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koimatsuba

Glen Roeder ...

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Was it REALLY time for him to go?

We all know his Fan relations & personal Skills weren''t the best, BUT would we be where we are now?

Surely even Roeder wouldn''t have lost or drawn the last 5-6 games?

DID the board panic sack him because of the lack of fans after at the FA cup Game against Charlton.

WAS it two or three games too soon?

IMO: I think it may have been a little too soon, ok Roeder was on his out with another two or three loses, and the team did rally behaind Gunn afterwards, BUT ...

Gunn and Co don''t have the ability of Roeder and Co. And I''m wondering if Roeder was still here we may have been a few more points better off.

We all know its not all Roeders fault we are where we are, its the board, the lack of cash etc ...

What do you all think, would we have beaten any of the other teams with Roeder still at the helm, at least Cureton wouldn''t have come back!

I''ve never wanted Gunn incharge, I wanted an Ince or similar, but I have got behind the boys at the games, it just seems such a mess now, and all too late.

Cheers All

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Doubtful if we would have  beaten Barnsley if Roeder had still been in charge although i think we may have picked up some others points. Either way we were caught between a rock and a hard thing. Boothroyd was my favorite although i hoped Gunny would come off. Time is running out on that score and i feel sorry for him and us now

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Now we are cemented in the bottom 3 I fully expect the Board to make a move to get Roeder back. The fact he got us out of the bottom 3 last season will be their main driver. He will probably turn us down flat and no doubt Doomcaster will then claim we never even spoke to him. Sound familiar?

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I don''t think the majority of fans would of wanted Roeder to go if they had thought the board would actually appoint Gunn after one lucky win. He''s legend and everything but he''s not a manager. Just can''t believe the club made the same mistake twice i.e. appointing an inexperienced manager ala Grant. It would be funny if it wasn''t so tragic.

As has been said above an experienced manager like Boothroyd, Ince or Dowie would have been far better replacements.

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Totally Agree, I wanted Bothroyd or Ince, But as you have said the chants of '' "Bryan Gunn, Bryan Gunn hes got no hair but we don''t care" cemented his name in the job. Did the others even get an interview. Anyway thats in the past now.

Will the board ever learn? Can you imagine a ropund table with Grant, Worthy, Roeder and Gunn on it. I bet a few jokes could be said there!

Lets hope that Crook and Butterworth start to help Gunn more and get us winnign again. DIFFERENT PLAYERS! Pattison! for god sake play the man!!!

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[quote user="koimatsuba"]

Was it REALLY time for him to go?

We all know his Fan relations & personal Skills weren''t the best, BUT would we be where we are now?

Surely even Roeder wouldn''t have lost or drawn the last 5-6 games?

DID the board panic sack him because of the lack of fans after at the FA cup Game against Charlton.

WAS it two or three games too soon?

IMO: I think it may have been a little too soon, ok Roeder was on his out with another two or three loses, and the team did rally behaind Gunn afterwards, BUT ...

Gunn and Co don''t have the ability of Roeder and Co. And I''m wondering if Roeder was still here we may have been a few more points better off.

We all know its not all Roeders fault we are where we are, its the board, the lack of cash etc ...

What do you all think, would we have beaten any of the other teams with Roeder still at the helm, at least Cureton wouldn''t have come back!

I''ve never wanted Gunn incharge, I wanted an Ince or similar, but I have got behind the boys at the games, it just seems such a mess now, and all too late.

Cheers All

[/quote]

Roeder had to go, end of. We wouldn''t have gained another point and he would''ve been beaten in the streets by an angry mob if he hadn''t been sacked. The Charlton performance was so disgraceful that he and his family had to hide for hours after the game. That''s the definition of an untenable situation. I think gunny has the makings of a good manager, unfortunately he has no time to learn or room to make mistakes or faff and fart around like Roeder did for the last year and a bit. My choice was Boothroyd but apparently the board wouldn''t meet his terms for a longer contract. I think he would''ve had an immediate impact and was for many the obvious choice.

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ince went for the job and didn''t get it. And rightly so. His attitude is wrong for city. He would have been branded another roeder with 5 games. Roeder would have gone no matter how many fans were there. the board knew if we lost he was going. it was pre planned. People already calling for his head etc should be ashamed. we need someone who knoows the area, the players the club the fans... not many others give us this. gunn does. we need someone for the fans and players to unite behind. gunn is new to management, but others around him aren''t. we have had 4 managers in 3 years... we need to keep this one.

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[quote] Roeder had to go, end of. We wouldn''t have gained another point and he

would''ve been beaten in the streets by an angry mob if he hadn''t been

sacked. The Charlton performance was so disgraceful that he and his

family had to hide for hours after the game. That''s the definition of

an untenable situation. I think gunny has the makings of a good

manager, unfortunately he has no time to learn or room to make mistakes

or faff and fart around like Roeder did for the last year and a bit.[/quote]Agreed. We were dire that evening and it was clear he''d lost the dressing room. Gunn does have the makings of a good manager, but this is a results driven business and he needs to deliver now more than ever. [quote]My choice was Boothroyd but apparently the board wouldn''t meet his

terms for a longer contract. I think he would''ve had an immediate

impact and was for many the obvious choice.[/quote]See, I don''t think he could''ve done much more than Gunn in the short term thanks to the shoestring budget. Besides, people forget he had a poor run at Watford with a similarly poor squad which ultimately led to his departure there. I''d have preferred Ince, who at least has a good record outside of the Premier League.

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[quote user="koimatsuba"]

Was it REALLY time for him to go?

We all know his Fan relations & personal Skills weren''t the best, BUT would we be where we are now?

Surely even Roeder wouldn''t have lost or drawn the last 5-6 games?

DID the board panic sack him because of the lack of fans after at the FA cup Game against Charlton.

WAS it two or three games too soon?

IMO: I think it may have been a little too soon, ok Roeder was on his out with another two or three loses, and the team did rally behaind Gunn afterwards, BUT ...

Gunn and Co don''t have the ability of Roeder and Co. And I''m wondering if Roeder was still here we may have been a few more points better off.

We all know its not all Roeders fault we are where we are, its the board, the lack of cash etc ...

What do you all think, would we have beaten any of the other teams with Roeder still at the helm, at least Cureton wouldn''t have come back!

I''ve never wanted Gunn incharge, I wanted an Ince or similar, but I have got behind the boys at the games, it just seems such a mess now, and all too late.

Cheers All

[/quote](YAWN). Did you actually see any of the last games under Roeder? Without a Lita replacement Roeder would have lost it big time. Results have indeed been dire but overall play has been better.

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[quote user="koimatsuba"]

Was it REALLY time for him to go?

We all know his Fan relations & personal Skills weren''t the best, BUT would we be where we are now?

Surely even Roeder wouldn''t have lost or drawn the last 5-6 games?

DID the board panic sack him because of the lack of fans after at the FA cup Game against Charlton.

WAS it two or three games too soon?

IMO: I think it may have been a little too soon, ok Roeder was on his out with another two or three loses, and the team did rally behaind Gunn afterwards, BUT ...

Gunn and Co don''t have the ability of Roeder and Co. And I''m wondering if Roeder was still here we may have been a few more points better off.

We all know its not all Roeders fault we are where we are, its the board, the lack of cash etc ...

What do you all think, would we have beaten any of the other teams with Roeder still at the helm, at least Cureton wouldn''t have come back!

I''ve never wanted Gunn incharge, I wanted an Ince or similar, but I have got behind the boys at the games, it just seems such a mess now, and all too late.

Cheers All

[/quote]

Certainly Cureton wouldn''t have come back.  "What a pity but I honestly think he''s gone.  Willing lad, gives all.  I respect him for trying but it''s just not there any more

"We''re playing at half speed in the training game and he''s missing them there as well.  I''m more patient with him than Lee is but I can''t afford him.  He''s a yard off the pass I think and it''s not a risk I can take.  I don''t feel comfortable playing him as a striker - honestly, I think he''s gone.  It''s sad because he loves the game, loves the club.  I know he wants to play but he''s not scoring in training and not in matches and if he is supposed to be your striker....well.....it''s tough on him but who''d play someone who isn''t scoring in training or matches.  You can''t go on that long with it.  There comes a cut off point and to be truthful I''ve reached it."

(Off the record then, but not now).

Will a former QPR favourite be among the spectators tomorrow night I wonder.  He still has his LMA pass.

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Fascinating insight Cam.

Saturday''s performances seem to prove this theory was correct. That was the one thing about Roeder I think he is a decent judge of a footballer and would be ideal as a director of football or chief scout. Just lacked the ability to motivate the players and lost Stefanovic which was the turning point of the season.

 

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i dont think its gunns fault what so ever , its roeders fault we are left with a load of loan players who arnt good enough and cant be bothered.

gunn really hasnt had much of a choice to field a team he wants too .

its roeders fault we are in this mess , they are his players he brought in ,

you can change the manager again and again , its not going to change the fact norwich took some serious gambles that backfired, unproven players , injury prone .

and paid out for players we didnt use , to pay out 500k on agents fees was pathetic.

the people up top are to blame , clueless , spineless , and no ambition .

i would like to know exactly how much they spent , as ive said before they could have spent that money on proven players , then rumour has it , no one wanted to play under roeder.

the board need to have a good look at themselves , and realise thier poor decisions have affected this club .

i notice delia has gone into hidding , why doesnt that surprise me ... shes a coward and putting her head in the sand isnt working .

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They are not all Roeder''s players - Carney, Killen, Gow, Cody etc are all Gunny''s signings and have nto exactly set the world on fire.

My big concern with Gunn is whether he will be able to cope with us getting relegated and stay motivated etc as that is going to be his main attribute as a manager until his experience catches up with his enthusiasm.

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The problem wasn''t sacking Roeder, it was appointing Gunn. As others have noted, Roeder had clearly lost the dressing room, and we were drifting. He simply had to go.The board than had the cahnce to appoint an experienced manager with enough time to get us out of trouble. For whatever reason (and I don''t claim to have knowledge of what goes on inside the inner sanctum), they chose to appoint a manager with no experience whatsoever. Not surprisingly, he has proven inept in the extreme as results have shown, and we are now sinking fast without hope of salvation.

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I think the position we were in would not have been attractive to an experienced manager and the board thought the risk in Gunn was equal to the risk with another manager.  It does not look like their gamble has paid off though.

We will be even less attractive to an experienced manager next season and doubt it Ince and Boothroyd etc will be interested if Gunn is to be replaced.

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[quote user="koimatsuba"]

Was it REALLY time for him to go?

We all know his Fan relations & personal Skills weren''t the best, BUT would we be where we are now?

Surely even Roeder wouldn''t have lost or drawn the last 5-6 games?

DID the board panic sack him because of the lack of fans after at the FA cup Game against Charlton.

WAS it two or three games too soon?

IMO: I think it may have been a little too soon, ok Roeder was on his out with another two or three loses, and the team did rally behaind Gunn afterwards, BUT ...

Gunn and Co don''t have the ability of Roeder and Co. And I''m wondering if Roeder was still here we may have been a few more points better off.

We all know its not all Roeders fault we are where we are, its the board, the lack of cash etc ...

What do you all think, would we have beaten any of the other teams with Roeder still at the helm, at least Cureton wouldn''t have come back!

I''ve never wanted Gunn incharge, I wanted an Ince or similar, but I have got behind the boys at the games, it just seems such a mess now, and all too late.

Cheers All

[/quote]Do we?Our current position is 90% Roeder''s fault. The board havent helped but they have made money available, Roeder chose to spend it on poor loans. The main reason we are where we are is because Roeder''s new defence consisted of 2 dinosaurs that are now history and a kid from Fulham who was completely out of his depth. Coupled with releasing Huckerby, not replacing Dion and in fact starting the season without a strike force for the Championship (what other manager would have played Cureton and Lupoli together).The best teams are born out of consistency. A consistent back four, a striker partnership that bonds and so on. Weve had none of this all season because of the revolving loan door and injury prone defenders.

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we have over ten games left.... 4 coming up quickly one after the other. i would figure we''ll see gow killen and carney involved in these. i think blaming gunn is a bit off. i don''t think the results have been terrible. Yes we have not got the wins we want and that''s really bad but so far we haven''t been beaten 3 or 4 nil.i really hoped norwich fans would give gunn a chance. but already people are calling for his head. THAT IS CRAZY.Gunn has i would imagine been through more in his life in football and in his personal life than any of us and come through. i don''t think football management will be any different.whatever happens to us, i think it will go down to the last day.

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Football is a results driven business and we have not been getting the results.

I do not think anyone is calling for Gunn''s head, but there was concern over his appointment due to his lack of football management experience.  If we are relegated, I think everyone involved needs to take their share of responsibility, learn from the mistakes and move on.  Fans included.

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This is spot on:

[quote user="Lupo Loop"]

Fascinating insight Cam.

Saturday''s performances seem to prove this theory was correct. That was the one thing about Roeder I think he is a decent judge of a footballer and would be ideal as a director of football or chief scout. Just lacked the ability to motivate the players and lost Stefanovic which was the turning point of the season.

 

[/quote]

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And so is this, the whole post, but especially the first sentence.

[quote user="Beauseant"]The problem wasn''t sacking Roeder, it was appointing Gunn. As others have noted, Roeder had clearly lost the dressing room, and we were drifting. He simply had to go.The board than had the cahnce to appoint an experienced manager with enough time to get us out of trouble. For whatever reason (and I don''t claim to have knowledge of what goes on inside the inner sanctum), they chose to appoint a manager with no experience whatsoever. Not surprisingly, he has proven inept in the extreme as results have shown, and we are now sinking fast without hope of salvation.[/quote]

I have long wanted to support the board, and I despise the personal attacks on people who have made mistakes but have been 100% committed to the club and have done their best. 

But the appointment of Gunn was an awful decision, it looked like an awful decision at the time and is proving to be an awful decision. If it was made because we couldn''t afford a long-term contract for a proper manager, that is a disgrace - it is THE most important job at the club. If it was made on the back of the Barnsley game, as Munby seemed to suggest, then the board have absolutely no footballing judgment whatsoever - I could have been manager for that game and we''d''ve won it.

The decision has almost certainly condemned us to relegation and has put a decent man and club legend in a position to which he is unsuited. I don''t blame Gunny: he will do his best and I still hope he gets us out of it. But as a board decision, it was, and remains, unforgivable.

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The current managerial situation reminds me a bit of when Megson took over from Deehan for the last few games of the season we were relegated from the Premier. I think he ended up losing them all or thereabouts.

Obviously, in time, Megson has gone on to be a decent manager. Gunn could also one day be that, but, untried managers really can''t be expected to learn their trade in the heat of a relegation scrap...

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Was it REALLY time for him to go?

We all know his Fan relations & personal Skills weren''t the best, BUT would we be where we are now?

Surely even Roeder wouldn''t have lost or drawn the last 5-6 games?

DID the board panic sack him because of the lack of fans after at the FA cup Game against Charlton.

WAS it two or three games too soon?

IMO: I think it may have been a little too soon, ok Roeder was on his out with another two or three loses, and the team did rally behaind Gunn afterwards, BUT ...

Gunn and Co don''t have the ability of Roeder and Co. And I''m wondering if Roeder was still here we may have been a few more points better off.

We all know its not all Roeders fault we are where we are, its the board, the lack of cash etc ...

What do you all think, would we have beaten any of the other teams with Roeder still at the helm, at least Cureton wouldn''t have come back!

I''ve never wanted Gunn incharge, I wanted an Ince or similar, but I have got behind the boys at the games, it just seems such a mess now, and all too late.

Cheers All



Do we?

Our current position is 90% Roeder''s fault. The board havent helped but they have made money available, Roeder chose to spend it on poor loans. The main reason we are where we are is because Roeder''s new defence consisted of 2 dinosaurs that are now history and a kid from Fulham who was completely out of his depth. Coupled with releasing Huckerby, not replacing Dion and in fact starting the season without a strike force for the Championship (what other manager would have played Cureton and Lupoli together).

The best teams are born out of consistency. A consistent back four, a striker partnership that bonds and so on. Weve had none of this all season because of the revolving loan door and injury prone defenders.
Are we in a better position player-wise than when Peter Grant left?

When Grounds leaves after Wolves match we will have same keeper and back four. Croft : fotheringham: Russell and Cureton are still playing.

Only Pattison; Clingan: Hoolahan and Cort are left of GR''s players plus Bertrand on loan. We have lost Dublin; Huckerby: Brown amongst others.

Doesn''t look like much of an improvement and League position certainly isn''t.

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