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Gary Doherty

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Spurs fans probably thought Mark Bowen, John Polston and Ian Crook were rubbish and look how successful they were for us. Spurs have never been consistent at spotting decent players so we should probably take heart that they are letting him go- they often end up keeping the rubbish.

I have seen this bloke play live against Chelsea and Villa and I actually thought he was good. Always seemed to be in the right place, strong and won headers. Can''t remember if he has much pace or what his passing was like.

We know the defence needs strength in depth and this is a good signing with the resources that we have. The poor soul hasn''t even played a game yet. No-one like big Iwan in'' his first season and look at how it all ended.

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I think theres a world of difference between dean richards, who cant get a game for tottenham and is being offered on the cheap and zidane. It''s not about realism, it''s about not settling for less. We are a premier team we should buy premier players. Do we want to finish higher than tottenham, yes, maybe we wont just yet, but that has to be an eventual aim. Why should we take their cast offs. were not a division one club anymore. When theres players who played in euro 2004 still without clubs and available for decent prices and were taking gary doherty something isnt right.

at least one person tell me what doherty offers that we dont already have.

which is not to say come saturday I won''t be cheering him wildly, I will, but Im entitled to my opinion about his worth, and I dont think he has any.

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I remember him getting me loads of points in the Sun Dream Team a few seasons ago, he scores goals as well so ''bring him on''

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Rich,

Do you not think we are trying to temp quality palyers to Carrow Road? Imagine for how many players we sign how many we have been in talks with? there is always going to be stiff competion for good players and financially we have a lot less to offer than other clubs, that''s a fact. So maybe the best we can expect is to sign players from lower leagues, abroad or ones that have fallen down the pecking order at Prem clubs. Obviously we can hope for more, but our expectations should be realistic also. Good luck to Doherty.

Now who was it that saw Henry and Zidane in the Swafham branch of B & Q ?

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to answer your question

"at least one person tell me what doherty offers that we dont already have."

More versatility. More experience. And, I would imagine, more attributes that we are yet to see (given a chance).

Most Premier league teams have good squad players, sounds like a sensible option to me.

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Rich: "Why should we take their cast offs?".

Well we are happy with Man City''s cast off (Hux), AC Milan''s cast-off (Helveg), Bolton''s cast-off (Charlton) and so on!

And Pride of London: "Doherty can defend. He will put his head where it hurts. He won''t shirk a challenge. He will also pop up with the odd goal- I have not seen many better headers of the ball around."

Erm, sounds a bit like Malky then, who is a current full Scotland international is he not!!!

Ama

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I have had enough of this, please can we keep the views on players positive, at least until we have given them a chance, and lets not get arrogant about what we are, we are premier league at the moment ,and I hope to hell it stays that way for a long time but realistically we are competing against teams that spend more on one player than we have ever spent on our entire team, so lets not turn in to Ipswich fans and suddenly think we are elite, lets show the great and the greedy that little clubs don’t have to turn in to pigs to be in the same league, and that with hard work and honesty we can survive and thrive.

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Since when have we ever had to heed the views of Spurs fans? They are the most fickle, spoilt and ignorant set of idiots in football. Their expectations are way way above what is realistic, and they love nothing more than to see one of their players make a mistake, just so they can boo him.

Doherty was a teen prodigy - they paid over a million for him from Luton when he was about 19 or 20, and he certainly has potential, he just needs a change of club to one who''s fans will actually want to see him succeed. Besides, Worthy will get the best out of him.

And as for Spurs cast offs, hmmm..... Culverhouse, Bowen, Polston, Crook - any of those reserve team no-hopers ring any bells?

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Unless he comes through the ranks, every player is someone else''s cast off. We need strength in depth and versatility. We are also now buying players from Spurs and AC Milan rather than Crewe, Watford and Cambridge.

Look at Middlesbrough- they bought good solid players, stabilised in the Prem and are now linked with almost all high profile moves.

Give it time but don''t expect pigs to fly right now.

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Hi

Just came on your board to see the reaction to "The Ginger Pele" Joining your team.
Got to say I find some of you are being really unfair to the fella (I thought we were fickle)
You are getting a player who will give absolutely everything to the cause, A defender with great positional sense, great in the air although not the quickest his passing is fairly good.

Before his broken leg and before the boo boys got on his back , he really was a cracking player (not as a striker though) .
I really hope u lot dont get on his back , give the lad a chance and I''m certain you have got an excellent adittion to your squad, I for one am sorry it didnt work out for him at Spurs, but wish him all the best at Norwich , and hope he can help keep you up........

Good luck Canaries for the season.................John

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Ama, thank god for optimists like you.

If Worthy can transform Doherty the way he transformed Malky then I be well chuffed. Before Worthy became manager I honestly felt Mackay was the worst centre back that I''d ever seen in the yellow shirt. Honestly, I really did. But the way Worthy got Malky to perform by keeping it simple, staying in position and playing as part of a unit was just amazing. A real testament to quality coaching and man management. Remember too that Steeno was just a reserve team player before Worthy took charge.

So if anyone can transform a defender''s career then Worthy can.

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Ama one of the difference between Malky and The ginger pele is that the latter has played the last few years of his career facing the likes of Phillips, Johansen etc whereas Malky has ''only'' faced Div 1 players and difference in quality is enormous. While I have a lot of time for Malkys endeavour i do not think he has the quality to perform to a high enough standard week in week out. Neither may Doherty mind you but he i not as bad as everyone is painting.

Worthy rarely (but occasionally does) picks a wrong un and knows he has to spend every penny wisely - all we can do is wait and see and get behind the bloke.

OTBC

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fair enough I agree to disagree, some good points raised. But again what is it with the regime on this board that thinks that everything worthy does is right, even wenger makes mistakes. this isn''t a fascist regime, worthy can and will make mistakes and this should always be the place to question it. I respect and admire open disagreement with me I just dont think that makes me any the less a fan because I disagree.

as it is here''s why I think this is a bad signing.

A: Better players out there: Traianos Dallas is sitting on the roma bench after a euro 2004 in which he silenced every top european striker he marked, including Henry. He wants to move, to a premier club, why not Norwich. If Bolton can get Okocha then why not us Dallas. It''s got to be worth a try. He won''t cost huge wages and would be an amazing pickup. The limitations we have are apparent, but we on the other hand we arent a struggling division one club like Stoke.

B: Different players out there: Arsenal have campbell, toure, and cygan, chelsea have gallas, terry, ricardo carvalho and robert huth. they are different players with different strengths. malky, fleming, charlton are differing players, adding doherty gives us nothing we dont already have. Which is why dean richards is a much better option, he''s fast and pacy, which we don''t have. Oh marty dean richards looks to be headed to west ham for the season as part of the carrick deal, are west ham a bigger club than us now. Is the first division a better option than the premier.

c: why buy for the sake of buying: I agree we need another defender, but if the options are not out there then why compromise, which is what this deal seems like to me. In all honesty it''s not the biggest pressing problem, where as striker is. malky, fleming, charlton and even helveg could cover it and then maybe re-assess in january, but buying for the sake of it, does not help.

d: premiership experience: does not make a good player. jody craddock and paul butler were the first choice centre backs for sunderland and they got relegated, a year later they got relegated at wolves, both teams had bad defences. coincidence? my point is that these players are not good, but have premiership experience. if we want experience why didnt we go for the likes of petit, that premiership experience chestnut is just rubbish. you need to be a good player as well.

e: he''s a republic of ireland international: ricketts played for england, should we rush out and buy him.

f:cast offs: okay I was wrong with the choice of word cast offs, sometimes cast off can be good. footballers often prove their old club wrong. there is though a world of difference between the players we picked up and doherty. huckerby was let go because he wasnt considered good enough for the premier, helveg because he was too old for prob the best team in europe in ac millan. doherty cant make an average spurs team, which in itself shouldnt be a criticism, but think about it, if bently was an okay player arsenal would have sold him. they loaned him, what does that tell you. same for chelsea and carlton cole. but then I''ll hold my hand up and say clubs can be wrong, I can be wrong, worthy can be wrong. I hope me and spurs are wrong here, I just fear not.

g: just because he''s ex spurs doesn''t make him great: so culverhouse, polston were all ex spurs. so was steffan freund didn''t hear the mad appeal to get him. If he works out well then great, but judge him on his playing, and from what I''ve seen he''s a poor defender with a poor reputation. which is where I''m judging him.

h: I have no h, nor no life if I keep typing away here:)

If all this makes me the evil canary then im not going to lose any sleep over it. I''ll cheer him on saturday and every game, as I do every player.

rich

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Worthy is simply getting 2 players for every position like he said he would. My main corcern is playing Charlton and Fleming, two little guys.

Goalkeepers: (okay so we''ve got three but they''re different, you can''t just put Gary Holt in goal. Although why couldn''t we have kept Chrighton as thrid choice?)

Green
Gallagher
Ward

Right Backs:

Helveg
Edworthy

Big centre half:

Malky
Doherty

Small centre half:

Fleming
Charlton

Left backs:

Drury
Charlton/Brennan

I think Malky should be given a chance in the position he''s made his own over the last three seasons. The defense works as a unit, and Malky''s handly put a foot wrong. He can certainly do a job against the weaker sides (with slower forwards). We shouldn''t dismiss all the players we still have. Hopefully Doherty will offer us something extra but it''s just a case of two for each position and then work out which player earns the call from their work in training and matches.


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rich

I like your points in response. Good debate and I agree with many of the things you say, let''s give the guy a chance and resurrect this after a dozen games or so. Maybe he is similar to what we have already, but maybe he just does it better. Interesting comments from a Spurs fan which belies many of the rumours at the start of the thread.

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After reading some of the messages, i am truly disgusted, by some of the comments. We are not a big team with bundles of cash. Six or seven years ago we nearly didn''t have a club to support. We should be grateful everyday that we can still go to Carrow Road. To be in the Prem i still have to pinch myself, looking on the board advertising the next match, and it says Arsenal, wow, amazing.
A player who gives a 100 percent wants to play for us, what is so bad about this, i for one will not be on his back and will be willing him to do well.
For a club supposedly pulling in the same direction some of our fans need to take a long hard look at themselves.
I remember the season b4 last and listening to some of the fans calling in on Radio Norfolk after a bad result and wanting Worthington out, i was amazed at those comments and suprise suprise no one could back these comments up. This guy deserves every chance, and if we are the fans we say we are, then we need to give him this chance. This guy will want to prove spurs and the doubters wrong. Come on guys lets keep it real, and think before we speak.

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Rich

Most of these points are futile, you can use your reverse argument in many cases, i.e. Lineker played for England, does that means he was good or bad since so did Geoff Thomas! pointless argument. Doherty is still playing for Ireland and has more caps than Geoff Thomas / ricketts, yes? I would imagine there is a link between playing for your country and being any good, generally speaking that is, and not refering to the rare exceptions.

As for Dean Richards, maybe he wants to stay in the capital for personal reasons, as is often the case. And, financially the deal may be worth more to Dean Richards since it is clearly not a straight cash deal, they are part exchanging him for a well respected talent. So, maybe if Norwich had Carrick to swap we may have got Dean Richards? but we don''t, so we haven''t, therefore we keep trying other options, some of which may have included the other players you seem to think would want to come to Norwich. I don''t advocate setting our sights too low but we must have realistic expectations.

As for you disrespecting any player with premiership experience is mindless, yes I could probably name a few less than impressive Prem players but that would be pointless. I actually think Petite would be a bad signing, too old and lazy, my opinion mind!

Anyway I have things to do and a life to lead so maybe I''ll leave it there and look forward to the next futile batch of critisisms of our new signing, personally I wish him all the best and have heard good things about him too, lets dwell on them for the time being?

Anyone got Figo''s tel no.?

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Rich,

I totally agree with your original point. If you dare to question or debate Worthy''s tactics and decisions, some posters immediately want you locked up for treason and the key thrown away. When I''m sat at FCR you''ll never hear me giving a player a hard time; I just cheer and sing along (as best as a 40-something can!) and give 100% support at games (and that will include John Doherty, however good or bad he turns out to be). I disagree with virtually none of NW''s decisions. However, that doesn''t mean that I can''t have opinions on the team and Club, does it? There are some on here that want blind obedience at the shrine of King Worthy at all times - that must make me an "evil Canary", as you put it, as well. They''re probably the same people who complain that supporters in non-Barclay stands don''t sing loud enough, even though those supporters pay good money to come along to support the team each week. NW has done wonders for this Club and we owe him so much as supporters; however, he is only human and fallable, like everyone else in this world. He has made, and will continue to make, the wrong decisions on rare occasions. It is not wrong for people to question his decisions at those times, and it irritates me that the Pink Spectacle Brigade try to bully those people over their opinions. This message board exists for reasoned debate and discussion; if it was only for "yes"-men and women, it would be pretty dull and false.

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I agree with tumbleweed it''s been an interesting debate, I think the only play with the answer is Doherty and I''m sure we all wish him the best when he puts on a Norwich shirt. In fact I really hope he proves me wrong.

onwards and upwards come on the canaries.

rich
:)

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Hi Guys

Am sorry to tell you this, but I''m afraid Doc really is a bad player. He''s not good enough for the Premiership. No question about it. And here''s why...

In 2000, David Pleat (yawn) bought Doc from Luton (Pleat''s old team, mates with chairman etc.) for £1mill. We were told he would come in and challenge for a place alongside Campbell. So in came Doc on the right of a back three and he played ok. He gave his all, he was good in the air (compared to Chris Perry, our only other cb, all 5ft2 of him) and he was young, which we liked cos our average age was about 45.

He played out the season, in and out the team, looked promising, and then scored two important goals, one against the Hammers in the League Cup QF and one against Arsenal in the FA Semi.

So suddenly everyone loved him (as is the way in football).

But then in October of the next season he broke his leg and was out for almost a year.

Since then, he''s been - and there''s no getting away from it - rubbish. It wasn''t until pre-season that he was booed (I know, I''m a regular at the Lane) and it was only in one match, but in that match, Doc managed to be out of position twice in two minutes and we lost the game 2-1 having been 1-0 up. It''s that kind of ridiculous lapses in concentration that frustrate fans so much.

He looks a prem def. Big, strong, good in the air, puts his body on the line. And for half of every game, you think "yeah, he''s doing alright today" and then suddenly he''ll go and muck up and back pass, or fall over, or whatever, and you''ve conceded a goal.

And then he''ll shout at everyone around him, so it looks like he''s focused on the game.

He''s rubbish guys, not what you need at all.

God help you this season.

Oh and when Spurs were at their lowest point, under Hoddle 18 months ago, Sheringham and Doc were up front together. And he''s def not a striker. Prob the worst touch for a forward in the history of prem football.

If you gonna play him anywhere, and I pity you if Worthington does, then at least play him in defence.

God help you all.

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i wholeheartedly agree with LinkNR9.

i''ve supported norwich since 1979. i''ve never left them for ANYONE. and i''ve NEVER lived in england. i''ve probably watched a full norwich match on TV a total of 10 times in 25 years because wherever i''ve lived, we are not covered. i listen to EVERY game on the internet (thank god for the web) and i''ve been called a nutcase, obsessed, a lunatic -- every possible name for someone who is obsessed with a football team. you have NO idea how hard it is to be devoted to a club that''s not covered in the media in a sport where, in most cases, it hasn''t been the #1 sport in the country where i have lived.

i think that earns me the right to express my point of view. and after 25 years of support since the age of 7, i find it a little incredulous that people on this board can complain when there are dissenting views from supporters who are die-hards! we LOVE the club! we WANT it to succeed! we want EVERY player signed by the club to be fantastic for us! but sometimes, we think that NW can make a mistake.

i believe he has done so in Doherty and i hope i am wrong. but to stop the dialogue with repeated calls of "stop the moaning! give the guy a chance" etc etc is insulting to the level of passion and intellect we all put into watching the sport and making opinions about every team and every player.

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If he is good enough for Worthy, he is good enough for me! Just hope that if we do sign him, he will not be put in the team for a week or two until he has a chance to settle. How often do you see new signings at clubs have an immediate impact? Give the lad a chance and what matters if he looks like an 82 bus as long as is strong enough to stop one!

OTBC

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I know that Worthy makes mistakes (like brining on Edworthy in midfirld on Saturday) but I think that Docherty will turn out to be a good decision. He has a way of getting the best out of players who have suffered from a lack of confidence.

Also we have no choice but to buy players who have either failed at a top flight club or are unproven at the level where we are now (mind you even those players are very expensive). I reckon Docherty is a better player than Primus aswell.

ps, nycanary, your post put a tear in my eye and a lump in my throat. Have you ever made it over to Carrow Road?

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It''s clear from reading the posts on this thread that opinions seem pretty polarised as to whether this is a good signing or not and we have all been allowed to express which camp we fall into at the moment, apart from the few who are sitting on the fence right now, and that''s also their entitlement of course.. I don''t have any doubt that if/when Gary Doherty pulls on the yellow and green that we will all give him every encouragement and we''ll be hoping that he can put what must have been a difficult time at Spurs behind him and rediscover his pre-injury form for us. Worthy obviously sees something in him and he hasn''t often been proved a poor judge in the past; however, if time proves him wrong in this instance then I''m sure a lot of us will be quick to admit it, myself included as I think he could turn out to be a shrewd buy. If he does sign tomorrow there''ll certainly be a pretty stern test waiting for him on Saturday. Nothing like the deep end, hey?!

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no reason to say this but my gut feeling is that Doc will make us all eat our words. Worthy is no fool, Doc is not as bad as he is painted, with enthusiasm, a frssh start and confidence he might just be a new creation in waiting. Just look at how Ekoku and Sheron blossomed on leaving us!!!!

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there are so many messages on this subject but tumbleweeds says it all

after all what does anyone who supports spurs know about football?

he he, the biggest lot of arrogant gits ever, and that includes the mancs!

i am prepared to give the lad a chance, poor guy, how can anyone slap him down b4 he has even kicked a ball - come on, this man is going to pull on OUR shirt, and play for our wonderful club

chill out and believe in nige, let''s face it, he has bought in some cracking players in the past, i have every confidence in docherty, and want to see him in action b4 i judge him one way or the other

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What do we know about football?

Well we know that, whilst we might come across as arrogant, it''s only cos we constantly crave success. we want the best, we demand the best, and when we have to put up week after week with the shite that players like Doc produces, whilst paying the extortionate fees that we do, then we have every right to be pissed off.

FINALLY, however, we have a decent management in place. We have a new DOF, a new Manager, two new first team coaches, a new medical staff and seven new first team players. We are about to sign Nice RB Noe Pamarot to replace Carr, Michael Carrick as back up CM and Kily Gonzalez on a season''s loan to solve our LW problem.

We have a top strike force of Defoe, Keane and Kanoute.

We have a host of young british and irish players and propects... King, Gardner, Robinson, Defoe, Davis, Davies, Keane, Ricketts.

We''ve cleared out some shite... Anderton, Poyet, Ziege, Postiga, Doc.
We''ve still got some left... Bunje, Richards, Redknapp, Jackson.

But all in all, this season (i know it''s an old Spurs cliche) looks more promising than anything since the 1995 Klinsmann and Sheringham era.

And whilst you slate Spurs fans, we''ve been loyal throughout the last 15 years of rubbish. We''ve stuck by the club no matter what. And when a small portion of the crowd boo Doherty in a pre-season friendly against Cagliari (not that I agree with it), I don''t think it gives you lot the right to slag us off and call us arrogant fans who know nothing.

Our club is aiming for Europe, you''re aiming to stay up.

Good luck to you, but the difference is there for all to see.

That and the fact that you just paid us nearly a million quid for an irish donkey.

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One thing in dohertys favour is that he has been playing in a team low on confidence under a manager in Pleat who is incapable of instilling confidence in himself let alone his players. That plus the fact that even in better days Spurs never have known how to defend properly. If I''m honest I have my doubts as to whether he will prove a good signing but I would be delighted to be proved wrong and we should at least give him a chance.

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