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xcityman

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A good friend of mine has been watching the situation at NCFC with great interest because he once worked for the club, he has many friends there and in his own words many people who deserve all thats now coming to them. I will not say in what capacity he worked for them but it may become evident with what department he was involved in as i go on.

We were together on wednesday evening and one or two drinks were sunk and he told me several things that all make sense when considering the clubs current position. He spoke quite passionately about things and these are the points he made very clear, all of course are opinion but they are the opinion of someone who was party to a a considerable amount of information.

Firstly i think it is important to say that he did NOT want them to go down but in the same breath did suggest that relegation would force the ‘club’ in to a big clear out and root out the really problem that is deep in the core of the club rather then the previously used tactic of sacking those who could also be considered accountable for a lack of success so to avoid the finger being pointed at them.

Mr Doncaster is partly accountable for the state of the clubs current situation. When i first heard this i replied with ‘surely its more then just partly, he is the CEO’ but i was shot down very quickly with this; Dont be fooled by job titles, Doncaster is by trade a solicitor and started for the club in that role and solicitors take instructions from those they work for. Delia is the organ grinder and Doncaster is the monkey and that is something that Mr Worthington and his wife worked out very quickly and as a result set out very early to forge a ‘special’ relationship with the majority share holder. Perhaps most significant about this is that it enabled Worthy to put forward is own case to the owner at a very personal level and not always across the board room table. Worthy was a genius in that he targeted the one person in the club who had the final say.

I certainly remember a few comments among supporters making reference to this relationship and I fully understand the concerns expressed at the time about the special relationship between Delia and Worthy but look what worthy did for us and look what has happened since he left.

The managers since worthy have all suffered because of a lack of ‘personal time’ with Delia, all their negotiations have taken place over the board room table among all directors, including Doncaster.

The point is that the CEO and the football manager have a conflict of interest, the manager needs money to buy ‘good’ players and the CEO must save money to get his bonus. So in the chain of communication of manager to CEO and to owner there is a fundamental problem, did Doncaster put the case across with best interests of the manager, the club or did he do it for his own interests. that reminds me, I understand that i have to be careful with this one but the stewards at the games work for who? and who is a director of that company?

Doncaster has dealt with people at every level within the club, players, coaches, all non football staff, agents and potential investors and in the small world of football his reputation is well known, not popular and clubs and agents do not want to deal with him. Logistically Norwich is not appealing to players at first glance so it is difficult enough to attract them without a CEO that is know as difficult, unreasonable and a little bit sneaky. Yes football is now more business efficient then ever but personal skills, positive reputation are still very relevant in a relatively small business community.

So back to the ‘partly responsible’ comment. The bottom line is Doncaster was put in a position by Delia, he is not an experienced CEO let alone a CEO of a football club. His unpopular, cloak and dagger methods are naive and some would say equals incompetence.

He has slowly watched the club rot around him and been party to some horrific football decisions. He spoke recently about his wage and that he could work in london for more so he must love NCFC to stay. Rubbish, any company in london would look at his reputation and the decisions he has been party to and say no chance. I cant believe the two appointment after Worthy, Grant, coach yes but no experience as manager, under no circumstances would i see this as a decent appointment. Roeder, my mate said this is the appointment that sealed the fate of NCFC. How the board of directors could even consider this man is beyond him. Relegated how many clubs? His manner with the fans caused concern from day one, he sacked the kit man, the physios, the scientist? He ripped the heart out of the club and replaced it with....(wont say that bit)

If im looking at that appointment on its own i would seriously question the credibility of the board. Do they not speak to people in football? Do they not study the environment to find out about these people? Or does the CEO speak to his ‘mates’ for advice? Donky you have no mates they stitched you up with the advice son. My mate assures me Roeders reputation is very well know in football, This is NCFC we deserve better.

So Doncaster and Delia are the two who are finally at the sharp end, after years of dodging the bullets they are in the firing line and one of them will go, me thinks it wont be Delia ;-)

Anyway, what started as a constructive comment has become a rant, sorry but i think you get the point.

PS prudence with ambition is the biggest load of B*^locks i have ever heard, what it actually means is we want the prem but dont want to pay for it so what il do is take minimum risk stay in with the club to promote my own business and if we get to the prem its a bonus.

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I will not say in what capacity he worked for them but it may become evident with what department he was involved in as i go on.

 

No, you still got me there. Give us a clue?


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A really interesting and (for me) credible post.

Did your mate mention anything about how much of the funds from transfers pass down to the playing budget. Doomy has consistently stated (including at the open day) that the manager has always been given any such fnds to reinvest. However, the accounts and the evenidence of what we see on the pitch suggests that this is another bare faced piece fo spin. Any insight you would be able to provide in this area would be really helpful.

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Really interesting comments here and sounds very plausible. Just probably backs up what I have been saying all along about The Cook!

If she had any sense of decency she and WynnJones would IMMEDIATELY resign from the Board (they do not have to sell their shares to do this). It''s just so frustrating that the bulk of the fans simply close their ears and eyes to anything that is less  than 100% complimentary to The Cook  and will never take any action against her. If she had been subject to the loud and personal criticism that Chase received she would have fled town years ago.  

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You are so very right indeed. Sacking Doomy is the first thing we need to do to start to turn the club around. Come on Delia, let''s be sacking him.

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[quote user="Mustachio Furioso"]

I will not say in what capacity he worked for them but it may become evident with what department he was involved in as i go on.

 

No, you still got me there. Give us a clue?


[/quote]

cleaner...

jas :)

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Thanks for this. Not to decry but this sentence:"The point is that the CEO and the football manager have a conflict of

interest, the manager needs money to buy ‘good’ players and the CEO

must save money to get his bonus."Is there any published evidence that Doomy''s bonus is based on what ever might be termed "saving money"?I only ask from a pedantic viewpoint.

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[quote user="Chrisr"]Thanks for this. Not to decry but this sentence:"The point is that the CEO and the football manager have a conflict of

interest, the manager needs money to buy ‘good’ players and the CEO

must save money to get his bonus."Is there any published evidence that Doomy''s bonus is based on what ever might be termed "saving money"?I only ask from a pedantic viewpoint.[/quote]

Think it could be, doomcaster and the board have provided a nice cosey set up at carrow road, it is clear some people go because it s a nice day out, doomcaster has let Norwich with no assest''s and loan players......The trail of thoughts are "if we go down, the loan payers can go back, leaving us with no debt!!"Also the assests situation is scary, we are left with no players worth over 1 million, this means if we do sell we are lft to scrape the low league barrel, the overall factor is the club is left in the worst stat for years..............But guess what, Doomcaster still gets his bonus!!

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[quote user="Yellow Rider"]

...If she had been subject to the loud and personal criticism that Chase received she would have fled town years ago.  

[/quote]

It''s finally starting....

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[quote user="CANARYCHARGE"][quote user="Chrisr"]Thanks for this. Not to decry but this sentence:"The point is that the CEO and the football manager have a conflict of

interest, the manager needs money to buy ‘good’ players and the CEO

must save money to get his bonus."Is there any published evidence that Doomy''s bonus is based on what ever might be termed "saving money"?I only ask from a pedantic viewpoint.[/quote]

Think it could be, doomcaster and the board have provided a nice cosey set up at carrow road, it is clear some people go because it s a nice day out, doomcaster has let Norwich with no assest''s and loan players......The trail of thoughts are "if we go down, the loan payers can go back, leaving us with no debt!!"Also the assests situation is scary, we are left with no players worth over 1 million, this means if we do sell we are lft to scrape the low league barrel, the overall factor is the club is left in the worst stat for years..............But guess what, Doomcaster still gets his bonus!![/quote]Cool. But, I still ask my original question. Is there any published evidence that Doomy''s bonus is based on what ever might be termed "saving money"?

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A very interesting post

The bit about Worthy certainly rings true with me. The relationship they formed was far to close and it was at this time,i was reliably informed, [yeah i know its not gospel], our great ''custodian'' and ''saviour'' Delia was taking Players and staff''s wives out on regular jollies for ''Bonding'' sessions. Now don''t get me wrong, the odd night is good for moral but its very hard to sack a friend and its why you never mix business with pleasure.

If this is the case, and I''ve heard it mentioned by so many, than it sums up to me were its gone wrong. It has never been seen as a serious Club/Business and more of a little get together for those who own it, and yes, many fans see their Saturdays as nothing more nowadays.

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[quote user="Arthur Whittle OBE"]

A very interesting post

i was reliably informed, [yeah i know its not gospel], our great ''custodian'' and ''saviour'' Delia was taking Players and staff''s wives out on regular jollies for ''Bonding'' sessions. Now don''t get me wrong, the odd night is good for moral but its very hard to sack a friend and its why you never mix business with pleasure.

If this is the case, and I''ve heard it mentioned by so many, than it sums up to me were its gone wrong. It has never been seen as a serious Club/Business and more of a little get together for those who own it, and yes, many fans see their Saturdays as nothing more nowadays.

[/quote]

LOL There is no secret about it, it was something the club were proud to do. Delia said in TV interviews etc.(during the Championship promotion season) how she took the WAGS on coach trips to help the families settle into the club and make friends, so the players are then happy and can concentrate on playing for the club and feel part of the club. The players said that it really helped and Norwich were promoted to the Premiership.

It just shows how desperate some people are if they want to use that as a criticism against Delia and/or the board.

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I know that this is another nail in my coffin but surely if you contrast the first two or three reasonably objective paragraphs with the final rantings it must arouse some suspicions?

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the term saving money is a bit simplistic. trim budgets in any way possible and that means give potential players little as possible

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How does Delia use the club to promote her own business?

As far as I can see the profits from the restaurant go to the club so the club makes from using her name. Plus she has invested many millions into the club and has dedicated years of her life to the club. She isn''t flashy and has has even lived in the same house for many years. She does not have any kids and regards Norwich City as her family. She must be truly devastated at the disgusting abuse and accusations she has been getting from some fans.

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How does delia use the club to promote her business?

We cant argue with you on that point but why invest in a football club? why go on the pitch half cut and shout at the fans? why try and get on to the itfc board before norwich? simple, investment and not love for the club, investment in personal interests.

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[quote user="xcityman"]How does delia use the club to promote her business? We cant argue with you on that point but why invest in a football club? why go on the pitch half cut and shout at the fans? why try and get on to the itfc board before norwich? simple, investment and not love for the club, investment in personal interests.[/quote]

Because Delia and her husband have no kids, her hubby is a Norwich fan and she had become one too, the club was in very serious trouble, and they thought they would help rather than stand by and let the club go bust. She went on the pitch because she wanted the team to do well and they needed all the support they could get. It was a mistake, but it showed that she cared and is genuine.

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[quote user="xcityman"] why try and get on to the itfc board before norwich? [/quote]Got any proof of that then?

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[quote user="xcityman"]How does delia use the club to promote her business?

We cant argue with you on that point but why invest in a football club? why go on the pitch half cut and shout at the fans? why try and get on to the itfc board before norwich? simple, investment and not love for the club, investment in personal interests.[/quote]

But whats your point, the too go hand in hand, if you ask anyone what delia smith is they will say Football and cooking...thats a fact!! so yes se has used the club as a marketing tool!

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[quote user="book end"]You are so very right indeed. Sacking Doomy is the first thing we need to do to start to turn the club around. Come on Delia, let''s be sacking him.[/quote]

Obviously you have not learnt a thing about what this post is trying to tell you?

"Delia is the Organ Grinder and Doncaster is just the Monkey"

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[quote user="Smudger"]

[quote user="book end"]You are so very right indeed. Sacking Doomy is the first thing we need to do to start to turn the club around. Come on Delia, let''s be sacking him.[/quote]

Obviously you have not learnt a thing about what this post is trying to tell you?

"Delia is the Organ Grinder and Doncaster is just the Monkey"

[/quote][img]http://redstatebluestate.mlblogs.com/Organ_grinder_with_monkey.jpg[/img]Dance, Doomy, dance!

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No proof just thought i would throw it in. But there is a school of thought that suggests she did try but sheepshanks knocked her back as he did many other investors.

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my point exactly. Its a tough one the view is that donky is in a position of power but cant do the job as well as he should be able. Yes we can argue that he has done a ''good'' job but good in what sense, financial, PR for delia or good in the football sense? he has balanced the three very well in the past but now has slipped up.

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[quote user="tom cavendish"][quote user="Arthur Whittle OBE"]

A very interesting post

i was reliably informed, [yeah i know its not gospel], our great ''custodian'' and ''saviour'' Delia was taking Players and staff''s wives out on regular jollies for ''Bonding'' sessions. Now don''t get me wrong, the odd night is good for moral but its very hard to sack a friend and its why you never mix business with pleasure.

If this is the case, and I''ve heard it mentioned by so many, than it sums up to me were its gone wrong. It has never been seen as a serious Club/Business and more of a little get together for those who own it, and yes, many fans see their Saturdays as nothing more nowadays.

[/quote]

LOL There is no secret about it, it was something the club were proud to do. Delia said in TV interviews etc.(during the Championship promotion season) how she took the WAGS on coach trips to help the families settle into the club and make friends, so the players are then happy and can concentrate on playing for the club and feel part of the club. The players said that it really helped and Norwich were promoted to the Premiership.

It just shows how desperate some people are if they want to use that as a criticism against Delia and/or the board.

[/quote]

And you sir have no idea as to how to run a business. Just like our Board....yeah it''s really paid off hasn''t it?

Wake up Tom.

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This thread manages to put Wiki to shame in the "I can post anything and some people will believe it" stakes.

xcityman, you say you have absolutely no proof that Delia ever tried to

get on the ITFC board - yet some will read this, log it in a brain cell

and regurgitate it as gospel if the subject ever comes up again when there really is absolutely no proof that this ever happened.

Doncaster''s bonus? Where? I get the annual accounts and I''ve never noticed a bonus for him. Do you get a different set to me? I know some managers get a cut of transfer fees and such but not around these parts.

Seriously, offer proof - facts that stand up and maybe you''ll have a point.

Good grief, I don''t enjoy looking like the constant defender of the faith but sometimes it''s just too easy...

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[quote user="CANARYCHARGE"][quote user="xcityman"]How does delia use the club to promote her business? We cant argue with you on that point but why invest in a football club? why go on the pitch half cut and shout at the fans? why try and get on to the itfc board before norwich? simple, investment and not love for the club, investment in personal interests.[/quote]



But whats your point, the too go hand in hand, if you ask anyone what delia smith is they will say Football and cooking...thats a fact!! so yes se has used the club as a marketing tool!
[/quote]

Do you really think that? Delia would have made a lot more money over the last twelve years if she had never got involved with NCFC. To suggest that she used it as a Marketing tool is sheer stupidity.

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[quote user="LQ"]This thread manages to put Wiki to shame in the "I can post anything and some people will believe it" stakes.

xcityman, you say you have absolutely no proof that Delia ever tried to get on the ITFC board - yet some will read this, log it in a brain cell and regurgitate it as gospel if the subject ever comes up again when there really is absolutely no proof that this ever happened.

Doncaster''s bonus? Where? I get the annual accounts and I''ve never noticed a bonus for him. Do you get a different set to me? I know some managers get a cut of transfer fees and such but not around these parts.

Seriously, offer proof - facts that stand up and maybe you''ll have a point.



Good grief, I don''t enjoy looking like the constant defender of the faith but sometimes it''s just too easy...


[/quote]

This story has been denied by Sheepshanks on the record.  "I am not aware of Delia Smith or her husband ever offering investment to Ipswich Town FC and I can say that I remember everyone who has offered investment to this club.  I have met her socially on several occasions in the area but the question of investment has never been raised by either party."

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