend this meeting. I know at least 5 or 6 Norwich season ticket holders who attend Carrow Road and watch us play but who''s "first" club is not Norwich - they just want to watch live football. They won''t be at this meeting. I would not regard them as Norwich fans in the same way that i would regard you or I or Smudger or badger or virtually everyone that posts on this messageboard. This is one of the reasons why you will never see the types of mass uprising you used to get at CR under Chase - there are a lot of people like that who have STs now.

[/quote]

I don''t think it would be more representative Jim but the public meeting gives fans the chance to air their views and feel they are actually doing something which is what many have been crying out for. The reason I took exception to the immediate comments from Badger and Smudger was because I believe that type of remark will put fans off attending/speaking.

I didn''t attend the public meeting called by NCISA to discuss Worthington. I didn''t believe there was any point going to a meeting designed to put presure on the board to sack a man that I still had faith in. The press reported that at the end of the meeting only 4 out of the 500 fans voted to keep faith in the manager. Do you think this was representative of the whole fan base Jim? Interestingly it was also reportred that a lone voice spoke in defence of the manager stating that the fans gripe should be with Smith&Jones. All I can say about that is that it''s a strange world!

I believe this public meeting is different though, and I will get there if I can. There is no agenda like the last one. It really does seem as though it will be worth attending whatever your point of view and i would encourage all fans to ignore those earlier comment on this thread and not only attend but make their feelings heard.

 

[Badger 0]

[quote user="Evil Monkey"]Or, failing that, a big stick... If one side of the debate is going to bleat about having abuse thrown at them, then they should maybe take a look at themselves and their own behaviour as well.  Do unto others, and all that.... unfortunately, in these parts, it seems that that applies only up to the point at which someone disagrees with you, in which case it turns into a free-for-all.  Both Smudger and Badger could be accused of this childishness.Incidentally, Kathy or Tilly or whoever, what are the outputs of this meeting expected to be? A written statement on behalf of the fans? A petition or poll? Or just a strongly shaken fist in the direction of Doomcaster?[/quote]A bit harsh Evil Monkey? All I said was "Any proposal that has Smudger''s backing I would concern me - I have seen enough of his "debating style" on here! " - and I apologised to him for that!It is the constant abuse of other fans that I find most disheartening.

[The Fish Seller 0]

[quote user="Badger"]I appreciate that the constraints of the Data Protection Act but given way in which majority opinions are distorted on this board, I would have thought that it could well be in their interests. It would certainly be fairer and more representative.I''m not up with all the politics of NCISA although I read references to them but I do appreciate that it is a labour of love for most of you and you do your best. However, in all honesty, I don''t think that it will be representative of most peoples opinions. It is likely to bring the angriest of fans out - it is the nature of these things (like phone in polls) and that in itself will put off a lot of people - myself included. I don''t think that it makes me any less of a fan - perhaps just a bigger coward![/quote]Badger why don''t you wait and hear what peoples feelings are before making excuses, BTW a day or two ago weren''t you firmly of the opinion that there are only about 30 people unhappy enough to be likely to attend such a meeting anyway?Tilly or Kathy can you confirm whether this is an open meeting or NCISA only and if so can you join at the door please.(Would love to come and have rather a long journey).

[As my login causes problems [ :o) ] 0]

It is concerning that the continual arguers are already arguing.

Alas not everyone at the meeting will get a chance to speak, but hopefully a few eloquent ones will speak up for most viewpoints, and if issues are raised then maybe a show of hands can follow to get a consensus.

As to what comes out of the meeting, it would be wrong to preempt the discussions but I am sure a few key pointers for the future will be found and a clear message to the present incumbents.

[Badger 0]

[quote user="Buckethead"]Badger why don''t you wait and hear what peoples feelings are before making excuses, [/quote]Because I am not sure what other peoples feelings have to do with it? I don''t think it will be representative and if I did attend I would be too cowardly to speak out. People are perfectly entitled to attend a meeting if they wish to - but I don''t think that anyone will be convinced that it represents majority opinion, whichever way you vote. [quote user="Buckethead"]BTW a day or two ago weren''t you firmly of the opinion that there are only about 30 people unhappy enough to be likely to attend such a meeting anyway?[/quote]NoBTW as I pointed out on another thread it''s not about us but the football team, so if you want to ask me questions why not PM me rather than in the public arena?I think that the issue here is that I don''t think that the meeting will be representative of Norwich fans as a whole. I think that at the very least this is a point worth consideration. This is not intended as a criticism of NCISA who are working as a labour of love. I think that if a ballot could be organised it would carry more weight and resolve the issue more clearly. The practical issues of this have been pointed out above but I think the idea is worthy of further consideration.Just a suggestion, but how about if the NCISA held an independently-scrutinised ballot, where votes had to be accompanied by last year''s season ticket/ membership card? We don''t need them now (and if we did we could send an SAE).

[Vinny !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 0]

Is there an age limit, as i would like to get my boy involved 14 year old...

will there be refreshments or am i asking too much....

[gazzathegreat 0]

Buckethead, it''s open to all, but you can join NCISA on the night if you so wish.

Look forward to seeing you there.

[Vinny !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 0]

Me and the boy will be there

[kdncfc 0]

[quote user="Badger"][quote user="Buckethead"]

Badger why don''t you wait and hear what peoples feelings are before making excuses,

[/quote]

Because I am not sure what other peoples feelings have to do with it? I don''t think it will be representative and if I did attend I would be too cowardly to speak out. People are perfectly entitled to attend a meeting if they wish to - but I don''t think that anyone will be convinced that it represents majority opinion, whichever way you vote.

[quote user="Buckethead"]

BTW a day or two ago weren''t you firmly of the opinion that there are only about 30 people unhappy enough to be likely to attend such a meeting anyway?

[/quote]

No

BTW as I pointed out on another thread it''s not about us but the football team, so if you want to ask me questions why not PM me rather than in the public arena?

I think that the issue here is that I don''t think that the meeting will be representative of Norwich fans as a whole. I think that at the very least this is a point worth consideration. This is not intended as a criticism of NCISA who are working as a labour of love. I think that if a ballot could be organised it would carry more weight and resolve the issue more clearly. The practical issues of this have been pointed out above but I think the idea is worthy of further consideration.

Just a suggestion, but how about if the NCISA held an independently-scrutinised ballot, where votes had to be accompanied by last year''s season ticket/ membership card? We don''t need them now (and if we did we could send an SAE).



[/quote]

I would say that if 600 people attend the meeting it would be enough to be representative of how the fanbase feels, anyone who is happy with the current set up is just as entitled to attend and raise their hand in favour of whatever they see fit without the need to give their reasons for doing so. It''s just the same on this site and a few do stick up for the board but it has to be said that the majority are totally fed up with it and are desperate for change.  I''d say that a very high percentage of us do think that changes are needed both in the boardroom and at managerial level but some of us would be far more radical in what we think needs to be done than others but at the end of the day we all want the same thing.

[Badger 0]

[quote user="kdncfc"]

I would say that if 600 people attend the meeting it would be enough to be representative of how the fanbase feels, anyone who is happy with the current set up is just as entitled to attend and raise their hand in favour of whatever they see fit without the need to give their reasons for doing so. It''s just the same on this site and a few do stick up for the board but it has to be said that the majority are totally fed up with it and are desperate for change.  I''d say that a very high percentage of us do think that changes are needed both in the boardroom and at managerial level but some of us would be far more radical in what we think needs to be done than others but at the end of the day we all want the same thing.

[/quote]For it to be representative it needs to be typical of the whole body of fans which it cannot hope to be, any more than this site, so I disagree with you on this. I am sure you are right when you say that a very high percentage of fans agree that changes are needed - I think that the number agreeing with any specific change would be lower.I think that in a straight poll of managers, the numbers supporting Gunn would be quite high - probably higher than on this site. Of the other people that would attract votes, I am sure that some would be non-starters. I''m not sure that any candidate that is affordably available would attract a higher vote than Bryan Gunn.

[Arthur Whittle 0]

[quote user="Smudger"][quote user="Badger"][quote user="Smudger"]

THere we go you see... the first to give out the abuse yet again.... [:$]

[/quote]

Sorry Smudger but in all honesty, I do find your arguments rather aggressive.
[/quote]

Not even half as aggressive as what was handed out to me when there was only a few of us in the minority campaigning for change and trying to make the rest aware of what was going on at our club.

Are we still in the minority?

I really don''t know, but again judging by some of what was handed out at the Open Day on Monday then I would say that those with the ''Gunn Out'' view most certainly were.

Judging by the numbers that turned up I would suggest that even those who are prepared to push through changes no matter what are also in the minority.

I would suggest the majority seem to want to give a failure of a manager in Gunn another chance just because he is a Norwich Legend and the they also have no wish to push through change as they believe that without Delia Smith there would be no Norwich City FC.

I think that the majority are wrong on both counts and that we still have a battle on our hands trying to prove that.

Even the local press do not want to take up a story where possible investment has been turned away, because it will once and all nail the myth that Delia Smith has the best interests of NCFC at heart!

[/quote]

*Bump*

Well done NCISA.

[big dick sanchez 0]

I''ll be there, on a boat.

[Canary Wundaboy 1,358]

I''ll be there.

[ca 1]

I hope fans turn up in the thousands especially those who have so much to say on here, its your big chance to make a difference so turn up and voice your opinion.

[Wembley_Canary 0]

How many people can fit into St Andrews Hall? I hope we get a big turn out, will the NCISA meeting be advertised in the EDP/Evening News aswell as a mention on any local radio stations to get the word out there as much as possible?....

 

[ca 1]

I''m sure it will be well advertised by NCISA [:)] but meanwhile if we tell everyone we know that will help.

[nutty nigel 7,509]

But I see the continual patroniser keeps patronising.

Why is it concerning? What are they arguing about? This is a discussion board and if you are averse to discussion I suggest you just post your opinions, whatever they are, on the NCISA web site. [:|]

Even I don''t take offence at Tilly''s little dig about whether I turn up. The chances are I will be there, unless of course it''s conditional on joining your organisation.

 

[The Fish Seller 0]

[quote user="gazzathegreat"]Buckethead, it''s open to all, but you can join NCISA on the night if you so wish.

Look forward to seeing you there.[/quote]Cheers GTG haven''t had to bunk into St Andrews Hall since the Undertones played there and I can''t climb as well as that these days.[;)]

[nutty nigel 7,509]

[quote user="Buckethead"][quote user="gazzathegreat"]Buckethead, it''s open to all, but you can join NCISA on the night if you so wish. Look forward to seeing you there.[/quote]

Cheers GTG haven''t had to bunk into St Andrews Hall since the Undertones played there and I can''t climb as well as that these days.[;)]
[/quote]

Back in 1971 I saw a band called Van der Graaf Generator at St Andrews hall Buckethead. Have you ever heard of them?

 

[The Fish Seller 0]

Yes Nigel have certainly heard of them but wouldn''t recognise one of their songs  I''m afraid as they were just a little early for me. Remember lots of people having posters of them though, possibly because they''d played Norwich I guess.

[Badger 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Back in 1971 I saw a band called Van der Graaf Generator at St Andrews hall Buckethead. Have you ever heard of them?

 [/quote]

Didn''t they play at the Theatre Royal a few years later?