Let's be brutally honest

[vos 155]

I personally do not think we are any better than 12 months ago. We have already failed to beat some very very mediocre teams and in most games so far we have never looked like scoring. OK the players pulled themselves together upon Roeder''s arrival last year to avoid relegation - just.

However with his persistent team changes which in most cases defy basic logic I already think he has lost the plot and support of several players. He clearly has his favourites and won''t be moved. Pattison and Fotheringham appear to be first on the team sheet although many pollsters don''t rate them for this Division. Week after week we see players instructed to play in unfamiliar positions.At the moment we do not have anything approaching a settled team.

Most worrying is the lack of skill and quality throughout the team. This showed up last week when Drury after a long lay off looked a class above the rest of the team and then is dropped. Hoolhan is a footballer compared with the rest of the midfielders but on most occasions cannot find space to play a bit because the so called ball winners in turn never give him a decent pass - as was the case with Huckerby. I can see no improvement in skill in any position or player since Roeder arrived. In the second half against Sheff Utd a lot of our play revolved around passing the ball back to Marshall and he hoofed it high in the air.

I am afraid it begins to look like another grim season.

[CDMullins 436]

Cant comment on Clingan becuase i havnt seen him But...

 

Our midfield saturday was awful, i honestly dont think one of our midfielders would have got in the Barnsley side. We have nothing ''about us'' no creativity, no bite, no passion. 

 

Barnsley a suppsodly poor side had us chasing shadows and without creating many chances, stroked the ball about very well

[Paul Spector 0]

I totally disagree. We are a far superior team than 12 months ago. IMO you are completely wrong.

[CDMullins 436]

I think we are in a better position than 12 months ago, much better squad and i have faith in Glenn (Though i would question some of the decisions he made on saturday)

 

6th would be a freat season, but i cant see that, more like 12th, juts above the scum

[They need to EARN the right to play us 0]

[quote user="WeWantWorthyBack"]I totally disagree. We are a far superior team than 12 months ago. IMO you are completely wrong.[/quote]100% correct. The original post is drivel.

[GJP 79]

[quote user="WeWantWorthyBack"]I totally disagree. We are a far superior team than 12 months ago. IMO you are completely wrong.[/quote]

We''re a bit better, definitely. But not "far superior".

A couple of good strikers and we might be. If we ever get them. We''ve needed them for months and it hasn''t been sorted.

 

[xxxx 0]

The original post is spot on , its another battle against the drop this season , we dont have a striker at the club and never look like scoring ,  our few permanent players get left out however they play to allow Roeder to play his beloved loanees . The whole club is in a total mess and as for finishing above Ipswich , some of you need to start living in the real world , they have been beating us easily for the last few years and with the squad they have i dont see that changing this season . We are more on a par with the likes of Blackpool nowadays and i would not bet to much on us finishing above them .

[John Boubepo 0]

[quote user="vos"]

I personally do not think we are any better than 12 months ago. We have already failed to beat some very very mediocre teams and in most games so far we have never looked like scoring. OK the players pulled themselves together upon Roeder''s arrival last year to avoid relegation - just.

However with his persistent team changes which in most cases defy basic logic I already think he has lost the plot and support of several players. He clearly has his favourites and won''t be moved. Pattison and Fotheringham appear to be first on the team sheet although many pollsters don''t rate them for this Division. Week after week we see players instructed to play in unfamiliar positions.At the moment we do not have anything approaching a settled team.

Most worrying is the lack of skill and quality throughout the team. This showed up last week when Drury after a long lay off looked a class above the rest of the team and then is dropped. Hoolhan is a footballer compared with the rest of the midfielders but on most occasions cannot find space to play a bit because the so called ball winners in turn never give him a decent pass - as was the case with Huckerby. I can see no improvement in skill in any position or player since Roeder arrived. In the second half against Sheff Utd a lot of our play revolved around passing the ball back to Marshall and he hoofed it high in the air.

I am afraid it begins to look like another grim season.

[/quote]Totally agree - as I''ve said before - the more GR tinkers the worse we get! the only decent string of results he''s put together, was when he was forced to play the bulk of Grants squad in the positions they were supposed to play, that was almost 12 months ago when he first took over.In his [GR''s] defence the squad does look slightly stronger on paper, however results indicate no improvement whatsoever, other than  45 mins against Birmingham, performances are as dire ever!

[NorwichRat 4]

[quote user="vos"]

I personally do not think we are any better than 12 months ago. We have already failed to beat some very very mediocre teams and in most games so far we have never looked like scoring. OK the players pulled themselves together upon Roeder''s arrival last year to avoid relegation - just.

However with his persistent team changes which in most cases defy basic logic I already think he has lost the plot and support of several players. He clearly has his favourites and won''t be moved. Pattison and Fotheringham appear to be first on the team sheet although many pollsters don''t rate them for this Division. Week after week we see players instructed to play in unfamiliar positions.At the moment we do not have anything approaching a settled team.

Most worrying is the lack of skill and quality throughout the team. This showed up last week when Drury after a long lay off looked a class above the rest of the team and then is dropped. Hoolhan is a footballer compared with the rest of the midfielders but on most occasions cannot find space to play a bit because the so called ball winners in turn never give him a decent pass - as was the case with Huckerby. I can see no improvement in skill in any position or player since Roeder arrived. In the second half against Sheff Utd a lot of our play revolved around passing the ball back to Marshall and he hoofed it high in the air.

I am afraid it begins to look like another grim season.

[/quote]

 

You and others here are totally wrong. You have no idea about creating a team and the time it takes for that team to starte to be consistant.

Any new teas needs AT LEAST 10 games for it to show what it is capable of. We hae had glimpses and that makes me optimistic cause we will get bette.

We are in such better shape that last year  go post your crap on a binners site. 

[ricky knight 0]

[quote user="NorwichRat"][quote user="vos"]

I personally do not think we are any better than 12 months ago. We have already failed to beat some very very mediocre teams and in most games so far we have never looked like scoring. OK the players pulled themselves together upon Roeder''s arrival last year to avoid relegation - just.

However with his persistent team changes which in most cases defy basic logic I already think he has lost the plot and support of several players. He clearly has his favourites and won''t be moved. Pattison and Fotheringham appear to be first on the team sheet although many pollsters don''t rate them for this Division. Week after week we see players instructed to play in unfamiliar positions.At the moment we do not have anything approaching a settled team.

Most worrying is the lack of skill and quality throughout the team. This showed up last week when Drury after a long lay off looked a class above the rest of the team and then is dropped. Hoolhan is a footballer compared with the rest of the midfielders but on most occasions cannot find space to play a bit because the so called ball winners in turn never give him a decent pass - as was the case with Huckerby. I can see no improvement in skill in any position or player since Roeder arrived. In the second half against Sheff Utd a lot of our play revolved around passing the ball back to Marshall and he hoofed it high in the air.

I am afraid it begins to look like another grim season.

[/quote]

 

You and others here are totally wrong. You have no idea about creating a team and the time it takes for that team to starte to be consistant.

Any new teas needs AT LEAST 10 games for it to show what it is capable of. We hae had glimpses and that makes me optimistic cause we will get bette.

We are in such better shape that last year  go post your crap on a binners site. 

[/quote]

 

your should post in lah lah land mate. why are people always binners if they dont tow the percys party line,

[king canary 7,578]

Ah Ricky do you ever make a post without the word Percy in it? Just because a few of us can look at things with realism (Ie after the massive changes last season play offs would be incredible) and realise that patience is in order before jumping on the teams back, we are Percy''s? Well your a nancy negative nuh nuh nuh, I''m off to draw with Crayons on Fozzy''s face.

[ricky knight 0]

[quote user="king canary"]Ah Ricky do you ever make a post without the word Percy in it? Just because a few of us can look at things with realism (Ie after the massive changes last season play offs would be incredible) and realise that patience is in order before jumping on the teams back, we are Percy''s? Well your a nancy negative nuh nuh nuh, I''m off to draw with Crayons on Fozzy''s face.[/quote]

i use percy as much as you lot call us binners, anyone who dares criticise in anyway, i would suggest thats very childish, so i am going to draw a beard on delia, shxt she already has one.

[king canary 7,578]

You lot? To be honest Ricky I have never called anyone a Binner thats generally Mr Wright. You are perfectly allowed to criticise of course Ricky, but just because some of us are positive doesnt mean we are some form of deluded ''percy.''

[BlyBlyBabes 0]

[quote user="WeWantWorthyBack"]I totally disagree. We are a far superior team than 12 months ago. IMO you are completely wrong.[/quote]

A remarkably well argued response.

Well done.

You are to be congratulated for raising the quality of debate on this thread.

OTBC

 

[Delias Tasty Nibblets 0]

sod it were two points off the playoffs, id settle for that with one game of the season still to play, whats everyone moaning about? if we''d won on sat people would be wetting themselves with excitement.

[Barry Brockes 145]

But we didn''t win on Saturday and but for a shocking penalty miss would have been beaten by a team who will end up in the bottom six this season. We don''t have anything like sufficient creativity or goalscoring ability in the present squad to do anything other than struggle for wins. And why? Because those type of players cost good money which we clearly don''t have. Yes, we have played well in some games this season, particularly against Birmingham, but we didn''t beat them and the league table tells its own story. We have arguably the best goalkeeper in this division and a solid back four which should keep the goals against column down. But midfield and attack, forget it. No more than lower average championship at best. Ten points after eight games would see us with between 55 and 60 points by the end of the season if we continue as we are and that seems about right to me. It is not the stuff play-off dreams are made of. That would make us a marginally better team than last year but most certainly not vastly superior.  

[Lincs CR 0]

I''m worried that half the fans seem to think Glenn''s 3 year plan is scheduled over 2 years... it''s quite clear he realistically is aiming for a top half finish, so why are so many expecting a play off campaign at the very least, it is totally unrealistic.

I''ve seen people say "Mid-table mediocrity" on here, a mid table position around 10th-12th is a good season for us, look at the rot we''ve been in the past 2 seasons, anywhere near 10th is a good season in my eyes.

I don''t think the team has played poorly at all, the STRIKERS have played poorly because they''ve been given so many scoring opportunities so far this season and failed to put them away... as for the conceding we''ve not conceded bucket loads.

Home goals conceded - 3

Away goals conceded - 5

8 goals conceded so far is better defensive stats than Reading, QPR and only one goal worse off than Wolves who are flying this season. So for those saying our defense looks poor once again you are totally wrong, but those saying our strikers are letting the team down... spot on I''m afraid...

[Graham Humphrey 13]

Thing is though, although we created lots of chances in the first four or five games, the last three we haven''t created much at all. The midfield hasn''t been creative enough.

[lucky green trainers 0]

[quote user="Graham Humphrey"]Thing is though, although we created lots of chances in the first four or five games, the last three we haven''t created much at all. The midfield hasn''t been creative enough.[/quote]agreed GH - injury crisis??? - wot injury crisis!!! - unfortunately for roedy - clinkers shoulder knock has started a trend.  the last 3 games have shown that although decent loans were made, the injury records of steffs, kennedy and lupes we''ren''t the best - and true to form, all 3 have missed games now - and how long until sibs picks up a knock???  having said that, roedy has managed to shuffle the pack in difficult circumstances (maybe too much) but to be fair - we''ve kept 2 clean sheets...nuff said - probably?!?as for midfield, fozzy doesn''t look the same player so far - last pre-season he worked hard and got super-fit, he probably needed a good rest this summer and hasn''t got back to those same levels??? i dunno...certainly, rusty looks like a player still recovering from a double hernia op - while matty patty looks to be carrying a niggle,  and so yeah - we''re not dominating the midfield like we should be.up front, with lupes half fit/out - we''ve no convincing plan ''b''s to replace him -  curo looks legless and league 1, and aside from playing rusty upfront to partner an increasingly desparate looking sibs - thats it...we don''t look to have a goal in us!!!i''ve yet to see a reserve player capable of making the champs grade - so thats it - we have to go with what we''ve got - clearly we''re skint...so all in all, and in these difficult circumstances, i suppose 2 clean sheets - i goal conceeded - i win, draw,1 loss, 4 points from 9 isn''t too bad???less than convincing perfromances - agreed - but the boys have kept battling and ground out some points...lets face it - if morale was rock-bottom, then to lose key players and have some carrying niggles could be an excuse for the team to roll over - they haven''t so thats at least some credit for roedy and clark...but, to be brutally honest - no one knows whats gonna happen in jan yet - if buyers don''t come in with fresh dosh - it could be nasty - so until the finance is there with new investors on board - i''m just happy for NCFC to stay in this league - with the turners bailing out, this is clearly a transition season for city...accordingly, my expectations are low...but sure - the intl break is happening at the right time - hopefully clinkers and bell and the other boys will get back to good fitness, and we can start again...at the mo, i think 2 draws until then would be acceptable...but hopefully lupes can play 30 mins tues nite and we can snatch a win at soton,,,derby are starting to motor now///

[Regime Change 0]

[quote user="NorwichRat"][quote user="vos"]

I personally do not think we are any better than 12 months ago. We have already failed to beat some very very mediocre teams and in most games so far we have never looked like scoring. OK the players pulled themselves together upon Roeder''s arrival last year to avoid relegation - just.

However with his persistent team changes which in most cases defy basic logic I already think he has lost the plot and support of several players. He clearly has his favourites and won''t be moved. Pattison and Fotheringham appear to be first on the team sheet although many pollsters don''t rate them for this Division. Week after week we see players instructed to play in unfamiliar positions.At the moment we do not have anything approaching a settled team.

Most worrying is the lack of skill and quality throughout the team. This showed up last week when Drury after a long lay off looked a class above the rest of the team and then is dropped. Hoolhan is a footballer compared with the rest of the midfielders but on most occasions cannot find space to play a bit because the so called ball winners in turn never give him a decent pass - as was the case with Huckerby. I can see no improvement in skill in any position or player since Roeder arrived. In the second half against Sheff Utd a lot of our play revolved around passing the ball back to Marshall and he hoofed it high in the air.

I am afraid it begins to look like another grim season.

[/quote]

 

You and others here are totally wrong. You have no idea about creating a team and the time it takes for that team to starte to be consistant.

Any new teas needs AT LEAST 10 games for it to show what it is capable of. We hae had glimpses and that makes me optimistic cause we will get bette.

We are in such better shape that last year  go post your crap on a binners site. 

[/quote]

Not wanting to be pedantic, but haven''t we now played 8 league games, 1 league cup match, plus pre-season.  I didn''t pass GCSE Maths but I''m guessing that''s more than 10 games.

[Mister Chops 7]

[quote user="vos"]

I personally do not think we are any better than 12 months ago.

[/quote]Norwich City v QPR, 8th October 2007Norwich: Marshall, Otsemobor, Shackell, Dublin

(Murray 46), Drury, Croft, Russell, Jarvis, Lappin (Strihavka 63),

Martin (Brown 76), Huckerby.Subs Not Used: Gilks, Chadwick.

Norwich City v Sheffield United, 20th September 2008

Norwich: Marshall, Otsemobor, Grounds, Omozusi, Drury (Hoolahan

68), Croft, Fotheringham, Pattison (Lupoli 25, (Cureton 65)), Bertrand,

Sibierski, Russell. Subs Not Used: Nelson, Archibald-Henville.

I think we are.

[Beauseant 0]

I think the jury''s still out on how good we are,or can be, but I certainly feel we are better than at this stage last year,at least in terms of quality.My worries are:

a Lupoli''s overall fitness.He has still to complete a game.

b The lack of a playmaker.

c The lack of cover upfront.Rusty is no more than a fill in striker,and its a double whammy if he plays there,because he and Clingan are without doubt our best central midfield pairing.

I hope that point a resolves itself, and believe that Bell may solve point b. Point c will hinge on the loan market or cash coming in before January.At this stage I can''t see much more than upper part of mid table,but I can envisage a situation where it all clicks and we go on a run if everyone gets and stays fit.

[ricky knight 0]

[quote user="king canary"]

You lot? To be honest Ricky I have never called anyone a Binner thats generally Mr Wright. You are perfectly allowed to criticise of course Ricky, but just because some of us are positive doesnt mean we are some form of deluded ''percy.''

[/quote]

how people can see any positives in a 0-0 draw with the mighty barnsley is beyond me, thats thanks to a penalty save at that. it must be a generation thing, its the scraping of the barrel for excuses for bad performances i find cringeworthy.

[ROBFLECK 132]

Brutally honestly...

The players that really want to play for us are the ones with a permanent deal... The loannees will do their best, but their heads are not with NCFC, they want to get back to PL.

Our team is not going to get them there.

[Beauseant 0]

[quote user="ROBFLECK"]

Brutally honestly...

The players that really want to play for us are the ones with a permanent deal... The loannees will do their best, but their heads are not with NCFC, they want to get back to PL.

Our team is not going to get them there.

[/quote]

 

Absolute nonsense.Does Kennedy, strike you as someone who isn''t fully committed,or Bertrand? These players have every incentive to do well as GR''s report back to their clubs could have a huge bearing on their future.

[Syteanric 1]

[quote user="Beauseant"][quote user="ROBFLECK"]

Brutally honestly...

The players that really want to play for us are the ones with a permanent deal... The loannees will do their best, but their heads are not with NCFC, they want to get back to PL.

Our team is not going to get them there.

[/quote]

 

Absolute nonsense.Does Kennedy, strike you as someone who isn''t fully committed,or Bertrand? These players have every incentive to do well as GR''s report back to their clubs could have a huge bearing on their future.

[/quote]

Agreed Beausent! even if the player has no future at his club.. doing their best on loan is vital to them... when you on loan your technically in "the Shop window".. scouts from all sorts of clubs must go to games and are always on the look out... if a player peforms well on loan than rather than going back and sitting on his arris on the bench for the reserves... he could be snapped up by another team and get 1st team football.

 If i was a player on loan i''d be giving my all every game.. the club im with might stump up for me, i might do well enough to force my own managers hand at my parent club.. or the reason above might come into play...

the Loan system is a useful tool for player and club...

I guess it depends on the players attitude at the end of the day though.

jas :)

[ROBFLECK 132]

[quote user="jas the barclay king"][quote user="Beauseant"][quote user="ROBFLECK"]

Brutally honestly...

The players that really want to play for us are the ones with a permanent deal... The loannees will do their best, but their heads are not with NCFC, they want to get back to PL.

Our team is not going to get them there.

[/quote]

 

Absolute nonsense.Does Kennedy, strike you as someone who isn''t fully committed,or Bertrand? These players have every incentive to do well as GR''s report back to their clubs could have a huge bearing on their future.

[/quote]

 

I didn''t say they were crap or not doing their best! Off course they are, incentive is first team foorball in PL.

Agreed Beausent! even if the player has no future at his club.. doing their best on loan is vital to them... when you on loan your technically in "the Shop window".. scouts from all sorts of clubs must go to games and are always on the look out... if a player peforms well on loan than rather than going back and sitting on his arris on the bench for the reserves... he could be snapped up by another team and get 1st team football.

 If i was a player on loan i''d be giving my all every game.. the club im with might stump up for me, i might do well enough to force my own managers hand at my parent club.. or the reason above might come into play...

the Loan system is a useful tool for player and club...

I guess it depends on the players attitude at the end of the day though.

jas :)

[/quote]

I didn''t say they were crap or not doing their best! Off course they are, incentive is first team foorball in PL.

[My spoon is too big! 21]

Have you compared our current points tally with that of 12 months ago? Back then we were 21st with 7 points and it took us until the 24th of November to break into double figures.

I don''t think your argument stands up to scrutiny. The team has had a bad couple of games, but we''ve started stronger than we did last season. Even if we don''t get to the playoffs this season, I we won''t be flirting with relegation.

[Yellowbeagle 0]

NorwichRat wrote the following post at 29/09/2008 12:34 AM:

You and others here are totally wrong. You have no idea about creating a team and the time it takes for that team to starte to be consistant.

Any new teas needs AT LEAST 10 games for it to show what it is capable of. We hae had glimpses and that makes me optimistic cause we will get bette.

We are in such better shape that last year  go post your crap on a binners site. 

 

God i hate idiots like this berk who accuse everyone of being a binner (probably a closet Binner himself), who doesnt agree with his own ideas. Probably got most of his ideas about creating a team playing Championship Manager on his PC.

If we are going to wait for 10 games for the loan players to gell, then another 10 games for the new loan players to gell in January then at least we''ll be consistent for the remaining 26 matches. We are a little bit better than last year, but will probably be midtable and safe from relegation. I''m hoping they will surprise me with a playoff push but just dont feel they will.

[king canary 7,578]

[quote user="ricky knight"][quote user="king canary"]

You lot? To be honest Ricky I have never called anyone a Binner thats generally Mr Wright. You are perfectly allowed to criticise of course Ricky, but just because some of us are positive doesnt mean we are some form of deluded ''percy.''

[/quote]

how people can see any positives in a 0-0 draw with the mighty barnsley is beyond me, thats thanks to a penalty save at that. it must be a generation thing, its the scraping of the barrel for excuses for bad performances i find cringeworthy.

[/quote]

This thread is not about the Barnsley match, its about saying we are as bad as we were last year, which many people disagree with. From what I have seen this season I believe we are quite alot better than last season. Sure a 0-0 draw with Barnsley is not a stunning result but at this point in the season I believe we wont be in a relegation battle, but dont expect play offs either.