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Pete Raven

MAN IN THE STANDS - It's the hope that kills you

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[quote user="jas the barclay king"]

Brilliant article from "the man"....

thanks for pointing it out Pete

jas :)

[/quote]

Yep, totally agree. He''s always able to sum up fan feelings very well.

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Utter tosh and Archant Spin.

Comment on the "behaviour" of the club - note this is from an anonymous hack:

"But the impression I get is that Cullum has been chased out of Norfolk, with the Stowmarket Two and Neil Doncaster gloriously waving their pitch-forks behind him. Now, before I get shot down for daring to question the judgement of Ayatollah Delia, let me restate that I would still choose them over Cullum, as things stand.

But what is clear is that there is an almost unhealthy fundamentalism that surrounds the Stowmarket Two, which brands anyone an infidel for questioning their judgement.

One of their supporters, an experienced national sports journalist, even said he did not need to speak to Peter Cullum to know whether he was right for Norwich, because Delia would instinctively work out what''s best for the club. Holy moly!

This is the woman, and board, who appointed Bryan Hamilton and Peter Grant…everyone makes mistakes, it is not being disloyal or ungrateful to question the actions of our current regime, even though they don''t take criticism very well. They may think they are always acting in the “best interests of the football club”; but we have a duty to question that sometimes. "

Then has the gall to say
"And to this end, a certain amount of mud has been slung Cullum''s way since the talks were “officially” cancelled - miraculously emerging on message-boards and in reports."

And the first part is not raking out an industrial size muckspreader? have you such rose tinted glasses on that you cannot see the amount of balderdash and piffle that has been slung around by the "Peter Cullum is god brigade"

If you are a journalist who has the ear of Peter Cullum get us some facts will you - as you have had an interview with Peter Cullum surely you can at least follow it up!

Just admit is you are upset because another "national journo" has been credited with your scoop!

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This is exactly how i feel and have thus far not chosen to express it. There has been a lot of knee jerk reactions of late but i cant blame Delia for not wanting to walk away from a club she has put money into (which no one can deny) with nothing. I don''t think that would be right.

What i hate about this is the way that the two have had their bluff called and they have been found badly out and made to look like liars. If they are or not we don’t know because of the air of secrecy that seems to surround the club. From what they have said in the past about stepping aside and the way they have seemed extremely reluctant to speak to THE richest supporter in the world of NCFC has damaged them beyond repair. She now appears to be some mad old power crazy bat to be honest.

My support has waned badly for them and the board over the past few weeks, their conduct in the whole affair has been shocking.

At the very least they need to come out and explain themselves fully and honestly, though I fear this will now not be enough. One wonders if we shall see the return of the wall of speakers in the Barclay/south stand corner as per the final last weeks of RC?

As a life long supporter of the club I would not be unhappy for them to step aside.

 

 

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[quote user="gfresh"]

This is exactly how i feel and have thus far not chosen to express it.

[/quote]

Are you trying to tell us you are in fact the Man, gfresh? [Y][:)]

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Nope tis not me for i am not he![;)]

No really it just made a alot of sense and i would have written something not dissimilar to that. But, if im honest, I couldnt be bothered to write it!

It is more how they have handled this whole situation more than anything that leaves a very bitter taste in my mouth. In their shoes i wouldn''t have accepted either but what i would have done was at least try to explain myself to the fans and why.

Living in London i can''t wait for the Q&A session!

 

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Nope tis not me for i am not he![;)]

No really it just made a alot of sense and i would have written something not dissimilar to that. But, if im honest, I couldnt be bothered to write it!

It is more how they have handled this whole situation more than anything that leaves a very bitter taste in my mouth. In their shoes i wouldn''t have accepted either but what i would have done was at least try to explain myself to the fans and why.

Living in London i can''t wait for the Q&A session!

 

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[quote user="gfresh"]

 

Living in London i can''t wait for the Q&A session!

 

[/quote]

it will be stage managed crap and they will probably want to know your question in advance.. if you a "dissenter" you will not be allowe to have your say.

jas :)

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[quote user="jas the barclay king"][quote user="gfresh"]

 

Living in London i can''t wait for the Q&A session!

 

[/quote]

it will be stage managed crap and they will probably want to know your question in advance.. if you a "dissenter" you will not be allowe to have your say.

jas :)

[/quote]

Maybe it is, maybe it isnt but if the dissenter''s don''t go then we all lose out. I will make it and hopefully others will do as well and make sure that views are put to em.

You can only but try and hope.

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[quote user="jas the barclay king"][quote user="gfresh"]

 

Living in London i can''t wait for the Q&A session!

 

[/quote]

it will be stage managed crap and they will probably want to know your question in advance.. if you a "dissenter" you will not be allowe to have your say.

jas :)

[/quote]

There will be a number of questions taken in advance, but once these are answered it will be a totally open forum. I''m sure however that one of the early questions, and most probably the first question, will be based upon the whole NCFC v Cullum situation. Once the formal Q&A session is over, the board are normally available for the next 30 minutes or so to take individual questions.

 

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[quote user="sxcanaree"]



One of their supporters, an experienced national sports journalist, even said he did not need to speak to Peter Cullum to know whether he was right for Norwich, because Delia would instinctively work out what''s best for the club. Holy moly!

This is the woman, and board, who appointed Bryan Hamilton and Peter Grant…everyone makes mistakes, it is not being disloyal or ungrateful to question the actions of our current regime, even though they don''t take criticism very well. They may think they are always acting in the “best interests of the football club”; but we have a duty to question that sometimes. "

Just admit is you are upset because another "national journo" has been credited with your scoop!

[/quote]

Mick Dennis is who this is aimed at.  And Mr Dennis''s article was a total utter embarrassment.  You have got a bit irate by this article.  It reflects my views perfectly.

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[quote user="jas the barclay king"][quote user="gfresh"]

 

Living in London i can''t wait for the Q&A session!

 

[/quote]

it will be stage managed crap and they will probably want to know your question in advance.. if you a "dissenter" you will not be allowe to have your say.

jas :)

[/quote]

 

Jas

The forum will be organised by the Caps and not in any way by the club. Yes questions will be managed to prevent a free-for all and we do normally ask people who really want to ask a question to let us know in advance but last years Q & A sessions was one of the best we have ever had and ND and co certainly were not given an easy ride. Anyone who wanted to ask a question was able to do so. There are quite a few in the Caps who are more than prepared to let the club know what they think on a variety of subjects and there will certainly be plenty of us there who will be keen to ask about the whole Cullum affair.

Jim

 

 

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MITS'' article seems exceptionally confused to me, CJF. He claims he''d rather see Delia in charge than Cullum, then calls her an Ayatollah. Given that he has actually spoken to Cullum, his article does absolutely nothing to clarify the situation for the fans. A quite shockingly poor piece of writing just when we need archant to tell us what''s going on.I normally have little time for Dennis, but I actually liked his piece. Whether you agree with his stance or not, it was clearly argued and asked some interesting questions. Actually there''s some quite good stuff on MFW at the moment.I have no idea what the true story is, and can''t believe that Delia hasn''t made some kind of statement to stem the tide of popular opinion against her. But I am also pretty disappointed in how this has been reported by Archant, who seem to have become little more than Cullum''s PR department. Any chance of some investigative journalism?

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[quote user="sxcanaree"]

Utter tosh and Archant Spin.

Comment on the "behaviour" of the club - note this is from an anonymous hack:

"But the impression I get is that Cullum has been chased out of Norfolk, with the Stowmarket Two and Neil Doncaster gloriously waving their pitch-forks behind him. Now, before I get shot down for daring to question the judgement of Ayatollah Delia, let me restate that I would still choose them over Cullum, as things stand.

But what is clear is that there is an almost unhealthy fundamentalism that surrounds the Stowmarket Two, which brands anyone an infidel for questioning their judgement.

One of their supporters, an experienced national sports journalist, even said he did not need to speak to Peter Cullum to know whether he was right for Norwich, because Delia would instinctively work out what''s best for the club. Holy moly!

This is the woman, and board, who appointed Bryan Hamilton and Peter Grant…everyone makes mistakes, it is not being disloyal or ungrateful to question the actions of our current regime, even though they don''t take criticism very well. They may think they are always acting in the “best interests of the football club”; but we have a duty to question that sometimes. "

Then has the gall to say
"And to this end, a certain amount of mud has been slung Cullum''s way since the talks were “officially” cancelled - miraculously emerging on message-boards and in reports."

And the first part is not raking out an industrial size muckspreader? have you such rose tinted glasses on that you cannot see the amount of balderdash and piffle that has been slung around by the "Peter Cullum is god brigade"

If you are a journalist who has the ear of Peter Cullum get us some facts will you - as you have had an interview with Peter Cullum surely you can at least follow it up!

Just admit is you are upset because another "national journo" has been credited with your scoop!

[/quote]

Are you ever going to give it a rest?

I have never before come across such a know-all who thinks he''s such an expert on all things media when in actual fact you appear to be a fairly run-of-the-mill freelance hack.

If you really don''t like Archant, don''t waste your time coming on to this Archant board. There are plenty of other sites where I am sure you would be most welcome.

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Think he is always a great read. He is the one person on here or any other NCFC site that I go out of my way to read.Think he has added another nail to the Delia coffin although I cant understand him stating he would still prefer this awful excuse for a board than Cullum. They are an utter shambles and have done nothing that has pleased me for a long long while.His thread is clearly Pro Cullum but I suppose he does not want to lose the Delia Worship brigade as readers. I think he has made his true feelings clear enough though. Well done the Man another great read.[:D]

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[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]MITS'' article seems exceptionally confused to me, CJF. He claims he''d rather see Delia in charge than Cullum, then calls her an Ayatollah. Given that he has actually spoken to Cullum, his article does absolutely nothing to clarify the situation for the fans. A quite shockingly poor piece of writing just when we need archant to tell us what''s going on.

I normally have little time for Dennis, but I actually liked his piece. Whether you agree with his stance or not, it was clearly argued and asked some interesting questions. Actually there''s some quite good stuff on MFW at the moment.

I have no idea what the true story is, and can''t believe that Delia hasn''t made some kind of statement to stem the tide of popular opinion against her. But I am also pretty disappointed in how this has been reported by Archant, who seem to have become little more than Cullum''s PR department. Any chance of some investigative journalism?
[/quote]

Re the last para you could say exactly the same about MFW if you ask me because all Waghorn has been doing is seeking to foster his links with the club so as to preserve his access to future information. He has not asked any searching questions either.

The MITs piece seems to be quite clear to me. He is saying that Cullum needs to show more of his hand before he would back him over Delia and MWJ but that the fact Cullum has found it so hard and his approaches have been greeted with such hostility is a bit worrying from a board who claim to be actively seeking investment. I think a lot of fans probably fall into that camp.

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[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]MITS'' article seems exceptionally confused to me, CJF. He claims he''d rather see Delia in charge than Cullum, then calls her an Ayatollah. Given that he has actually spoken to Cullum, his article does absolutely nothing to clarify the situation for the fans. A quite shockingly poor piece of writing just when we need archant to tell us what''s going on.

I normally have little time for Dennis, but I actually liked his piece. Whether you agree with his stance or not, it was clearly argued and asked some interesting questions. Actually there''s some quite good stuff on MFW at the moment.

I have no idea what the true story is, and can''t believe that Delia hasn''t made some kind of statement to stem the tide of popular opinion against her. But I am also pretty disappointed in how this has been reported by Archant, who seem to have become little more than Cullum''s PR department. Any chance of some investigative journalism?
[/quote]

As for Dennis''s article

http://norwichcity.myfootballwriter.com/full_article.asp?i=3688

I am really sorry but most of it sucks big time.  Questioning why he hasnt invested before?  This could be labelled at anybody who wanted to get into the club? Saying De.lia must be right?  pathetic?  But this is the guy who never thought Worthington should have gone... Says it all really.

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[quote user="Jim Smith"]

Re the last para you could say exactly the same about MFW if you ask me because all Waghorn has been doing is seeking to foster his links with the club so as to preserve his access to future information. He has not asked any searching questions either.


[/quote]

That is all Waggers ever did during Worthy Out times too, and he even admitted as much in one of his articles.

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[quote user="Jim Smith"]

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]MITS'' article seems exceptionally confused to me, CJF. He claims he''d rather see Delia in charge than Cullum, then calls her an Ayatollah. Given that he has actually spoken to Cullum, his article does absolutely nothing to clarify the situation for the fans. A quite shockingly poor piece of writing just when we need archant to tell us what''s going on.I normally have little time for Dennis, but I actually liked his piece. Whether you agree with his stance or not, it was clearly argued and asked some interesting questions. Actually there''s some quite good stuff on MFW at the moment.I have no idea what the true story is, and can''t believe that Delia hasn''t made some kind of statement to stem the tide of popular opinion against her. But I am also pretty disappointed in how this has been reported by Archant, who seem to have become little more than Cullum''s PR department. Any chance of some investigative journalism?[/quote]

Re the last para you could say exactly the same about MFW if you ask me because all Waghorn has been doing is seeking to foster his links with the club so as to preserve his access to future information. He has not asked any searching questions either.

The MITs piece seems to be quite clear to me. He is saying that Cullum needs to show more of his hand before he would back him over Delia and MWJ but that the fact Cullum has found it so hard and his approaches have been greeted with such hostility is a bit worrying from a board who claim to be actively seeking investment. I think a lot of fans probably fall into that camp.

[/quote]Fair enough. My point, though, is that if MITS knows that Cullum''s approaches have been greeted with hostility, he should say so. He, after all, has spoken to Cullum. He seems to be wanting to have his cake and eat it.

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[quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"]I am really sorry but most of it sucks big time.  Questioning why he hasnt invested before?  This could be labelled at anybody who wanted to get into the club? Saying De.lia must be right?  pathetic?  But this is the guy who never thought Worthington should have gone... Says it all really.[/quote]Indeed this article is pretty sucky.  Admittedly if I considered myself friendly with one side I would be inclined to say that kind of thing, Its only natural, but how is that supposed to convince or inform anyone else.As to the MITS, well this looks to me like he has been caught up in bad journalisitc practices, submitting a press release from Cullum as an interview from him and not asking any questions.  He now seems to be trying to blame everyone else for this, Cullum for not volenteering more information, DS for making him write the article, anyone who wants answers to those quetions he should have asked for having the temerity to ask them.  Well he screwed up, he got our hopes up higher than they would have been if he had done his job.  Its not the real hope that kills you, its idiots writing articles full of fake hope when there isn''t any there and that could easily have been found out!

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[quote user="7rew"]Well he screwed up, he got our hopes up higher than they would have been if he had done his job.  Its not the real hope that kills you, its idiots writing articles full of fake hope when there isn''t any there and that could easily have been found out![/quote]MITS is just a journalist giving his opinions of things. What fake hope?  That was gone the moment the club stated that someone will come along and pay 56 million quid for NCFC? Thats ends all hope dead for the short term and medium-term future of the club of anything more that another million loan from the Turners... (and we would be lucky to even get that)

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He didn''t write the original EDP bit my reading is that he spoke to him subsequently around the time it emerged they were going to have talks.

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CJF, its not his opinion peice that I''m complaining about.  Its his supposedly factual piece for the main paper that consisted of publishing a press statement from PC as an interview.  A few questions and thought before that piece was published and we could have known all the facts before that was published.  We could have known:why talks broke down the first time,whether they were likely to recomence, whether anything had changed since the last talks,what Cullum offered last time (in some detail),what Delia had asked for last time,what Cullum didn''t want to talk about and the same for DS.In fact we could have had the answers to all or most the questions that we still have. We could have known immediately how much hope this had of happening, rather than guessing.We could also have completed any signings in the last two weeks that were put on hold by the takeover talk, ethier by the club or because the price went up.But all of that didn''t happen, because either MITS was too lazy to do his job propely or too starstuck by talking to a billionaire to ask the questions he should of.  Not good MITS, not good at all.

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[quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"][quote user="7rew"]Well he screwed up, he got our hopes up higher than they would have been if he had done his job.  Its not the real hope that kills you, its idiots writing articles full of fake hope when there isn''t any there and that could easily have been found out!
[/quote]

MITS is just a journalist giving his opinions of things. What fake hope?  That was gone the moment the club stated that someone will come along and pay 56 million quid for NCFC?

Thats ends all hope dead for the short term and medium-term future of the club of anything more that another million loan from the Turners... (and we would be lucky to even get that)
[/quote]

And this is the major beef a lot of people have when you get past all the sabre rattling. The fact is that whilst Delia and Co stick to their unreasonable guns there is pretty much NO hope at all of someone coming in to buy the club. The demands they are asking are completely ludicrous and they know it and now we know it. They now look very two faced and in danger of becoming the new RC.

 

It doesn’t now matter if you liked PC’s methods or not he has forced their hand and shown their true colours as far as I see it.

 

Though I do I think it’s unfair to single out Delia to be honest, as there are others involved, but then this is the price you pay for being so public previously.

 

He who lives by the sword……..

 

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[quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"][quote user="7rew"]Well he screwed up, he got our hopes up higher than they would have been if he had done his job.  Its not the real hope that kills you, its idiots writing articles full of fake hope when there isn''t any there and that could easily have been found out!
[/quote]

MITS is just a journalist giving his opinions of things. What fake hope?  That was gone the moment the club stated that someone will come along and pay 56 million quid for NCFC?

Thats ends all hope dead for the short term and medium-term future of the club of anything more that another million loan from the Turners... (and we would be lucky to even get that)
[/quote]

And this is the major beef a lot of people have when you get past all the sabre rattling. The fact is that whilst Delia and Co stick to their unreasonable guns there is pretty much NO hope at all of someone coming in to buy the club. The demands they are asking are completely ludicrous and they know it and now we know it. They now look very two faced and in danger of becoming the new RC.

 

It doesn’t now matter if you liked PC’s methods or not he has forced their hand and shown their true colours as far as I see it.

 

Though I do I think it’s unfair to single out Delia to be honest, as there are others involved, but then this is the price you pay for being so public previously.

 

He who lives by the sword……..

 

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