Peter Cullum - the reality

[dylanisabaddog 4,911]

We''ve all had a good laugh at our friends down the road since it became apparent that the deal with Mr Evans was not all that it appeared.  We now have exactly the same situation and we all seem to want to hand over our club to this man without knowing the most basic of facts.

The most important issue is how much Cullum is prepared to pay for the shares he wishes to acquire.  The EDP is very quiet about this point and it may well be the reason why his offer was turned down last year.  It seems reasonable to me that Delia Smith and Michael Wynn-Jones should expect to get back the money that they have invested in the club but we don''t know what the offer was from Cullum. 

The other point is the offer to "put in up to £20m".  Cullum doesn''t say what form this money would take, but it seems likely to be a loan as opposed to a new share issue..  He says "the £20m is an investment that is unlikely to yield a good return".  Note that he doesn''t say that he expects no return at all.  He is merely saying that he could get a better return if he invested his money elsewhere.

If, as seems likely, the additional money is a loan, we would be £40m in debt rather than the current £20m.  If we don''t get promotion with that sort of debt it would be disasterous.  If we got relegated, we could go out of business altogether.

This is just another example of very poor journalism by the EDP.  If they don''t have the full facts they should keep their mouths shut and stop using the football club to sell their paper.

I know nothing about this man at all other than he has increased the turnover of his company from £4.5m in 1998 to £243m today, mainly by acquiring other companies.  I doubt he achieved that level of ''success'' without creating a few casualties on the way.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jim Smith 2,317]

You are right that we do not know much about him although i have to say that everything I do hear about him points to the fact that he is a decent bloke who is likely to have the clubs best interests at heart rather than be in it for personal gain.

As i said ona nother thread all I want to know is that we are doing everything we can to get him on board if he is genuine and that they have not been playing russian roulette with the future of our club by not getting him on board last season when they had the opportunity.

If there was a good reason why they turned this offer down then lets hear it. He''s gone public now so there is no reason why the board can''t as well. Lets get the cards on the table so everyone knows where they stand.

[Hog 0]

Its quite simple if you ask me, Cullum actually a Norwich fan who has made his fortune by being a brilliant businessman, but is no longer motivated by money.

Evans, arms dealer and asset-stripper who couldn''t give a damm about Ipswich FC, will actually leave them totally in the brown stuff when he has finished with them.

[Songwriter 0]

[quote user="Salahuddin"]

Its quite simple if you ask me, Cullum actually a Norwich fan who has made his fortune by being a brilliant businessman, but is no longer motivated by money.

Evans, arms dealer and asset-stripper who couldn''t give a damm about Ipswich FC, will actually leave them totally in the brown stuff when he has finished with them.

[/quote]This is the sole fact we must remember.  He isn''t a Forgeiner in for a quick buck, he isn''t faceless name that wants the cash of a prem football club in five years only.He is a local Norwich boy, done good.  VERY good. He isn''t gonna run away.  He knows the players, club and history.

[dylanisabaddog 4,911]

How on earth do you know that he is a decent bloke?

I, on the other hand, am a very decent bloke indeed.  I have been supporting Norwich City for 40 years. I know you don''t know me very well but could you lend me a couple of grand.  I promise I''ll give it back.  Honestly.

On a more serious note, although Cullum has gone public, he has given very little information and may just be using the EDP to promote his own interests.

 

[Hog 0]

Are you a binner by any chance?

[Jim Smith 2,317]

I said everything I''ve heard about him suggests he is a decent bloke. he is well regarded in the business world, he gives millions of pounds a year to charity, we have had people post on here who know him (although interestingly none today which is surprising!) who say he is a genuine local lad.

He''s not asking for a loan is he. he''s the one offering the money!

[newyorkcanary 14]

It''s one thing to offer money and not ask/expect anything in return.  That''s called charity.  Cullum is offering money, but wanting control of the club in return.  It sounds like a low-ball offer to me.  What''s to say this whole EDP article wasn''t engineered by him to generate pressure on Delia to bend?  What''s $20 million now could be $40 million next week.  One can''t expect Delia to relinquish control of the team for a figure we all think/hope would be used on players, but paying nothing to her in terms of value for her shares.  It seems to me it is in our best interests for Delia to stand firm and make Cullum pony up more, with a guarantee that x percentage goes to players, and that this is not a loan, which would put our manageable 20 million debt into something a bit more troubling.

[canary cherub 1]

[quote user="Jim Smith"]

I said everything I''ve heard about him suggests he is a decent bloke. he is well regarded in the business world, he gives millions of pounds a year to charity, we have had people post on here who know him (although interestingly none today which is surprising!) who say he is a genuine local lad.

He''s not asking for a loan is he. he''s the one offering the money!

[/quote]

I agree.  He''s not a shark and neither is he a saint.  fwiw I don''t think we''ll find anyone who ticks more boxes. 

 

[dylanisabaddog 4,911]

[quote user="Salahuddin"]Are you a binner by any chance?[/quote]

My first match was Bristol City at home (3-2 win) in March 1968.

I have since seen over 1000 Norwich games home and away.

I am merely suspicious by nature, particularly about "decent blokes" who increase a company''s turnover from £4m to £240m in 8 years.  It reminds me of Ken Bates.

If you call me a Binner again I will seek you out and deal with you in the appropriate fashion.

If you wish to call me a Binner to my face I will see you at either the Dereham game at Aldiss Park on 25 July or the Spurs game on 28 July. (Upper Barclay Block B Row L Seat 34), or for that matter any game next season. 

 

 

[kdncfc 0]

If things continue as they have done this club is going nowhere but down, we need investment and if the reason that Delia has turned Cullum down is because she has had a better offer then that''s fair enough. If she is hanging on because she simply doesn''t want to sell then it is wrong as she is holding the club back. As it is we have been lied to when we were told that no one has come forward to invest in the club when in fact Mr Cullum made this offer last October. At the end of the day we will get no one better than Mr Cullum and it would be madness to at least not get back round the table to try and sort out a deal.

[All Gunns Blazing. 0]

Do any of you question why he first offered £20M when we were 5 points adrift at the bottom of the table? Possibly then because he thought he could get it at a discounted rate, Delia would panic and jump ship?

[Mello Yello 2,289]

How about....."Delia Smith - the reality?"

 

[lucky green trainers 0]

[quote user="Salahuddin"]

Its quite simple if you ask me, Cullum actually a Norwich fan who has made his fortune by being a brilliant businessman, but is no longer motivated by money.

Evans, arms dealer and asset-stripper who couldn''t give a damm about Ipswich FC, will actually leave them totally in the brown stuff when he has finished with them.

[/quote]having read this post, this was also my first thought sal - for me, there is a world of difference between cullum and evans.however, and clearly, cullums''s offer was made at a low point - city were adrift at the bottom, and so obviously his offer reflected that.  having been rejected, i find it hard to believe that since then no further contact has ensued, including further offers (informal or formal ball park figures or similar).  the timing of cullums announcement is interesting, suggesting an impasse has been reached, and by making his original offer public - surely this is a tactic to build a bandwagon for change and put pressure on the board.  no one knows the exact details of the offers, aside from the parties involved, but it would seem a billionaire wishing to invest in NCFC  - who is a local boy made good must tick quite a few boxes for most fans, and if the terms are fair and reasonable, should be welcomed.  and yeah, we all know delia and michael have invested their own dosh in city over the years, but they too bought out chase at equally a low point.  whats sauce for the goose?  and in any event, presently, it seems we historically are still at a low point, with the smallest and weakest squad in living memory.  it seems to me there is a clear need for further investment in the squad, be from the present board, or from new faces.for me - there is only one test here - that both cullum and the smiths should reach a settlement that is fair, reasonable and realisitic in the prevailing market conditions - and that all parties should always be acting in the best interests of NCFC, as their true guide.   if self interest prevails on either side, then NCFC is the real loser in my book.there is always a mid-ground in any sale.  go on peter, delia and micky - ffs, find it, and pdq.  only 8 weeks until the transfer window closes!!!

[canary cherub 1]

[quote user="Til I Die"]

Do any of you question why he first offered £20M when we were 5 points adrift at the bottom of the table? Possibly then because he thought he could get it at a discounted rate, Delia would panic and jump ship?

[/quote]

Yes of course he picked his moment. 

And why were we down there in the first place? 

Prudence with (hardly any) Ambition has come back to bite them big time. 

 

[barclay seats 4849 0]

I dont think you have read the statement...........................can you read ?? are you a binner ?

[milan marcus 0]

Are you for real?

Here is a guy who has made an absolute fortune for being a brilliant entrepreneur.  He is worth over a billion that is a billion not a million.  He is totally respected in the city (London not Norwich!) the world’s largest financial centre.  What do you want to know about him? What do you really know about Delia?  Try a goggle search on the guy and make your own judgement.

“Ernst & Young UK Entrepreneur of the Year award and is the current holder of the M&A Deal Maker of the Year” sounds a bit better than Mr Evans resume does it not.

So here we have one of the UK most respected businessman who has made a fortune and now wants to invest some of that money into the club he used to play for.....could fairytales be true?

So do we embrace it and all wake up from the Delia years where with all due respect (and I do respect Delia without her we could have folded) we have not achieved anything. 

No not our Dylanisabaddog...please let me answer each point you made:

“hand over our club to this man without knowing the most basic of facts”

the facts are he is the richest genuine Norwich fan by a yard and now he wants to invest in the club.  On top of that he is one of the most respected business leaders in the UK.  If he wanted to borrow £50 million (not a couple of grand) any bank in the world would write him a check within 24 hours.  That will do for me as someone worthy of taking over our club!  And he used to play for our youth side!

The most important issue is how much Cullum is prepared to pay for the shares he wishes to acquire

The deal will not be about Cullum buying shares it will be what value his £20 million is to Delia.  If Delia wants £10 million for her shares then if Cullum puts in £20 million he would own 2/3rds and 1/3 would be owned by Delia.  I really worry Delia is getting greedy here.  I think he wants her to stay and do the front facing stuff which she is brilliant at (unless she gets on the pitch!).  If she wants money for her shares then everything goes wrong and that’s why I think the deal has stalled.  I think Peter wants his money to be invested in players therefore if he has to buy Delia out then that leaves only £10 million for players and he therefore and rightly in my opinion would walk away.  Delia needs to accept her new role in the club with grace and if the club get promoted then she can sell her stake and maybe get double for it...that’s not a bad return!

“but it seems likely to be a loan as opposed to a new share issue”

You have really lost it here.... a loan?  This guy is worth a billion.  He is talking cash as in pound notes not some dodgy loan deal.  Loan deals are for Delia and the Turners which we vitally needed at the time but this guy is the real deal with real cash to invest.

If, as seems likely, the additional money is a loan, we would be £40m in debt rather than the current £20m

Where are you getting loan idea from talk about getting something completely wrong – it’s a cash deal not a loan.

I doubt he achieved that level of ''success'' without creating a few casualties on the way.

Here is the proof that you are a very bitter about something in your life.  What a sad and shallow statement.  Here is a local guy who has achieved so much someone to aspire to and rather than celebrate success as they would do in any other country you get this drivel.

Face facts Dyalisabaddog

Peter Cullum is a star and that star if Delia does not make NCFC biggest mistake in its entire history is here to shine on our club.  I urge all fans to drop the traditional football cynicism and embrace this guy. We will never get another chance as good as this.  The route to the Premiership has been lit are we brave enough to follow it?  I really hope so.

 

[dylanisabaddog 4,911]

Chase bought Norwich City for £60k, took us to the brink of oblivion and then sold for £10m.  He was a "local businessman made good" and he sold Ashley Ward to Derby without telling the manager!

When Smith and Wynn-Jones bought the club we had gates of 14,000 and the South Stand was quite literally falling to bits.  They made one huge mistake in appointing Grant but at least had the common sense to get rid of him quickly. Now you want them to sell to someone who wants to double our debt from £20m to £40m.  How are we going to get out of that mess if we don''t get promoted?

The job of a football manager is to win his division.  The job of a Chairman is to ensure that the club is still there for years to come.

 

[Unlucky Fried Kitten 0]

As more figures emerge about this saga it would appear that Mr. Cullum has not really been terribly thorough about the details of his proposal. The way the EDP worded their headline this morning, I thought the deal was done and dusted. I''m glad I didn''t buy a copy on the strength of that! It''s looking very much as though it''s a case of same as you were - onwards and upwards, prudence with ambition. It''s a bit like seeing your winning numbers for the lottery appearing on the TV screen, only to discover the dog has eaten your "winning" ticket. DAMN and BLAST!!

[Yelverton Yella 0]

At last a sensible thread on this whole subject- so sensible in fact that it has lured me out of years of lurking!Before I''m accused of being a Binner because this is my first post, I should point out that I first started actively supporting NCFC in 1959 when I was 8 although before that I used to stand at the top of Belvoir St and listen to the crowd cheering when we scored a goal!Incidentally, when at the CNS I was a classmate of Peter Cullum although I haven''t seen him since he left school and would never have guessed that he would have gone on to become so rich and powerful.I have been amazed at the vitriolic comments posted by some contributors on here over the last few months.Yes, I know there have been mistakes in both the playing and management sides of the Club but, frankly, if there is anyone who works in or runs a business that says they have not made a shedload of mistakes over the years they are either wearing halos or liars....The point is that, over the 50 odd years I have followed City, there have always been mistakes and there have always been moaners. Some of my earliest memories of standing in the River End with my family are the comments from fellow spectators- ''That boy (insert name- anybody remember Laurie Sheffield?) in''t narthing but a cart hoss. He in''t fit to play for City''. I also seem to remember equally derogatory comments about managers  and Directors (Arthur South in particular!)Enough of reminiscing, though, surely the thing is that you are born a supporter of your home town (or rather City) club and part of that support is going through the good times and the bad but still supporting whoever runs out in yellow and green on the day and desperately wanting them to win at all costs.I may be mistaken but there are people on this forum who almost seem to want Norwich to fail on the field or not to sign the best players so that their prophecies of doom can be vindicated and they can pursue their personal vendettas against ''The Board'', ''The Cook'', other posters etc. etc. Their refrain now is ''Take the money!!" or you are not acting in the best interests of the Club and we will insult you some more (shall we have a demonstration?).I''m not repeating the arguments about the projected investment from Mr Cullum because I think they are very well put in the opening post of this thread. I, like all supporters, am desperate to see investment in the Club to buy new players but not at the cost of increasing debt and our vulnerability to a hostile takeover by someone such as our neighbours down the A140 have ended up with. (Not that I am suggesting for one minute that PC is in that class)I think there is more going on behind the scenes than we can know and I can''t believe Mr Cullum seriously expected to buy control of the club for £20m. I think the £20m is an opening salvo to launch the PR battle and ensure the fans put pressure on the existing Board. Don''t fall for this- when did anyone accept the opening offer in a takeover? In my business career I am a veteran of several major takeovers and know all the weeks and months of negotiations, due diligence, warranties and legalities that go on before a deal is struck- it does not happen in 5 minutes! What is more I can never remember a deal being done for the opening offer price..Finally, I am as excited as everyone else by the developments but would urge everyone to stay calm and rational and not resort to ''slagging off '' fellow supporters (including Delia!) at least until matters become clearer. Let''s hope that the £20m can be leveraged into something approaching a decent price for the club while keeping control in the hands of people to whom it means something!OTBC!

[jetstream 0]

"Now you want them to sell to someone who wants to double our debt from £20m to £40m"

Did you actually read milan''s post?

It wouldn''t be debt.

[ron obvious 1,502]

[quote user="Unlucky Fried Kitten"]As more figures emerge about this saga it would appear that Mr. Cullum has not really been terribly thorough about the details of his proposal. [/quote]How dare you! The very idea that Mr. Cullum is anything less than a God in human form is tantamount to heresy!Whereas evrybody knows about that binner-worshipping bitch who''s been trashing the club for her own evil purposes, She who is the Antichrist made flesh ....Wossat?He''s a businessman?And she''s a businesswoman?Perhaps it''s not as cut & dried as I thought......

[milan marcus 0]

Dylan my old china respect to your thoughts I am afraid my beloved club will never achieve in the new commercial football world because people like you who have no desire or ambition in life end up in Norfolk managing the club.

BTW

Its cash not a loan but you will never accept that until PC gives up and buys a £20 million boat in the med!

Will you be happy when we get relegated next year through lack of investment in the squad?

[Arthur Whittle 0]

[quote user="ron obvious"][quote user="Unlucky Fried Kitten"]As more figures emerge about this saga it would appear that Mr. Cullum has not really been terribly thorough about the details of his proposal. [/quote]

How dare you!

The very idea that Mr. Cullum is anything less than a God in human form is tantamount to heresy!

Whereas evrybody knows about that binner-worshipping bitch who''s been trashing the club for her own evil purposes, She who is the Antichrist made flesh ....

Wossat?

He''s a businessman?

And she''s a businesswoman?

Perhaps it''s not as cut & dried as I thought......
[/quote]

She also talks out of her backside when telling the fans that shes not been approached by anyone silly enough like the saviour chef who would put there money in the club. Those most blind are the ones that dont want to see Ron.

[ricardo 7,384]

[quote user="Arthur Whittle OBE"]

[quote user="ron obvious"][quote user="Unlucky Fried Kitten"]As more figures emerge about this saga it would appear that Mr. Cullum has not really been terribly thorough about the details of his proposal. [/quote]

How dare you!

The very idea that Mr. Cullum is anything less than a God in human form is tantamount to heresy!

Whereas evrybody knows about that binner-worshipping bitch who''s been trashing the club for her own evil purposes, She who is the Antichrist made flesh ....

Wossat?

He''s a businessman?

And she''s a businesswoman?

Perhaps it''s not as cut & dried as I thought......
[/quote]

She also talks out of her backside when telling the fans that shes not been approached by anyone silly enough like the saviour chef who would put there money in the club. Those most blind are the ones that dont want to see Ron.

[/quote]

On the bright side Arto, the Percy''s have lost a few more members today.

The veil is slowly lifting from their eyes. Just give it a little more time.

[iluveadie 0]

Are you a binner by any chance?

It always makes me chuckle that as soon as anyone gives a level headed argument against the majority opinion on this board, they immediately get accused of being a ''binner''!

"Agree with me or I''ll call you nasty names and won''t invite you to my birthday party. Smelly head."

 

[As my login causes problems [ :o) ] 0]

Dylan you really are transparently a desperate Delia groupie.

To make out that such a pillar of the financial community as Peter Cullum is some sort of cowboy is rather pathetic.

The Club has come out with a frantic claim of monies required ignoring the financial realities, and it appears that you are too.

The time has come for change, and the only questions relat to the terms of the deal.

 

[Nuff Said 5,119]

According to the official site, the price of the club is:

Investment in playing squad	£20 million
Purchase of shares based on current share issue price of £30 per share	£16 million*
Repayment of bank debt that would be triggered by a change of control	£16 million
Repayment of directors'' loans	£4 million
TOTAL	£56 million

*This figure is based on an offer for 100% of the issued

share capital as required by the rules of the City Code which apply to

Norwich City Football Club PLCObviously, everything is negotiable, but clearly £20 million isn''t going to cover it, let alone give us a transfer budget. Presumably the bank debt could be renegotiated, and the directors might well agree to leave the loans outstanding, so the key issue is the share price. Anyone have any idea how this is calculated, since the club isn''t listed?

[Camuldonum 0]

[quote user="Nuff Said"]According to the official site, the price of the club is:

Investment in playing squad	£20 million
Purchase of shares based on current share issue price of £30 per share	£16 million*
Repayment of bank debt that would be triggered by a change of control	£16 million
Repayment of directors'' loans	£4 million
TOTAL	£56 million

*This figure is based on an offer for 100% of the issued share capital as required by the rules of the City Code which apply to Norwich City Football Club PLC

Obviously, everything is negotiable, but clearly £20 million isn''t going to cover it, let alone give us a transfer budget. Presumably the bank debt could be renegotiated, and the directors might well agree to leave the loans outstanding, so the key issue is the share price. Anyone have any idea how this is calculated, since the club isn''t listed?
[/quote]

I think you will find it is calculated in "private" shares on the price of the latest issue, including any issued while a takeover is going on.  The offer must be for at least that and most takeovers offer more but that''s the minimum that has to be offered - the price of the last offered shares so that the shareholders don''t make a loss.

[Carrow89 0]

Milan Marcus''s guff must be some of the most dim wittest sh*te posted on this forum in a long time - and that''s against the usual anti club brigades simplistic bleats.In this fantasist world Peter Cullum is happily handing over £20m as cash ! Not a  loan, no strings attached, merely a ruffle of Roeder''s tousled head with a conspiratal wink " don''t say nothing to Delia nad Michael young fella me lad ". This is the kind of infantile warbling you would expect from poorman road and it''s terminally dumb suupporters.If it is an unconditional gift how is it then that Peter Cullum could state that Delia would continue to front up the club. Surely it would be a decision out of his hands if he was simply handing the money over as cash.If there were no strings attached why doesn''t he simply hand if over to the club as a gift as the simply minded milan marcus thinks he''s doing ? And in that light if he was so concerned about the club (and is so generous) then why didn''t he hand over the £5m as a gift last autumn ?The board has a legal duty to the club as an entity, which is over any

moral duty some fans feel should take precedent. That''s the world or

business and corporate law.