Peter Cullum - the reality

[dylanisabaddog 4,867]

It is difficult to repond to the points you make as they make no business sense whatsover.  But I will try

hand over our club to this man without knowing the most basic of facts”

We haven''t been told what form the money to be intoduced will take (see below)

The deal will not be about Cullum buying shares it will be what value his £20 million is to Delia.  If Delia wants £10 million for her shares then if Cullum puts in £20 million he would own 2/3rds and 1/3 would be owned by Delia.  I really worry Delia is getting greedy here.  I think he wants her to stay and do the front facing stuff which she is brilliant at (unless she gets on the pitch!).  If she wants money for her shares then everything goes wrong and that’s why I think the deal has stalled.  I think Peter wants his money to be invested in players therefore if he has to buy Delia out then that leaves only £10 million for players and he therefore and rightly in my opinion would walk away.  Delia needs to accept her new role in the club with grace and if the club get promoted then she can sell her stake and maybe get double for it...that’s not a bad return!

The club is a limited company -  the only way to acquire control of the club is to own 51% of the shares. Smith and Wyn-Jones own over 60% between them and the bulk of those shares would have to be purchased.  This would cost Cullum up to £16m.

Of course Delia wants money for her shares - she is merely seeking to get back what she has put in.  That doesn''t seem greedy to me.

"but it seems likely to be a loan as opposed to a new share issue”

There are 2 ways of getting money into a Limited Company.  A loan or a share issue.  Cullum has not said how he intends to introduce the money but the most common method with football clubs is a loan - like Evans at Ipswich.

The very limited information in the EDP says that Cullum isn''t expecting to get much return on his investment.  If the money is introduced by means of a share issue then a return on the investment can be taken out as a dividend - but only if the company makes a profit, which seems highly unlikely.  It is very easy, however, to take interest on a loan, in the same way that Evans is doing at Ipswich.

The other advantage to a loan is that it is easier to get your money out

You have really lost it here.... a loan?  This guy is worth a billion.  He is talking cash as in pound notes not some dodgy loan deal.  Loan deals are for Delia and the Turners which we vitally needed at the time but this guy is the real deal with real cash to invest.

As above, you don''t and can''t just give a Limited Company money (unless you want the company to pay 30% Corporation Tax on it).  Money can be introduced by loan or by a share issue or by giving a personal guarantee on a loan from a third party.. 

Here is the proof that you are a very bitter about something in your life.  What a sad and shallow statement.  Here is a local guy who has achieved so much someone to aspire to and rather than celebrate success as they would do in any other country you get this drivel.

I think you''re missing the point.  The guy is clearly finacially astute but has made an offer that the current owners have clearly been advised not to take. You seem keen for the current directors to take a huge hit on their investment but I doubt Mr Cullum would take a loss on his proposed investment.  That isn''t how he got to be business man of the year.

 

I should stress that I have no problem with Cullum - I just want to see the facts before getting too exited.  If it transpires that he has made a fair offer for the club and offered solid guarantees about the future then we should do all we can to get the current owners to accept.  From the information provided to date I have doubts that this is the case.  A businessman of his pedigree knows exactly what the club is worth.  If he is not prepared to pay that sum, why has he gone bleating to the EDP, other than to apply pressure on the directors to sell their assets for less than they are worth.

By the way, is London really the world''s biggest financial centre?  I would have thought it was New York.

[Mello Yello 2,279]

[quote user="Ralph Wright"]Milan Marcus''s guff must be some of the most dim wittest sh*te posted on this forum in a long time - and that''s against the usual anti club brigades simplistic bleats.

In this fantasist world Peter Cullum is happily handing over £20m as cash ! Not a  loan, no strings attached, merely a ruffle of Roeder''s tousled head with a conspiratal wink " don''t say nothing to Delia nad Michael young fella me lad ". This is the kind of infantile warbling you would expect from poorman road and it''s terminally dumb suupporters.

If it is an unconditional gift how is it then that Peter Cullum could state that Delia would continue to front up the club. Surely it would be a decision out of his hands if he was simply handing the money over as cash.

If there were no strings attached why doesn''t he simply hand if over to the club as a gift as the simply minded milan marcus thinks he''s doing ? And in that light if he was so concerned about the club (and is so generous) then why didn''t he hand over the £5m as a gift last autumn ?

The board has a legal duty to the club as an entity, which is over any moral duty some fans feel should take precedent. That''s the world or business and corporate law.

[/quote]

I do so hope you''re hurting. Because, at this moment in time - I feel so enlightened.....[:D]

Times are a changin'' Ralphy Boy!......And I''m so pleased that you''re not enjoying it![:P] 

[Noseybonk 0]

It is difficult to repond to the points you make as they make no business sense whatsover.  But I will try

hand over our club to this man without knowing the most basic of facts”

We haven''t been told what form the money to be intoduced will take (see below)

The deal will not be about Cullum buying shares it will be what value his £20 million is to Delia.  If Delia wants £10 million for her shares then if Cullum puts in £20 million he would own 2/3rds and 1/3 would be owned by Delia.  I really worry Delia is getting greedy here.  I think he wants her to stay and do the front facing stuff which she is brilliant at (unless she gets on the pitch!).  If she wants money for her shares then everything goes wrong and that’s why I think the deal has stalled.  I think Peter wants his money to be invested in players therefore if he has to buy Delia out then that leaves only £10 million for players and he therefore and rightly in my opinion would walk away.  Delia needs to accept her new role in the club with grace and if the club get promoted then she can sell her stake and maybe get double for it...that’s not a bad return!

The club is a limited company -  the only way to acquire control of the club is to own 51% of the shares. Smith and Wyn-Jones own over 60% between them and the bulk of those shares would have to be purchased.  This would cost Cullum up to £16m.

Of course Delia wants money for her shares - she is merely seeking to get back what she has put in.  That doesn''t seem greedy to me.

"but it seems likely to be a loan as opposed to a new share issue”

There are 2 ways of getting money into a Limited Company.  A loan or a share issue.  Cullum has not said how he intends to introduce the money but the most common method with football clubs is a loan - like Evans at Ipswich.

The very limited information in the EDP says that Cullum isn''t expecting to get much return on his investment.  If the money is introduced by means of a share issue then a return on the investment can be taken out as a dividend - but only if the company makes a profit, which seems highly unlikely.  It is very easy, however, to take interest on a loan, in the same way that Evans is doing at Ipswich.

The other advantage to a loan is that it is easier to get your money out

You have really lost it here.... a loan?  This guy is worth a billion.  He is talking cash as in pound notes not some dodgy loan deal.  Loan deals are for Delia and the Turners which we vitally needed at the time but this guy is the real deal with real cash to invest.

As above, you don''t and can''t just give a Limited Company money (unless you want the company to pay 30% Corporation Tax on it).  Money can be introduced by loan or by a share issue or by giving a personal guarantee on a loan from a third party.. 

Here is the proof that you are a very bitter about something in your life.  What a sad and shallow statement.  Here is a local guy who has achieved so much someone to aspire to and rather than celebrate success as they would do in any other country you get this drivel.

I think you''re missing the point.  The guy is clearly finacially astute but has made an offer that the current owners have clearly been advised not to take. You seem keen for the current directors to take a huge hit on their investment but I doubt Mr Cullum would take a loss on his proposed investment.  That isn''t how he got to be business man of the year.

 

I should stress that I have no problem with Cullum - I just want to see the facts before getting too exited.  If it transpires that he has made a fair offer for the club and offered solid guarantees about the future then we should do all we can to get the current owners to accept.  From the information provided to date I have doubts that this is the case.  A businessman of his pedigree knows exactly what the club is worth.  If he is not prepared to pay that sum, why has he gone bleating to the EDP, other than to apply pressure on the directors to sell their assets for less than they are worth.

By the way, is London really the world''s biggest financial centre?  I would have thought it was New York.

 

Excellent post Dylanisabaddog. Too much rabid anti board hysteria and not enough sensible, knowledgable posts. Calm down people.

[Mello Yello 2,279]

[quote user="Wight Yellow"]

It is difficult to repond to the points you make as they make no business sense whatsover.  But I will try

hand over our club to this man without knowing the most basic of facts”

We haven''t been told what form the money to be intoduced will take (see below)

The deal will not be about Cullum buying shares it will be what value his £20 million is to Delia.  If Delia wants £10 million for her shares then if Cullum puts in £20 million he would own 2/3rds and 1/3 would be owned by Delia.  I really worry Delia is getting greedy here.  I think he wants her to stay and do the front facing stuff which she is brilliant at (unless she gets on the pitch!).  If she wants money for her shares then everything goes wrong and that’s why I think the deal has stalled.  I think Peter wants his money to be invested in players therefore if he has to buy Delia out then that leaves only £10 million for players and he therefore and rightly in my opinion would walk away.  Delia needs to accept her new role in the club with grace and if the club get promoted then she can sell her stake and maybe get double for it...that’s not a bad return!

The club is a limited company -  the only way to acquire control of the club is to own 51% of the shares. Smith and Wyn-Jones own over 60% between them and the bulk of those shares would have to be purchased.  This would cost Cullum up to £16m.

Of course Delia wants money for her shares - she is merely seeking to get back what she has put in.  That doesn''t seem greedy to me.

"but it seems likely to be a loan as opposed to a new share issue”

There are 2 ways of getting money into a Limited Company.  A loan or a share issue.  Cullum has not said how he intends to introduce the money but the most common method with football clubs is a loan - like Evans at Ipswich.

The very limited information in the EDP says that Cullum isn''t expecting to get much return on his investment.  If the money is introduced by means of a share issue then a return on the investment can be taken out as a dividend - but only if the company makes a profit, which seems highly unlikely.  It is very easy, however, to take interest on a loan, in the same way that Evans is doing at Ipswich.

The other advantage to a loan is that it is easier to get your money out

You have really lost it here.... a loan?  This guy is worth a billion.  He is talking cash as in pound notes not some dodgy loan deal.  Loan deals are for Delia and the Turners which we vitally needed at the time but this guy is the real deal with real cash to invest.

As above, you don''t and can''t just give a Limited Company money (unless you want the company to pay 30% Corporation Tax on it).  Money can be introduced by loan or by a share issue or by giving a personal guarantee on a loan from a third party.. 

Here is the proof that you are a very bitter about something in your life.  What a sad and shallow statement.  Here is a local guy who has achieved so much someone to aspire to and rather than celebrate success as they would do in any other country you get this drivel.

I think you''re missing the point.  The guy is clearly finacially astute but has made an offer that the current owners have clearly been advised not to take. You seem keen for the current directors to take a huge hit on their investment but I doubt Mr Cullum would take a loss on his proposed investment.  That isn''t how he got to be business man of the year.

 

I should stress that I have no problem with Cullum - I just want to see the facts before getting too exited.  If it transpires that he has made a fair offer for the club and offered solid guarantees about the future then we should do all we can to get the current owners to accept.  From the information provided to date I have doubts that this is the case.  A businessman of his pedigree knows exactly what the club is worth.  If he is not prepared to pay that sum, why has he gone bleating to the EDP, other than to apply pressure on the directors to sell their assets for less than they are worth.

By the way, is London really the world''s biggest financial centre?  I would have thought it was New York.

 

Excellent post Dylanisabaddog. Too much rabid anti board hysteria and not enough sensible, knowledgable posts. Calm down people.

[/quote]

Nothing wrong with being anti-board. It doesn''t also mean that you''re anti-NCFC. 

I presently don''t seem to be  foaming from the mouth - or seem to be suffering from raging hydrophobia either.[&]

You obviously prefer our current incumbents being at the helm.....Unfortunately, I don''t - and would like to see their departure (including the present Chief Exec). Woof![&]

 

 

[Mr.Carrow 376]

[quote user="milan marcus"]

Are you for real?

Here is a guy who has made an absolute fortune for being a brilliant entrepreneur.  He is worth over a billion that is a billion not a million.  He is totally respected in the city (London not Norwich!) the world’s largest financial centre.  What do you want to know about him? What do you really know about Delia?  Try a goggle search on the guy and make your own judgement.

“Ernst & Young UK Entrepreneur of the Year award and is the current holder of the M&A Deal Maker of the Year” sounds a bit better than Mr Evans resume does it not.

So here we have one of the UK most respected businessman who has made a fortune and now wants to invest some of that money into the club he used to play for.....could fairytales be true?

So do we embrace it and all wake up from the Delia years where with all due respect (and I do respect Delia without her we could have folded) we have not achieved anything. 

No not our Dylanisabaddog...please let me answer each point you made:

“hand over our club to this man without knowing the most basic of facts”

the facts are he is the richest genuine Norwich fan by a yard and now he wants to invest in the club.  On top of that he is one of the most respected business leaders in the UK.  If he wanted to borrow £50 million (not a couple of grand) any bank in the world would write him a check within 24 hours.  That will do for me as someone worthy of taking over our club!  And he used to play for our youth side!

The most important issue is how much Cullum is prepared to pay for the shares he wishes to acquire

The deal will not be about Cullum buying shares it will be what value his £20 million is to Delia.  If Delia wants £10 million for her shares then if Cullum puts in £20 million he would own 2/3rds and 1/3 would be owned by Delia.  I really worry Delia is getting greedy here.  I think he wants her to stay and do the front facing stuff which she is brilliant at (unless she gets on the pitch!).  If she wants money for her shares then everything goes wrong and that’s why I think the deal has stalled.  I think Peter wants his money to be invested in players therefore if he has to buy Delia out then that leaves only £10 million for players and he therefore and rightly in my opinion would walk away.  Delia needs to accept her new role in the club with grace and if the club get promoted then she can sell her stake and maybe get double for it...that’s not a bad return!

“but it seems likely to be a loan as opposed to a new share issue”

You have really lost it here.... a loan?  This guy is worth a billion.  He is talking cash as in pound notes not some dodgy loan deal.  Loan deals are for Delia and the Turners which we vitally needed at the time but this guy is the real deal with real cash to invest.

If, as seems likely, the additional money is a loan, we would be £40m in debt rather than the current £20m

Where are you getting loan idea from talk about getting something completely wrong – it’s a cash deal not a loan.

I doubt he achieved that level of ''success'' without creating a few casualties on the way.

Here is the proof that you are a very bitter about something in your life.  What a sad and shallow statement.  Here is a local guy who has achieved so much someone to aspire to and rather than celebrate success as they would do in any other country you get this drivel.

Face facts Dyalisabaddog

Peter Cullum is a star and that star if Delia does not make NCFC biggest mistake in its entire history is here to shine on our club.  I urge all fans to drop the traditional football cynicism and embrace this guy. We will never get another chance as good as this.  The route to the Premiership has been lit are we brave enough to follow it?  I really hope so.

 

[/quote]

It`s called "fear of change" milan marcus (possibly even mild paranoia......), and for some reason it seems very common in these parts.

Excellent post btw. [Y]

[Yelverton Yella 0]

Thank Goodness there are some sane posters on here. Thank you Dylanisabaddog and Wight Yellow.I can''t believe the naivety and attitude of some people on this forum who apparently believe you can name a figure, release it to the press and expect to take control of a Company regardless of its asset value, goodwill or true worth- and, by the way, I''m sure Mr Cullum doesn''t either! The current Board has replied with their opening shot so, hopefully, middle ground can be found (it usually is!) Good business tactic though to release his statement and harness mass support for an offer that appears to be worth about 1/3 of the Club''s true value. By the way, I am neither a Binner nor a  Percy (or whatever the opposite is)- just a lifelong supporter who wants to see fresh investment in players with appropriate safeguards to ensure my children and future grandchildren still have a club they can be proud of supporting.

[Noseybonk 0]

It is difficult to repond to the points you make as they make no business sense whatsover.  But I will try

hand over our club to this man without knowing the most basic of facts”

We haven''t been told what form the money to be intoduced will take (see below)

The deal will not be about Cullum buying shares it will be what value his £20 million is to Delia.  If Delia wants £10 million for her shares then if Cullum puts in £20 million he would own 2/3rds and 1/3 would be owned by Delia.  I really worry Delia is getting greedy here.  I think he wants her to stay and do the front facing stuff which she is brilliant at (unless she gets on the pitch!).  If she wants money for her shares then everything goes wrong and that’s why I think the deal has stalled.  I think Peter wants his money to be invested in players therefore if he has to buy Delia out then that leaves only £10 million for players and he therefore and rightly in my opinion would walk away.  Delia needs to accept her new role in the club with grace and if the club get promoted then she can sell her stake and maybe get double for it...that’s not a bad return!

The club is a limited company -  the only way to acquire control of the club is to own 51% of the shares. Smith and Wyn-Jones own over 60% between them and the bulk of those shares would have to be purchased.  This would cost Cullum up to £16m.

Of course Delia wants money for her shares - she is merely seeking to get back what she has put in.  That doesn''t seem greedy to me.

"but it seems likely to be a loan as opposed to a new share issue”

There are 2 ways of getting money into a Limited Company.  A loan or a share issue.  Cullum has not said how he intends to introduce the money but the most common method with football clubs is a loan - like Evans at Ipswich.

The very limited information in the EDP says that Cullum isn''t expecting to get much return on his investment.  If the money is introduced by means of a share issue then a return on the investment can be taken out as a dividend - but only if the company makes a profit, which seems highly unlikely.  It is very easy, however, to take interest on a loan, in the same way that Evans is doing at Ipswich.

The other advantage to a loan is that it is easier to get your money out

You have really lost it here.... a loan?  This guy is worth a billion.  He is talking cash as in pound notes not some dodgy loan deal.  Loan deals are for Delia and the Turners which we vitally needed at the time but this guy is the real deal with real cash to invest.

As above, you don''t and can''t just give a Limited Company money (unless you want the company to pay 30% Corporation Tax on it).  Money can be introduced by loan or by a share issue or by giving a personal guarantee on a loan from a third party.. 

Here is the proof that you are a very bitter about something in your life.  What a sad and shallow statement.  Here is a local guy who has achieved so much someone to aspire to and rather than celebrate success as they would do in any other country you get this drivel.

I think you''re missing the point.  The guy is clearly finacially astute but has made an offer that the current owners have clearly been advised not to take. You seem keen for the current directors to take a huge hit on their investment but I doubt Mr Cullum would take a loss on his proposed investment.  That isn''t how he got to be business man of the year.

 

I should stress that I have no problem with Cullum - I just want to see the facts before getting too exited.  If it transpires that he has made a fair offer for the club and offered solid guarantees about the future then we should do all we can to get the current owners to accept.  From the information provided to date I have doubts that this is the case.  A businessman of his pedigree knows exactly what the club is worth.  If he is not prepared to pay that sum, why has he gone bleating to the EDP, other than to apply pressure on the directors to sell their assets for less than they are worth.

By the way, is London really the world''s biggest financial centre?  I would have thought it was New York.

 

Excellent post Dylanisabaddog. Too much rabid anti board hysteria and not enough sensible, knowledgable posts. Calm down people.

 

Nothing wrong with being anti-board. It doesn''t also mean that you''re anti-NCFC. 

I presently don''t seem to be  foaming from the mouth - or seem to be suffering from raging hydrophobia either.[&]

You obviously prefer our current incumbents being at the helm.....Unfortunately, I don''t - and would like to see their departure (including the present Chief Exec). Woof![&]

 

Why is any post which urges even the slightest degree of caution met with such a response.

I am neither for or against the present regime. I feel that they have worked hard for the benefit of the club and are fully entitled to try and recoup the money they have spent, maybe even make money. It''s their perogative.

I would love to see fresh blood and new investment in the club. However, I do believe that we do not know enough about Cullum''s plans at this time to make an opinion as to whether it is a good or a bad deal for the club. More information will come out soon enough.

Those of you ranting that we should take the money, regardless of the details (that''s where the devil tends to lurk), remind me of the QPR fans last season. The same ones that have just had the price of their season tickets doubled.

If it were up to me, I would lock Cullum and the board in a room and not let them out until they agreed a price. In private, rather than this jostling for position in the public domain.

 

[Carrow89 0]

 Times are a changin'' Ralphy Boy!......And I''m so pleased that you''re not enjoying it!"Err, wrong on both accounts. The gleeful way that you told us that Doncaster and co were leaving today speaks volumes about your anti club stance and ignorance of the most basic of business law. Perhaps you are the hitherto unheard of troll milan marcus.Nothing has changed. The club is as it was. The anti club Quislings are still sniping with no ability to explain their simple minded claims. Whether I experience any form of schandenfreude from you and the rest of you anti clubbers being wrong again is doubtful. so perhaps I may not be "enjoying it" after all. Rather like enjoying Tuesday following Monday enjoying you lot being wrong.So perhaps as Quisling-in-chief I shall ask you Mello.If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?

[Arthur Whittle 0]

[quote user="Ralph Wright"] Times are a changin'' Ralphy Boy!......And I''m so pleased that you''re not enjoying it!"

Err, wrong on both accounts. The gleeful way that you told us that Doncaster and co were leaving today speaks volumes about your anti club stance and ignorance of the most basic of business law. Perhaps you are the hitherto unheard of troll milan marcus.

Nothing has changed. The club is as it was. The anti club Quislings are still sniping with no ability to explain their simple minded claims. Whether I experience any form of schandenfreude from you and the rest of you anti clubbers being wrong again is doubtful. so perhaps I may not be "enjoying it" after all. Rather like enjoying Tuesday following Monday enjoying you lot being wrong.

So perhaps as Quisling-in-chief I shall ask you Mello.

If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?
[/quote]

answer me this walphy wind up. Why do you continue to state that people who are anti board are anti club? You say the ''anti club'' brigade has no explanation for aguement even though the fact we very nearly ended up playing 3 tier football this season speaks volumes. You really are a numpty Walph, infact i''d say you have an unatural obsession with the gentlemens club. Oh and please answer my reply about the programme seller on Kings street, or are you more at home talking about the Witton estate in Ipswich, as only a scummer would be so impressed with the way our board has sunk our club in 12 years!

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="dylanisabaddog"]

Chase bought Norwich City for £60k, took us to the brink of oblivion and then sold for £10m.  He was a "local businessman made good" and he sold Ashley Ward to Derby without telling the manager!

When Smith and Wynn-Jones bought the club we had gates of 14,000 and the South Stand was quite literally falling to bits.  They made one huge mistake in appointing Grant but at least had the common sense to get rid of him quickly. Now you want them to sell to someone who wants to double our debt from £20m to £40m.  How are we going to get out of that mess if we don''t get promoted?

The job of a football manager is to win his division.  The job of a Chairman is to ensure that the club is still there for years to come.

 

[/quote]That is a total untruth.  He wants to invest in the club not give us a loan.  Ever seen Dragon''s Den???  Duh......Oh yeah when Delia took over we were 6 million in debt, we are now 20 million in debt and in a worse position in the league.

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="Ralph Wright"]

If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?[/quote]Would you put 20 million of your cash into the hands of Doncaster and co???  They would probably buy land and build a new hotel.There is a reason he wants control when he invests 20 million in the club.   Double what Delia invested in 10 years and remember according to mondays valuation Delia is getting every penny and more back when she leaves.If I had his money I wouldnt hand it over to the current unambitious losers in control.

[city-till-i-die 7]

[quote user="dylanisabaddog"]

We''ve all had a good laugh at our friends down the road since it became apparent that the deal with Mr Evans was not all that it appeared.  We now have exactly the same situation and we all seem to want to hand over our club to this man without knowing the most basic of facts.

The most important issue is how much Cullum is prepared to pay for the shares he wishes to acquire.  The EDP is very quiet about this point and it may well be the reason why his offer was turned down last year.  It seems reasonable to me that Delia Smith and Michael Wynn-Jones should expect to get back the money that they have invested in the club but we don''t know what the offer was from Cullum. 

The other point is the offer to "put in up to £20m".  Cullum doesn''t say what form this money would take, but it seems likely to be a loan as opposed to a new share issue..  He says "the £20m is an investment that is unlikely to yield a good return".  Note that he doesn''t say that he expects no return at all.  He is merely saying that he could get a better return if he invested his money elsewhere.

If, as seems likely, the additional money is a loan, we would be £40m in debt rather than the current £20m.  If we don''t get promotion with that sort of debt it would be disasterous.  If we got relegated, we could go out of business altogether.

This is just another example of very poor journalism by the EDP.  If they don''t have the full facts they should keep their mouths shut and stop using the football club to sell their paper.

I know nothing about this man at all other than he has increased the turnover of his company from £4.5m in 1998 to £243m today, mainly by acquiring other companies.  I doubt he achieved that level of ''success'' without creating a few casualties on the way.

if it is a loan..lets take the 20 mil... we have a better chance of promotion with it than without it...or we can stay as we are lanquashing in the championship and still getting deeper and deeper in debt by buying bargain basement players and going absolutly no were...and as a ncfc supporter i dont think PC will say "i need the money back and if that means liquidating the club then so be it"  im 100% possitive that a suppoter of his own club would plunder the club into administration and then cause it to fold!!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[/quote]

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"][quote user="Ralph Wright"]

If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?[/quote]Would you put 20 million of your cash into the hands of Doncaster and co???  They would probably buy land and build a new hotel.There is a reason he wants control when he invests 20 million in the club.   Double what Delia invested in 10 years and remember according to mondays valuation Delia is getting every penny and more back when she leaves.If I had his money I wouldnt hand it over to the current unambitious losers in control.[/quote]come on Ralph, would you?

[The Fish Seller 0]

Ralph you appear very muddled again, we can''t possibly be Quislings if we''re really binners. I suggest you read Citizen Journalists post a few times and let it sink in. Peter Cullum wants to see the team improved and the quality of football improved, Delia and Co. have proven themselves unconcerned with that and would quite likely use the money as CJF says.

[Mello Yello 2,279]

[quote user="Ralph Wright"] Times are a changin'' Ralphy Boy!......And I''m so pleased that you''re not enjoying it!"

Err, wrong on both accounts. The gleeful way that you told us that Doncaster and co were leaving today speaks volumes about your anti club stance and ignorance of the most basic of business law. Perhaps you are the hitherto unheard of troll milan marcus.

Nothing has changed. The club is as it was. The anti club Quislings are still sniping with no ability to explain their simple minded claims. Whether I experience any form of schandenfreude from you and the rest of you anti clubbers being wrong again is doubtful. so perhaps I may not be "enjoying it" after all. Rather like enjoying Tuesday following Monday enjoying you lot being wrong.

So perhaps as Quisling-in-chief I shall ask you Mello.

If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?
[/quote]

Sorry I''m late in retorting Ralphus, just finished polishing off a couple of Farley''s Rusk''s and watching my Teletubbies Video....

"Nothing has changed, The club is as it was".......Yup, but for how much longer? I cannot wait for the first home game of the season, and witness what the mood will be like. People are beginning to look at our ''illustrious'' ''Board of Control Freaks'' in an entirely different light.

"Will the current Chief Exec remain at Carra - if Cullum Commands Complete Control?" I think you and I know the answer to that.

"Who are the true ''Quislings'' Ralphus?....and why are those, (in reality) being somewhat economical with the truth?

It''s not just us Closet Binners.

"If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?

Maybe a problem with the state of the club finances? Only offering what he thinks is the true worth of the club? Who knows? Do you? (ask a fellow Butt-Kiss Boardist if it is a bit sticky).

Who''s Milan Marcus? Is he actually a real Troll living under Fye Bridge - that''s got your goat?

I can see that you''re really hurting Wrighteous, I have an XXL plaster for that hurt, it might just cover your mouth. (then again, you might need two).....dozen.

I''m having great fun[:D] It''s quite clear, you''re not.[6] Suffer.

You know change is on its way![Y][<:o)][B]

 PS, it''s spelt ''schadenfreude''.....King o'' the Quislings - signing out.....[:P]

[lucky green trainers 0]

[quote user="Mello Yello"]

[quote user="Ralph Wright"] Times are a changin'' Ralphy Boy!......And I''m so pleased that you''re not enjoying it!"Err, wrong on both accounts. The gleeful way that you told us that Doncaster and co were leaving today speaks volumes about your anti club stance and ignorance of the most basic of business law. Perhaps you are the hitherto unheard of troll milan marcus.Nothing has changed. The club is as it was. The anti club Quislings are still sniping with no ability to explain their simple minded claims. Whether I experience any form of schandenfreude from you and the rest of you anti clubbers being wrong again is doubtful. so perhaps I may not be "enjoying it" after all. Rather like enjoying Tuesday following Monday enjoying you lot being wrong.So perhaps as Quisling-in-chief I shall ask you Mello.If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?[/quote]

Sorry I''m late in retorting Ralphus, just finished polishing off a couple of Farley''s Rusk''s and watching my Teletubbies Video....

"Nothing has changed, The club is as it was".......Yup, but for how much longer? I cannot wait for the first home game of the season, and witness what the mood will be like. People are beginning to look at our ''illustrious'' ''Board of Control Freaks'' in an entirely different light.

"Will the current Chief Exec remain at Carra - if Cullum Commands Complete Control?" I think you and I know the answer to that.

"Who are the true ''Quislings'' Ralphus?....and why are those, (in reality) being somewhat economical with the truth?

It''s not just us Closet Binners.

"If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?

Maybe a problem with the state of the club finances? Only offering what he thinks is the true worth of the club? Who knows? Do you? (ask a fellow Butt-Kiss Boardist if it is a bit sticky).

Who''s Milan Marcus? Is he actually a real Troll living under Fye Bridge - that''s got your goat?

I can see that you''re really hurting Wrighteous, I have an XXL plaster for that hurt, it might just cover your mouth. (then again, you might need two).....dozen.

I''m having great fun[:D] It''s quite clear, you''re not.[6] Suffer.

You know change is on its way![Y][<:o)][B]

 PS, it''s spelt ''schadenfreude''.....King o'' the Quislings - signing out.....[:P]

[/quote]glad to see u back meelo - had to bail u out in your abscess on another thread, attempting some humour - obviously, a pale imitation!!!

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"][quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"][quote user="Ralph Wright"]

If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?[/quote]Would you put 20 million of your cash into the hands of Doncaster and co???  They would probably buy land and build a new hotel.There is a reason he wants control when he invests 20 million in the club.   Double what Delia invested in 10 years and remember according to mondays valuation Delia is getting every penny and more back when she leaves.If I had his money I wouldnt hand it over to the current unambitious losers in control.[/quote]come on Ralph, would you?[/quote]Still no reply Ralph?

[milan marcus 0]

Who is Ralph Wright?

Can he really be that simple?

Did I say that PC wants to hand over £20 million in cash no strings attached?

Let me explain again for all the simple people, Delia and anyone you wants to use Norfolk Fuzzy Logic to confuse and destroy the best opportunity in the history of Norwich City Football Club....

PC does not need to buy the entire club and all of Delia personal belongings and the petty cash box at Conley etc etc.

He wants like any other real fan to invest his money into building the team not buying other peoples shares, repaying loans blah blah

The facts are that the size of his investment warrants him being the largest shareholder and by rights in control of the club

I am amazed that this board is about NCFC because reading all the posts on here I thought it was a Gordon Gecko training camp.  Please stop quoting me company law and plc law and any other law.  The facts are thus:

PC is one of the top deal makers in the city.  I would have thought that he may just have an idea on how to make his proposal work.....don’t you?  As I said there is no need to buy the entire club even if that’s what the company rules say today.  Simply call a board meeting and make a change in the resolution...in fact do whatever it takes to get PC and £20 million into the club.  (as I said please don’t respond with trite regarding company law – if our board want this deal to happen they can make it happen!)

Delia and our board however are doing everything to hang onto power like any other group who love power....the trouble is it is time to let go

I would also add this is nothing about Delia and shareholders losing money.  They will lose far more is PC walks away.  Here is a quick survey for you to work out:

Would you want to own either?

A:            45% of NCFC with £20 million of transfer funds ready for a push to the premiership

B:            100% of a club with no transfer funds / no chance to get into the premiership

Please see the light and embrace this deal.  I want Delia to walk away with her head held high and thanks from the supports for all her effort but she must do this deal and do it quickly.  If she fails then she and the board of NCFC have betrayed us all.

[Michael Bates 9]

That last post there... is the best i have seen for a long while on here

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="Ralph Wright"]Milan Marcus''s guff must be some of the most dim wittest sh*te posted on this forum in a long time - and that''s against the usual anti club brigades simplistic bleats.In this fantasist world Peter Cullum is happily handing over £20m as cash ! Not a  loan, no strings attached, merely a ruffle of Roeder''s tousled head with a conspiratal wink " don''t say nothing to Delia nad Michael young fella me lad ". This is the kind of infantile warbling you would expect from poorman road and it''s terminally dumb suupporters.If it is an unconditional gift how is it then that Peter Cullum could state that Delia would continue to front up the club. Surely it would be a decision out of his hands if he was simply handing the money over as cash.If there were no strings attached why doesn''t he simply hand if over to the club as a gift as the simply minded milan marcus thinks he''s doing ? And in that light if he was so concerned about the club (and is so generous) then why didn''t he hand over the £5m as a gift last autumn ?The board has a legal duty to the club as an entity, which is over any

moral duty some fans feel should take precedent. That''s the world or

business and corporate law.

[/quote]are you really that stupid Ralph?  You are a dimwit of the highest order.  IT IS NOT A LOAN.   He wants to purchase NEW SHARES with REAL MONEY.  NO LOANS. No more debt to NCFC. £20 million real solid hard CASH handed to NCFC for new shares, money in the bank for the club.  NOT OWED TO PETER CULLUM.He would get cash back when he sold these shares.  NO LOAN YOU DIMWIT.The loser here would be the other shareholders who would have there share values diluted (Delia reguarly invested money into the club in this fashion) however if PC''s money brought success the worth of the shares would rise.god you are a thicko.

[YankeeCanary 0]

Mello Yello wrote:

(  Quote )Nothing wrong with being anti-board. It doesn''t also mean that you''re anti-NCFC. 

I presently don''t seem to be  foaming from the mouth - or seem to be suffering from raging hydrophobia either.

You obviously prefer our current incumbents being at the helm.....Unfortunately, I don''t - and would like to see their departure (including the present Chief Exec). Woof! ( Quote )

I have to agree with you on this Mello, otherwise you would not have allowed your wit to be so watered down over the past couple of years.

 

[Big Down Under 0]

[quote user="milan marcus"]

I am amazed that this board is about NCFC because reading all the posts on here I thought it was a Gordon Gecko training camp.  Please stop quoting me company law and plc law and any other law.  The facts are thus:

PC is one of the top deal makers in the city.  I would have thought that he may just have an idea on how to make his proposal work.....don’t you?  As I said there is no need to buy the entire club even if that’s what the company rules say today.  Simply call a board meeting and make a change in the resolution...in fact do whatever it takes to get PC and £20 million into the club.  (as I said please don’t respond with trite regarding company law – if our board want this deal to happen they can make it happen!)

Delia and our board however are doing everything to hang onto power like any other group who love power....the trouble is it is time to let go

I would also add this is nothing about Delia and shareholders losing money.  They will lose far more is PC walks away.  Here is a quick survey for you to work out:

Would you want to own either?

A:            45% of NCFC with £20 million of transfer funds ready for a push to the premiership

B:            100% of a club with no transfer funds / no chance to get into the premiership

Please see the light and embrace this deal.  I want Delia to walk away with her head held high and thanks from the supports for all her effort but she must do this deal and do it quickly.  If she fails then she and the board of NCFC have betrayed us all.

[/quote]Marcus, if I understand you correctly you are saying that forget the rules and laws, if the Board wanted to accept Cullum''s money they would find a way. I think you also said that as Cullum is cash rich, he wouldn''t put the money in as a loan. To be honest I don''t know nearly enough about these rules and laws to know if you are correct, but just want to point out the following (if I have misunderstood you please do tell me where);- Glazer was / is rich, but when he bought Man U all the money he ''invested'' immediately became a loan on the club. Man U are now hundreds of millions of pounds in debt, to Glazer. Not a great situation. The original poster is right to raise this as a concern.You also seem to think that it should be reasonable for Delia to cede control of the club without getting a penny in return, as she will potentially have a more lucrative minority holding in a club worth more. Two points on this;- I would prefer a clean sweep. Out with the old and in with the new. I can''t see how they would want to run the club in the same way, if they did there would be no point getting Cullum, so the board room would consistently be split. I can''t see how this is good for anyone.- Why should Delia cede control without getting her money back, for the same reason why should Cullum put in millions and not get control. Why should her money be under Cullum''s effective control? There would be no benefit to Delia (except for maybe a bigger profit, which she has consistently stated she isn''t looking for) so surely no hunger for her to agree to such a deal.I share your enthusiasm for getting Cullum on board. I want Cullum to buy out Delia. He can afford to, he should do. As a top deal maker he is trying to get control on the cheap, and Delia is rightly saying no.

[yellow hammer 0]

[quote user="Big Down Under"][quote user="milan marcus"]

I am amazed that this board is about NCFC because reading all the posts on here I thought it was a Gordon Gecko training camp.  Please stop quoting me company law and plc law and any other law.  The facts are thus:

PC is one of the top deal makers in the city.  I would have thought that he may just have an idea on how to make his proposal work.....don’t you?  As I said there is no need to buy the entire club even if that’s what the company rules say today.  Simply call a board meeting and make a change in the resolution...in fact do whatever it takes to get PC and £20 million into the club.  (as I said please don’t respond with trite regarding company law – if our board want this deal to happen they can make it happen!)

Delia and our board however are doing everything to hang onto power like any other group who love power....the trouble is it is time to let go

I would also add this is nothing about Delia and shareholders losing money.  They will lose far more is PC walks away.  Here is a quick survey for you to work out:

Would you want to own either?

A:            45% of NCFC with £20 million of transfer funds ready for a push to the premiership

B:            100% of a club with no transfer funds / no chance to get into the premiership

Please see the light and embrace this deal.  I want Delia to walk away with her head held high and thanks from the supports for all her effort but she must do this deal and do it quickly.  If she fails then she and the board of NCFC have betrayed us all.

[/quote]

Marcus, if I understand you correctly you are saying that forget the rules and laws, if the Board wanted to accept Cullum''s money they would find a way. I think you also said that as Cullum is cash rich, he wouldn''t put the money in as a loan. To be honest I don''t know nearly enough about these rules and laws to know if you are correct, but just want to point out the following (if I have misunderstood you please do tell me where);

- Glazer was / is rich, but when he bought Man U all the money he ''invested'' immediately became a loan on the club. Man U are now hundreds of millions of pounds in debt, to Glazer. Not a great situation. The original poster is right to raise this as a concern.

You also seem to think that it should be reasonable for Delia to cede control of the club without getting a penny in return, as she will potentially have a more lucrative minority holding in a club worth more. Two points on this;
- I would prefer a clean sweep. Out with the old and in with the new. I can''t see how they would want to run the club in the same way, if they did there would be no point getting Cullum, so the board room would consistently be split. I can''t see how this is good for anyone.
- Why should Delia cede control without getting her money back, for the same reason why should Cullum put in millions and not get control. Why should her money be under Cullum''s effective control? There would be no benefit to Delia (except for maybe a bigger profit, which she has consistently stated she isn''t looking for) so surely no hunger for her to agree to such a deal.

I share your enthusiasm for getting Cullum on board. I want Cullum to buy out Delia. He can afford to, he should do. As a top deal maker he is trying to get control on the cheap, and Delia is rightly saying no.
[/quote]

BDU,

In my opinion, I believe is in denial of the real situation facing her at the moment. The EDP has reported external financial experts (put what value you wish on their judgement) as saying that the real value of Championship clubs is falling as it becomes more difficult to compete at the top level, and as more clubs are going into bankrupcy. Therefore, although she has paid between 25-30 pounds per share, a market value (and yes it does depend on what anyone is prepared to pay for them) is estimated to e around 12-15 pounds per share. Now is is sad that she may lose money on the deal but then life just isn''t fair sometimes.

Consider: If you bought a house for 100,000 and failed  to carry out proper maintenance on the property and the rain gets in through a hole in the roof, you may run around with lots of buckets to catch the drips but it doesn''t solve the root cause of the problem. Eventually the fabric of your house worsens and the value of your house is now worth half of what you paid for it. On the other hand your neighbours carried out the ongoing investment in maintenece and now see their property has doubled in value because the house is in good condition. At Carrow Road, Delia has neglected over the years to invest in quality players and as a result we escape relegation by the skin of our teeth Unsurprisingly, the value of her shares in NCFC is worth less because so much investment is neccessary to get us back on track.

To go back to my analagy of house maintenance. If you cannot afford the neccessary maintenance costs of your house, then you really need to sellup and buy a more modest property within your means. Delia admits she is a ''poor millionaire'' and doesn''t have enough money to put into the club. However much she is attached to her ''home'' she really has to bite the bullet and sell up. It will only get worse in the long-term.

[knockin on heavens door 0]

I fear we''re f#cked.  We have no money BUT the prices will all have doubled for us in case we get some.  We have managed to be worse off under the possibility of a major injection of cash and this is keeping other clubs fans in stitches I''m sure.

[Big Down Under 0]

Yellow Hammer,1. She can''t sell up until someone makes an offer to buy her shares. Cullum hasn''t, and has made it clear that he won''t. I agree she can''t afford to bankroll the club in the way we would like or the way Cullum could, but until someone offers to buy her out I doubt she will go, and why should she?2. NCFC is not in as bad a position as you state. We have an excellent fan base, excellent facilities owned by the club, we can afford the loan repayments, we operate at a small profit. I have no idea as to the true ''value'' of the shares, I understand you can''t value football clubs in the same way as other businesses. I can''t trust the EDP''s sources until they say who the financial experts are, why didn''t they say?

[YankeeCanary 0]

There are far too many posters on here misguidedly making attempts to articulate good judgement, while  failing to keep their own emotional agenda in check. Most of you that fall into that category ( and that includes you Fat Prophet and Mr. Carrow ) would make terrible negotiators if you behaved in a manner that is consistent with your rhetoric on here.

Peter Cullum, along with Delia and Michael will deal with matter in the fullness of time in a manner that is acceptable to both parties. The deal will either get done or it won''t. That is true of all acquisitions or control changes. There are a number of regular and reasonably balanced posters who also realise what is good for NCFC that are sitting on the sidelines waiting to see how the principals decide to play this thing out without feeling the need to express their anger, torment and even personal attacks and accusations not based in fact. 

You know, for all you doom and gloom merchants, one thing that has not been discussed much as it relates to an acceptable offer is the potential of the club. Too many of you are so ready to state where a club of our size and potential should be but all too quick to ignore placing a value of that potential in the process of negotiation. In the 2000-2001 season we finished with less points than we did last season. The next season we were in the playoffs with less than an outstanding squad, including key players who were approaching the end of their careers. Two seasons later we walked away with the title after adding some attacking threat that did not cost a fortune. It is not necessarily the amount of money that is spent but the blend of players that is pulled together and the way they are managed. You can choose to argue this point until the cows come home, but it''s a fact.

This potential is a part of the negotiations and is known and understood by both sides. Mr. Cullum can do end runs and attempt to apply pressure and make various claims through the media but, he knows for certain, if he is serious about his pursuit of NCFC, that ultimately he will have to table something that is in the format of the wishes of the current majority shareholders for one basic and simple reason. They have control, much to the chagrin of their critics, and they are not going to give that control up for less than they choose or for future promises. If you listen to the input from Fat Prophet for one, Delia would hold on to the club and run it into bankruptcy rather than give up control. Imagine having someone that expresses that kind of nonsense on your negotiating team, regardless of which team you were on. As Donald Trump would say, "You''re Fired!"

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"][quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"][quote user="Ralph Wright"]

If there are no strings why doesn''t Peter Cullum simply hand over the money (ask an adult if it is a bit tricky) ?[/quote]Would you put 20 million of your cash into the hands of Doncaster and co???  They would probably buy land and build a new hotel.There is a reason he wants control when he invests 20 million in the club.   Double what Delia invested in 10 years and remember according to mondays valuation Delia is getting every penny and more back when she leaves.If I had his money I wouldnt hand it over to the current unambitious losers in control.[/quote]come on Ralph, would you?[/quote]Come on Ralph??